Week’s Episode Special Guest: Dan Buettner Episode Summary: In this engaging episode, Kimberly Snyder welcomes back Dan Buettner, the renowned author and researcher known for his work on Blue Zones—regions where people live significantly longer, healthier lives. The conversation begins with a nostalgic reflection on their past interactions, leading into a discussion about the natural lifestyle that characterizes Blue Zones. Dan emphasizes the importance of gentle, low-intensity physical activity, such as gardening and cooking, as opposed to the conventional gym workouts many associate with health. He shares insights from his latest research, highlighting that longevity is not about expensive supplements but rather about simple, whole food diets rich in beans, grains, and local fruits. Dan addresses common misconceptions about protein intake, particularly for plant-based diets, reassuring listeners that a well-rounded plant-based diet can provide all necessary nutrients. He also shares practical tips for incorporating Blue Zone principles into daily life, such as cooking at home to control ingredients and costs. The episode wraps up with a focus on finding purpose and community connection, which are vital components of longevity, encouraging listeners to engage in volunteer work or community activities to enhance their sense of purpose and well-being. Chapters 00:00 Introduction and Personal Reflections 03:07 The Blue Zones Lifestyle and Longevity 06:02 Plant-Based Diets and Nutritional Myths 08:58 Deliciousness and Cooking Techniques 12:07 Accessibility and Cost of Healthy Eating 15:06 Family and Community in Healthy Living 17:59 Culinary Traditions and Recipe Testing 21:04 Overcoming Cooking Barriers 22:27 Finding Purpose in Modern Society 27:06 Community Connections and Sharing 30:11 Eating Patterns and Intermittent Fasting 35:02 Protein Needs and Plant-Based Diets Dan Buettner Resources: Website: danbuettner.com Book: Blue Zones Kitchen: One Pot Meals: 100 Recipes to Live to 100 Social: IG: @danbuettner Podcast: The Dan Buettner Podcast Bio: Dan Buettner is an explorer, National Geographic Fellow, award-winning journalist, Netflix Host & Co-producer of the 3x Emmy Award winning: Live to 100: Secrets of the Blue Zones, 5 x New York Times bestselling author, and 3 X Guinness World Record holder for distance cycling. Dan discovered the five places in the world—dubbed blue zones—where people lived the longest, healthiest lives and shared this information with the world. His books, The Blue Zones: Lessons for Living Longer from the People Who’ve Lived the Longest, Thrive: Finding Happiness the Blue Zones Way, The Blue Zones Solution: Eating and Living Like the World’s Healthiest People, and The Blue Zones of Happiness were all national bestsellers. EPISODE SPONSORS: FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY Solluna Feel Good Digestive Enzymes OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY'S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger Simple Ways to Use the Power of Herbalism in Your Daily Life with Rachelle Robinette The Importance of Nitric Oxide and How to Optimize our Body’s Production of it with Dr. Nathan S. Bryan Heart Healthy, Plant-Based Eating with Dr. Jenneffer Pulapaka The Science of Longevity: Plaque Heart Scans, Cancer Screening, Glutathione & More with Dr. Julianna Lindsey Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:00.92) Dan, it's so great to have you back. Thank you so much for coming. I think this is the fourth time you've been on the show. Dan Buettner (00:08.527) I never feel like we've said enough and it's always such a great conversation. So glad to be back. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:16.814) Well, it's funny because it's early December as we record this. And a couple of days ago, Dan, I had a memory picture come up. You know how your phone feeds you these random pictures? It was from December 5th, 2019. And it was from your book launch party at Crossroads. And I was pregnant and I hadn't told anyone I was pregnant. But I remember when you signed my book, I told you. Dan Buettner (00:26.946) Yeah. Dan Buettner (00:35.475) my God, I remember that. Dan Buettner (00:45.222) I feel honored. And then I just kept it between me and my 800,000 Instagram followers. So we kept it really tight. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:55.21) Yeah, well, it's so I know you're in Miami and we were just chatting before the show about how since then, Dan, we've gotten this little piece of land and we grow cacao now on our farm. And how many times Dan we say as a family, I feel like I'm really living the Blue Zones lifestyle. the physical labor of working on the land. Here, you know, I try to go on walks every day to break up my work day before my kids come home from school. But just like I've seen in your Netflix series and in your books, I have a hand sawed down, I'm cutting scrub trees, I'm the trees to get the cacao pods. And there's something so Dan Buettner (01:28.715) I love it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:33.802) natural and it feels like whole being health to be in the land and be in nature. And I know you've seen that in a lot of these incredible Blue Zones communities. Dan Buettner (01:44.719) Not only seeing it, the evidence backs it up. I mean, we tend to think the road to longevity is pumping iron going into the gym. But in these blue zones where people manifestly live about 10 years longer, they're doing exactly what you do. They're moving naturally all day long. It's gentle, low intensity physical activity. And it's the type of movement our ancestors have done for tens of thousands of years. It's a... It's cutting things, it's cooking things, it's making things with our hands, it's walking, it's gardening. These are the activities that have optimized the human condition, physically speaking, for millennia. they're the things science will tell you will do the best job of getting you to a healthy age 90 or maybe even 100. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:38.444) Yeah. Well, going back to how it's been a few books since I, you know, since that memory picture came up and are you finding Dan, as you continue to study the blue zones, even more is being uncovered? I mean, these incredible communities weren't trying, like you said, to create all this longevity. was really part of their natural way of living. Or are you going deeper into these tried and true principles such as in your New book which focuses on one-pot meals. Dan Buettner (03:13.271) I've spent most of the last. 20 years working with cities, we get paid by insurance companies to try to incorporate community-wide nudges and defaults that help people mindlessly do the things that we know ladder up to more good years of life. meanwhile, an 84 billion dollar annual anti-aging industry has popped up and that industry has failed to produce even one pill, supplement, peptide, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:18.103) Yeah. Dan Buettner (03:45.703) stem cell, rapamycin metformin, none of them have been shown to stop reverse or even slow aging. So we're spending a lot of money experimenting on ourselves. Meanwhile, we know that eating a whole food, ideally plant-based diet is worth somewhere between 10 to 12 extra years of life expectancy. That's a meta-analysis that fouled over 10 million human beings for 30 years. So it's very hard to dispute them. By the way, that's peasant food. That's not super foods you see on the internet or, you know, some, some, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:21.644) Yeah. Dan Buettner (04:26.389) expensive supplement regimen. It's eating things like beans and grains and fruit, by the way, wild fruits that grow near you. The native Hawaiian diet, which was largely tubers and root vegetables and some fish, but a lot of fruit, but poi and taro, these are the things that fueled the Hawaiian Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:52.865) Yes. Dan Buettner (04:54.265) people for so many years. when Captain Cook arrived in Hawaii three centuries ago, he described them as fit, with beautiful teeth and great health and vitality. And they were largely disease free until our great gift of infectious disease. Most of those diseases originated in animals and then left to humans. And then we brought them to Hawaiians. I try to look for the diets that we know have helped humans thrive for for millennia. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:32.95) I feel like I get some particular, I would say scrutiny, Dan, because I'm plant-based mom, and my kids have been plant-based since conception. And I'll say my older son, who's nine now, is actually the tallest child in his class. Both my kids are exceptionally healthy. We never really have to go to the doctor except for those obligatory yearly or bi-yearly, at this point, appointments. And yet so many... moms in passing will say, well, aren't you worried about your kids getting calcium or protein? And I say, you know, they're really thriving. And, you know, some of the recipes that I love in here echo how we eat lots of bean and veggie soup, lots of black bean burgers, mean, foods that are really simple, but I've, my personal experience is my kids are exceptionally healthy being plant-based. I don't know that's something that people have asked you about as well. Dan Buettner (06:32.205) all the time and they're under the mistaken idea. Well, we've been marketed the idea that to be healthy, our kids need more protein and that is code for animal protein. But as you point out, plant-based protein is much healthier for us. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:40.344) Bye. Dan Buettner (06:53.087) And as long as you're getting your protein or amino acids from a number of sources, beans and grains and other vegetables, you're getting a whole protein. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:02.615) Yes. Dan Buettner (07:04.783) So that's number one, but number two, we're under this mistaken impression that we need more protein. And the average American, if you look at the CDC website, the average American gets about twice as much protein as they need. yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:22.27) No, it's crazy. Well, it's not just kids, Dan, as you know, it's being marketed as anti aging to have more protein. I mean, I have some of these longevity expert conversations and people are recommending a gram per body per pound of body weight like crazy numbers. And the only way people could achieve those is if they're focusing on protein bars and protein shakes, and now they're not having fiber. Now they're really not having whole foods. And it feels like, I don't know about you, but my first book was over 11 years ago now. And first there was this big discussion about protein, and then it felt like it died down, and now it feels huge again. It's like another big fad. Dan Buettner (08:07.0) Yeah. Well, we've seen it before. saw it with the Atkins diet and we saw it with the keto diet. You know, these diets get popular if they give permission for people to eat the crappy food they like to eat, which is bacon and sausage and hot dogs and hamburgers and, I can eat these and they're good for me. Well, people, people love to get permission to do naughty things. You know, what I've tried to do in the Blue Zone kitchen, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:20.63) Right. Dan Buettner (08:37.809) cookbooks. We were maniacally focused on deliciousness and I find that if you can if you can lead with deliciousness. Some people care about the environment and the fact that eating animal-based products is somewhere between 20 to 30 percent of our carbon footprint. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:42.838) Yes. Dan Buettner (08:58.293) Some people care about animals, but it's single digit percentages. I know you have a real soft spot for the pain and suffering of other sentient creatures. Some people kind of care about their health, but they don't care about it that much when they're hungry at lunchtime. What people really care about is deliciousness, which is why in this one pot, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:15.721) Right. Dan Buettner (09:20.591) cookbook that you have there, we reverse engineer deliciousness by working with Stanford to examine 650 recipes and find the patterns. What are the flavor combinations that make Americans go berserk and love? And it turns out it doesn't necessarily have to start with a piece of dead animal. It can just as easily start with a warm savory bowl of soup or a stew. what I learned, I'd say the biggest longevity secret I learned 20 years and studying people in the blue zones is how to make beans taste delicious. We're horrible at it in America. know, the Boston baked beans or refried beans are gross. But let me cook you a minestrone soup with cannellini beans and Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:51.18) Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:07.138) Wait. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:16.355) Mmm. Dan Buettner (10:17.391) lentils and garbanzo and slow cook them with herbs and spices and the right combination of other vegetables and finish it with a beautiful extra virgin olive oil and top it with some nice fatty avocado. You'll be loving me up all day long. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:36.254) You know, I found that really interesting, Dan, you talk about these spiky flavor combinations. Can you explain a little bit what you mean by that? Dan Buettner (10:43.543) Yes, yes. This dates back to an experiment done with Oreos. And it turns out that our developer for Blue Zone's Kitchen, you know, we have a line of frozen food called Blue Zone Kitchen. And so she was in charge of whatever multinational does Oreo cookies and they tried to market Oreo cookies in Asia and Asians didn't like them. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:13.452) Mmm. Dan Buettner (11:13.805) because Asians tend to like really soft. But in America, this combination of a slightly bitter, crunchy outside and this soft, gooey, comforting inside, it creates this tension or this spikiness which Americans like. So that's why in some of these stews we'll put a... crunchy topping on something that's warm and savory on the inside. Americans tend to like this, these extreme of mouthfeels, not necessarily flavors, but mouthfeels. so we try to incorporate, not all of our recipes have that, but I gave seven different flavor profiles, and then we went out into the world and found the most maniacally delicious recipes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:42.966) Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:07.746) They are delicious. I have to say, Dan, one of my favorite is the easy peasy falafel. My kids love falafel, but it's really hard to find baked. It's usually deep fried in crappy seed oil and making it is really easy. And it has that dichotomy, like you said, and it's also sort of mentioned that it's so much cheaper to eat at home and get much quality ingredients. We all know that food costs have gone up so much for all of us. And so what I love about this is it solves that solution of, like you said, tasty, but it's also a lot more inexpensive. You can get bean in bulk, you can get chickpeas in bulk, and then you're making your dollar really stretch. Dan Buettner (12:51.903) If every time you go out to eat in America, you consume about 300 more calories than you would if you ate at home, and those calories tend to be laden with ultra processed foods and more sodium and sugar. When you cook at home, you get to control the ingredients. And it's not only important to you, but it's important to your family who are just following what you provide. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:01.23) Mm. Dan Buettner (13:19.343) Most of the ingredients in the Blue Zone Kitchen cookbooks, or most of the recipes rather, cost under $3 a serving. And people think I don't have time. Well, we've overcome that time argument two ways. The first way, the easy way is everything can be cooked in one pot or one pan or one cookie sheet, or I love the Instapot. But the other thing is, so at Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:41.207) Yes. Dan Buettner (13:47.983) Even at my age, if I optimize my diet away from a standard American diet towards a Blue Zone type diet or the diet you eat, It's worth about six extra years of life expectancy. If I average that those six years back through the rest of my life, that's three extra hours a day that I can do whatever I want on average. Or I gain an extra three hours a day. And to take 20 minutes of those three hours and assemble in one of these Blue Zone Kitchen one-pot meals, push the button. in the morning and come back and have this savory, delicious, healthy, and cruelty free low carbon footprint, maniacally delicious meal. I'll take that deal all day long. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:36.472) Well, it's also simple and not counting all these numbers all the time. And it's, amazing, Dan, how complicated people try to make lifestyle and all these tests and things you're supposed to follow. I love it so much. The Blue Zones is, it just, there's this experiential joy, I would say. I'm in the kitchen making things and I don't have to count how many carbs. There's all this fiber. My kids are healthy, we're healthy, we have a lot of energy. And there's other parts of the lifestyle, like you said, having purpose and living in close connection with nature and gardening. And it just feels uncomplex and more joy comes through. It's hard to put into words. Dan Buettner (15:27.307) If you eat a whole food plant-based diet, you don't have to think. the piece, you know, if you're overweight and unhealthy in America, which is about 80 % of Americans, I don't blame them. Why? Because we are constantly pummeled with marketing messages telling us, first of all, selling us these processed foods. And then when we get sick, selling us these diets and these programs that you have to make it sound proprietary and difficult in order to sell it. It's very hard to sell somebody on the idea that beans and rice. There's a big study that was done in 1950 that prisoners in Puerto Rico were fed beans and rice for three years. They didn't lose any muscle mass. They didn't develop any cardiovascular risk. All these things that these protein enthusiasts will tell you never happened. All they ate was beans and rice, and there was a little oil put in there. And very rarely they had some other plants. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:06.99) You Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:17.582) Mmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:28.801) No. Dan Buettner (16:35.087) But they're cheap. You can get a pound of beans for a buck or $2 and a pound of rice for two bucks. you can make, add some spices to that. It's about 50 cents a meal. Nobody makes money off of that except your family saves. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:48.206) Mmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:52.398) I think it was your last book too, Dan, or maybe two books ago where your dad tested all the recipes. And I saw some parts of your interview recently with your parents, which is so beautiful. Thank you for sharing that with us. And it seems like they're such loving, centered people. Can you, and now they're, I think your dad's, they're both in their eighties. when you travel around the world to get the very best recipes as I've done, you can get kind of romance by these really exotic flavors, especially in Southeast Asia. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:59.542) yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:03.512) Wow. Dan Buettner (18:24.802) these umami's and these miso and fermented tofu and that sort of thing. For me, seaweed tastes delicious. The reason I brought Roger Butener, who grew up on a farm in Minnesota, if he... Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:39.33) What kind of farm? Dan Buettner (18:41.185) Well, it was, was, they, no, they grew, there was almost a subsistence farm. They had a cow and a pig and some chickens and then the 10 acres of vegetables. But they, they mostly ate vegetables because meat that, you know, they needed the, the, the, the, the animal, for, for income. But, you know, they were so, they're very poor. My dad for Christmas got an orange, for example, he worked all Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:46.38) Okay. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:53.264) okay. Dan Buettner (19:11.149) summer and got a box of cracker jacks so that kind of gives you the idea but he was you grew up middle America I had him taste every recipe and if he gave it the thumbs down I could be pretty sure that most of America Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:21.015) Yeah. Dan Buettner (19:25.143) would say, this is too fancy for me. So I want these recipes to be right down the strike zone for Americans that, you know, if you live, that they'll be delicious for anybody and not too overpower. There's a few more kind of ambitious recipes in the book, but a lot of them are just, you know, Roger Buten approved. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:49.208) Well, you mentioned taste and we mentioned cost. And the other thing I want to mention, is when my kids love the Blue Zones burgers, is that they're also really, most of them are really easy to make and they don't take a lot of time because we all live such full lives. And I know for me as a working mom, I don't want to end my work day, pick my kids up, take them to chess class and swimming and then spend three hours in the kitchen. So I appreciate that you also made them accessible in terms of time. What you hear all the time is I don't have time. I can't afford to eat healthy. I can't afford to go to Whole Foods. You don't have to go to Whole Foods to eat healthy. I wouldn't mind if you do. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:04.098) Central. Yeah. Dan Buettner (21:29.101) I don't have the equipment, I don't have the know-how, and what I make isn't gonna taste delicious. So this book, the whole book is designed to overcome all five of those objections and make it easy, cheap, fast, and maniacally delicious. And it was an instant New York Times bestseller, I'm proud to say. And I appreciate you talking to me about it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:34.669) Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:51.03) I saw. Congratulations. Dan Buettner (21:58.575) Because I know people listen to you are enlightened. People listen to Kimberly Schneider. They're soulful. They are way above average intelligence. They care about the planet. They care about other creatures. They care about their families. And they want to live with vitality and purpose. so I really appreciate having a chance to talk to all you listeners out there. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (22:27.884) Yes. Well, know, Dan, your philosophy of losing... Well... Dan Buettner (22:33.743) That was my mom calling me. Dali, she's 87. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (22:36.574) my gosh. the whole thing. my gosh. Well, I loved seeing, again, the clips. I loved seeing her face. And I think the reason people were so interested, and I was interested, Dan, is because you live with such purpose. And it's an unwavering focus on helping others and sharing this. And there's a curiosity, you know, where did this start? What was your family like? And even on page one in the intro, you talk about a cultural sense of purpose. And that's another aspect of the Blue Zones where elders feel loved and they feel included. So what do you think we can do as a modern society besides eating and sharing food to feel a little bit more of that purpose, Dan? Because obviously a lot of people are lonely. People are on social media, but not interacting as much with other humans. What are some things that you've seen? in your research that could be applied in simple ways in today's life. Dan Buettner (23:39.395) These are counterintuitive and they take some effort, but they make a difference. And I would start a simple self-exercise either with a piece of paper and a pen or a blank screen, four columns, first column, and you just very short phrases what your values are. I'm a feminist, I'm a liberal. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (24:02.318) Mmm. Dan Buettner (24:06.671) a conservative, I'm a Christian, whatever it is. I love animals, but what your values are. Second column, what I love to do, my passions. I love to be active. I love to travel. love to be with a certain type of person. Third column, what you're good at. I'm good at fixing things. I'm a good caretaker. I'm a good with the first idea. I'm good at dispute resolution. I care. I'm a good listener, whatever they are. So once you write those three columns, then you look, okay, how can I put this to work in my life? How can I put this into action? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (24:50.275) Mmm. Dan Buettner (24:53.675) And for most Americans, it's not their job. Only about 30 % of Americans find purpose at work. So then you ask yourself, well, where can I put this to work? And one of the most counterintuitively powerful ways to do that is once you know your values, your strengths, your passions, volunteer. And for you or me, it might be the Humane Society walking dogs. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (25:13.613) Mmm. Dan Buettner (25:21.293) Because purpose that's not put to work is almost meaningless. know, in Kauai you have that kuleana. And the reason I love that word, it's the hybrid of both purpose and altruism. It's what's my responsibility. And it's almost always to the community. And people put their kuleana to work. They take care of the land. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (25:26.082) Mmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (25:39.246) Mmm. Dan Buettner (25:52.449) a child who needs to be looked after. so it says, well, I'm sorry, volunteering is just not for me. Another easy way to find purpose. Over 95 % of Americans were born into a religion, a faith-based community. You may have drifted away from it right now. And I don't care if it's Jewish or Muslim or Christian or Buddhist, but... Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (26:09.687) I know. Dan Buettner (26:21.561) force yourself to show up a month of Sundays and show up to a faith that might resonate with you. And that's a very easy way to find purpose. But the data is crystal clear that people who feel and can articulate their sense of purpose live about eight years longer. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (26:29.998) Mmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (26:41.9) Yeah. Dan Buettner (26:42.177) And once again, I can't make any money off of you by telling you that. And a marketer can't make any money off of you, but that's why you haven't heard of it. But if you look at at the, at the literature, the, the, the, the evidence for purpose is rock solid and pervasive. And, it also makes life richer. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (27:02.83) Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (27:06.626) It really does. And then you're even more motivated to eat well, I think, and live this life because you feel important just for being you, right? You're not just going to sit on the couch, I think, eat junk food when you don't care or when you're just trying to get through. You know what's cool, Dan, in Hawaii, something we do with our neighbors is we do trades. just organically. So we have over a million bees. So we give honey to our neighbors. One of our neighbors grows a lot of papayas. So he's like, here's papaya's back. And then we give honey to another neighbor who grows eggplants and sweet potatoes. And so there's this really beautiful connection that I think is also, I don't know, call it purpose or just connection with the community around when you can share. you know, it's not barter. We're just giving it out freely. But Dan Buettner (27:37.849) I love Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (27:57.11) Since we started doing that, feel even more fulfilled being on the land. Dan Buettner (28:03.979) I was there recently and somebody told me if you're not eating fruit in Hawaii, it's not because you don't have money, it's because you don't have friends. Because apparently everybody's got a fruit tree and they can't keep up with the mangoes and the papayas and the guavas and yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (28:17.361) yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (28:22.926) with guavas. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (31:06.03) Keeping with some of the research around intermittent fasting and also what we've been doing in our saloon community with just having a glowing green smoothie or waiting instead of having a lot of fat and protein. It's very different than eating breakfast like a king, which some people have said in the past. Can you talk a little bit about what you found in the Blue Zones about this? Dan Buettner (31:27.363) Well, I still think you should eat breakfast like a king just later in the day. The thing to remember in Blue Zones, for the most part, they're done eating by four or five. Yeah, or they don't even have dinner in some cases. But the Adventist template is a giant breakfast at 10 and a smaller but still substantive meal at four, kind of a liner. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (31:30.338) Mmm. Mmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (31:38.818) That was me. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (31:55.296) Yeah, that's Hawaii. Dan Buettner (31:55.983) But the point is... Yeah, that's pretty so that so the point is you have about 14 hours Where you have a de facto fast? So the problem with you know me living in Miami everybody goes to dinner at seven or eight o'clock So you're not done until eight or nine So in order to get that that time for your digestive system to rest. I'm not eating breakfast until 11 o'clock or something like that's usually a sardinian minestrone for me, but you know if you can manage Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (32:11.787) Yeah. Dan Buettner (32:27.697) to eat. I think the ideal for most of us is 12 to 14 hours and that follows a Blue Zone pattern and you know can shift it back or up depending on you know how you live because we want to make it easy for you otherwise you won't do it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (32:46.998) Yeah. So it's interesting you talk about the minestrone soup for breakfast. I know a lot of the Blue Zones do eat savory foods in the morning. How do you eat, Dan? Do you rotate a couple of recipes that are your favorites and change up the veggies and the beans? Or are you someone that loves to keep trying new recipes at home? because I can be Dan Buettner (33:11.499) I'm kind of a one-pot guy, which is why. So, you know, there's a recipe in there. I think it's called Dan's Mastroni or Melisse Mastroni, but I make that, but. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (33:14.614) Yah. Dan Buettner (33:25.195) whatever vegetable has been sitting in my refrigerator and is starting to get to the sort of end of its life, I put that in there. And so the core ingredients are the same, but I start with them, start eating minestrone almost every single day. And it's a huge bowl. It doesn't have many calories, but it has about half the fiber I need for the day. And then mid afternoon, if I can avoid it, I won't eat anything. But often I'll eat a snack. And snack is I take, I'm a believer that some fermented food is good. So I have this coconut yogurt, and I put a bunch of berries in there and some omega-3 ground up chia seeds. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (34:19.692) Yeah. Dan Buettner (34:20.015) And then, live in Miami. I'm very social. I go out to dinner every night. I go out to dinner six nights a week. And it's always that tonight I'm going out, dinner reservation's at eight, 730. So it's just, at a certain point you gotta enjoy life too. And where I live in Miami, you're not gonna sit home and watch TV. It's too much fun. I go to the faena. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (34:31.064) Really? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (34:35.918) wow. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (34:44.707) Wait. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (34:48.398) Yeah. that's so, it's fun. And you also get some, so much light and sunlight and you're outside and living the life. I can see the beautiful weather behind you. Dan Buettner (34:59.746) Yeah. It's gorgeous day today, actually. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (35:05.953) Well, guess, you again, just wrapping this up, because we get so many questions about the protein, Dan, is if people were to measure, people always say to me, well, you know, am I getting enough protein when I'm eating this way? And, you know, so many times I say, well, you don't have to hyper fixate on the numbers. But naturally, when you're eating beans, and you're eating whole grains, and you're eating fruit, and you're eating amino acid rich vegetables like kale, you're getting enough. protein, can assure people who are. Dan Buettner (35:36.175) if you're eating a bean and a grain, so a bean and a corn tortilla or a bean and rice or tofu is everything, you're getting enough. Now, the only caveat is when you get 65, 70, when you get older, your ability to absorb it diminishes some in that I would, I would. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (35:45.09) Yes. Dan Buettner (36:02.351) talk to my doctor about what the right amount of protein is for you. It's a little harder when you get older, but if you're under 70 and you're talking, listen to me right now, 100 % whole food plant-based diet, forget about it, you're getting enough protein. Whole food plant-based diet with beans and grains, you're good. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (36:17.569) Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (36:21.612) Yes, and also you need more protein when you're pregnant, but that's also with certain recipes. Dan Buettner (36:26.541) Yes, and I'm past the age I can get pregnant. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (36:32.748) Well, Dan, thank you so much for chatting with us. Dan Buettner (36:34.895) I love you. You're so wonderful. Thank you very much. If people, I always really love to thank people for taking the time because there's lots of competition for people's time. And if they sat around and listened to us for... for 50 minutes, that's a gift. So thank you. If anybody has questions for me, I'm at Dan Butener on Instagram and I answer all my direct messages. And you do me a huge favor if you listen to the Dan Butener podcast or give one of our frozen Blue Zone kitchen meals a try, which are in just about every grocery store chain, know, major grocery store chain in the frozen food section. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (36:50.263) Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (37:06.626) enough. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (37:13.632) yeah. It's congratulations on that. I love the line. I've seen it everywhere. It sprouts at Whole Foods and also obviously makes it accessible for people. We're also going to link in the show notes, everyone, mysalooner.com to One Pot Meals, the Blue Zones kitchen book, which is out just a few months of all your recipe books, Dan, because I love One Pot Meals so much. think this is the one that I love the most. Dan Buettner (37:22.841) Target. Dan Buettner (37:40.751) you're such a sweetheart. Thank you. Thank you, Cameron. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (37:44.3) Well, thank you everyone so much. Yeah, thank you for coming. I mean, I could just ask, talk to you endlessly. I always learn more about the Blue Zones and I read all your books. So it's really amazing how it just keeps going deeper and deeper. Dan Buettner (38:00.163) Well, it's endlessly fascinating. Sometimes you go out in the world to discover, but sometimes you go in and the discovery is even richer. So that's what I'm doing now. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (38:07.914) Yeah. Yeah. Well, thank you everyone for tuning in. again, the show notes, mysalooner.com will link to Dan's work, his Instagram, his new book, and I will put information about his Blue Zone's frozen meals otherwise and share this episode, please, with anyone that you think would benefit, which is my opinion, pretty much everyone. all trying to live healthier, longer, happier lives. We'll be back here in just a few days. Till then, take great care and sending you all so much love. Dan Buettner (38:43.789) Aloha. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (38:44.936) Ha!

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (known as Dr. B) Episode Summary: In this episode, Dr. B discusses his new book, 'Plant Powered Plus,' which delves into the multifactorial nature of inflammation and the importance of a holistic approach to health. He emphasizes the interconnectedness of gut health, lifestyle choices, and emotional well-being, while also addressing the confusion surrounding dietary guidelines and the role of plant-based nutrition. The discussion highlights the significance of personal journeys in healing, the impact of circadian rhythms on health, and the importance of addressing root causes of health issues rather than solely relying on medications. Dr. B. shares insights on the role of coffee and alcohol in gut health, encouraging listeners to embrace a balanced and informed approach to their wellness journey. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz Resources: Website: theguthealthmd.com Book: Plant Powered Plus: Activate the Power of Your Gut to Tame Inflammation and Reclaim Your Health Social: IG: @theguthealthmd, TikTok: theguthealthmd_ YouTube: @theguthealthmd Bio: Will Bulsiewicz, MD MSCI (known as Dr. B), is an award winning gastroenterologist, gut health expert and New York Times bestselling author. He received his medical degree from Georgetown University and a Master’s in Clinical Investigation from Northwestern University. He earned the highest clinical honors in both his residency at Northwestern and his gastroenterology fellowship at UNC—recognition reserved for the top physician in each graduating class. He also completed an NIH-funded fellowship in epidemiology at UNC. He has authored more than twenty five scientific papers, his work has been cited more than 5000 times by other scientists, and he has delivered numerous keynotes as well as briefings to Congress, the USDA, and the NFL Alumni. His books Fiber Fueled and The Fiber Fueled Cookbook have over 500,000 copies in print and are translated into 20 languages. His highly anticipated third book, Plant Powered Plus, is scheduled for publication on January 13, 2026. He lives in Charleston, South Carolina with his wife and four kids and offers free resources at theguthealthmd.com. EPISODE SPONSORS: Solluna SBO Probiotics OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. Chapters 00:00 Introduction and Book Overview 02:10 The Multifactorial Nature of Inflammation 06:19 Personal Journey and Healing 10:04 Holistic Health and Connection 12:31 Navigating Dietary Confusion 18:06 The Importance of Gut Health 20:29 Four Essential Elements for Health 25:45 The Gut-Immune Connection 30:18 Inflammation and Fertility 32:41 Addressing Root Causes of Health Issues 36:02 The Role of Medications and Lifestyle Changes 39:19 Circadian Rhythms and Gut Health 53:52 Coffee, Alcohol, and Gut Health SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY'S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger Simple Ways to Use the Power of Herbalism in Your Daily Life with Rachelle Robinette The Importance of Nitric Oxide and How to Optimize our Body’s Production of it with Dr. Nathan S. Bryan Heart Healthy, Plant-Based Eating with Dr. Jenneffer Pulapaka The Science of Longevity: Plaque Heart Scans, Cancer Screening, Glutathione & More with Dr. Julianna Lindsey Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Kimberly (00:00.686)Hello and welcome back to our Monday interview show. I’m really excited to share my conversation with Dr. Will Bulsiewicz, also known as Dr. B, who is a plant-based gastroenterologist. He’s the New York Times bestselling author of Fiber Fueled. He happens to be a dear friend of mine who has come to my house several times and we have a very brother-sister-like relationship. And he has a new book out called Plant Powered Plus. Activate the power of your gut to tame inflammation and reclaim your health. So in this new book, he’s focusing on inflammation. He and I share a great passion for the real power of plants and a plant-forward diet. Whether you’re fully plant-based like Dr. B and I, or you are adding more plants to your diet in general, there’s so much power in eating this way. as we’ll talk about in today’s show. I also want to call out if you are interested in this topic of inflammation gut health, if you aren’t aware, my brand, Solluna has an amazing line of digestion-focused supplements, which are aligned with nature and backed by science. Our SBO probiotics, for example, have proper ratios and strains. They’re hardy enough to get through your stomach acid to implant in your gut. And I can’t tell you what a difference these supplements have made in my life personally, detoxing the digestive enzymes as well to make sure you’re getting the maximum amount of nutrition from your food and reducing bloating, getting rid of aging waste. So please head over to mysalunawith2lz.com to check out our amazing line of digestion focused supplements. All right, all that being said, let’s get right into our show today with Dr. B. Kimberly (00:01.64)Dr. B, Will, my dear friend, repeat podcast guest, welcome back and congratulations on your new book. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (00:11.33)Thank you, Kim. It’s always a pleasure to be with you and your audience. So thanks for having me. Kimberly (00:16.628)And this is your third book, if I’m correct? it? Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (00:21.294)This is my third book, baby. It’s hard to keep track of because we have four children at home and then I have three book babies. So yeah, this is my third book, baby. First was Fiber Fueled in 2020, the Fiber Fueled Cookbook in 22, and then here we are Plant Powered Plus in 2026. Kimberly (00:36.48)I feel like it’s been this journey, know, collectively in your career and also between you and I, I feel like we met around when your first book came out. And I think that’s when you first came on the show and we connected on so many different levels, sharing, of course, our passion for plant-based eating, for fiber. So we’ve been on our own little journey now six years. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:03.276)We have, and it’s a beautiful journey. And I love that. You’re like a sister to me. You have lot of that. I don’t have any actual sisters in my life. So you sort of helped to fill that void. But also I feel like as I look at your career, it’s actually played out. You’re a little bit more advanced than I am on some levels. But the way it’s played out for you feels a little bit similar to me, which is that you started off really nutrition oriented. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:33.42)And then the conversation expanded and grew into other places. And that’s kind of where I’m at now is of course, I’m going to talk to you about nutrition. And do I think it’s important? Of course, I think it’s important. It’s really important, but it’s not the only thing. Kimberly (01:35.753)Yes. Kimberly (01:48.168)Yes. I felt that in this new book, which we’ll get into right now, The Plant Powered Plus, and you’re really talking about this huge topic, which is so pervasive and multifactorial inflammation. And I love how you get into in this book, lifestyle so much, which we’ll talk about circadian rhythms, meal time, stress, lifestyle, connecting to purpose. Because like you said, it’s not just this narrow granular approach that’s going to heal us, but this whole body, whole being, whole heart, whole soul approach, which is so important for it to be sustainable and work. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (02:29.122)You know, one of the things, a hundred percent. And one of the things that I love about when you and I get to connect is that we come from our own sort of angle into the conversation, but we end up meeting in the same place and we might have our own ways of, of like understanding how we got there, but we’re using the same language, the same words to talk about the same paths to healing. Kimberly (02:58.089)Yes. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (02:58.862)And, you know, I think some people have been surprised Rich Roll was taken aback by some of the things in my new book, because he’s like, I really didn’t expect, like as a scientific guy, I really didn’t expect you to go into some of these places. But you know what the truth is, Kim? Everything that has been taught to us by traditional medicine, everything that you’ve been talking about for years, ahead of the curve. Kimberly (03:24.512)Mm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (03:27.732)science has validated. And the pathways, the physiology, which I, of course, I’d love to see and I love to talk about and we can talk about today. The pathways are now proven. So things that people used to dismiss years ago as being, that’s like kind of woo woo, right? Here we are today. This is real. These are real conversations about healing. And I can show you the exact physiology. Kimberly (03:30.335)Yes. Kimberly (03:48.534)Yeah. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (03:57.816)that involves the brain and the gut and the hormones in between that explains how these different things affect our life. Kimberly (04:07.112)I love how you chose to write this book in terms of a lot of health books feel very disruptive. You can’t get through a sentence without all the different footnote, you know, numbers and just parentheses. And instead you write a chapter and then with confidence you say at the end, there’s 428 citations to support this material. It’s all on the website. And I found that so refreshing. I could actually read the book and glean the subject matter. I think that’s what makes a lot of health books hard to read is there’s just so many references. For the average person, it becomes confusing and it dilutes the message. So there’s a real power in how you did that. I also love how you start the book with a dedication to your mother. It already started from a very heart-based place and it felt very personal. the way you wrote this one. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (05:06.028)Yeah, well, one of the things that happens in this book is I start to open up about some of the challenges that I’ve had in my life, some of the mistakes that I’ve made, but also some of the challenges that we faced as a family when I was a kid. And that involves both of my parents and my dad is deceased. And I, I dedicated fiber fueled to my dad, but, we, Kimberly (05:13.992)Mm-hmm. Kimberly (05:26.891)Yeah. Kimberly (05:31.891)Hmm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (05:35.768)had a complex relationship, my father and I. And when I wrote Fiber Fueled, it was very easy for me, Kim, to write in a way where it makes it sound like, hey, in 2012, I was this 32-year-old guy who was struggling with my health, and all I had to do was start drinking some smoothies. And all of a sudden everything fell into place and everything was beautiful, right? It’s so easy to do that. There’s the part of me that there’s some shame there. There’s processing that is still occurring to this day. There’s complex familial dynamics that like in 2020, I wasn’t, I wasn’t going to write about that. It’s not, I wasn’t ready to share that. And, and Kimberly (06:06.73)Yeah. Kimberly (06:16.853)Mm. Kimberly (06:26.847)Yeah. Kimberly (06:32.703)Yeah. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (06:33.59)You get a little further along and here we are, you know, six years later and I think that there’s opportunities for healing for people in this place through our relationships and also through our connection to other things, to a purpose, to a higher power. I really believe that this is what the world needs right now. And as a medical doctor, if I believe that, if that, if If deep inside of myself, my heart tells me that’s what people truly need to heal. I’m a coward if I don’t come forward and say it. And so, but as a person who is deeply committed to what I set off to do as a teenager, which was to be a medical doctor and help people. That commitment basically says, Hey dude, like this is uncomfortable. You have to step forward and be willing to talk about this. Kimberly (07:08.469)Mm-hmm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (07:32.578)So here we are. Kimberly (07:34.494)It’s so beautiful how it’s like the opening of the heart through the different layers. We are so concerned with how we’re perceived by others and our identity. I’m the smart, I’m the medical doctor. I have all the studies behind me, which is really important as a pathway for many people to come in. But then, like you said, there’s more to it. And I love how you’re really talking about that, the complexities, the things that can’t be ignored. know, people kind of put stress in a bucket and then we try to put band-aids on it. But why are we feeling stressed in the first place? Why are we so disconnected? We’re disconnected from our foods and we’re disconnected from our own hearts. We’re disconnected from people around us. We’re disconnected from our communities. And we’re going to be more disconnected. We’re going have disconnection in our gut microbiomes. Like it’s so many different layers that interconnect. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (08:28.002)Well, if you think about it, like this word holistic. Number one, the body does not care that we want to fragment it and talk about it as different things and different compartments of the body. Right? Gut health versus metabolic health versus immune health. Like the body doesn’t care. It’s all part of one body. It’s all interconnected. And there are things that are occurring inside of us. right now as you and I speak to one another, as we speak to one another on a microscopic level that are influencing an entire cascade of physiology, right? But also, we are not separate from our environment. I grew up believing that I was, I grew up believing that, look, like, look in the mirror, this is what you see, this is the person and everything else out there, that’s just the surroundings and I can go out and I Kimberly (09:10.676)Mm-hmm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (09:32.586)I can manipulate that I can change that. And now what I realize is actually no, what’s happening is the other way around. The environment is changing me. And the gut microbiome is the story. The gut microbiome is actually the story of my life. And from that, it’s influencing my physiology throughout my entire body. So Kimberly (09:39.785)Yes. Mm-hmm. Kimberly (09:46.997)Mm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (09:59.178)So we are we are part of this, you know, this concept of like oneness, this concept of like, something bigger. We can’t we can’t pull ourselves out of that. We are the product. We are the product of the people that we surround ourselves with. We are the product of our home and our environment that we live in. We are we are the product of our relationships. We are the product of all of these different factors. Kimberly (10:06.165)Yes. Kimberly (10:19.798)And like you said, in keeping with ancient medicinal practices, you talk so much about plant power and the diversity and taking all these different superpowers, the polyphenols and the antioxidants and the different vitamins and supercharging our bodies. When I read your book and when I, know, as from the start and we started connecting, it’s, seems obvious, but also just common sense. And then our mutual friend Dan Buenior has studied these blue zones. And we say, yes, we need plants, we need fiber. But what do you think? Well, now there’s just so much, I feel confusion still and misdirection, you we’re on the heels as you and I chat, the government dietary protocols have just been redone to sort of reflect this collective over emphasis on protein. A lot of people are getting, picking up little tidbits of information on social media and around. And now so much emphasis on beef jerky, beef tallow, know, protein bars, protein shakes all day long. And it’s moving us away. Like we’re talking about this environmental connection, gut health, soil diversity. I mean, I don’t know, the question it’s more just a, you know, a statement or reflection back because sometimes I just think, wow, there’s a, there’s a, there’s a lot of confusion to muddle through for many. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (11:57.964)Yeah, well, and unfortunately, I don’t know that the world is going to make that any easier for us anytime soon, right? Because the truth and the reality, so let me, I would love to frame it this way. And then we can talk about the dietary guidelines and some of my thoughts around that. So getting back to what we were discussing a moment ago of this idea of like, you are one person, you are one body. Kimberly (12:04.426)Yeah. Kimberly (12:13.129)Yes, please. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (12:25.506)There is a way in which your body is functioning and interacting with the surrounding world. And those are facts. Those are the laws of nature. And the laws of nature do not care what you want to believe. Right? And when we conduct science, Kimberly (12:39.606)Mm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (12:52.364)And this word science, it makes me sad that this has become a charged word. It really shouldn’t, it really should not be. Because ultimately this is the tool that we need in order to understand and interpret these laws of nature. And so if the laws of nature are the truth, literally the truth, indisputably, and they’re, and they’re working right now, whether we want to acknowledge them or not, it’s happening as we sit here. Kimberly (12:57.055)Right. Kimberly (13:15.327)Yes. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (13:22.496)Science is our approach getting closer to the truth. And that’s not to say that it’s, you know, flawless, clearly mistakes get made. But this is the technique that we’re using to try to ultimately get there. And the more that we can lean into that, the closer that we will get to the truth, and the closer that we get to the truth, the better that we will become at being able to observe the laws of nature and use them to our advantage. So I would, I would actually make an argument that you 5,000 years of Ayurveda, right, or traditional Chinese medicine. They’re not randomized control trials, but there is tremendous wisdom in 5,000 years of information that is human observation. That’s science, right? So anyway, and I think that the problem is, the problem is that Kimberly (14:01.961)Right. Kimberly (14:08.98)Yep, wishin’. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (14:17.24)We live in a world where like I’m actually taken aback and appalled by how much the information can vary depending on where you, what is your entry point? Right? So you click one thing and next thing you know, you will be fed all of these different things. And my wife might be sitting next to me on the couch. She clicks something different and she ends up in a totally different place. And our perspective on the exact same thing is radically divergent. Kimberly (14:27.286)Totally. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (14:47.436)Right? So, and this is the problem that we have is that this is now like, affected nutrition and science. And this has become a, like nutrition should not be political at all. It should not matter. We’re trying to make people healthy period, but now it’s become a political thing. So anyway, with regard to the dietary guidelines, there was a lot about the, there are some things that they got right. And I was grateful that they got right. Right. For the first time, they mentioned gut health. Kimberly (14:47.573)Yeah. Kimberly (15:02.57)Yes. Kimberly (15:07.638)Yeah. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (15:16.812)right? But how can you mention gut health and talk about the value? They actually said the right thing, which is gut health is important. You need more plant based food, you need fermented food. I’m like giving a standing ovation. And then I look at the rest of the guidelines and I’m like, so you’re not going to talk about the fiber deficiency in America at all, right? But then you’re going to reorganize the food pyramid to prioritize Kimberly (15:34.867)Exactly. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (15:44.79)animal-based foods, specifically red meat and butter and beef tallow. And these are the highest sources of saturated fat. And so here’s the like thing that it just, it doesn’t make sense. You don’t have to be a nutritionist to hear this and hear that it makes no sense. Because in their recommendation, if you actually read the document, they said with total clarity, Kimberly (15:46.986)Yes. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (16:12.436)your goal should be less than 10 % of your calories from saturated fat. And Kim, that was the same recommendation that they made in 2020. They haven’t changed that. And the average American gets 12 % of their calories from saturated fat. So if you’re recommending to us that we get less than 10 % of our calories from saturated fat, but you’re simultaneously making recommendations that increase our saturated fat intake, you’re you’re actually making us less likely to fulfill what you’re asking us to do. It doesn’t make any sense. Kimberly (16:42.582)Exactly. just leads to this, you know, kind of honing in on inflammation now. It leads to this chronic confusion, I think that’s out there about what we’re to focus on. I was at my son’s chess tournament the other day and we went next door. It’s convenient. We went to Starbucks and I haven’t been there in a while. And I was amazed, Dr. B, how many drinks you can just add. protein too. It’s everything. Everything is protein, protein, protein. And when we emphasize protein, we have no choice. The average person can’t emphasize so many things at once. So then there’s a de-emphasis on the very things that you’re talking about in your book, this diversity of plants and fiber and all the things that have been proven through these hundreds and hundreds of citations to really help with these conditions. People are Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (17:13.088)It’s become an entire thing. Yeah, the protein thing. Yeah. Kimberly (17:42.098)I love how you also talk about the severity of another big topic, menopause, how menopause symptoms are impacted by inflammation, food allergies, eczema, besides, of course, the pervasiveness of autoimmune conditions. It’s everywhere. And then everybody’s just trying to increase their protein intake every day, become sort of their barometer of whether they’re eating healthy. So there’s this gap here, Dr. B, and you address that head on in your book. not just with protein, just, you know, what’s going on with people and their lifestyle and where the focus really should be. Can you tell us a little bit about, you know, just mounted that in general, and then we’ll get into some of these lines, the three lines of defense, which I found were really interesting. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (18:23.075)Yeah. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (18:28.78)Yeah, so I think that a sensible approach to nutrition is to say, you’re not going to do every single thing, right? And that would just be, it would drive you bonkers to try to do every single thing. So we need to be strategic and we want to go after the big opportunities, the life changing opportunities. But at the same time, for it to actually be life changing. It has to be something that is missing. If you’re already doing it and you’re doing it to sufficiency, why would you change? Why don’t you just keep it the way it is, right? Whereas the stuff that’s missing, that’s where you could radically transform your health if it’s the right thing. So in the nutrition elements within this book, Kimberly (19:09.372)Right. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (19:25.57)That’s where the conversation starts from my perspective is I’m here to say that like in the event that any listener right now is unsure of whether they’re willing to do a plant powered plus diet. I want you to know that plant powered plus is welcoming many people of many different diets and we could apply different terms. I actually don’t like when we apply labels think that like we’re oversimplifying. Kimberly (19:52.66)Yeah. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (19:55.458)but we can apply terms and it’s not just vegan and vegetarian. It can include Mediterranean, can include pescatarian, it can include flexitarian. We have options, but the key here is that there are four specific things that I have identified that I see as being essential to gut health and to reduce inflammation. And they are fiber, Kimberly (20:20.15)Mm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (20:24.142)Polyphenols, which polyphenols are the colors of our food. So you walk into the supermarket and you see this beautiful produce section. It’s the rainbow. When we say eat the rainbow, we’re really saying eat polyphenols. Number three, healthy fats. And number four, have trouble getting my hand to do that properly. Sorry. I used to think I was a great athlete until right now, but anyway, yeah, there we go. Number four. Number four is fermented food. Kimberly (20:43.574)you Kimberly (20:47.901)Or, yeah. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (20:54.894)And so, and if you go through these one by one, fiber, 95 % efficient, polyphenols, well, they mostly come from fruits and vegetables. They can come from other things too, but mostly from fruits and vegetables. And at a minimum, 80 to 90 % of Americans are not getting the mark on those particular foods. Healthy fats were again, over consuming saturated fat. And we’re under consuming the fat that’s found in nuts and seeds and avocados. Kimberly (21:13.631)Yes. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (21:24.89)And finally, fermented food, even people who eat healthy, the vast majority, they consume less than one serving of fermented food per day. So these four things to me, that’s the opportunity. Because if you did these four things and work them into your nutritional routines, you would feel the difference. Kimberly (21:50.1)Yes. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (21:50.316)And it could be any of the symptoms that you described a moment ago and more inflammation is far reaching. Most of us on some level are dealing with something and there is an opportunity here. Kimberly (22:03.284)And these are accessible. You know, we can think of the vast colors and adding variety through the rainbows, the rainbow that is accessible when we walk into the farmer’s market or into the supermarket. When you talk about healthy fats, Dr. B, we talk, know, seeds, nuts, avocados, I know you mentioned in the book, not eating a lot of, you know, high-fried, high-heat foods, like fried foods, which many of us have known for many years. But do you, I wonder if you personally do cook with, like will you saute sometimes with avocado oil or I know some doctors would say, well, just use vegetable broth or try to avoid cooking with oils altogether. I know you say it’s not one size fits all, but in general, if someone’s thinking about coming over more and thinking, well, what are some of the ways in which I can… Tone in on healthy fats. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (23:04.408)So in the plant-based space, and Kimmy, I’m sure you’re familiar with this, there’s camps that have very, very big feelings on the question of oil, whether to include or not include, you know? And… Kimberly (23:12.532)I know. Yeah, Dr. Bernard is in the no oil camp and then some are, you know, amounts of coconut oil and other oils too. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (23:23.436)Yeah, so the way that I would approach this from my perspective is like for the people who are no oil and they’re thriving and their health is great, I wouldn’t change anything. I would stay as you are, right? I still think that you would benefit from healthy fat in your diet and that includes seeds and nuts and avocados, but I’m not saying that you should reintroduce oil if you’ve found that you actually are doing incredibly well without it. People who are trying to lose weight, Kimberly (23:30.805)Yeah. Kimberly (23:42.218)Yes. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (23:51.656)Oil is not really helpful when you’re trying to lose weight. It’s the most calorie dense thing that exists. But for the average person who’s listening to us right now, and I’m trying to convince them to increase their plant based food intake, because that’s how we address these four things that we’ve been talking about. Right? We have to acknowledge the reality oil tastes great. And I enjoy my food when it’s included with that. So I don’t personally go out of my way to ramp up my oil intake. But If you are to include oil in your diet, to me, the choice would be extra virgin olive oil at room temperature. I really don’t want people to cook at high heat with oil that much, but if you are, avocado oil is the choice. So like I don’t, I don’t do a ton of sauteing and frying and things like this. I don’t do much of that. I do a lot of slow cooking. and to me, those are the most like, it’s hard to beat slow cooked food, honestly. So, Kimberly (24:39.423)or roast. Thank you. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (24:51.522)But for what it’s worth, if I were to be doing that, I would use avocado oil. Kimberly (24:55.294)Yeah, well said. I think that there’s different types of cooking methods that we can adopt more. For me, we do eat lot of soups and stews in our family, and we don’t need to use a lot of oil when you cook that way. So there’s lots of different methodologies that can adapt as you come into this lifestyle. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (25:17.314)Yeah, so like for me, I just want to welcome people into this lifestyle and I want to change, I want to change their life. I want to change their health. And I sometimes feel like the oil question becomes a blocker to that. I don’t want that to be a blocker. want, I want people to come in and enjoy delicious, colorful food. Kimberly (25:20.424)Yeah. Kimberly (25:29.78)No. Kimberly (25:34.984)I love how there’s so many people suffering with allergic reactions, Dr. B. It could be pet dander, it could be eczema, it could be, I just don’t know. And I love how specifically you break down these lines of defense in our body. Now more and more people are starting to realize how closely our immune system is related to our gut health. But can you just give us a little bit of a… like an overview of the microbes, the gut barrier and our immune system and how they rise and fall together. I found that really well written in the book. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (26:15.136)Yeah, I mean, I’m happy to explain this out of curiosity. I bet you’ve been talking about this for 15 years, but Kimberly (26:20.468)Yeah. You know, it’s funny when I wrote the beauty detox solution and I was talking so much about digestion and it was like this revelation to me, Dr. V, that my skin had such bad acne and it wasn’t until I cleared my constipation and I gave up dairy, which I couldn’t metabolize very well, many things I was like, wow, this really works. And people, you know, had never heard of it. before. Now there’s so much talk about it, which I’m really happy to hear. you know, and of course, our, our event has been talking about agony and digestive health for so many thousands of years, but it’s always like, yeah, things get out. Thankfully that are helpful. Sometimes. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (26:57.774)Exactly. Yeah. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (27:04.588)Well, and I think I think sometimes what’s necessary is like, people are waiting for the mess mechanistic research to prove what people what the observation that you already are seeing that you already that you already knew, right? So because many of the studies are in the last five years since my first book came out in the last five, six years. So the but what we what we have learned is that Kimberly (27:15.936)Yeah. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (27:33.8)You know, I guess let me let me start and I’m going to zoom out for a moment and then we’ll narrow in, which is to say that as I entered into writing this book as an author, I had an opportunity I could have written about anything. And as a medical doctor, I want to go where the opportunity exists to help the most people possible. And what I saw is that we have an epidemic of inflammation. And so I started with a question that Kimberly (27:59.359)Yes. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (28:02.926)Um, for those of you who grabbed the book, you’ll find this on page, believe 371, 372 of the book. There’s a table where I actually did research to try to figure out how many health conditions can I prove with a, the scientific reference that this health condition is associated with inflammation. And I found over 130, like, I think there’s like 135. And so then I moved to my second question. Kimberly (28:28.502)Mm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (28:32.994)which was out of these health conditions, how many of them have dysbiosis, which means damage to the microbiome. Or another way of asking the same question is what’s up with the microbiome in these people that have these inflammatory health conditions? And the answer to that question was in layman’s terms, the microbiome was jacked up, the gut was jacked up. In fact, I couldn’t find any study. where there was evidence of chronic inflammation and the gut microbiome was appearing healthy. So it’s a hundred percent correlation that basically when we are struggling with chronic inflammatory health conditions, which could be allergic, as you mentioned, it could be autoimmune, but it could be metabolic like diabetes, obesity, these are actually inflammatory. Kimberly (29:09.142)100 % correlation. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (29:29.362)it could be mood disorder. Depression is an inflammatory mood disorder. Could be cognition. Our brain Alzheimer’s comes from inflammation. hormonal polycystic ovary syndrome, endometriosis, infertility in both men and women. In men, erectile dysfunction in women, perimenopause and menopause symptoms. so anyway, that’s just like a fraction and Kimberly (29:55.542)Well, Dr. Lee, can we pause there for a moment because it’s such a big topic is the infertility and PCOH is rampant. And you talk about here, I found it was really interesting, the glyphosate and some of these external toxins also correlating to fertility issues. But also in your work, seeing when you’re in general, from your diet or other conditions, your gut microbiome is disrupted. Or let’s say someone does have an autoimmune condition. I just met a woman over the break who has, she’s 28 years old and she was just diagnosed with multiple sclerosis and she’s just trying to get pregnant. So how, you know, you can have these really severe or mild to severe autoimmune conditions and how much it affects your fertility. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (30:49.966)Profoundly. Inflammation clearly affects fertility. And in fact, Kim, I’ll have to connect you to my friend, Natalie Crawford. And she is a fertility specialist, OBGYN, in Austin, Texas. She has a new book that’s coming out in April that’s entirely about fertility. And the first thing that she writes about is inflammation. Kimberly (30:54.219)Mm. Kimberly (31:00.906)Hmm. Kimberly (31:18.504)inflammation because there’s like inflammation’s up and infertility is up across the board. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (31:25.14)100%. Infertility is a massive problem in both men and women. So on the men’s health side, some of the statistics are terrifying. Sperm counts have plummeted in the last 30 years. Testosterone levels have plummeted in the last 30 years. So I mean, men are struggling on many different levels. And a lot of this is health conditions driven by chronic low grade inflammation that they’re not even aware, right? Like, you don’t feel well, you don’t feel like yourself, you’re not proud to be the man that you should be. And you don’t realize that there’s this thing that’s driving that that’s actually deeply seated inside of you. So and then in terms of women, 100%, there is no doubt that chronic inflammation is associated with infertility. And that can manifest through health conditions like polycystic ovary syndrome. or through endometriosis, but it’s not just that. And, you know, if you think about like, for example, how fertility can vary where infertility can show up when a person is underweight. Being underweight is inflammatory in the same way that being overweight is inflammatory. When your body is in metabolic balance, then that’s anti-inflammatory. When you’re out of metabolic balance, which is underweight or overweight, then Kimberly (32:34.92)Right? Kimberly (32:38.582)Mmm. Mmm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (32:49.464)it’s actually inflammatory and that’s part of what’s happening there. Kimberly (32:53.878)Dr. B, if people aren’t feeling well and they rush to take bioidentical hormones, let’s take testosterone or women going through really rough menopause, and it can help, but do you think there can still be or can mask the underlying inflammatory conditions which aren’t helped necessarily by those hormones? Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (33:14.688)I’m of the belief, my approach, like if I were to generalize about my approach to medicine, I’m of the belief that in all health conditions, every single one of them, we should be taking steps to understand what is the root of this health condition? How did we get to where we are today? And what are the steps that we can take to address the root of the health condition? And that doesn’t necessarily mean that we must reject medicine. Right? You can accept Kimberly (33:37.226)Yeah. Kimberly (33:43.186)It means along with that, holistically as well. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (33:48.857)100%. And the problem is that we have a healthcare system that’s built to basically dole out medicine or surgery or whatever it might be, and completely ignores how we got there. So in the example of the person, Kim, who has an autoimmune health issue, and I’ve taken care of many of these people throughout my career, all right, there’s a story that you will hear repeatedly, and I’m quite sure there’s going to be listeners who are going to be like, Oh, my gosh, that’s me. Where Kimberly (34:07.262)Yes. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (34:17.102)They come in, let’s pretend they have ulcerative colitis and you put them on a powerful drug, for example, humira, right? $3,000 a month. And this powerful drug will take a flaring person with active ulcerative colitis. And when it properly works, it will put them into remission. But here’s the issue. If the only thing that you do is use the drug and you don’t change anything else about your life, you have something. that is contributing to dysbiosis, contributing to the manifestation of this health conditional sort of colitis. And it will, that engine is still churning. Even though you have patched up the actual like outward signs of it, the engine that drove your disease is still churning. And so what happens is these people then fail that drug, right? Like give it nine months, 12 months, they fail the drug. And you go, no, like this drug was working. Now we have to change it. We have to do something else. You go to a second drug. Well, the second drug lasts three months, right? Because the issue is their disease is actually progressing and their disease is progressing because we never turned towards addressing what’s actually causing the disease. So, the same would, I would argue the same is true when it comes to these questions of like bioidentical hormones, which is that Kimberly (35:24.735)Hmm. Kimberly (35:32.948)Yeah. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (35:42.848)I want women to be well and healthy and thriving and feeling great. I want that. I also really want to address the root of these issues so that we can make you the healthiest possible person possible. And if we get you to a point where you don’t need the medicine, all medicines have side effects, all of them. If we can get you to a place where you don’t need the medicine, that’s where we should be. Kimberly (35:56.32)Yeah. Kimberly (36:01.919)Yes. Kimberly (36:06.56)I love it. I love how you bravely talk about GLP-1s as well because there’s so many doctors, Dr. Baez, know, just saying, this is great. It’s great for so many reasons. And maybe it does help for many who are in that obese category or pre-diabetic, but it’s still, I just wonder about the long-term effects and it’s not really challenging people to change their underlying lifestyle habits. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (36:38.218)If I could see the future and know what it means to take these drugs for 60 years, it would help me to understand how to properly position them. And the problem is I don’t have a crystal ball to be able to do that. And we have young people who are taking up these drugs and you must understand that first of all, there’s very firmly established side effects that like there’s risks. Kimberly (36:45.331)Right. Kimberly (37:07.882)Yeah. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (37:09.344)already clearly established. like pretty much everyone that goes on these drugs gets constipation. This is one of the issues that’s going to show up automatically. and there’s other things as well, but even taking that and put it to the side, because in the short term, the benefits may outweigh the risks. But the problem is the drug company will never ever Kimberly (37:18.134)Mmm. Kimberly (37:30.473)Yes. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (37:39.01)Like hit me up when they do this because they will never ever do a study that shows us how to get you off of the drug. And if you stop the drug, the weight all comes back. So this is an unfair proposition to the vulnerable person where we’re basically saying you must take this drug and you must commit to taking this drug for the rest of your life. Because if you stop taking this drug, you’re going to gain all your weight back. So, but okay, what does that mean? We have no clue what happens beyond the first few years because we only have a few years of experience with these drugs. So what happens at 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60, 70 years? I mean, there’s people young enough taking these drugs right now that they might be taking them for 70 years. We have no clue what’s going to happen. Kimberly (38:46.688)There is this term in Arya Veda, Dr. B, pranayaparata, which means crime against wisdom. And we can just see, you we’re talking about clean environment when our blood is clean, when our colons are cleaned out, there’s more space for prana, shakti, whatever word you want to use, just our natural intelligence to inhabit and heal and rejuvenate. And when you’re not digesting naturally, Let’s say you’re eating a low fiber diet, besides the drugs, let’s say you’re on the carnivore diet, which I saw firsthand and you were at my house, Dr. B, when my husband was on this diet for a very short term. There’s no way someone doesn’t get constipated. There’s no way someone, at least I’ll say most people I saw in him constipation, headaches, just one of the wisdom. One of most important parts about good digestion is you’re getting the toxins out. There’s a wisdom to constantly releasing. There’s a wisdom to eating a high fiber diet, to eating all these colors and polyphenols that you’re talking about in your book. There’s a naturalness to that cycle. We take it and we masticate, we chew, we absorb, and then we also release. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (40:02.229)100 % and there is so much good that comes from that regularity of digestion because our body was designed with a rhythm. And all aspects of our life require that rhythm in order to function properly. And it’s very clear and apparent if you have a heart condition. if I, you know, and I’ve seen this firsthand in the hospital where If you flip a person out of a heart rhythm, they could be a great athlete, they could look like a million dollars and you can cripple them instantly. Like they can’t do anything. Right? Because the heart is out of rhythm. If the gut is out of rhythm, manifesting with constipation or diarrhea, are we so surprised that it has negative consequences on the rest of our body? Right? The gut microbiome cannot be healthy when the gut is out of rhythm. And it’s very clear. We’ve seen this where all you have to tell me All you have to tell me is some basic information about what a person’s poop looks like. And I can already tell you quite a bit about what’s going on with their gut microbiome. And let’s go back to 30 minutes ago, as we started the show, where I said to you, your gut microbiome is the story, the story of your life, and it impacts your physiology. if what I’m saying is that your poop Kimberly (41:16.02)Yes. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (41:23.928)tells me about your microbiome, then that means your your poop is your story too. And it tells me a lot about what’s going on. What we want is we want that to be a healthy, satisfying, complete elimination on a regular basis. And when that’s the place that we are, we feel our best. Kimberly (41:45.492)And the lack thereof of poop as well, Dr. B, right? Just not going out of that holding. It’s lack of energy, lack of vitality, lack of abundance, lack of openness. I feel like it’s harder to be in your heart. You’re more irritated. So. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (41:52.803)Yeah. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (42:02.094)You know, it’s interesting the, the, some of the language that we use that I’ve used since I was a kid, language like anal, anal retentive, right? Tight ass, right? Like uptight, right? The, the very bizarre thing, Kim is that like, we have tests that we run as a gastroenterologist that can measure these types of things. Yeah. And actually like Kimberly (42:10.762)Yeah. True. Kimberly (42:25.845)Wow. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (42:30.668)this sort of pattern of people being sort of like uptight and anal retentive. they, they, you actually will find higher sphincter tone in these people. And they, and, and I do think also there’s like a personality element to this and affects the rest of their body. So it’s so fat. Again, I come back to there’s these ideas of things, observations that we’ve made for a very long time that ultimately proved to be true. Even like some things that are so casually said like that. Kimberly (42:45.012)No. Kimberly (43:07.158)Well, it’s stress, right? Stress is tension you hold. You don’t want to let go. People pulled onto resentments. They’re angry versus this letting go, the fluidity that carries throughout. I love, you know, just mentioning rhythms for a moment. If we could touch on your chapter about the circadian rhythms and how that affects gut health and… inflammation. Could you talk about meal times? You talk about sleep? Can you just give us a little overview of how living in rhythm has a powerful effect as well? Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (43:43.778)Well, so first of all, before I even talk about the nerdy science side of things, I want to say to the people who are listening to us that some of the things that I’m about to say, if you do them, like I literally believe on day one, you will feel the difference. So let me start with this, that about half of our genetic code is flipping on or off at specific time points during the day. Kimberly (44:18.9)Mm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (44:20.376)based upon our circadian rhythm, which is our 24 hour clock. In our microbiome, it’s even more than that. Research has shown that more than half of our microbes are rising and falling at specific times of day to meet the moment to make sure that your body has what it needs in order to properly function. And there’s a number of different inputs to this. So it’s not so simple as hey, here’s this one thing, right? Again, All aspects of who you are, how you live your life ultimately will be reflected in this place in your microbiome. But a, an example of this that I find to be quite fascinating is what happens in the morning, which is that overnight, your body, your brain has been producing melatonin and melatonin is the sleepy time hormone. And in our brain, that’s what allows us to get a good night’s rest. But in actually your gut, where believe it or not, you not only have melatonin, you have 400 times more melatonin in your gut than you have in your brain. And all this melatonin in your gut is helping to repair and restore the gut barrier overnight. And when it repairs and restores the gut barrier, that makes the immune system Kimberly (45:38.39)Mm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (45:46.57)And also the gut microbes a lot stronger and healthier. So, but then the morning comes and you get up and what defines the morning? Well, we evolved with light. If you and I went camping, we would know when the day starts because the sun comes up. That’s the way that it is every single day. It’s reproducible. Right? Now the timing may vary a little bit by time of year, like this time of year, obviously it’s a little bit later. Kimberly (45:50.954)Fascinating. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (46:15.468)in the Northern Hemisphere. But the bottom line though is every single day we can count on that the sun is going to come up. And we have been actually trained where the light from the sun in the morning will actually come through our eye, hit the retina in the back of the eye and get picked up by the brain. And instantly, the body will recognize it’s no longer night. It’s now day. And it’s a switch, you actually flip. so melatonin levels, which is your sleeping time hormone, they plummet. And meanwhile, cortisol, which I am happy to discuss the nuance, your listeners probably recognize cortisol as the stress hormone. And when it’s out of balance, and at the wrong time, it has consequences. But when it is properly timed early in the morning, cortisol is 100 % your friend. And so when we make this flip, we drop our melatonin, we spike our cortisol, that cortisol is what allows us to wake up. It allows our body to like all of our different tissues to start getting active. We become more focused, more vigilant. Right? This is why I do my best writing as an author. I don’t know about you, Cam, but like for me, Kimberly (47:16.969)Mm. Kimberly (47:22.431)Mm-hmm. Kimberly (47:44.042)Yes. Me too. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (47:44.14)I write best early in the morning. Yeah, I can like, cause I can get great focus and this is the, this is the product of cortisol actually that hormone is allowing this to happen. Okay. So, the, thing about it is if you step outside, right, I’m not talking about sitting inside and flipping on your lamp and having your cup of coffee. I’m talking about stepping outside of your home and getting natural sunlight, right? Getting natural light. When you do this. Kimberly (48:11.414)Mm-hmm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (48:17.294)you will increase your cortisol by 50%. And so in the beginning of this segment, I said, I believe on day one that the people who do this, they will notice and feel the difference. So here’s what I’m saying to you. If you step outside, you start making this a part of your routine in 2026, where you’re going to step outside in the morning, you will notice that you are more awake in the morning, you are more energized, you have better focus. Kimberly (48:20.918)Mmm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (48:46.402)you have better cognitive endurance, meaning that you can get more tasks done during the day. So daytime, you become elite. And then Kimberly (48:55.946)direct sunlight, Dr. B, what if, you know, it’s cloudy out, you’re getting light. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (49:01.166)So, um, the, the sort of, uh, amount of time, the calculus on this is just like a change in how much time you have to spend out there. But the key is you can’t look out your window because the glass is actually blocking these rays because what we’re talking about is blue light. So you have to actually get outside. But, um, so on a, on a clear day, it could be five to 10 minutes on a cloudy day. would be 30. So I say, Kimberly (49:06.965)Yeah. Yeah. Kimberly (49:16.95)You have to. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (49:30.766)If you can get outside for 30 and take a walk, get some morning exercise, because light can spike it by 50%. Exercise, depending on the intensity, can spike it by 25 to 50 % in addition to that. those are the two, Kim, those are the two most powerful levers that we have for morning circadian rhythm. And they impact our gut microbiome directly. So the microbes are responsive to the fact that the shift where the basically the melatonin dries up the quarters all rises, the microbes now respond to that. But the other thing that happens is our body produces serotonin. This is why by the way, light exposure is the treatment for seasonal affective disorder. So people that are getting like depressed this time of year, the winter doldrums, light is the treatment for the reasons that I’m describing right now. Kimberly (50:23.446)Mm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (50:23.726)light light exposure increases serotonin production. And that serotonin in the brain, it that’s actually contributing to many of the benefits that we’re talking about. But also serotonin is actually the precursor to melatonin. And so that means two things. Number one, that morning light, the serotonin that you get from that in 14 hours, It will make you sleep like a baby. So if you suffer with insomnia, actually the starting point is to start getting morning sunlight. Because if you do that, it will help you to get into a natural daily bodily rhythm. And that bodily rhythm is what you actually need to get good sleep at night. But the second thing is that I serotonin is the precursor to melatonin. Let’s go back to gut, serotonin, and melatonin. Kimberly (50:56.918)Amazing. Kimberly (51:03.764)Mm-hmm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (51:21.582)where we know you and I have discussed on the show in our prior episodes, that 95 % of serotonin is produced in the gut. And now what I’m saying to you is I’m going to expand beyond that to say, yes, all of the serotonin is flooding the gut and the serotonin in the gut becomes the precursor to 400 times more melatonin in the gut than we have in the brain. And that’s going to repair and restore your gut barrier at night. Kimberly (51:30.42)Yes. Kimberly (51:44.598)Mm. Kimberly (51:50.976)such intelligence in the body. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (51:53.102)Yeah, it’s a symphony. Kimberly (51:56.222)You know, when you were talking about it to Dr. B, it’s making it doable. think about dog walkers who get up and they have to take their dogs outside naturally anyway. Or I drop my kids off at school in the morning and then I play with my kindergartner in the yard for 20 minutes before he goes into class. So there’s ways in which we could make this part of our lifestyle, whether you’re a busy mom, a dog walker. Maybe you don’t have dogs or kids, but you can do your morning call or maybe drink your hot tea or your lemon water or your coffee outside. So this just becomes part of your natural lifestyle, not another thing to check off the list that feels unnatural. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (52:37.622)I think that the way that I see this is that if what I am saying to you is legitimate, then you will feel the difference so much that you will not want to give it up. It will become a non-negotiable. And that’s the way that it is for me. And if on the flip side, it doesn’t really have a meaningful impact on how you feel, then you’re not going to be as motivated. But I’m willing to throw, I’m willing to roll the dice and make a gamble. that you’re gonna feel that difference and then you’re gonna want it. I have a private community where I had a large group of people who were all doing this in the month of September every single day. And some of the stories that came out of this of healing, people healing their psoriasis, some of the stories of people improving their digestive symptoms, we didn’t change their diet. We just walked outside, it’s completely free. You just step outside your home. Kimberly (53:16.757)Mmm. Kimberly (53:23.882)Mmm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (53:33.976)for 30 minutes in the morning. these people, I don’t have a survey to make it totally clear what percentage, they’re constantly telling me how they do this. Still to this day, many of them are bundling up in the wintertime because this is how much they’re convinced that this is necessary. Kimberly (53:50.516)Yes. That’s so beautiful. I love the experiential and also Dr. B going back to the personal, I love to close out with the personal-ness in your book, the alcohol section. I mean, we all hear now how much alcohol has gone down, thankfully, because there’s so much research and you talk about how it really does damage the gut barrier lining. But you also say, hey, I’m human and sometimes I still want to have a drink, right? Which I think is really beautiful to acknowledge. No one’s perfect. And you see this, you do the research, you’re a gastroenterologist, you’re have drinks sometimes with a friend. People are drinking sometimes in the blue zones, right? Like our friend Dan Buettner talks about. So in the morning, Dr. V, I’d love to know, are you drinking coffee? Because you like how it tastes sometimes. You’re getting the energy from the morning light, but sometimes are you also having some caffeine? Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (54:51.212)well, in the event that you didn’t know this about me, Kim, I am very much obsessed with coffee. Kimberly (54:57.654)I didn’t know this. this. I love this because as we hear like, just, you know, ride the quarters all and I also since we had our how we had our cacao farm in Hawaii, Dr. B and I’ve come to visit coffee farms, I appreciate coffee, I drink it sometimes now. So you know, because sometimes people are like, well, no, no, caffeine, these blanket statements, which, you know, we’re human, can enjoy coffee and alcohol at times and still have healthy gut. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (55:23.502)I’ll make, I’ll make my argument for coffee. and, but I’ll lead by acknowledging that I’m very much biased in this space because I’ll believe any study that says the coffee is good for you. And, and, and before I say it, just, just to be, just to be completely fair, there are people that coffee is not a fit and they should not feel bad. And there are, there are alternative choices for those people. so, but like, cause, cause Kimberly (55:36.927)with Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (55:52.654)Coffee can give some people diarrhea, can create anxiety, can give you insomnia. If my wife has one cup of coffee past noon, she can’t sleep that night at all. Whereas for me, I could have cup of coffee at 10.30 at night and go to bed 15 minutes later. So. Kimberly (56:05.172)Done. Yeah. Kimberly (56:11.838)You’re one of those people who drinks coffee at the end of dinner. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (56:15.35)I don’t intentionally do that, but sometimes if we’re going out to a nice dinner and it’s like, you know how it is, it’s like so rich that you’re just like, yeah. So then I feel like kind of like trash. And so I’ll have a cup of coffee at the end of dinner just to kind of reset myself, recalibrate. But anyway, all right. So the case for coffee is this though, is that people don’t realize actually coffee is a microbiome beverage. It has a ton of stuff that’s really good for your microbes. Number one. Kimberly (56:21.045)Yeah, they are. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (56:44.172)It actually has an abundance of polyphenols. Yeah. So, I’ve talked about these four things that I’m trying to everyone, trying to get everyone to get more of. And in the category of polyphenols and antioxidants, believe it or not, the number one source of antioxidants in the American diet is coffee. Kimberly (56:44.726)to know. Mmm. Kimberly (57:01.779)Really. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (57:02.828)Yes. Now that is sad, right? Cause there’s, mean, I’ve said like fruits and vegetables are where that most, it mostly exists. And now here I am, I’m saying the number one source in our diet is coffee. So clearly we’re not getting enough fruits and vegetables. All right. But, coffee is the number one source of that. And then the second thing is coffee actually does have fiber. It’s soluble fiber. So it’s dissolved within the beverage. You wouldn’t know it’s there, but it’s there. And so there’s actually research that Kimberly (57:17.429)right. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (57:32.098)that has been done, you know that I’m, I work with a company, Zoey, that’s a personalized nutrition company. And there’s research that was done by Zoey where they discovered that coffee actually changes over a hundred different microbes and that there’s one particular bacteria called the wasana bacteria that is associated with coffee consumption where we can literally tell based upon your microbiome whether or not you’re a coffee drinker. And Kimberly (58:00.264)Wow. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (58:01.132)And coffee, the last part here is that coffee to me is the perfect way for me to end close out this conversation with something that’s really important for gut health. We’ve talked a lot about variety. Yes, variety is important. Let me talk about something else consistency. Now I’ll separate, I’ll explain cause that sounds like they’re diametrically opposed. I don’t actually see him that way, but let me explain this first. Kimberly (58:19.285)Mmm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (58:30.496)of all of the foods that we analyze that Zoe, and we have a database of 300,000 people, the number one in terms of impacting the microbiome was coffee. Kimberly (58:46.667)Wow. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (58:47.852)Why would that be? Well, Kim, coffee, head to head, one v one against turmeric, coffee would lose coffee head to head against kale coffee would lose. But here’s the difference. We drink coffee every single day, people that are like legit coffee drinkers like myself, every single day don’t miss a day. Here’s what’s happening inside my gut. Day one, small little nudge. Thanks to the polyphenols and the fiber. Day two, another small nudge. Day three, another small nudge. And what’s happens is you get 30 days and 60 days and 90 days in, and you have really, really, really reinforced the benefits of this particular beverage through consistency. Whereas the kale, get whatever I get from the kale, but then I don’t have it again for 10 days. And I start to drift back to where I started. So. Kimberly (59:21.514)Mmm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (59:45.794)I said that coffee, that consistency and diversity are not actually diametrically opposed. What I mean by that is that you should look to expand your diet into variety as much as possible. It’s delicious. It’s also really, really good for you. But at the same time, you should not be afraid to lean in to the habits and the routines. Kimberly (01:00:02.463)Mmm. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:00:11.128)that can really benefit you. And I see like coffee as being something that could be a daily ritual. And I also see tea as being a daily ritual that can do that. And I see smoothies as opportunity to do that. So I think like, I basically think that there’s a lot of different ways that you can fulfill that. Kimberly (01:00:24.341)was. Wow. Fascinating. I’ve never heard that with Zoe’s research. Timothy came on our podcast as well, Dr. B, and talked about some of the other research, but he didn’t get into that. It’s really fascinating. And I imagine along with other foods, if we can choose organic coffee, it would be beneficial because of pesticides. What do you think? Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:00:36.098)Yeah. Yep. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:00:51.616)I mean, are we going to open this can of worms as we walk out? So the answer is yes. Yeah. So it’s a bigger topic. There’s a few arguments here. There’s a few arguments. You know, it’s funny to me when I hear people say, well, organic has pesticides too. Yeah. They’re not the same. Right? They’re not the same. Kimberly (01:00:54.72)Thank Kimberly (01:01:00.905)Okay. Kimberly (01:01:16.566)Right. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:01:17.666)There’s a difference between the pesticides with organic and the pesticides that are non-organic. And unfortunately, I’m quite concerned about the impact of glyphosate on our gut microbiome. So I just want to say this because there’s a lot of people on the internet who have very big feelings every time I start to talk about this topic. If you just simply Google, do your own research and Google glyphosate, gut microbiome. Kimberly (01:01:28.041)Yes. Kimberly (01:01:44.937)Yes. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:01:46.744)PubMed, P-U-B-M-E-D. And this will lead you to a list of many different scientific publications where the scientists, not me, are discussing the impact of glyphosate on the gut microbiome. And what you will read is it’s not pretty. All right, so anyway, so the point is that I want to stay away from that as much as I can. Kimberly (01:02:03.606)Mm-hmm. Mm. Kimberly (01:02:13.654)I love how you phrase it. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:02:16.78)As much as I can. It’s never going to be perfect. It can’t be a hundred percent, but I’m going to try to stay as far away from that as I can. organic is the way for us to accomplish that. Now that doesn’t mean that coffee is sprayed with glyphosate, but a lot of things are that you don’t even realize and it’s not on the packaging. They’re not going to tell you. So the way in which I keep myself away from that is by prioritizing organic. I also think that there’s a strong argument. If you can afford it. I mean, we all have to do what’s within our budget, right? Like I shop, I shop at Costco and Aldi’s because I have so many kids. So. Kimberly (01:02:50.922)Sure. Kimberly (01:02:55.604)and there’s so much more at Costco. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:02:58.228)can do quite a bit there. You can do quite a bit there. I can get a 10 pound bag of organic black beans for 10 bucks. So and that that feeds us for a long time. But anyway, I also think though that like if you can afford it, there’s a there’s also the environmental impact because many of these chemicals that are being sprayed, they don’t go away so easily. Kimberly (01:03:03.627)Yeah. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:03:19.95)and they linger and they impact the environment and even if it’s not on your food it still is depleting the soil and destroying this planet and that’s not what we want to hand off to future generations. Kimberly (01:03:32.564)Right, right. What affects the one affects the all because we are all one. Just where we started our discussion. Well, for what it’s worth Dr. B, this is my favorite book of yours. It’s the one that I found had so I mean, they all have so much fresh new information. But this one was really interesting, as I mentioned earlier, really easy to read because the citations are separate. Come from your heart. It’s holistic. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:03:46.006)Kimberly (01:04:02.358)It touches so many different topics. I think it’s a topic that we all need to be more well-versed in inflammation, whether we’re inflamed or we have a colleague or a family member or a friend. So I encourage all of you amazing community members who are listening to this right now to please share this episode with anyone that you think would benefit, as well as about Dr. B’s new book. Plant Power Plus, activate the power of your gut to tame inflammation and reclaim your health. Dr. B, where can we get your new book? Where can we learn more about you as well and your work? Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:04:40.3)My book is available everywhere that books are sold. I, well, well, but no, but I do appreciate the opportunity because actually like, think it’s really important to try to go to your local bookstore if you can. And the reason why is, can you imagine you don’t need, I don’t need data to back this up. Can you imagine how hard their sales have been impacted by, you know, companies that can ship to your door in two days? Kimberly (01:04:43.913)I knew you were going to say this. I had to ask though. Kimberly (01:04:55.455)Agreed. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:05:09.804)So, and I’m not saying I don’t want you to order from that company. can, absolutely. I’m grateful for anyone who wants to support my work. But what I am saying is like, I want these local bookstores to still be in business five years from now. And the only, that only happens if we go and we purchase from them. So, so there’s that. And, and then you can find me, my home base is the got healthmd.com. And from that location, you can find all the different things that I do. I wear many hats and learn about the different aspects of like the different opportunities for healing. Like basically I’m trying to impact people’s lives in as many ways as possible. So, and I have a new YouTube channel, So if this is going on YouTube, we should do it as a collaboration. That’d be really cool. Kimberly (01:05:56.032)Beautiful. amazing. Kimberly (01:06:03.984)Is it the gut health MD? Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:06:06.316)Yes, my handle is at the health MD although I’ve discovered that on YouTube that’s not the same as Instagram. Like you can’t search as easily but you should be able to find me. Kimberly (01:06:15.742)Well, we will link to all those sites and links over on our show notes, mysaluna.com as well. Thank you again so much, Dr. B for being with us, for sharing your wisdom. It’s always so easy to talk to you and just so refreshing to talk to someone who genuinely cares and is passionate about helping others as you so obviously are. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:06:41.774)Well, I’m very grateful for you. You’re as I said, and I really mean this. You’re like a sister. You have like a sisterly energy for me. Um, and I also want to share that it was really funny when my cookbook came out in 2022 and I came over to Kim’s house, uh, to record a podcast together and I asked her, can you do a yoga segment with me? And I am the least flexible person on the planet. And she was walking me through yoga maneuvers that are not highly complex. They’re like pretty basic, that are good for digestion. And it’s just, I don’t know. It’s hilarious, Kim. I got a lot of work to do there. I need some help. Kimberly (01:07:05.622)was thinking about it. Kimberly (01:07:24.668)It is a really fun memory. I remember getting on the floor at my living room and doing twists. Like, come on, Dr. V, you gotta get this colon twisted. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:07:33.966)I’m like, I’m trying, I’m trying. Kimberly (01:07:37.494)Well, you’re doing amazing in so many areas and congratulations again. I’m just so happy for you and your very well deserved success. Just being a voice of real healing, holistic healing in the world. So thank you so much and thank you all so much for tuning in. Like I mentioned, please share the show with anyone and all that you think would benefit. Dr. Will Bulsiewicz (01:07:52.174)I appreciate you, Kim. Thank you so much. Kimberly (01:08:02.644)The show notes again are at mysolluna.com. I’ll see you online as well at underscore Kimberly Snyder. And we’ll be back here in just a few days for our next show. Until then, take great care and sending you all so much love.

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Rachel Swanson Episode Summary In this episode, Kimberly interviews Rachel Swanson and they discuss the holistic approach to fertility and health, emphasizing the importance of understanding the body's natural intelligence. They explore the impact of technology and medical guidance on fertility, the empowerment of women in their reproductive journeys, and the significance of microbiomes in overall health. The discussion also covers metabolic health, methylation, environmental factors, and the importance of heart coherence in managing stress and enhancing fertility outcomes. Sponsors: EPISODE SPONSORS: FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY DETOXY OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. Rachel Swanson Resources: Book: Trying! A Science-Backed Plan to Optimize Your Fertility Website: https://www.rachelswanson.com/ Chapters 00:00 Holistic Approach to Fertility and Health 02:49 The Role of Technology and Medical Guidance in Fertility 06:05 Empowerment and Support for Women 08:57 Microbiomes: Oral and Vaginal Health 12:06 Metabolic Health and Its Impact on Fertility 14:51 Methylation and Gene Expression 17:55 Environmental Factors and Consumer Choices 20:43 The Importance of Heart Coherence and Stress Management 23:55 Conclusion and Call to Action SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY'S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript:  Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:01.063)Rachel, thank you so much for coming on today. Rachel (00:04.948)It is such an honor to be here with you. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:08.457)Well, I’m really excited to talk about your book, which is about fertility on the cover, but I really feel like it’s this larger plan for health and vitality. And I really appreciate you talking about that because I think it’s easy to, in all ways, our society always likes to take a fragmented approach. Let me just deal with this back pain or just sleep or just exercise versus you know, what we’re so about in our community, which is the holistic lifestyle. So what’s gonna help your, you know, overall lifestyle is going to support your fertility. And even if you’re not specifically ready to have a baby yet, just learning about some of these modalities can be helpful for other things and for later. Rachel (00:57.876)Exactly right. mean, I couldn’t have said it myself. And I guess just to, you know, to open the conversation, I mean, this could go so many different directions with what you’ve just said. But I guess, you know, from just what I’m experiencing, too, I mean, everything that you said, right, it sounds very intuitive in that sense, and it will definitely be intuitive to your community. But kind of what I’m seeing as the lay of the land and in clinic, especially, it’s like when it comes to fertility, we’re witnessing this. extraordinary tech advancement. have the AI accelerating discovery. We have multi-millions being injected into making procedures better. But Kimberly, what I find, at the same time, the guidance that we’re giving women about optimizing their own biology feels like prehistoric. I mean, it’s just there’s nothing proactive about it. There’s nothing personalized about it. so I just think that the reality is it’s become this, this topic has become this over medicalized conversation. And it’s like women are feeling behind, we’re always racing against the clock, right? I know probably someone listening to this right now will probably know that exact feeling. so it’s just, the decisions that are being made are like to start a family and to come into one’s full self. It’s like this. frantic energy when it should be coming from a state of like this abundant energy, right? This is one of the most powerful transitions a woman has and she’s like being stripped of the empowerment. So that’s ultimately why I wrote the book and why I gave it that framework that you just so eloquently spoke about because look, women deserve to understand how to leverage their body’s natural intelligence to optimize reproductive outcomes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:49.041)Yes. Well, I can say for myself that years before I even thought about having kids, I was starting to work on healing my gut health and find holistic tools for anxiety and meditation. And it wasn’t with the specific idea that it would help me get pregnant later. It was really this holistic approach, but you know, I’m really grateful and thankfully for me when I did go to have kids, it happened, you know, nearly on the, pretty much on the first try. And so what I see today is so many people unable to sleep, which is a natural function. So many people unable to poop, which is a natural function. And now we’re seeing, I mean, I read some of these numbers about, you know, IVF in your twenties. And there’s a lot of these influencers documenting their journey. They try a little bit and then it doesn’t work. And I wonder how much people are looking more deeply at some of the things we’ll talk about today, oral microbiome, vaginal microbiome, just so many factors that could help. Rachel (04:04.462)Totally, you know, and I think there’s so many biological hurdles that we’re kind of imposing on ourselves through our diet and lifestyle choices. And, you know, that’s making it harder to conceive. But if we take a step back, you know, that’s also setting us up for a more complicated pregnancy and having a lesser quality health span and a shorter lifespan. And so it kind of gets back to this point of what you do now. It’s, yes, you may not even think about, it’s setting you up for fertility or setting you up for success, but that’s exactly what it’s doing. And so, yes, to your point, if we don’t look at this deeper picture, how do we have the opportunity to kind of intervene and change the entire trajectory with what occurs afterwards? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:51.31)Rachel, are you a mom? Rachel (04:53.486)I’m not a mom. Right now I’m a mom to two amazing cats and hundreds of clients, it seems like. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:01.065)It’s really interesting. Can you tell us a little bit about being drawn to this journey? Because I’ve met some Ayurvedic doulas, several that aren’t moms as well, and their whole focus is taking care of these newborn infants and cooking for moms. And some of them have said, I feel like this is my calling. I mean, it’s really interesting. You write with such passion and you obviously… really heartfelt and wanting to support. you want it? mean, if I could ask these personal questions because I’ve always been in being a mom one day or do you feel like your service is to help women in this way? Rachel (05:32.534)Of course you can, I have an open book. Rachel (05:42.99)I absolutely will have a family one day. ideally, it will be with my child. But I see family in sort of a very different sense. I see it as people that we want to spend our entire lives with and figure out together our purpose and passion while we’re on this planet. And for a lot of people, that can look different than just having one’s own biological kids. But look, of course, I Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:52.434)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:07.325)Yes. Rachel (06:10.848)totally anticipate that being my path that I’ll go down, right, to have my own biological children. It hasn’t happened yet, but I can’t wait for it to happen. until then, I just think I do not need to be a mom in order to support other moms and support them getting pregnant. And I just felt in practice what I was seeing is women coming in and it’s like. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:29.616)Yes. Rachel (06:37.358)They were given fragmented advice. They were given such symptom-focused reactive advice from their doctors. And again, it’s like, see this as going into motherhood. I want women to sort of be the full embodiment of themselves, not in this constricted, restricted sense where they’re making all these changes from a place of fear. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:59.785)Right. Rachel (06:59.918)Right? So again, so that’s actually where the really the passion comes from. And also because like I get fired up knowing that what our conventional sort of, you know, medical system sets them up with, which is from a diet and lifestyle standpoint, nothing. It’s kind of like do whatever you you want, right? Especially if you’re going to be going under, you know, IVF or doing similar procedures of that matter. It’s like we’re we’re taught that, you know, nothing. nothing really matters. What we do sort of outside the clinic when it’s the exact opposite. I have over 400 studies proving that in the book. That’s why I was so passionate about it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:35.262)Yeah. Well, I think it’s nice to have the research to back up what we intuitively know when you go deep, deep, which is, most of all, life is a miracle. The fact that our bodies work and do all these things, we’re blinking our eyes, our hair’s growing, our liver is detoxing, our skin’s regenerating, babies are being created, it’s all a miracle. And there’s this beautiful reverence that we can have for it. And to your point, I think the lifestyle helps. to make it just more easeful for us to get out of the way, for the miracles to happen. We’re not doing it. We don’t have to make it happen. Sometimes it just feels like everything feels so forced and masculine and hardened and linear. And even if we’re, whatever pathway we’re going down, I think it’s really important to, you know, remember the miracle that this all is and soften into that. Rachel (08:35.148)You know, it’s, I love everything that you just said, and it really kind of speaks volumes. And I think it actually even speaks to the work that you do and that you help women and couples with, especially with your new book too. think that’s why this kind of blends, this conversation too, I so appreciate it because it blends so synergistically together, right? Because we’re saying the same things. We’re just kind of giving different. tools and frameworks for how to approach it and they all blend together. think it’s fantastic and that’s actually why I was looking forward to having this conversation because of that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:13.885)Beautiful. So let’s get into some specifics, Rachel. And I love all the different topics you talk about in your book. So for example, in our community, we talk a lot about gut microbiome. So we know we have amazing SBO probiotics that are clinically researched. We are large, or not everyone. I am plant-based. My kids are. A lot of our community eats largely plant-based. My husband is an omnivore. But I’m really interested how you talk about the microbiome throughout, specifically the oral, if we could start there, and then the vaginal microbiome. So a couple of weeks ago, I had an interesting podcast with Dr. Nathan Bryan. I don’t know you’re familiar with him. He’s an expert. So I’m reading the section here and I said, hey, this is the second time I’m reading this in a few weeks, talking about the correlation between mouthwash and blood pressure. Rachel (09:50.764)Yeah. Rachel (09:57.942)Yes I am. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:11.719)And I was reading this in the kitchen and our beloved housekeeper, Ms. Elena, who’s from Guatemala. said, Ms. Elena, have you gotten off the mouthwash yet? She’s like, the scope? And I’m like, yes, you have to stop. And she has blood pressure issues. And she’s like, you know, when I was growing up in Guatemala, we didn’t have all these products and all this stuff, right? It’s just, we’ve gotten so away from nature. We feel we have to sanitize everything. And as you and Dr. Brian talk about, it has huge implications for our oral microbiome. Just mouthwash, fluoride toothpaste. Rachel (10:46.12)So true. I’m so glad you kind of you segue this into the conversation because yes, I mean, just just that one study alone about the mouthwash and how, yes, it’s like we’re going to this over sanitization of all of these ecosystems that are actually there, you know, supporting us. But we’re like trying to wipe it all out, which is which is crazy. Right. So but yes, to your point that that one particular study, I mean, think about it. You’re literally stripping away. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:55.208)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:07.709)What? Rachel (11:15.618)the bacteria that’s going to help convert the nitrates and food into nitric oxide for your body. And we’re just wiping it out with all of our products, including our mouthwash. That’s why in a week, if someone uses mouthwash twice per day, it significantly increases their blood pressure. It’s just wild. Thank you for passing the message to your housekeeper and to everyone you know. It’s amazing what these little microbes can do. And so I, in the book, how it’s related to fertility is that I just see this, think of it as a Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:21.416)Yes. Rachel (11:45.25)you know, a reproductive relevant ecosystem, if you will. So if there’s dysbiosis in the mouth, just think of that as having, you’re having like a, it’s like a power imbalance among the microbes living there. If that’s coupled with inflammation that really sets the stage for what is periodontal disease, that’s actually what can spell trouble for the rest of the body and in other places besides the mouth. And so. I talk about it in the context of fertility, but you’ll also hear about it in the context of other diseases. It’s also associated with cancer. It’s associated with neurodegenerative disease. It’s associated with heart disease. So again, it’s like, yes, I’m zooming in and putting all the research behind how it relates to fertility and how it relates to optimizing reproductive function. But I just want everyone to know that everything that you and I are going to talk about today and everything that’s in the book. It has so much relevance outside of fertility, doesn’t it? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:42.121)I’m laughing Rachel because it is so hard to get my sons to brush their teeth. And I had the Pokemon toothbrush that they love. We are a fluoride free family. I love that bokeh, alpha hydroxy appetite. have kids flavors. So I make their toothpaste taste as good as possible. I don’t know what it is. Rachel (12:57.376)You had everything. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:11.005)what kids don’t like to brush their teeth. Rachel (13:14.508)Nope, not at all. almost have to, you know, it has to be sort of a state where like they are so happy, but also like willing to stand still or sit still for two seconds, right? But it’s like, you could only do the best you can as mom, which is getting all of these amazing, you know, toothbrushes and basically everything you can, but in the most natural way, just to, you know, get a little swipe here and there, right? Get like one tooth floss, but yeah, I get it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:24.852)my god. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:41.661)Well, on the other hand, I’m happy to say my kids drink the Glowing Green Smoothie. I took a picture yesterday of my younger son eating his large strands. We cut it in certain way of his kale salad. So it’s really great to start your kids young, I think, not to get off track here as much as possible with these simple plant-based foods. And even if I have a lot of moms writing in that their kids are struggling, We also have a lot of family-friendly recipes, Rachel, because my older one starts to get into foods that taste good, other sorts of treats, but there really is such amazing creative ways to bring it back. So back to your point, this is a whole lifestyle. It’s for fertility, it’s for families, it’s for just us being healthy in general, all these factors, oral microbiome, not to get off track, and also… vaginal microbiome, which I love that you talk about this. I love that you talk about products, the types of things that we’re using with our periods. I just did a full reset, Rachel, only organic underwear, because you start reading about the pesticides and cotton, right? Like the off gassing. So tell us a little bit about, you know, how these products and chemicals and Rachel (14:56.22)amazing. Well done. Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:09.659)other ways in which we affect our vaginal microbiome and how we can support it. Rachel (15:14.256)I can’t wait. But I guess to seal up the little present of the oral microbiome, you know, I just have to I have to say, look at also all the other things that you’re doing, you know, with your children and the diet that they have. Remember, diet is the lever, like the biggest leverage point for for a healthy oral microbiome. You know, when I did my clinical rotations for my license, it was so cool. One of the rotations that we did was at. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:30.322)Yes. Rachel (15:40.532)NYU School of Pediatric Dentistry, which was like wild that we were even able to have that rotation. And so basically what I was seeing every single day are like, my God, these poor like little kids coming in mouthfuls of cavities. you know, it’s because, you know, their parents were giving them soda all day long, or they were falling asleep with like a little juice bottle that was like rotting out their teeth and having so much candy. So I just think like, I know sometimes the biggest struggle will feel like brushing someone’s teeth, but look at how much you’re doing. And that’s really kind of controlling the oral environment. It really kind of comes down to diet. So, okay, next to the next present, this reproductive relevant ecosystem. Yeah, yeah, definitely. So, it’s the vaginal microbiome. there is newer research on this sort of, again, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:21.457)Yeah. Thank you for. Rachel (16:36.148)ecosystem that no one’s really talking about, but it has major implications for fertility outcomes. this is where for us women, signs and symptoms are our opportunity to kind of listen to what the body is telling us, right? We just have to be receptive to that communication. So a lot of women, luckily, they know if they’re experiencing something that’s abnormal, right? Or they’re having reoccurring symptoms. This is our way, this is our body telling us, like, it could use a little assistance, right? There could. Yes, yeast infections, bacterial vaginosis, these type of infections. And all I could say like, look, there might be like a little, you know, hostile takeover situation happening among these microbes. And lucky for us, we can measure that now at home with like a DIY swab kit. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:08.617)When you say symptoms, do you mean yeast infections specifically? Rachel (17:31.886)right, that we can send back to the lab. It’s amazing. And I guess to just kind of bring this back to a bigger picture, you know, if I were giving getting IVF, but I was having, you reoccurring symptoms for years where I was kind of in and out of the OB-GYN, having to take my antibiotics, this and that, I would sure as heck, you know, do a $200 test kit before spending tens of thousands of dollars on IVF, considering there are certain community state types. It’s called that influence IVF success. Do you see how wild this is? How we can do so much to optimize our own ecosystem, but we aren’t. We’re just kind of, to your earlier point, 10 minutes ago, it’s like we’re not really kind of trying to discover any deeper root causes or anything of that nature. But anyway, I find this really fascinating. And to your point, the products that we’re using, and I love how you just kind of did like an overhaul of all the undergarments. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:15.375)Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:20.194)It is. Rachel (18:28.31)A lot of the products that we’re using, unfortunately, I think of it as kind of, in a way, running interference on our bodies’ natural intelligence, right? So what can happen is that all of the products that we’re using, like douching and all these cleansing products, it can strip out the protective species. And what happens is that really sets the stage for more opportunistic bacteria to kind of take hold and cause problems. So yeah, it’s all about this conscious. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:36.851)Yo. Rachel (18:58.222)consumerism really, it’s like all the products that we’re putting in and around that area. mean, heck, we can put estrogen cream and other hormone creams to get absorbed. Like how could we not think that’s happening with all the other products that we’re putting down there, right? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:13.843)Well, so it’s funny that you say that word, douching. Rachel, I’m sorry, it’s a funny word. Is it still popular? Rachel (19:24.266)There’s a lot more people that do it than you think. mean, so much so it’s even mentioned in some of these scientific articles of what potentially can strip away bacteria. think you and I are so fortunate that we kind of almost live in these bubbles where it’s just like. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:29.683)Really? Rachel (19:46.454)We couldn’t think of doing that. And it’s like our entire community is like, we already know that we shouldn’t be stripping away all of this beneficial bacteria. But yeah, I mean, all of this is still very, very popular. I mean, just go into any CVS, look at all just the cleansing products there is, right? It’s nice. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:00.446)Right. Well, the good news is this saves money, right? Get rid of the mouthwash, sweep the fluoride free, toothpaste, do not douche, straight up. And then, you know, some of the things you talk about in here, go fragrance free in soaps, body care products, be careful of chemicals in your period products. I use a cup, but if you’re using tampons, make sure that they’re, you know, Rachel (20:08.065)Hahaha Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:34.073)I mean, there’s some crazy stuff in cotton, which I’ve read about recently, which is why I switched to organic underwear, lubricants you talk about, and of course, taking care of our gut microbiome with diet probiotics and so on. Rachel (20:42.125)Yeah. Rachel (20:48.404)Exactly. And I guess one about the the period products, I know we we like automatically our mind jumps to tampons, pads, these sort of things. And, gosh, I actually really hate saying this because I’m so like pro innovation, right. And it was products that help women out. But I kind of think about like all of these brands that are doing this this underwear that like helps to like absorb the blood right during the menstrual cycle. And in reality, like think of how that’s Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:13.852)Yeah. Rachel (21:17.134)possible, like think about how many chemicals that takes to be able to do that. So a lot of these period products unfortunately have a lot of the forever chemicals, the PFAS and like that. And so yeah, it’s a lot. And I think that was kind of a lesser known fact and it definitely surprised me as well. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:27.943)Mmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:37.501)Well, what do you think about cups? Because it makes sense to me, environmentally, I just wash it out. Rachel (21:44.182)Yeah, yep. So that’s seen as kind of the, you know, one of the best options in that category, right, of all the options that we do have. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:52.679)Yeah. Okay. All right. So let’s, let’s move on, Rachel. Let’s talk about, I love, you know, metabolic health again, back to our overall vitality body composition. And can you speak a little bit how this is related to our overall health and our ability to do natural functions such as get pregnant and have babies. Rachel (22:18.036)Yeah, absolutely. Metabolic health, think, well, to take a step back before we kind of dive too clinical into what this means, I like to think of it as, you know, it just has to do with the flow of energy through our system, right? I mean, that’s what it’s all about. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (22:33.147)Yeah, but under our spells, our prana, essentially. Rachel (22:37.28)Yeah, thank you for that. So when there’s an imbalance here with our metabolic health, clinically we call that metabolic dysfunction. It’s basically an energetic blockage in our body and it really can interfere with our goal of getting pregnant. I’ll give you just a few examples of what the research has found. Metabolic dysfunction, you know, that can impact egg quality, sperm quality, embryo quality. It can interfere with hormones, the hormonal communication, which influences our monthly cycles, including ovulation, of course, which is necessary to get pregnant. It impacts our chances of conceiving. It impacts our chances of IVF. It can increase complications in our pregnancy. And this also, this conversation also applies to men as well, right? So there, if they have metabolic health or whether they have metabolic dysfunction, this can impact our ability to get pregnant as well as complications we can experience during pregnancy, which is wild. So why do I bring this up? Again, maybe this doesn’t really apply to a lot of your community members. Maybe it does, but let’s look at the country. And in terms of the country stats, know, one in 10 people approximately. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (23:34.889)Yeah. Rachel (23:51.498)in this country are defined as metabolically healthy, which means I’m like, hey, Kimberly, 90 % of us might have this opportunity to optimize our body in a way that’s going to get us closer to our goal. So there’s a few biomarkers that I speak about in the book that kind of tells us, hey, how is this system functioning? How is energy flowing through our body? And I specifically talk about blood sugar, like knowing your fasting blood sugar, also knowing your Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (23:59.945)Yeah. Rachel (24:21.102)HbA1c, which is like a three month report card of your blood sugar and knowing your insulin levels. The reason I just I think insulin is so gosh darn important is because, you know, insulin resistance means our cells aren’t responding properly to this hormone, right, as it should. This is what underlies PCOS, which for goodness sakes is the number one cause of anovulatory infertility globally. Right. So that’s what Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (24:26.983)Mm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (24:44.04)What? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (24:48.777)It’s growing too, right Rachel? Is it not going up? Rachel (24:50.824)Yes. So that’s why I actually take this so seriously in the book. And I’m like, we can nourish ourselves in a way that can facilitate better energy production in our body. And of course, there’s the entire chapter on it. There’s action plans, there’s everything and how to personalize it for your body. But that’s kind of just, again, the lay of the land and kind of what we’re dealing with and the opportunity. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (24:56.445)Yeah. Rachel (25:17.816)that we have to optimize our physiology in our favor. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (25:22.065)And you also talk about that in regards to methylation, gene selection. And that also is a larger topic around lifestyle, how we eat. Can you touch on methylation briefly? Rachel (25:34.286)my gosh, you bet it is. So methylation, think of this as the process by which your choices, like your food choices, your thoughts, your environment, your stress levels, it essentially can think of it like speaking to your DNA. So we can’t change the genomic sequencing, but we can change how DNA is expressed, which is heritable. That means it’s passed out to your child. And so we can actively create this internal environment. that’s full of vitality and that we can literally pass this vitality down to our child. Think about the health crisis, our children, and teens who are involved in too. I just think we have a responsibility here and that starts with preconception health. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (26:07.271)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (26:18.791)You know, it also, I really think, includes heart coherence, Rachel. Think about the difference when you’re in your heart and you’re connected to yourself, to your partner, to others. You’re less likely to eat crappy food. You have these loving thoughts. There’s all the research about heart coherence as well with the hormonal balance and just the energy opening up. So that part too, I think, preparing for preconception is making sure you create stability in your environment. you work through certain things. No one’s gonna be in a, you it doesn’t have to be perfect, but I think all of this is part of that totality. Rachel (26:58.124)You know what, Kimberly, this is why we need you here on this planet. We need your work and we need your books because for goodness sake, I mean, that’s it’s such a cornerstone of what we’re trying to accomplish here. And if we don’t put in the work with exactly what you’re describing, everything else is going to seem so much harder again. So, I mean, I guess I guess I’m here shouting out your book because it’s like everyone can take those little moments for themselves and Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (27:18.258)You Rachel (27:26.382)put their physiology in a better place, right? That is kind of what’s most surprising to me. I know in the book we talk about, say, like the environmental chemicals as an example, right? And all of these stressors in the environment. But here, what you’re talking about, I’m like, this is actually the most underrepresented topic when it comes to of toxic, is toxins in general, because it’s like. How are we speaking to ourselves? How much stress are we dealing with? What are our self-limiting beliefs, right? So on and so forth. I think we could talk about it now or just on that subject alone. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (27:55.113)It’s. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (28:02.429)I feel like heart and head can work together, right? Knowing the facts, knowing the research, feeling confident that you’re doing everything for your oral microbiome, for methylation, and it’s important to have that knowledge. And then I think it’s also important to marry it with your heart being in it because as we know, stress can really affect fertility and outcomes and stress affects us in our life overall. So I’m really glad you take such a holistic approach to Rachel. Rachel (28:32.896)Yeah, it’s this is this what it’s it’s all about. You know, I always speak to the science. Obviously, the book is crazy evidence based and so many citations. But look, again, this is just validating this kind of like this ancient wisdom to the intelligence that you’re speaking about right now. Right. It’s just kind of, you know, putting evidence behind it. But we all of this, we know it to be true. Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (28:58.909)Yes, we’re all a miracle. The fact that we’re here. And sometimes again, I think we move away from that and there’s so much fear and panic and anxiety if you start to get too much down the rabbit hole on Google or social media feeds. So, I really appreciate you bringing your wisdom, but also your heart, The through line I always say of our guests and our show, and I can really tell as I’m reviewing all these books, is the authenticity and wanting to help. And obviously you really do have so much love in your heart to want to support other women. And it comes through in the book, it comes through in the way, the clarity and also the succinctness, I will say, with which you write. Because, you know, people are pretty busy and You you say a lot in a readable book, and I think that’s really important to offer people as well. Rachel (30:01.902)I mean, Kimberly, if I told you, like, I don’t even want to admit how many years that took in order to do that and how many rewrites. I mean, it’s almost embarrassing when I think about it. So you saying that is like the biggest compliment for me. Because again, over three years, like rewriting, rewriting to just kind of, you know, get this message so succinctly, having women being able to optimize their physiology in a way that’s, you know, actionable. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (30:12.403)No. Rachel (30:31.79)You know, not just woo woo, but like really also putting evidence behind everything again that your book talks about. It’s amazing. It’s this sort of synergistic energy that we can bring to help lift up other women. So thank you so much for having this conversation. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (30:47.817)Well, thank you so much, Rachel. And I had to say, I’m looking forward to when you do become a mom, because you are going to be this living embodiment of all this work and all your teachings as well, when it’s meant to happen at perfect divine timing. Share with us, Rachel, where we can get your book, Trying a Science-Based Plan. Rachel (31:01.87)Thank you. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (31:12.861)to optimize your fertility and I’m smiling because it’s science-based, but there’s so much heart in it. Your work where we can find out more about you, your book, your work and so on. Rachel (31:23.648)Yes, my gosh, so please pre-order the book. It’s on Amazon. It’s there waiting for you. And you can find out more information on my website, rachelswanson.com. My Instagram is at Rachel’sRx. I’m going to be getting a lot more social with this book launch, because I’m used to being behind the scenes, right, in clinic, kind of one-to-one care. But I’ll be coming out of the woodworks more. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (31:42.418)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (31:46.781)So amazing. Well, the world needs your heart, Rachel, and congratulations on your first book. Thank you so much for sharing your, again, your wisdom and your heart. Thank you everyone so much for tuning in. I encourage you to share this episode with anyone that you know that is trying to conceive, that is looking to optimize their health and wellness as you heard today. This isn’t just about fertility, but whole body well-being. think all the information we talked about with the microbiome and the oral microbiome could really help so many people. So please share the show. Our show notes will be at mysaloona.com where we will link directly to Rachel’s book and her work, as well as other articles and shows I think you would enjoy. We will be back here in just a few days. I’ll also see you on social at underscore Kimberly Snyder. Till then take great care and sending you all so much love.  

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Dr. Grant Elliot Episode Summary In this episode, Dr. Grant discusses his personal journey from being a competitive athlete to becoming a chiropractor focused on pain management. He emphasizes the importance of movement as a form of medicine, the impact of beliefs on pain perception, and the need for a holistic approach to treatment. The discussion covers the complexities of lower back pain, the risks associated with surgery, and the significance of unique movements in rehabilitation. Dr. Grant also highlights the emotional factors that contribute to pain and offers insights into managing hip pain, particularly in relation to pregnancy. He concludes by providing practical advice on time commitment for pain management and resources for further assistance. Sponsors: LMNT OFFER: Right now, for my listeners LMNT is offering a free sample pack with any LMNT drink mix purchase at DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD. That’s 8 single serving packets FREE with any LMNT any LMNT drink mix purchase. This deal is only available through my link so. Also try the new LMNT Sparkling — a bold, 16-ounce can of sparkling electrolyte water. USE LINK: DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD Feel Good Digestive Enzymes OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. Dr. Grant Elliot Resources: Website: therehabfix.com Social: @rehabfix Chapters 00:00 Introduction and Setting the Stage 00:13 Exploring Wellness and Nutrition 00:16 Introduction to Pain and Healing 03:21 The Journey to Chiropractic Care 06:23 Understanding Lower Back Pain 09:12 The Mechanics of Movement 12:26 The Role of Perception in Pain 15:18 Surgery vs. Conservative Care 18:22 Movement as Medicine 20:44 Understanding Pain: Beyond Posture 24:29 The Emotional Impact on Pain 29:05 The Multifactorial Nature of Back Pain 29:57 Exploring Hip Pain and Its Connections 34:14 Efficient Movement Protocols for Pain Relief 37:12 Resources for Pain Management and Assessment SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY'S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: speaker-0 (00:00.257) Welcome to the Feel Good Podcast, which is all about heart led living and wellness. When we awaken the power of our hearts and let that guide us through our daily choices and decisions, through our four cornerstones, food, body, emotional well-being and spiritual growth, we will experience the most incredible results and create more vitality, health, strength, peace, abundance and love in our lives. I am your host, Kimberly Snyder, New York Times bestselling author, founder of Saluna, creator of the research-based Heart Aligned Meditation, wellness expert, nutritionist, and international speaker. I am passionate about supporting you on your unique heart and wellness journey. Let's get started. speaker-1 (00:57.518) Hi everyone and welcome back to our Monday Interview Show. Very excited to share a conversation with you here today with Dr. Grant Elliott, who is a pain rehab specialist. He is the founder of RehabFix and he specializes specifically in back pain, sciatica, avoiding surgery. In fact, he says 97 % of people don't actually need the back surgery that they're prescribed. He's worked with many different prominent wellness and other types of people, including Dr. Andrew Huberman, helping to relieve pain through simple lifestyle practices and movement, which we'll get into today. Now, I was interested in doing the show because I think pain is really pervasive. If you start to listen to loved ones, to friends, colleagues, you'll start to notice a lot of people complaining about pain. And so the strategies we talk about today are accessible and again, can be a really powerful way to avoid surgery. So I'm really excited to share today's show with you. Whether you have pain or not, this is information that can really be useful to you and also loved ones around you. Before we get into the conversation though, a little reminder that our notes are at mysaloonit.com. We will link to our... links and research that we talk about on today's show, as well as other podcasts, articles that I think you would enjoy. You can also sign up for our newsletter on there to stay on top of our community happenings. We send out so much amazing information, including free recipes, promotions for our saluna digestion focused supplements, which are a really powerful way to elevate your lifestyle. Also, Free community Zooms, we'll have one coming up in January. I'm doing a couple of retreats next year. So it's a great idea to come deeper into our community by joining our newsletter. I also thank you in advance for taking just a minute out of your day to leave us a review on Apple, Spotify, wherever you listen, which is an amazing way to support the show. Also by sharing this episode or the show in general with anyone that you think would benefit. speaker-1 (03:17.57) All right, all that being said, let's get into our conversation today with pain specialist, Dr. Grant Elliott. Grant, thank you so much for being here with us today. I'm very excited to chat with you. Yeah, likewise. Thank you so much for having me. I think your work is fascinating because you're working with a body in such an intelligent, integrated way that many of your clients are not only reducing pain, but they're also reducing their amounts of surgery that they have to get. So I think it's really fascinating what you're doing, but before we dive in, I'm interested how you even were drawn to this line of work in the first place. Did you experience a lot of pain? Did you have it around you? What did your path entail? a few series of interconnected events. I would say the first one was, you know, growing up, me and my brothers were boys in athletics, always, you know, fitness aware, health aware, I would say. And I saw a common trend amongst pretty much all of my grandparents, which were declining health, pill for this, pill for that, injection for this, injection for that, surgery for this. And even at a younger age, I kind of observed that and I was like, you know, what if like you tried speaker-0 (04:35.8) getting healthy, know, novel concept. But I kind of like saw that even at a younger age. once I was in like middle school, high school, and I kind of was starting to think about what do I want to do? And I knew I wanted to go into some form of health fitness related thing. Well, when I was in high school, I was a competitive cyclist and I was doing cross country mountain bike racing and I was good. I was doing scholarship opportunities. and I was, I was competitive. I was good. I started dealing with a little back pain and this back pain started insidiously, which is the most common way back pain comes up. Kind of we, we kind of start to notice it. We wake up with it one day and it starts to last a little bit longer, a little bit longer. And then a few weeks, a few months go by and we realize, Hey, this thing is kind of not going away. This is a majority of scenarios. And that was kind of me. It hurt the most during my races. during my highest output, I'm gonna bend over position, pushing myself hard. And it started to get to the point where within 15, 20 minutes into my race, which they were normally an hour and a half to two hours, my low back just felt so like swelled up and pumped and stiff and achy. had to get off the course, I had to get off the trail, go into the woods, start doing some stretches in the woods to be able to get back on and continue. And I was doing that over almost every 10 minutes. And as you can imagine, you're not competitive anymore if you do that. So I went from winning almost every race, usually first or second every race, to going worse and worse and worse and worse and worse. And so my dad was like, hey, chiropractors, they're the low back specialists. Let's go see one. And what I know now is that we went to see what we would consider a old school, traditional type chiropractor where it's the here's your x-ray, your spine's crooked. You got to come see me multiple times a week. And we didn't know any better. A lot of people don't. And not that there's anything wrong with that, but it's not the most effective form of care. And which is what we're going to talk about today. And so I did that and surprise, surprise, did not get relief, didn't get better. So my performance continued to decline. And so I eventually just stopped racing, lost my scholarships. speaker-1 (06:55.264) It's so hard mentally. Yeah, it's, it's frustrating. Like with anyone, if you're a, you know, a hundred percent into something and you're finding identity in that and you're viewing that as, Hey, this is going to pay for my school. Yeah. Well, you know, there's some attachment to the hat. Um, so that was difficult and yep, that's kind of where I found myself. And then I just had to find a different outlet for athleticism and fitness. So just started working out, just went to a gym. never had a formal gym membership. Uh, at that point I was just in sports. So I joined a local gym, was working out, and I started to notice this one individual there who was doing unique movements, unique like warm-up drills, mobility drills, like activation drills, just unique movements that I hadn't seen before. So I approached him, talked to him, developed a relationship, and he ended up being a chiropractor. So I made the comment to him. I was like, hey, you know what? Like, the things you're doing, like, I've never seen them before, the way you talk, just the things you talk about. seemed completely different than my experience with a chiropractor. And he was like, well, I think he should come shadow me. So I went and shadowed him. And I saw my first example of an evidence-based chiropractor, which is, you know, including rehab and manual therapies and a lot of education, movement education, helping people to become independent as quickly as possible by teaching them how to fix themselves. I witnessed that and I realized, okay, if this is what I had had, probably wouldn't have quit racing. I probably wouldn't have lost my scholarships and my situation would be different. And so that motivated me to become a chiropractor to ensure that I could prevent as many people as possible from having the situation that I did. And that is what ultimately led me to this field. speaker-1 (08:44.238) What an amazing journey, know, the saying the wounded healer, if you hadn't gone through those experiences, maybe you wouldn't be so passionate about the work that you're doing because you lived through that loss and that attachment and pain for so long. Yeah, it definitely creates motivation to say the least. And so it was really just the drive for like, Hey, I wasn't a success. I was a failure. And so I just want to make sure I can go into this, be the best version of this so I can help as many people as possible and reduce the number of failures. Because I quickly realized, and this applies to any profession, any profession of any kind, the majority of any profession is average. I'm seeing all these individuals with low back pain specifically go to their general provider and get general advice and go to general chiro, chiros and general PTs and just get like, you know, kind of just generic stuff. And I was like, yeah, well, this isn't working because low back pain is the number one disability in the world. And so that just, you know, made me put my a hundred percent focus into being a rehab evidence movement based provider for that to do my part of making a dent in it, so to speak. So a couple of things in your story that were interesting, one is that you were a super athlete, sounded like you were training all the time and you got lower back pain. And sometimes we hear, sitting is the new smoking. So lower back pain can affect people that are very active and on the flip side, people that aren't moving very much at all. Is that right? Absolutely. Yeah. And, the term sitting is the new smoking. Actually not a huge fan of that term because there's really, there's really nothing wrong with sitting. The issue is if we stay in the same position too long and we don't move enough, that's the main issue. If you sit for eight hours straight and you don't move, you don't exercise. All right. Yeah. You're smoking, but if you happen to sit at work throughout the day, but you take frequent breaks and you have an exercise routine and you get your walks in, then there's nothing wrong with, you know, speaker-0 (10:51.352) But to your point, yes, obviously anyone who is moving more is healthier, in better shape. That's going to reduce their incidence of injury and chronic disease and all the things that go with it. That is obviously a given, but that does not mean they're immune to it. Not at all. And so we see two main things as know, individuals who are very active, who are pushing themselves, there's usually common patterns that they either fell into or doing that can still perpetuate. low back issues, can still create these symptoms to occur. And then on the other side, like you said, people who are not moving enough, who are just sitting all day, not getting the right movements, don't have mobility routines, yeah, they're also suffering. And what we do know is that, yes, the healthier you are, the more like you are, that the easier these things are to overcome. it's, you know, the couch potatoes, frankly, that have the highest incidence of injury for sure. And yeah, that's not a good recipe for any form of health. Can you share with us anatomically, you say lower back is where a lot of people feel pain. Why is it the lower back, the couch potatoes and all kinds of athletic people versus let's say the shoulders and the upper back since we might be looking down a lot on our phones or computers or driving. What is it about the lower back do you think? Yep. There's two main components here. One is a mechanical perspective and then the other one is a societal conditioning belief perspective. And so what I mean by this is one, our lower back, it's the primary lever arm for all movement. So if I sit, that's where majority of the force is going. If I stand and I bend forward, that's where a majority of the leverage is going. If I'm reaching out to, you know, pick something off the ground or catch something that's still pulling on my lower back, it's the It's a primary lever arm. We use it for everything. It is involved in every position. So therefore it has the most amount of stress on it. Now, one thing I want to say there is don't hear what I'm not saying. I'm not saying that stress is bad for your lower back. Stress is good for us. Stress is good for our muscles, for our bones. When our muscles are under stress, they grow and they get stronger. When our bones are under stress, they grow and get stronger. When our low back is under stress, it can still grow and adapt and get stronger. speaker-0 (13:12.46) It is still a primary lever and it still is stressed the most. You combine that with a societal belief, a societal narrative that's very, very negative about lower back pain and that creates the number one disability in the world, which it is. 80 % of human beings alive will experience low back pain at some point in their life. It is the number one disability. It costs over $100 billion in healthcare expenses and everything. It's massive. It is massive. What I mean by the second point there is if someone, let's just say hurts their elbow, they're telling their friends, they're telling their family, nobody's freaking out. They're probably just saying, that sucks. I'm sure it'll be better in a week or two. Right. You know, it's, no big deal. But the belief system, the narrative about low back pain is such that as someone says, I hurt my low back, then people are responding. my gosh. Should you go get imaging? my gosh. My. My aunt Susie got a back issue and she was never the same for 10 years. She's using a walker now. She didn't get surgery. It's there's all these really, really negative narratives about lower back pain because it's so misunderstood. So well, people don't realize is pain is common. And to a certain extent, pain is normal. It's a part of the normal human experience, but it's how we interpret that pain. And it's what we do with that pain that determines where we go and determines the level of disability and suffering we might occur. So, yeah, somewhat out there, let's say for the last 10 years, they've heard all these horror stories about people and their family who dealt with low back issues or their friends, families who dealt with low back issues. Let's just say that's ingrained in their mind of, my gosh, back issues, super bad, super serious life altering. And that's ingrained in their mind. That's their belief system. Okay, now let's take a very normal incident. Someone is, let's say moderately active. And then there's a particular day where they're working in the garden two extra hours. They sit at work a couple extra hours. They're not moving as much as they normally would have. They have had a really stressful week. They ate maybe a few more inflammatory foods than they otherwise should have. And then, my gosh, I gotta go, you know, move all these boxes, help my friends move. It's a lot of work that maybe their lower back is not used to. And they go to bed and they wake up and... speaker-0 (15:39.278) They're a little back sore. No big deal. No big deal. But because of their belief system, what they've heard for years, they take that very normal, very common experience and they catastrophize it. It's, my gosh, it's doomsday. I just woke up and I'm experienced back pain. This is bad. I need to run to the hospital. I need to run to my doctor. I need to run to imaging. option. It's the perception and that creates an avalanche and a spiral that people get trapped into and it leads them to the wrong forms of care extremely quickly. And that's what turns it into a chronic issue. speaker-1 (16:27.872) Even in these winter months, hydration cannot be forgotten. We don't want our skin and hair to become dried and frayed and for our energy to start to lag. Hydration is about water and also electrolytes, which need to be replenished regularly. You can do that through your diet and also by the insurance of drinking a daily element electrolyte pack. This is something I do as part of my morning practice. Now, in the morning when I drink my room temperature water, I add a element packet in, usually watermelon or raspberry, which are my favorite flavors. And what I find is that it supports consistent energy. It wards off fatigue and it helps my skin to glow. I love the element brand because it contains a science-backed mix of magnesium, sodium and potassium. It doesn't have added sugars or fillers or preservatives. And right now for our amazing community to get in on this. Element is offering a free sample pack with any Element Drink Mix purchase. Please go to www.drinkelement.com slash feelgood. That's eight single serving packets for free with any Element Drink Mix purchase. That's www.drinkelement.com slash feelgood. We are not what we eat, we are what we digest. And to support you each day, Saluna's Digestive Enzyme Supplements support your highest levels of health and beauty and youthful vitality, which is really the life force running through you, your aliveness. Created to aid the body's natural digestive process, these unique digestive enzymes work directly on the food you eat to help break down macronutrients, protein, fat, and carbs, and fiber. into a form that can easily pass through your digestive system and be utilized by your body to benefit your health and beauty. In other words, these saluna digestive enzymes save your body energy, which over the long term helps to preserve your own life force and keep you youthful. Key benefits and ingredients include enhancing digestion and assisting in the absorption of critical nutrients, delivering two to three times more lipase versus other top formulas, speaker-1 (18:49.784) for optimal fat metabolism, including specialized enzymes to help break down plant fiber, helping to reduce bloating, gas, and other sources of digestive distress, providing powerful anti-Candida enzymes for faster healing and detox. Please go to mysaluna.com and use code PODFAM15 for 15 % off your entire order, including these amazing digestive enzymes. Once again, that's mysaluna.com with the code PODFAM15. MySOLLuna.com, code PODFAM15 for 15 % off your entire order. speaker-1 (19:35.63) It's also kind of scary how, I don't want to say knife happy or prone to recommending surgery. A lot of doctors are right off the bat. I have heard, I know people who have gotten back surgery and it said that they said it didn't really help their pain. They still had the same issues. But to your point, when you perceive that something's really scary and wrong, you can be more susceptible to agreeing to surgery without exploring some of these other means. And that is Oof, that is pretty scary. Yep. So we're the number one online low back program in the world. We have over 200 consultations a week with people all over and we get clients every single week who have had one to three surgeries already on their lower back and are in the exact same position or worse positions. Wow. And if we look at what the evidence shows, the evidence is really clear. They call it the third, third, third rule. The goal of a good surgeon is that 30 % of the individuals that undergo low back surgery would be deemed success, which just means their outcomes improve. 30 % of people improving is a good goal. About 30 % will stay the same. No change, just as much pain, no change. But now they've undergone an irreversible procedure. Yeah. And then about 30 % will be worse. So when we average these out, the failure rate is around 50 % or more. my god. speaker-0 (21:04.204) And then what we see is that with every consecutive surgery that is performed, the risk of chronic pain and the outcomes only go down. They get worse and worse and worse with every consecutive surgery. But how does this contrast with what the evidence shows us? And this is why it's so important to understand the evidence and to be an evidence-based provider so that you can have the knowledge and be equipped to make the right decisions. We know that 97 % of lumbar disc herniations, which is one of the most common lower back issues that are operated on, 97 % can recover without surgery. No surgery needed. Wow. the movements that you were talking about. Yes, conservative therapy. only about 3 % of people with painful lumbar disc herniations will require surgery. But I'm telling you this, there's no way, there's no chance if you take the average percentage of lumbar surgeries performed across the world, there is no way it's 3 % of individuals. It is way more than that. Way more. So, surgeons are performing surgeries that are not indicated. Surgeons do not know the clinical indication for surgery, which is crazy to think about, but a lot of them don't. And yeah, it's, you know, this is what I do. This is what I get paid to do, which there's nothing wrong doing what you get paid to do. There's nothing wrong with that. But if, you know, they're not taking into consideration clinical protocols and clinical indications and any MRI they get, that shows a disc, regardless of if the disc is symptomatic or not, they're saying, hey, it's my job to cut this out. speaker-0 (22:39.384) then we're gonna get a lot of really, really poor outcomes. And this is what we're seeing in healthcare. Wow. So going back to, I like this phrase you used earlier, unique movements. And in our society, the way we move is very linear front and back. You mentioned you having a healthy lifestyle moving in general. Some of your videos on your Instagram channel are unique. And I think, know, interesting, but also a lot of them are quite accessible. There's some circular movements, there's different ways in which we move. So can you talk a little bit about your philosophy? I know there's so many different exercises, but moving with in unique ways and how that can help the pain. Yeah, here's the most important and easiest lesson we can, you know, describe in a verbal format. So first and foremost, we all need to understand that movement is medicine. Movement is medicine. Now, with that being said, different movements are different forms of medicine. There's going to be certain movements that are beneficial to someone, and right now I'm primarily talking about people who have pain. They have sciatica, they have a disc herniation, they're symptomatic. Certain movements will make them feel better and certain movements will make them feel worse. So movement is medicine, but different movements are different forms of medicine. And we want to find the right medicine for that person at the right dosage and at the right frequency. Just like your pharmacist would do for an alternative condition, you want to treat movement the same. So yes, movement is medicine, but just understand speaker-0 (24:19.448) my gosh, I tried movement and I'm flared up and I'm worse and my gosh, movement won't help me. That is not true. That is not true. You have to find the right medicine, just like you would for any particular condition. Now, with that being said, the easiest way to evaluate one's movement is to think, okay, what are we doing the most of throughout our day? We need to think about this. So for a majority of individuals, they're going to fall into a category where we are sitting most of the day, which once again, there's Nothing inherently wrong with that. It's if we don't do anything about it that creates the issue. But if we're sitting most of the day, think about the position that that puts our body in and various joints. So most of us are probably sitting right now. Let's think about this. Your knees are bent. Your hips are flexed, meaning your knees are closer to your torso. So there's a short angle in your hip flexors. Your lower back is probably rounded forward. Your mid back is probably rounded forward. Your shoulders are probably rounded forward. This is a position the majority of us are going to be in. So here's how we think about it is if that is the position that our joints and our muscles are getting the most of throughout the day, we want to do the opposite of those motions to undo the stress and the forces that are placed on them. It's like, I'm, imagine I'm bending, this might be a silly example, but sometimes silly and basic examples work the best. Imagine there's a moldable piece of aluminum, let's say, okay? And we're kind of pushing it one direction. We're pushing a little bit more, a little bit more, a little bit more. And it's slowly bending to the side. You're thinking, okay, that piece of aluminum, that's not very straight anymore. How do we straighten it back up? By bending it the other way. So, If our low back and our hips, let's say, if they're getting a whole lot of one motion, one motion, one motion, one motion, a majority of the day, you're putting stressors on that that are, you know, might eventually put it in a position where, hey, we can't tolerate this anymore. So we got to start to bend it back the other way to get it straight. And that's the concept of doing more of the opposite, doing more of the opposite. So if my low back is in a flexed, rounded position most of the day, speaker-0 (26:37.144) I need to do more of the opposite. need to stand up straight. I need to put my back in an extended position. I need to get on the floor, perform a Cobra pose for repetitions, get my back into an arch position. I need to do extension-based movements in the gym for my hips. Okay, if my hips are in a flex position, same thing. I need to get more hip flexor stretches. I need to do hip extension-based movements. I need to do glute motions that involve pushing my hip into extension. This is gonna do the opposite. reverse the motions that are being overdone on these regions to help undo a majority of the stress. And so there's many different movements that can satisfy this protocol. But the easiest way to look at one's situation, because remember, people have different lifestyles and they might be in different positions throughout the day, is if you can analyze your body and think, okay, what position are my joints in eight hours a day, start to do more of the opposite. You mean while you're so there's the movements that are the opposite. But what about grant our posture and manipulating how we're sitting for those hours? Is that part of your protocol too? Well, Not necessarily. Because if we look at the evidence, we know that the evidence does not support a causational relationship between posture and pain. Really? That is interesting. speaker-0 (27:57.302) Yep, doesn't exist. Posture is very commonly a narrative that is inappropriately pushed on a lot of people and is blamed when it otherwise should not be. posture, think about it this way. If I'm sitting down, if I had been forward and I had been back, I was just in like 30 different postures. A posture is just one position at one moment in time. To take someone's entire pain experience and to stamp the label, it's because of your posture. is a huge disservice, it's incredibly negligent to your job as a healthcare provider and to the person who's dealing with pain. Because here's what I mean by this. Pain is influenced by so many things. Yes, it's influenced by mechanical stressors, what we're doing and what we're putting on our body throughout the day and the positions we're in. But also it's influenced by interpersonal relationships. It's influenced by stress at work. It's influenced by diet. It's influenced by sleep. It's influenced by our belief systems. It's influenced by all of these things. So if someone has, you know, situations where it would involve multiple facets and we take all those things, we don't analyze their sleep. We don't analyze their lifestyle. We don't analyze their emotional impact. We don't analyze their belief system. We don't analyze anything. We don't analyze their exercise. We don't analyze their movement. Nothing. And we go, yeah, your back hurts because your posture. man. That's one of the worst things you could tell someone because you're isolating them into a box. It's fractured. Yeah, you're segmenting them. You're fracturing them. And so if you're labeling them with that, and so now the only thing they're doing is, you know, obsessing about their posture, but all these other things are occurring in their life. They're movements off. They're not getting the right movements. They are getting bad sleep. They have bad to all these things. And that's not being adjusted. Then they're going to stay trapped in this box for a really, really long time. Wow. speaker-0 (29:51.95) So we don't want to make that mistake. So posture is only important in the context of being aware of the position you're in too long. So if I sit in a bent position for a really, really long time, that is one posture I'm in for too long. That's not going to feel good. But also if I sit perfectly straight, shoulders back, my gosh, I look beautiful. Okay. If I stay in that position for a long straight, that's not going to feel good either. We don't want to be in any one posture for too long. We want to be in as many different postures as possible as frequently throughout the day because the best posture for you is the one you're in for the next five minutes. It was really interesting too. You just mentioned talking about emotional impact or state. Do your clients self-report that, saying, you know, I'm feeling frazzled or I'm going through a lot of turmoil in my life? How do you measure that? Yeah, this is more of a delicate concept because some people don't believe that emotions, stress, mindset can play a in their pain. Some people don't believe that. They might interpret that as being, you're telling me the pain's in my head. And we say, no, but also, yes, 100 % of our pain. is created by our brain. All pain is created within your brain. All pain is real. Pain is an experience. So one, people might have a belief that, these things aren't involved, so don't even suggest that to me. And that can become a bit of a friction point, if you will. Other people might agree with that, but might be withholding that form of information. There could be a certain level of comfortability that might be needed to disclose those things. So the manner in which speaker-0 (31:49.058) we can breach these topics needs to be delicate. So there's usually a few signs or symptoms that we can identify that usually relate to more of an emotional origin or a stress origin or a mental origin related to it to some capacity. There's many different variables when I say mental origin. There's many different places. But if we hear some things that we think could be related, then some very, very simple questions that could open some doors could just be, hey, do you notice more pain at work? Okay, well, they're going to say yes for one of two reasons. Either one, because the position they're in while they work actually increases their pain, or just the environment they're in increases emotional stressors, increases mental stressors, and therefore that increases their pain. And we can identify that through a little bit of questioning. If not, we might say, Is your pain worse at home? Maybe they feel completely fine at work and maybe they're sitting at work and then they go home and sit and they're not fine. Why would that be? Is there something about your home environment that causes increased emotional stress or anxiety or things that relate to that? Outside of that, additional questions are, when this pain began, was there anything substantial that changed in your life? That's an open question. Other deeper questions could be, Has anything significant happened recently to any close friends or close family members? And there are many scenarios where a loved one to any capacity was either in an accident or was very ill or passed away. And that was in direct relationship with that individual's pain experience. And once we were able to identify that and relay that education and help the individual realize that, that sort of autonomy over their pain experience and that understanding and feeling independent and more in control. That was all they needed to start the healing process. That can be very powerful. speaker-1 (33:54.03) It's so powerful because people do fracture. Like we said, there's a lot of specialists that are like, well, I only treat, you know, your nose and throat and forget about everything else or only your liver, only your bones. But seeing we're whole beings, right? And we have the mind, we have emotions, we have the physical body and they do interplay and they do, they do affect. And there's so many studies now, seeing how stress affects hormonal regulation, affects digestion. So it makes sense that different factors, it's multifactorial when you're looking at back pain. And I'm really happy to hear that you're taking that holistic approach, which some practitioners don't, obviously. Yep. It's, you look at back pain as a whole, 90 % is called non-specific low back pain, which is exactly what, you know, that the title says non-specific. You cannot trace it back to one specific thing. And that's not to say that there can't be a clear mechanism of injury for low back pain. Like a really common presentation is, you know, we'll work with someone who's active, common gym goer. They might have done a heavy squat, done a heavy deadlift, or maybe they just... Maybe they weren't working out, they're in their home and just bent over to pick up their phone and they felt a pop in their lower back or it seized up. And now they're speaking with us. Yes, in that scenario, you might think, that seems pretty specific. It was that one thing they did. But even in that scenario, it's not that clear cut. Yes, that tells us the mechanism of injury. But we have to trace the steps back to, well, why did that thing create the injury? And then we have to look back at everything else that we've discussed up until this point. is nonspecific. It's multifactorial. There's many, many different things involved. So looking at those things, figuring out what might be missing, and then combining that with the proper rehab plan that does address the actual joints, muscles, disc, nerve in the way that they need, that's the recipe. speaker-1 (35:53.528) Sounds like a good recipe. So, Grant, thankfully, not going to go here, I don't have lower back pain except for when I was pregnant twice, right? I think that's pretty common in women. But I have experienced hip pain, and I believe that's fairly common in women, and I don't know if that's related to the lower back and the other factors you were mentioning, if there's a relationship, if it's separate, if it also has to do with hamstrings. Can you share a little bit about hip pain? Yeah. First off, pregnancy is a very, very common period of life for low back, hip or sciatica induced pain. There are things that you can do to manage symptoms in the later stages of pregnancy. But this is a really common onset. There's obviously a lot of stress and a lot of changes going on within your body. you can find symptom management. You can find significant symptom reduction. It's usually difficult. Let's just say, for example, like my wife, I've had three young kids. I got a four year old, a three year old and a seven month old. And my wife, you know, I'm the low back guy, but even still she developed on and off sciatica around, you know, month seven, month eight, you know, month nine. At that point, there's only so much you can do. There's still a lot you can do, but there's only so much you can't, you know, eliminate it. There's stresses going on in your body. So. The main reason for this is not only the force distribution within your body, but then of course the hormone relaxin that relaxes all of your ligaments, increases ligament laxity as a whole, joint laxity throughout your body that can therefore create pain in various places. So the pelvic floor is related to this as well. Pelvic floor strength, pelvic floor integrity, that relates to your hip and the low back relates to your hip. Two things that are affected during So when we look at the hip, we look at above and below. We look, okay, what does the ankle do? What does the knee do? What's the integrity of the pelvic floor, especially as it relates to women primarily who have gone through labor and then the low back, the low back and the hips, they're like best friends. If one isn't happy, usually the other one isn't either. So really the two main things to look at in any area of the body, but primarily the hip would be, okay, is there a joint restriction? Is there a position of your hip that you're not getting enough of? Is the joint itself essentially locked up? speaker-0 (38:19.534) and not going a direction otherwise should be. And then what is the stability of the hip as a whole? That would be impacted by muscular strength and muscular function in different ways. So usually we see a few common patterns of the type of stability that's missing. So to keep things super generic, if someone has hip pain, we want to focus on the lower back because that's a relationship. We want to rule out the lower back, make sure the lower back is not referring to the hip. And then once that Okay. speaker-0 (38:49.568) is checked, okay, then we're focusing on the mobility of the hip that is primarily deficient and then stability of the hip that is deficient. And that's sort of the blueprint approach to addressing hip pain. I remember I went to see a, not a chiropractor grant, but a fascia specialist and he was having me do clam shells to try to stabilize the hip. You're smiling. didn't probably, a bit basic. Well, it's all relative to where the person is at. I clamshells are very basic exercises. It's this minimal load. But if the individual performing them cannot tolerate more load than that, then it would be appropriate for that situation. The only issue is a majority of individuals who are given that exercise, they can usually handle more load than that. The vast majority of individuals dealing with pain are significantly under loaded, which means not enough weight is placed on their body, not enough like stress is placed. So imagine I'm in the gym and I'm double curls with one pound. That's not going to do anything. I should probably do more weight than that. So that's load. So if we look at a healthy individual who's remotely active, clam shell is not going to be enough load most of the time. Yeah. Okay. So if someone's listening to this and they're interested in learning about these movements and they're also saying, which to be honest, I say to myself, Hey, you know, I'm a pretty busy working mom. How much time would I need to a lot? And of course the, you know, the higher the pain, you're, you're, you're more willing to do more. But in general grants, someone's doing your protocols, seeing your videos, doing, you know, going on your website, making consultations. speaker-1 (40:34.702) How much time in general, I know this is a really blanket statement, would one have to dedicate to these movements? You shouldn't be dedicating more than 10 to 15 minutes a day if you have the right plan. Wow, that is not what I expecting her to say. That is amazing. 10 to 15 minutes. Okay, sign me up. That is, it's precise, it's specific, and it's effective. You don't need more time than that. Think about it this way. I used an analogy earlier of movements medicine. You got to find the right medicine. imagine if I walked into a pharmacy and I was like, I don't really know what I'm dealing with, but I got symptoms. I don't really know the names of these medications or what they do, but I'm just going to kind of take everything and like walk around and guess. Okay. That's what it's like for a lot of people dealing with back pain or other pain who are just searching the internet for various exercises, trying random things. That's what they're doing. Now, once again, movement is good. Movement is good, but movement is medicine. And if you have pain, you will do movements that hurt. You will do movements that are better. You've got to identify the right ones. So what we do is we help someone accurately identify their situation. We walk into the pharmacy, know, theoretically, we're not actually doing this. speaker-0 (41:56.994) We clear all the shelves and we say, yep, these are the two that you need to take the first week. These are the two. This is how often, this is how many, just do that. So now we have the most targeted approach towards that specific condition. So they're not wasting their time doing 30 minutes, 60 minutes, two hours of stuff that is not specific or targeted to that particular issue. So when you have a very, very targeted approach, you can do a lot less and get way more significant of a result. once again, don't hear what I'm not saying. I'm not saying people can be super healthy for the rest of their life, only 10 minutes a day. That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying if we have pain and you have a rehab plan, 10 to 15 minutes is all that's necessary. But of course, when we get people healthy and they can get back into the gym and do things, obviously we want to spend more time exercising and moving and investing into our health. Yes, of course, it's the whole lifestyle. Like we said, sleep and food and everything. are you saying, Grant, I can put some weight on my knees and keep doing my clam shelf? Yeah, you can load yourself up. Put a barbell on your back, rip a barbell off the ground. Do some weight, baby. That's good for everybody. So, Dr. Grant, thank you so much for sharing your wisdom with us. I love your holistic approach and the evidence-based and the fact that you're including emotional well-being and the specific, the targeted, pain from a very wide palette. So where can we learn more about your work? And if someone's interested in doing your program, where do we go? speaker-0 (43:40.398) So you can find me and my team and all of our content searching RehabFix on all platforms. I'd like to provide anyone listening or watching is if you go to my Instagram,And you just message us the word podcast. Nothing else. Just message us the word podcast. I will actually send you a do it yourself assessment, which is a process that we normally take our one-on-one clients through. And this isn't shared anywhere. This isn't posted anywhere. This is only going to be exclusive to the people who listen to this podcast where you just message the word podcast. I'll send you a video. It'll take you through a do it yourself assessment. I'll walk you through the tests you should do. I'll walk you through the exercises you should do. And the majority of people see real time diagnosis, real time relief during that so that you can get a direction where to go. And of course, at the end of it, if you want more help and a more plan based on your findings, you'll have the opportunity to reach out for us for that. pain reduction and also as we just spoke about reducing unnecessary surgery. So please share the episode. Please go to mysolluna.com for the show notes. We will also link directly to Dr. Grant's website and his handles. And you can also find me on Instagram at at underscore Kimberly Snyder. We will be back here in just a few days. So till then take great care and sending you all so much love.

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Dr. Amy Killen Summary: In this enlightening conversation, Dr. Amy Killen discusses the evolving landscape of wellness technologies and supplements, focusing on collagen, hormone replacement therapy, and the importance of ovarian health. She emphasizes the connection between inner health and outer beauty, particularly skin and hair health, while also addressing the role of lifestyle factors such as diet, stress, and sleep. The discussion extends to the potential benefits of peptides, the impact of sugar and caffeine on health, and the significance of melatonin for sleep. Dr. Killen empowers listeners to take control of their health and well-being through informed choices and lifestyle adjustments. About Dr. Amy Killen A leading longevity and regenerative physician, entrepreneur, speaker, clinical practice owner, author, and frequent media guest, Dr. Killen has become an outspoken advocate for empowering people to look and feel their best by combining lifestyle modification, integrative medicine, body-identical hormones, peptides, and regenerative therapies. Dr. Killen, a former emergency physician, has firsthand experience with the bureaucratic obstacles that can delay critical treatments from reaching patients. Driven by a passion for healthcare innovation, she is dedicated to making effective yet underutilized diagnostics and treatments widely accessible. Dr. Killen is committed to transforming healthcare through entrepreneurship, education, and patient empowerment. She is also the founder and CEO of the Human Optimization Project (HOP), a longevity-focused supplement company dedicated to providing women with unique, science-backed products designed for convenience and effectiveness. These easy-to-use, portable solutions target aging at the cellular level. Additionally, Dr. Killen is the co-founder and Chief Medical Officer of Humanaut Health, a cutting-edge longevity clinic franchise. Humanaut Health combines hormone therapy, peptides, regenerative medicine, lifestyle medicine, and advanced diagnostics to deliver a tech-enabled, proactive approach to health optimization. In her Utah-based practice, Docere Clinics, Dr. Killen and her colleague, Dr. Harry Adelson, pioneered the Full Body Stem Cell Makeover, one of the most innovative regenerative procedures currently available. Guest Resources: Website: www.dramykillen.com, Hopbox.life Social: @Dr.AmyBKillen Episode Sponsors: FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY GLOWING GREENS POWDER OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. Episode Chapters 00:00 The Rise of Wellness Technologies 03:03 Collagen: The Controversial Supplement 05:58 Skin Health and Inner Wellness 09:04 Hormone Replacement Therapy: A Deeper Dive 11:51 Understanding Testosterone in Women 15:07 The Role of Ovarian Health 17:57 Peptides: The New Frontier 20:45 Sugar and Women's Health 23:50 Caffeine: Friend or Foe? 26:50 Melatonin: The Sleep Hormone 29:44 Hair Health: Addressing Hair Loss 32:47 Empowerment Through Knowledge SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY'S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:01.226) Dr. Amy, thank you so much for joining us here today from Utah, right? Amy Killen MD (00:05.902) Yes, yes, I'm in Salt Lake City, Utah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:08.534) It's amazing how connected we can be wherever we are. I was thinking about, I've been excited to talk to you for a couple of weeks. I feel like this is such an exciting time for all the new technologies and wellness products and wellness modalities. But there's also so much confusion out there about what works and what doesn't and what people should be spending money on. So it's exciting, but it's also an interesting time, isn't it? Amy Killen MD (00:40.32) It is. It is. hard to know what's good and what's not sometimes. There's so many options out there these days. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:46.87) And I know you speak to many subjects, but I want to start with one supplement, which we've all seen that just blew up, which is collagen. And I always was, I suspected something was going on with it, Amy, because it just sort of seemed a little strange. And I didn't know if we would actually do anything to eat collagen. It was sort of like this idea, you have to eat hair to grow better hair versus nutrients that support it. I read a really interesting article you wrote about how the research seemed promising and then more started to become uncovered. Can you share a little bit about your findings? Amy Killen MD (01:27.342) Yeah, collagen is one of those things I've kind of changed my mind about. And I don't think it's bad by any means. I think it has purposes. I think it's still probably good for, especially for joints and like musculoskeletal health. But I have changed my opinions about collagen for skin health in that I don't think we have as much data as we thought we did. So there were a series of studies over the last couple of decades on collagen for skin health and... The short version is the initial kind of meta-analyses where they bring all the studies together from like 2021, 2023 were very promising. And it seemed like, you know, taking collagen in orally as a powder or drink or whatever, you know, could actually improve skin hydration and elasticity and make people look a little bit fresher. And so, you know, I'd been recommending collagen for years based on all of those initial studies. But a new study, our review article came out in 2025 that basically, you made me little bit weary about those early results. What they did was they took all those initial studies and they categorized them by who was funding the study. So if it was industry funded, if it was the college and company was funding it, it went in one bucket. If it was not industry funded, it went another bucket. And they found that all the studies essentially that had good results were industry funded. And if you looked, took those off the table, then collagen did not seem to really improve skin health. So it's still, I think the jury is still out. Like we still have more to learn, but at this point, I'm not a hundred percent convinced that collagen is the panacea we thought it was for skin. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:03.476) Right. And in your work, Dr. Amy, I know, you know, so many of us want to look good, like you mentioned, people want to look fresh, they want their skin to look good, they want their hair to look good. But also on a deeper level, and I've always believed this, your skin and your hair and these outer markers, if you will, for beauty do have relevance to your inner health, your organ health, what's going on in the cellular level. Can you speak to that as well? Amy Killen MD (03:33.218) Yeah, absolutely. think the skin is just one more visible marker of health in general. So absolutely, I think the foundation is always going to be the same things that make us healthy, know, clean diet, exercise, sleep, you know, all those kinds of things. For skin, getting some sort of protection from UV light, especially in the skin that's exposed to UV light over and over again is important for aging, for slowing down aging. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:52.907) Yeah. Amy Killen MD (03:57.09) But we always want to start from the inside, but as a sort of midlife woman, I also am very, conscious of like, what else can I do besides live healthy? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:07.092) Yes. And what else would you say if someone wants to go beyond collagen? Like you said, might be great for joint health, but the reasons people, a lot of people were buying those products was because they wanted to improve skin elasticity. So beyond healthy diet, what have you seen that actually does have merit? Amy Killen MD (04:21.388) Yeah. Amy Killen MD (04:26.104) I mean, the biggest things that we know work, we know that sunblock works. So like, like a mineral sunblock, like zinc oxide or titanium dioxide. It sits on top of the skin, doesn't get really absorbed into the skin. And you know, I think that that's really important as just put it on every day before you go outside. I'm a big fan of the sun, but I also think we have to protect the, especially the face and neck and those areas. So that definitely works. Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:32.444) huh. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:47.189) I'm laughing because I just came from Hawaii. I'm like always trying to wear a hat because to be honest, Amy, you know, I try with the sunscreen. I put it on the face, but you know, the hat is always in my, our farm cars. So I try to keep that consistent. Amy Killen MD (05:01.612) Yeah. And you know, mean, some sun is healthy. Like we know that some sun exposure is very important for overall health. know the population that gets sun tend to have lower risks of diabetes and multiple cancers and heart disease and all kinds of things. So some sun is important. It is also one of the biggest drivers of aging in the skin. So the other thing I really like, I think that retinoids have a lot of evidence behind them. They're one of the best studied. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:05.762) Yes. Amy Killen MD (05:28.438) ingredients for skin health. And that's like retinols or a treatinol and retinoids and things like that. And you can get those over the counter or you can get prescriptions for stronger ones, but we know those work. And then good antioxidants applied topically to the skin as well as taken orally can also be helpful. Like astaxanthin, for instance, it's a great, it can be taken orally and it has great skin benefits and also some sun protection benefits actually. And you can also apply it topically. So things like astaxanthin, vitamin C, vitamin E. Some of those have really good research for both oral and topical applications for skin. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:03.562) And he still holds, Dr. Amy, that if we're trying to get pregnant, if we are pregnant, we should avoid retinoids. Amy Killen MD (06:10.86) Yeah, avoid retinoids, especially the stronger ones. Always talk to your doctor before you're taking anything, certainly orally. I don't know about what the research is right now on the weaker topical retinols when you're pregnant, but I would definitely talk to your doctor first. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:27.328) There's also a lot of conversation around hormone replacement therapy these days. There's a lot of conversation, menopause, perimenopause. Is one of the benefits, because I've heard different things of taking hormones, can that improve your skin and bone health as well? Amy Killen MD (06:45.326) Yeah, absolutely. we lose... So women during perimenopause, which you know is about five to 10 years before menopause, and it can start as early as 35 or so and still be normal, perimenopause, estrogen and progesterone start to go down. And estrogen especially is very important for your skin. It helps your body to maintain the collagen in your skin. In fact, when you go through menopause, you lose 30 % of your collagen in your body system-wide. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:55.54) Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:04.758) Mmm. Amy Killen MD (07:15.552) it just drops off a cliff because it loses the estrogen signal that is required to keep the collagen in the tissue. replacing estrogen whenever it's time to do that, usually it's late perimenopause or early menopause, can really help to preserve skin elasticity and hydration and structure and all of those things. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:15.552) Wow. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:36.426) What if you're in your 30s and you don't have any of these symptoms yet? You you still get your period every 28 days and your moods are stabilized, you're sleeping well, you don't have hot flashes. When would be a signal that says, hey, you might want to explore these hormone replacement options? Amy Killen MD (07:56.206) know, if you're in your thirties and you're feeling good and your cycles are good, you're, probably good. Like you don't necessarily have to go do anything at that point. In general, it's usually people when they get a little closer to the forties or when you're starting to have symptoms, like you're all of sudden, you can't sleep at night, especially like the two weeks before your period, or you're really irritable or you're having really bad PMS pain or symptoms. Um, there's a lot of different kinds of symptoms often in the, in the weeks before your period that will signify that, that progesterone is starting to go down and that you might. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:03.285) Yeah. Amy Killen MD (08:25.826) want to talk to your doctor about replacing that. That's the first hormone we usually replace. Or other changes, libido changes, weight changes. There's so many different things that can happen during that timeframe. But if you feel great and everything is going as scheduled, then you don't necessarily have to worry about your hormones in your 30s. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:39.574) Thank Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:43.126) But by 40s and 50s, it's something to explore. Amy Killen MD (08:47.862) Yeah, usually, I I recommend at least talking to your doctor about hormone optimization therapy once you get close to menopause because these hormones have so many long-term health benefits. So not even just treating symptoms, but also preventing osteoporosis or preventing dementia or heart disease or some of these things that are more common in women and especially become common after you lose estrogen and the protection of that. even if you're not having symptoms, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:06.193) Bye. Amy Killen MD (09:14.818) you know, by mid forties or so, I would recommend talking to your doctor about kind of game planning, how you're going to approach hormones later on. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:22.848) Well, maybe some women would need a different doctor or a more specialized hormone doctor because, you know, some doctors don't seem to know that much about this, the general practitioner. With a sigh. Amy Killen MD (09:32.726) Yes. know, unfortunately doctors, yes, doctors I know it's so frustrating. Doctors only receive about like less than two hours in the U.S. less than two hours of training in menopause throughout their entire medical career. Now OBGYNs may get a little bit more and I think we're starting to see more awareness around this. But like when I went through and most doctors went through, we didn't talk about menopause. We didn't talk about replacing hormones. And so most doctors that are out there just haven't had the education. And unless they've taken it upon themselves to take courses and go through programs, they just really don't know that much about what really happens during these transition periods for women and why it's so important to talk about them. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:19.254) What are some of the questions someone should ask a potential doctor? What should they look for? Because again, that becomes confusing. And I've also seen Dr. Amy people giving advice and then you look a little deeper and they're chiropractors or there's something that is not there. They still are a doctor, but something that's unrelated. But maybe they did do the courses. So who knows? I don't know. Amy Killen MD (10:36.28) Yeah. Amy Killen MD (10:41.378) Yeah. Yeah. think that, you know, making sure that you have a medical provider who is able to prescribe drugs in general is important. You chiropractors can't prescribe most drugs. So they're going to be, they'll have a, they have a toolkit that they can use, which a lot of them are very smart and very informed, but their toolkit is not going to include prescribing hormones. So sometimes that will bias them a little bit. Like they'll, they'll, they'll say, well, you shouldn't do hormones because X, Y, and Z, but part of it is cause they can't prescribe hormones. But I would say, talk to doctors and ask them what their experience is prescribing these body identical or bioidentical hormones, which is what we want, and how open they are to it. And are they offering it to most of their patients, or is it just a small number of patients who take it? Are they trying to not just treat symptoms, but also prevent future diseases with these hormones? I think it's also important. And also, talk to your friends if you have people, other friends in the space who have gone to doctors and get recommendations from them, because it can be really hard. It can be hard to find a good doctor, I think. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:45.408) Do you think that with telehealth now, you can meet with a doctor online, you can send in blood work, it sort of opens up the field, doesn't it? Amy Killen MD (11:54.55) It does. think it's definitely getting easier. And, one of my companies is Humanaut Health and we have in-person clinics and then we're building out the telehealth as well. And we do hormones and longevity medicine, but there are a number of other companies that just do telehealth and they do a great job. And I think that, I do think that there's more availability of these services, but they are usually cash pay. Like you're not usually using insurance to pay for these. And so obviously that's not going to work for everybody. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:22.464) Right. So going back to the hormones for a moment, testosterone is something that we usually hear for men, know, replacing their testosterone as they age as well. What about for women? This is an interesting topic. Amy Killen MD (12:34.971) you Yeah, yeah, you know, it's interesting. Women actually have more testosterone in their bodies than they do estrogen. When they're younger, like when you have before menopause and really even after menopause, we make more testosterone and we have more testosterone in our bodies at any given point than we do estrogen. And yet. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:55.446) after you start getting your period or pre-mences. Amy Killen MD (13:00.202) once, yeah, once, once like from puberty on your body's making testosterone and you know, we think of testosterone as being a male hormone, but it's really just a human hormone. We all have it. We all need it. And so absolutely. think that, you know, offering it as, you know, replacing it in women can be important. Not all women will need testosterone replacement. Some people continue to make it and it's testosterone is a little different than estrogen and progesterone because it doesn't like fall off a cliff at. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:03.818) Wow. Amy Killen MD (13:29.782) at menopause. Your body still makes testosterone even as you age, but you're just making less and less each year. So it's similar to men. You just make less and less and less as you get older. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:40.16) So once you get on that train of hormone replacement therapy, how often would you have to get checked to see if the dosages need to be tweaked or how you continue? Because it sounds like there's changes that progress. Amy Killen MD (13:51.672) Yeah. Amy Killen MD (13:57.366) Yeah, you know, and yeah, so usually I recommend patients get seen every three months in the beginning and get lab work done and see your medical provider every three months. And especially in those early months, you're going to have some adjustments to these medications because there's not a single, you know, no, no one dose is going to work for everyone. And there are different ways to take the hormones that you can take them as a pill or a patch or a cream or a trochee under your tongue. There's all these different methods. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:03.724) wow. Amy Killen MD (14:24.054) and each one has pros and cons and each one works differently in different people. So there's a lot of kind of adjusting and tweaking that happens during the first three, six, nine, 10 months or so that you're on hormones. But then once you get on something where you feel good and your levels are pretty steady, then you can space your visits out a little bit more if you want to. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:45.482) What do you think, Dr. Amy, about our grandmothers and our great grandmothers that went through menopause? I just think about my grandma in the Philippines. I don't, I mean, people didn't talk about it as much, but she didn't seem to complain that much about it. Do you think with microplastics and pollution, it's harder on our hormones and shifts, or do you think women just didn't discuss their challenges as much because they didn't have the technology? Yeah. Amy Killen MD (15:12.386) Yeah, I think that's a great question. I don't know the answer for sure. I know that we're not going into menopause earlier necessarily. Like we do know that like endocrine disruptors and microplastics and toxins in the environment can affect our ovaries. And people who have a lot of exposure to those things can go into menopause earlier by about two and a half to three years. So that is a problem, but like population wide, we're not necessarily going in earlier than, you know, our grandmothers did. But Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:31.51) Hmm. Amy Killen MD (15:41.73) whether or not they had as severe a symptoms, I don't know. I think that they probably were just really tough and they just didn't talk about it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:49.522) Right. Now speaking of ovarian health, which is also another issue, fertility is an issue. Just so many issues now that I feel like in the last 10 years are being talked about. People are doing IVF in their 20s. What's going on with our ovaries? Amy Killen MD (16:09.678) You know, the ovaries are really the pacemaker of our female body in terms of determining how quickly you age and kind of how well you age. you know, we don't talk a lot about ovarian health, but the ovaries are much more than just a reproductive organ. So certainly we need them to ovulate and have eggs and to make babies. But because you're making these hormones, estrogen, progesterone, testosterone in the ovaries, as well as, you know, 40 or so other chemicals that are being made, the ovaries kind of decide how quickly the rest of your body is going to age. And it's interesting, but I think, you know, as far as fertility goes, you know, there are, think a lot of it is environmental. A lot of it is, you know, the, the endotoxins and the, the liquid disruptors. And I also think that the lifestyle is a big part of it. We know that stress, for instance, has a very direct result on ovarian health and ovarian function, sleep, diet, exercise, you know, all the things that we know are important. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:43.168) Wow. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:51.798) controls. Amy Killen MD (17:07.392) All of those are sending messages to the ovaries to help the ovaries decide, you know, kind of how healthy they could be and then whether to ovulate or not. And so there's a lot of things that go into it, but the ovaries are very receptive to everything that you're doing in your life, better or worse, to make yourself healthier. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:27.092) that interesting. I wonder what traditional Chinese medicine says, the emotions associated with the ovaries because, livers, anger and spleen is sadness, but I've never heard that about ovaries being an indicator of your overall aging. That's so interesting. Amy Killen MD (17:43.148) Yeah, I don't know either. I don't know much about the Chinese medicine, but I think that we haven't paid enough respect to the ovaries over the last, you know, hundreds of years. And finally, researchers are saying, this is really important for how women age, not just fertility, but also how we age. So I think that they'll finally get some respect and we're studying them, but it's about time. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:04.022) So something as simple as respecting circadian rhythms and wearing blue-light blocking glasses and things like optimizing your sleep can really help ovarian health. Amy Killen MD (18:14.594) Yeah, Overe, you know, when you, the ovaries are really interesting. know, every month you release one egg, right? But what people don't know is that up to a thousand other eggs start to develop throughout the month. And the only one is chosen to ovulate to get released. But the other ones, all the other 500 or thousand eggs that started to mature, those will die. So basically every month you're losing up to a thousand or so of these very precious eggs, which is horrible. I know. And then when you run out of eggs, that's when you hit menopause. And so the question that researchers are asking is, can we slow down the rate that we're losing these eggs? Can we have fewer of these precious eggs start to develop? we're testing drugs, like people are testing drugs like rapamycin. How does lifestyle affect this? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:43.151) It's like a fish with all the eggs, you know. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:50.88) Right? Amy Killen MD (19:07.462) because once the eggs start to, whenever they die in the ovaries, it's called atresia, they start to release these inflammatory signals. And so it makes all the ovary, like all the rest of the ovary becomes like a less hospitable place to the future eggs. So there's a lot of things that are happening in the ovaries that are reflective of health. Some of it's just genetics, but there's a lot also reflective of your health. And so we know that we can move some levers with the ovaries, but we don't have control over genetics, obviously. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:35.99) Oh, it's interesting again, back to my grandmother from the Philippines who lived in a very rural existence and she had healthy babies, Amy, to 48. Right. that was, started at 18, had a few, took a big break, went back to school and started at 36, I believe, and had six more. Amy Killen MD (19:45.666) Wow, that's amazing. Amy Killen MD (19:56.462) How many she have total? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:58.089) She had eight, but one died in infant mortality. Was it very, very early on. But NAD, I read some interesting research about how that can help with ovarian health. What's your opinion on that? Amy Killen MD (20:03.224) Wow. Amy Killen MD (20:14.626) Yeah, there are some animal studies that NAD precursors like NMN or NR might be helpful in improving ovarian health, as well as some of the other kind of longevity supplements that are out there. Some of the antioxidants may be helpful in reducing the oxidative stress in the ovaries and help as well. Melatonin is another one that's been studied and has some good animal research for it, as well as like DHEA, which is another oral hormone that we can take. So there's a lot of animal data. Unfortunately, we don't have a lot of human data yet that these are particularly healthy for us long-term for ovarian health. We just don't know. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:53.386) Now this is a big question Amy, and I know it's individual and it's complex, but another big trend out there is peptides. And it seems like when you go down that rabbit hole, there's so many. And for the person that's like, I want this and I want this, then you can suddenly start taking all these different peptides. I am not as well versed. I don't take peptides myself right now, but wow, I have friends that are taking all sorts of things. Amy Killen MD (21:21.773) Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:22.634) Can they counteract? Do we need all these different peptides? Do they work? I mean, I'm sure that research is also ongoing. Amy Killen MD (21:29.526) Yeah, mean, peptides is a whole category of these molecules that are essentially just short proteins. So a peptide is just like a few amino acids long. So it's a very short protein strand. And most of the ones that are talked about widely are also made by your own body. you know, essentially can we replace some of these peptides that they all do very different things and they all, you know, will bind to receptors and have very direct actions in the body. And I guess the short version is there are, there's hundreds, maybe, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:57.334) Yeah. Amy Killen MD (21:58.488) thousands of peptides out there and they all do different things. Most of the research on most of the peptides is primarily in animals, although certainly, know, peptides like the GLP-1s, which is Ozempic, you know, and Monjaro, those are peptides. And those, of course, have really good strong human data on them at this point. So I think peptides are fascinating. We use them a lot at Humanoid, but you also do want to have a medical provider who understands them because there's so many of them, like you said. They can have interactions. are some of them you want to cycle. You you use, do them for four or six weeks and then you stop them for a period of time. Some of them you can do every day. So it's, it's a whole thing that you want to have someone that really knows what they're doing. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (22:42.442) And also you still wanna maintain the healthy lifestyle habits. Like we said, you still need a healthy diet, you still need to exercise, you still need to sleep. It's not like a magic needle. Amy Killen MD (22:52.064) It is not. Yeah, it's all always start with the foundational stuff. I think of peptides as being, you know, like an icing on the cake or maybe it's the sprinkles on the icing on the cake hormones or the icing and the peptides are more like sprinkles. But so, you know, those things can be helpful in situations, but that's not the thing you reach for first when you're looking for help. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (23:11.03) Right, right. It's like the layer, layers up. Can you talk a little bit about sugar, Dr. Amy? We hear a lot about sugar for different aspects of health, but specifically for women's health, ovarian health, of the hormones, some of the topics we've been discussing so far. Refined. Amy Killen MD (23:15.533) Yeah. Amy Killen MD (23:31.918) Yeah, I I think that keeping your blood sugar in a healthy range is very important for longevity. We know that. Certainly simple carbohydrates and actual sugar, like table sugar, if you get too much of it can affect your blood sugar and can cause problems down the line with more rapid aging of all different parts of your body, your ovaries, your blood vessels, your brain. So maintaining a healthy blood sugar is really important. I don't want people, I don't like the idea that we shouldn't have any sugar. I mean, I think that that's a little crazy that, you know, to say that all sugar is bad all the time, but it's like anything else. you, know, moderation is important. know, knowing how sugar affects you specifically is important. Tracking it potentially, like putting on a glucose monitor can be really helpful or at least getting blood work, you know, every three to six months and making sure that your markers of insulin sensitivity and resistance are in a healthy range. So certainly follow it, but you know, I like a dessert at night if I'm Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (24:03.413) Yeah Amy Killen MD (24:27.648) if I've been pretty good all day, you just don't want to go overboard with those things. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (24:32.574) Yeah, I mean, we were just in Hawaii. As I mentioned, I love fruit. We're eating papayas off the tree and guavas, but in a fiber-filled form, not the juice, with the whole fruit. And that feels really good in the body as well. Amy Killen MD (24:40.194) Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Fruit, think, is amazing. Certainly, you could do too much of it, but it's really hard to get too much fruit. Unless you're diabetic, most people are not eating too much fruit. I'm not worried about that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (24:57.354) Bradley fruit and fiber, because another big trend with protein, Dr. Amy, I see a lot of people just having protein bars and protein shakes. We need protein, but there's so much, you know, unprocessed foods that can come with that. And then people aren't as focused on fiber. Amy Killen MD (25:07.501) Yeah. Amy Killen MD (25:18.146) Yeah, I think protein and fiber, especially as I get older, know, as I get closer to 50, which is like next month, I start thinking more and more about, you know, how I need to be eating every day. Like how much protein am I getting? How much fiber am I getting? Like those are the two things that I really pay attention to for myself and my patients, especially midlife kind of and older women, because fiber we know is important in so much as far as disease prevention, cancer, heart disease, obesity, diabetes, and then protein we know is important for building muscle and maintaining muscle. And that's one of those things that your body doesn't store those amino acids in any form except for your muscles. So if you're not eating the protein, then you can break down your muscles, which is obviously not what we want. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (25:52.086) right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (25:59.638) What do you think of amino acid supplements? Amy Killen MD (26:02.83) I think that they're fine. think that, you know, getting amino acids either from like an amino acid supplement, it's an option. I don't think it's any better necessarily than just getting it from, you know, a steak. But certainly if you need to, if you can't get enough from food, I think that supplementing is a fine option. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (26:19.446) How bad is caffeine for, I keep saying ovarian health because I loved how you made that a central point and for women in general. Amy Killen MD (26:28.833) Yeah. You know, I don't, a good question. I don't know if I've seen much published on caffeine for ovarian health. I think I'm a fan of caffeine. I don't think it's bad. I think certainly you can do too much and maybe there's, you know, don't want to do it, you know, after 2 PM or so, depending on how quickly you process it. Some of us are fast processors and some people are slow processors. It's good to know that, but I think that caffeine has its place, but we probably shouldn't overindulge too much. And certainly if you're Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (26:43.027) you Amy Killen MD (26:58.35) If you're taking a lot of caffeine because you're just super exhausted and you can't get through the day and all of that, it's good to know, like, well, why are you so tired? And get back to what's actually going on versus just drinking a lot of Red Bulls. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (27:11.222) Well, I only started drinking coffee a few years ago because as you and I were chatting, we started to grow cacao and we visited some farms around and the coffee is grown there and I just fell in love with the plant. It's very strong. And then sometimes I read things about how it can affect just your overall your adrenals and your body's functioning. So I'm cognizant of it. But I also think it's a very powerful plant. Amy Killen MD (27:24.077) Yeah. Amy Killen MD (27:38.936) Yeah, I think that I like coffee, I like cacao, I think that caffeine has its place. I don't have any concerns about it for most people, but certainly if you have high blood pressure, if you do have adrenal problems, if you have problems sleeping, there are some cases where you want to limit or get rid of caffeine, but for most people, I think it's perfectly fine and certainly can be helpful. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (28:01.418) Well, so on the flip side, we see a lot of supplements now with melatonin. And I know you had mentioned that earlier. And again, I've read some conflicting things. Certainly these brands are saying it's okay to take. know people that take it regularly and then some saying, you know, watch out, you don't want to take melatonin too often because then your body will produce it. What do you, what do you think about that? Amy Killen MD (28:20.888) Yeah. Yeah, think that melatonin, it can be helpful for sleep, but it's also a very strong antioxidant, which is probably why it was helpful in some of those animal ovarian aging studies. And I do think it has a place in it for some people. Not everyone responds well to melatonin. Some people, it makes them more wired. Some people has no effect in terms of sleep. And of course, the dosing is all over the map. mean, some people fall asleep and can't wake up at 0.5 milligrams. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (28:42.677) Hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (28:52.054) my gosh. Amy Killen MD (28:52.108) Some people take a hundred milligrams and it has no effect. And so there's a very wide dosing range. I don't worry as much as some people do about, you know, if you don't, if you take too much, then you won't make your own. I certainly if you take a hundred milligrams a day, you probably won't be making your own, but I'm treating mostly women who are kind of midlife women. And one of the hormones that really goes down as you get older is your ability to make melatonin. And so your body's not making as much as it was, which is part of the reasons that older people have a hard time sleeping. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (29:16.414) Amy Killen MD (29:21.976) So I think that replacing that, if it's helpful for them, I think it's great. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (29:26.682) that's great to know because some of these products or mints or powders have five milligrams, which seems like a sort of a hefty amount if you're not being prescribed melatonin. Amy Killen MD (29:33.39) Yeah. Amy Killen MD (29:40.686) Well, first of all, a lot of the over-the-counter products, as you know, they've done tests and especially melatonin, that many of the over-the-counter melatonins don't have any melatonin in them or they have a very small amount. So it is important to get it from a good source, a company that you or your doctor trust. But I tell patients, start with something like 0.5 or 1 milligrams and then just kind of march up a little bit. I tend to stay less than 10 milligrams from most people unless I'm Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (29:52.246) crazy. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (30:08.694) We're not. Yeah. Amy Killen MD (30:09.814) Once I'm doing some kind of like strong antioxidant protocol with them. And if it's just for sleep, usually I stay, you know, less than 10 for most people, but you'll find kind of a sweet spot. Like it's, very personal. Some people, you know, three milligrams is perfect. Four is, you know, is not, and two is not. Like you really have to kind of experiment. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (30:27.86) Wow. Finally, Amy, it's like asking an encyclopedia for questions. I blast questions at you all day, but we started talking about collagen skin health. I this is really going to, I think, the vulnerable side of women because we want to continue to look good and we know it's correlated with our inner health. But the other part is hair. And there's so much hair loss nowadays, hair thinning. hair breakage, hair not growing. I see so many articles about hair. And I also looked at some of these top hair selling supplements. And a lot of them are essentially, know, multivitamins to an extent with some other ingredients in them. But can you tell us a little bit about why you think this, first of all, the phenomenon of why women are experiencing so much hair loss and hair thinning? Amy Killen MD (31:22.37) Yeah, and I don't know if it's more than it was in previous generations or not. Again, it may just be an awareness that we talk about it more, but we do know that about 50 % of women in midlife will notice hair loss, hair shedding. So half of people, half of women will notice hair loss just from midlife. A lot of it's hormone changes. Estrogen is very good for your hair. And so when estrogen starts to go down, then the hair follicles change. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (31:34.72) Mmm. Amy Killen MD (31:49.262) and you're more likely to lose those follicles and to enter kind of a dormant hair phase. So estrogen loss is very bad for hair, but also progesterone and testosterone have roles in hair. Cortisol is also horrible for your hair. You when you have very high cortisol for very long, because you're stressed out and you're dealing with your multiple to-do lists and you know, all of these things, that is definitely something that will cause hair loss over time. All the environmental, all the... chemicals and toxins and things in the environment is bad for hair. Like all the things that are bad for us is your hair follicles are very sensitive to those things. And so they, yeah, so they're like little barometers to kind of what's happening in your personal life, your physical life and the environmental life. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (32:25.206) much. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (32:34.314) So do you think it's more macro though, again, the diet, the stress, the sleep versus people spending a lot of money on these specific hair growth supplements? Amy Killen MD (32:45.838) think it's both. tell my, I do, I treat a lot of hair loss and I tell my patients, if you really want to regrow hair, you have to like throw the kitchen sink at it. It is not just one thing. So maybe we're doing topical minoxidil, which you can get over the counter. Maybe we're doing an oral minoxidil, which is a prescription. Maybe we're doing red light therapy caps, which do work and can be really effective. Maybe we're doing injections with like PRP or stem cells or regenerative. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (32:56.042) Mmm. Amy Killen MD (33:15.502) you know, things like that in the office every so often. Plus we're working on lifestyle, plus we're working on, you know, making sure they're getting clean, clean diet and blocking certain hormones and things. So there's a lot of things that can go into it. And there's lots of different causes of hair loss too. So figuring out what's the reason, you know, with testing and with a good history and even a scalp biopsy, if you have a dermatologist and then going down how to treat it. know it's a lot. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (33:18.666) Wow. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (33:38.159) my gosh. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (33:42.198) And also, I'm just thinking breakage, taking care of your, mean, for me, it's the basics, getting less sun, washing the salt water out because otherwise the ends get more split and break, which I guess is for any human. Amy Killen MD (33:47.553) Yeah. Amy Killen MD (33:52.054) Mm-hmm. Amy Killen MD (33:56.344) Yeah, totally. Yeah. And the sun, like you mentioned, the sun, is not great for your skin over time is also the same, also not great for your hair follicle. causing the UV damage, causing oxidative stress, and it's essentially causing DNA damage in the cells around the hair follicle, just like it does in your skin. the sun is causing this damage. And if you don't repair it by either wearing sunblocks and hats and then taking maybe antioxidants or applying them. then that can cause hair loss as well. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (34:29.094) Well, thank you so much, Dr. Amy, for sharing about so many different topics. As soon as I ask you a question, there's right there the information, the knowledge, right there to share. Is there anything I didn't ask you or we didn't cover that you feel might benefit our community today? Amy Killen MD (34:50.09) think the main message I like to tell people is that we have, all of us have so much more control over how we age, how we feel, our health, than we sometimes think that we do. And I think in the old days, used to kind of, we used to think that our doctors were gonna keep us healthy, and now we understand that we have to keep ourselves healthy and our doctors are there just to kind of help guide and to be a resource if things go really bad, but it's really on us to stay up on. keeping ourselves healthy and staying up on the knowledge. I hope it's empowering, not stressful, but we do have a lot of control. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (35:26.102) Well, I think it's really empowering how you kept going back to these lifestyle basics, which definitely are in our control, and then saying, OK, well, then we can think about peptides or hormone replacement therapy or things on top. But the basics are tried and true. We'll support our hormonal health, our ovarian health, our bone health. And I think that's really empowering. And then to take the time to learn about other modalities if we feel called. Amy Killen MD (35:38.424) Yeah. Amy Killen MD (35:48.813) Yeah. Amy Killen MD (35:54.83) Absolutely, basics are still the basics. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (35:57.78) Well, Dr. Amy, where can we find out more about your work and keep connected to you? Amy Killen MD (36:05.838) So I have a website which is dramikillen.com, K-I-L-L-E-N. And then I'm also very active on both Instagram and Substack. I do articles every week on Substack and then I do a fair number of posting on Instagram. So it's dramikillen on those areas. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (36:23.016) Amazing. Well, thank you again so much for sharing your wisdom with us. We really appreciate you coming on. Amy Killen MD (36:28.802) Thank you, this was super fun. Have a good day. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (36:30.614) And everyone, thank you so much for logging on today and listening or watching. I really encourage you to share this interview with anyone that you think would benefit, another woman in your life, a colleague, a friend, because all of this is meant to empower, as Dr. Amy said, and the more we share with each other, the more we can support each other. We're on our show notes at mysaloon.com. We will link directly to Dr. Amy's handles. website. So please check that out. We'll also link to other articles and shows I think you would enjoy. be back here in a few days. I'll also see you on Instagram at underscore Kimberly Snyder. Till then, take great care and sending you all so much love.

Summary: In this conversation, Kimberly and Michael Hoeppner discuss the concept of the 'confidence trap' in communication, emphasizing that confidence can be fleeting and often leads to self-critique. He advocates for focusing on communication behaviors rather than chasing confidence, suggesting that this approach can lead to more effective speaking and personal development. About Michael Hoeppner Michael Hoeppner is the Founder and CEO of GK Training, a firm dedicated to giving individuals, companies, and organizations the communication skills to reach their highest goals in work and life. He has worked with some of the world’s most influential companies and leaders, across a wide range of industries, universities, and professional sectors. His corporate clients include: three of the top eight financial firms in the world, 45 of the AmLaw 100, and multinational tech, pharma, and food and beverage companies. He teaches his unique approach to communication at Columbia Business School, in both the MBA and PhD programs. Resources: Website: michaelchadhoeppner.com Book: Don't Say Um: How to Communicate Effectively to Live a Better Life Company: GK Training Episode Sponsors FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY SBO PROBIOTICS OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. Episode Chapters 00:00 The Importance of Communication 00:16 The Spiritual Aspect of Communication 00:49 Exploring Vocal Variety SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY'S BOOKS The Hidden Power of the Five Hearts Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! How to Believe in Your Self Worth with Jamie Kern Lima How to Raise Your Standards In Your Love Life with Matthew Hussey How to Eat to Beat Your Diet with New York Times best selling author Dr. William Li The issues with consuming vegetable and seed oils with Dr. Catherine Shanahan How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo How to Optimize Your Metabolic Health with Dr. Casey Means TRANSCRIPT: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:00.966) Michael, thank you so much for joining us here today. I'm very excited to chat with you. Michael Chad Hoeppner (00:06.36) Thank you, it's my pleasure. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:08.262) Also a little bit more careful than usual, given that your book, don't say how to communicate effectively to live a better life, is about communication. Michael Chad Hoeppner (00:21.078) You know, one of the unintended consequences of this book is that without even meaning to, I've made everyone who talks to me tremendously nervous, because they're thinking like, my gosh, he's watching my every move. And I joke with my wife where she'll say like, can you just turn off the communication lens for a second? Because I just want to have an argument. I just want to a discussion, right? I just want to have a nice conversation, you know? But I promise you. I am not interested in being the um-police. And in fact, in the very first page of the book, I joke that the title is a little bit of a trick because don't say is a classic example of thought suppression. As soon as you say don't say all you're thinking about is So the point of the book is really how do you escape those sorts of thought suppression traps and instead focus on things that you can do to be better. So. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:58.161) Right. Michael Chad Hoeppner (01:10.744) far from me watching every single thing you're doing like a hawk. No, I'm excited to have this conversation and get into what are things that people can do to be even better. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:10.834) Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:18.79) Yes. You know, I feel like communication is something that we don't discuss enough openly, especially in today's world where texting and these ways in which we communicate a lot can just be very snippy and careless a bit. And one may ask, well, why are you guys talking about communication on a wellness show? And for me, the way I see it, and I'd love to hear your perspective, Michael, with working in this field for so long. I know when I communicate effectively, it fosters closeness and two of our cornerstones, two of our pillars are emotional well-being, spiritual growth, and then food and body. So I know for me, the more I express, the more close I feel, the more I feel full as a human and connected. Michael Chad Hoeppner (02:15.352) Where do you want me to start on this? I mean, I think one of the great unexamined aspects of communication is that it is in fact a health and wellness intervention in our day, if we do it well. And let me just piggyback on what you said. I'm not even talking about emotionally, it feels good to connect with others. It feels bad to be stuck in like hostility when you process that, it feels better. I'm not even talking about that. talking about really simple things, mechanical things. In order to speak, you have to move. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:45.275) Yes. Michael Chad Hoeppner (02:49.73) Your diaphragm drops down, your lungs fill with air. In order to speak effectively, you're better off having tall posture so there's room for your diaphragm to move down, your lungs to fill with air. To speak well is actually a tiny way of moving your body in a dynamic coordinated way. It's like a little tiny bit of exercise each day. You could think of it that way. But even building one more thing about your point about devices. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:11.75) Yes. Michael Chad Hoeppner (03:17.078) I mean, goodness gracious, think of how much the time we're on screens versus being in some sort of dialogue with another human and we're called the social primate for a reason. We need that communication. So thank you for bringing this idea of health to this topic. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:34.608) You mentioned in the book, content is what we're saying, but delivery is everything. So whether we're in an angry space or we're wanting to get hired for a job or we're wanting to connect with a friend, the ways in which we deliver have a tremendous impact on our quality of life. Can you go into that for a moment? Michael Chad Hoeppner (04:00.014) Sure. Well, I'll put it to an example about devices, because you just asked about the text and things like that. Here's a perfect proof point, OK? If you've ever misread the emotional intent of a friend's text message, that's because you misheard their delivery. You thought they were saying like, call me back. And really, they were saying like, call me back. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:21.99) Right. Michael Chad Hoeppner (04:30.005) So that's like a very concrete example of how delivery matters so very much. And a lot of how we deliver things, it indicates our EQ. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:40.178) Right, right. Now you talk about linguistic precision. And I start since reading your book, I start to notice hmm, I do say the word like more than I perhaps would like like to. And there are these little words which seem to dilute this power. You have all these different exercises in the book, which I find really interesting. Can you give us a little clue or a little exercise or some insight into how one would start to cut back on those filler words since it's so common? Michael Chad Hoeppner (05:18.455) Sure. You've read the book, which I appreciate. Thank you. You'd be surprised at how many folks interview me and have not read the book. So first of all, thank you for that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:27.886) no, I read the, it's fascinating book by the way. Michael Chad Hoeppner (05:31.791) Thank you. Thank you. So I'm going to teach you an exercise that you already know, but your listeners might adore this exercise because on the one hand, it helps with a question you asked about, is like synoms and you knows, but take it in a different, different lens. also can be an amazing way to anchor into a sense of purpose or to set an intention or to really just dive into mindfulness, the exercise is called finger walking. And it's exactly like the title sounds. All you do is you walk your fingers across the table or desk, choosing each and every single word that comes out of your mouth. Now, I'm actually doing this right now, if you're just listening to the episode, if you're watching, you're seeing it, of course, but you use your fingers as a kinesthetic device. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:17.744) Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:29.681) Mmm. Michael Chad Hoeppner (06:29.698) to force yourself to choose words, not just open your mouth and see what words tumble out. If you don't know what to say next, you have to pause your fingers until you have figured out what words you want to choose. And if you struggle with this activity, the problem is not in your brain, it's not even in your mouth. It's that you weren't precise enough with your fingers. Think of it almost like a ballerina trying to walk through a field of tulips. without disturbing a single flower. Now I coach that with clients so that they can help eliminate those useless cluttered words that you're talking about. But you could also imagine setting an intention for the day and walking your fingers across the desk, choosing each word, seeing how much energy you can dedicate to really choosing each word and therefore being incredibly concrete about the day's goals. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:27.78) I love the physicality of what you teach. And there was another exercise involving blocks or Legos, which we have a lot of Legos having a five year olds and a nine, two, two boys, five and nine. And it's this, I think it was for pausing intentionally instead of just, you know, going on and on and rambling. So there's a really, most of us don't think of communication as having this really solid physicality. Michael Chad Hoeppner (07:40.269) Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:57.882) And it makes me think of the spiritual concept of embodiment, where we're embodying the energy of the words and we're not sort of fritting our energy away. Can you talk a little bit more about that? Michael Chad Hoeppner (08:09.71) really glad you brought up the word embodied because the fancy phrase for all of the exercises in this book is embodied cognition. So, know, cognition, thinking or learning embodied using the body. It's using your body to learn better communication practices. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:19.538) Mm. Michael Chad Hoeppner (08:30.51) and the Lego block exercise. As a funny aside, by the way, I relate to your Lego point. I've been running this company now for, you know, more than a decade and a half. I started it in 2010. So for the first five years of running the company, I did not have kids. And I had my first child, my daughter in 2015. So up until that point, I had to order Legos to have for clients. All of a kids come along and the house is littered with Legos. So now if I need it for a client, I just go and raid their toy chest, raid their Lego chest. Anyway, back to the point of the exercise. The way it works is as follows. You stack a Lego block at the end of every single idea. You can almost think of the Lego block as a period at the end of the sentence. So you pick up a Lego block, you say one idea or one sentence, and at the end of the sentence, you Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:55.609) wow. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:18.8) Right. Michael Chad Hoeppner (09:24.782) put it down in silence. Then you pick up the second Lego block, say the second idea at the end of that idea, kind of like the period at the end in silence, you click it in place on the previous. And third, and so on and so forth, building your communication. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:44.412) Brilliant. Well, Michael, even as we're talking, I'm aware that I naturally insert, yeah, right. Agreeing. Would you consider that filler? Would you say, hey, you and I are looking at each other right now and that's enough? Versus, I feel like I do that a lot and maybe many of us do that a lot in listening. You talk about how communication is really being engaged and focused. on the other party, nodding, but sometimes these little words, yes, got it. What do you think of those words? Michael Chad Hoeppner (10:21.91) Yeah, I'll put it this way. In the chapter on filler, I give two incredibly intuitive criteria for what filler is. And the first is, it's not grammatically necessary. And the second is that you're not aware you're doing it. Jokingly, I one time worked with a client who used the word viscerally as a filler. He would put the word viscerally into practically every sentence. Yeah, completely unnecessary and so random. So for him, the word viscerally was actually a filler, yes. But a lot of those words, like, as an example, it can be used in a way that is grammatically necessary. I feel like a piece of wood adrift in the sea. the word like is used in that situation as a symbol. Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:16.4) Sure. But anymore like this. Sure. Wow, you're talking these words to emphasize that I'm in agreement or I'm really listening to you. What do you think of those words? Michael Chad Hoeppner (11:18.242) but often that's jammed in. Michael Chad Hoeppner (11:30.886) I get it because what I would call those would be corroboration sounds, like you're corroborating for me that you're attentive. And I will put the same lens on it, which is if you're not aware you're doing it whatsoever, and it's not actually necessary, it's not helping the other person, it might be worth considering are there different ways to show and to indicate that I'm being attentive? But for most people, they're probably not a problem. They're probably a good thing, not a bad thing. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:36.752) Yes. Michael Chad Hoeppner (12:00.224) And to give everyone listening a little bit of a relief with this, the goal, and when I teach classes on presence around the world, the goal is not that you should have this kind of presence and you should make an mm-hmm sound every 75 seconds because that's the ideal. The goal is it presence is you. It's not me, it's not somebody else, it's not some universal normative ideal. Presence is you, but ironically, you, when you're thinking the very least about you and your presence, when you're thinking the most about reaching the other person. And that's why I think that the idea of this book can be so liberating and so fulfilling for the very topics that you speak about all the time, this idea being focused on mission, purpose, something bigger than oneself. Communication is a manifestation of that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:58.66) It's also, there's a spiritual angle that I kept coming back to when I was reading your book and putting attention on another. There's this yogic, Vedic concept of oneness beyond the ego, beyond the little self, and it's how we expand. And as you said, how funny when we're least thinking about ourselves and we're expansive, then there's real presence. There's an energy that comes in and then true connection can really be forged. Michael Chad Hoeppner (13:28.247) That's right. And what I would offer and submit is that when you're at your very best, and I mean this both about you, but I mean about everyone listening. When you're at your very best, really connected to the other person, really listening, whatever ratio of mm-hmms and yes and rights that you say is right for you. And when they go wrong is when all of a sudden you tip into self-consciousness and Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:51.026) Mm. Michael Chad Hoeppner (13:58.2) feeling inadequate and insecure and you're trying to almost overdo it, or rather you're multitasking and you're not really listening to the other person. You're just kind of, mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm, uh-huh, mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:10.212) Right? You can feel when someone's doing that. Michael Chad Hoeppner (14:13.057) Yes. So as opposed to fixating on how should I or shouldn't I or how many or how few, instead, fixate on really trying to reach the other person and trusting that if you do that, all of what I call the behaviors of presence will unlock automatically. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:31.59) Michael, how did you even get into this work and how did this become your focus, communication? Michael Chad Hoeppner (14:37.995) Yeah, I come at it from a professional acting background originally, but the work went in a very different direction when I started the company in 2010, because I began to experiment with exactly what we're talking about today, embodied tools, kinesthetic tools to teach people the fundamental building blocks of speaking, like pausing, like choosing words. like using their voices and their bodies to set an intention or to reach someone across the room. And so I began coaching people to stack Lego blocks or to throw a wiffle ball or to speak with an impediment in between their teeth. And what happened is that people got much, much better very quickly. And by 2014, I was teaching at Columbia Business School and 2016 offering some feedback on presidential politics. And I don't suggest that that of track to brag about me. I mention it because no one was doing this. No one was thinking about communication from a deeply kinesthetic approach. And I still think there's a lot to be gained from this kind of approach. And I really hope that your listeners, if they take nothing away from this conversation besides this, I am a communication athlete. I am a communication instrument. And if I use my body in different ways, I can dramatically alter my communication. So anyway, that's kind of how I got into it also why I still am very committed and very passionate about it today 15 years later. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:05.138) Mm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:18.514) There's an interesting part in the book where you talk about confidence, which seems to come up a lot in our community. We get a lot of questions and comments about wanting to feel more confident. you know, for many people, there's so many different ways to achieve that. Sometimes it's this external focus, which can lead to even a hyper fixation on the body. Sometimes it's wanting to achieve more. You say something in the book and I'm paraphrasing, of course, that you don't have to feel confident to project confidence. Is this sort of like the fake it till you make it idea? Tell us your view of confidence and how communication can play a part. Michael Chad Hoeppner (17:05.291) Yeah, this is a huge topic. So you have to promise to interrupt me midstream if I go on too long on this one, because we could do a whole podcast on this one question. OK. First of all, you are not paraphrasing. You actually quoted from the book brilliantly. That's exactly what I say in the book. And to be very clear to your listeners, I'm not suggesting that confidence is not a great feeling. It is. And I'm also not suggesting that confidence isn't relevant in many aspects of our life. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:10.898) Okay. Michael Chad Hoeppner (17:33.292) What I'm trying to do is liberate people from a confidence trap that affects their communication. Confidence trap with communication is essentially when I feel confident, I speak well. When I don't feel confident, I fail. And what happens is that people chase the feeling of confidence. And the more they chase the feeling of confidence, often the more ephemeral it is. And then, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:40.57) Okay. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:01.49) Sure. Michael Chad Hoeppner (18:02.219) they begin to blame themselves and fall into self-critique and even like shame and things like that. And I have found in almost two decades now of doing this with everyone from presidential candidates to high school students, the much faster and the much more fun route, by the way, to become much better at speaking is to embrace this idea of I'm going to learn to do the behaviors. that allow me to communicate really, really well and I'm not gonna obsess about my feelings of confidence a little bit. So in a way, to get back to your question on the fake it till you make it, in a way it's related, but it's not the same thing. What I'm suggesting is if you focus on these behaviors, not only will you come across better, but they may in fact actually help you say smarter stuff. And it may in fact ultimately change how you feel. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:34.812) Hmm. Michael Chad Hoeppner (18:59.405) Two, take the finger walking activity. just taught a couple of minutes ago. Let's say you practice doing that on remote calls. Instead of just opening your mouth and speaking at forwards per second as fast as you possibly can to show that you know everything, but also getting tongue-tied and getting stuck and then forgetting to breathe and feeling nervous. Did that pretty quickly, obviously. If instead on those calls, you practice using this finger walking exercise. One, you're going to say much more specific, accurate, articulate stuff. two, because you're speaking more slowly, as unlocked using embodied cognition, you're going to have more time to actually think of what you want to say and maybe even breathe. And those things might unlock greater confidence. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:47.61) I can't help but go back to how your book is, I see the word accidentally spiritual. My last book, Michael, was about heart coherence. So the energetic, the physical heart. And there is another line that you talk about not paying so much attention to your emotions and thoughts, but rather this physicality. And we could say that in a lot of, you know, meditative mind, I really like the word mindfulness, could say, heart based consciousness raising techniques where thoughts are based on perception and our perceptions can shift greatly depending on the state of our nervous system. Am I right? And then our emotions are fleeting and sometimes we identify with them. And of course that would affect how you come across, you're communicating. So I really liked how you just kept bringing it back to posture, physicality, breathing, which I want to talk about next, because there's a steadiness in that. And it gives us something to focus on beyond these thoughts, which can really lead us astray. Michael Chad Hoeppner (20:56.823) There's a reason that yoga fixates on these very specific moves and poses. And you don't go into a yoga practice trying to feel confident or trying to think of all the important things in your life. You simply do these very regimented, very powerful flow. And that unlocks, yeah, and that unlocks a lot of really great, you know, positive knock on effect. So, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:18.162) for the Oscar. Yes. Michael Chad Hoeppner (21:25.759) I'm quite flattered actually that you're talking about the accidental spirituality in this book. I think it maps very straight ahead. And I'll tell you why. All the great religious traditions feature something about focusing on the other, not the self, not fixating on the self, focusing on the other, offering, do unto others, these sorts of things. And communication is the human superpower Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:46.16) Correct. Michael Chad Hoeppner (21:55.276) to do that, you this massive vocabulary so that we can focus on and reach and help the other person. So if really practiced well, communication can even be a spiritual daily practice of being other focused. So I take it as a compliment. Now, it doesn't seem like, I don't feel like you're shoehorning this into the discussion whatsoever. I think there's a lot of alignment there. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (22:08.722) Mm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (22:13.691) I love it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (22:21.98) There is, and I was not looking for it, to be honest, and it came across organically as I was reading. So, new confidence, we talked about that, and there's this section in the book where there's kids' faces, and it made me laugh a little bit. I believe it was this section where you're talking about having a greater range of ourselves instead of monotony that we can sometimes fall into for different reasons. And I think you said something about trying to get into an eye contact. contest with my five year old. I think about my five year old or my nine year old is so convincing and he'll do all sorts of things. Can you talk about range and what it means and why it's important to cultivate again as adults if perhaps we have lost it? Michael Chad Hoeppner (23:09.409) Yeah, we come into this world and the first thing we do is we breathe and then we scream. So communication is ultimately the very first thing when we enter planet Earth or planet Earth's atmosphere, however you would say it. we tend to as kids have a tremendous amount of range. First of all, the human voice naturally has this massive range. If you don't believe me, just think of a kid crying and screaming, a little baby is huge range. And also kids, because they're resourceful, because they're resourceful humans, they learn lots of different tactics to try to get what they want. But then we get put into society. and professional situations and we get taught to constrain all of that and be more professional and I'm putting professional in air quotes. What it typically means for most people is just be a deeply reduced version of yourself. I'm not talking about bring one's whole self to work. I'm actually talking about something much more fundamental which is literally how much you breathe. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (24:11.41) Mm. Michael Chad Hoeppner (24:22.135) how much musicality you do or do not have in your voice, how much you move your face, how much you move your hands, how forcefully and dynamically you articulate your words. And yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (24:33.543) Can you pause for a second, Michael? You said musicality. What do you mean by that? Michael Chad Hoeppner (24:38.155) Yeah, well, in the chapter on vocal variety, I talk about the musicality of our voices. This means not the words, it means the sounds of the words. And in that chapter, I anchor musicality to vocal variety and in fact to five P's pace, pitch, pause, power and placement. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (25:05.2) Mmm. Michael Chad Hoeppner (25:05.737) Ace is speed, so that's fast and slow. Pitch is high and low, so like musical note up or down. Pause is silence, that's what that Lego block activity you asked me about, that's what that unlocks. Power is another word for volume, loud and quiet. And then placement means where the sound primarily is placed within the body. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (25:12.338) Thank Michael Chad Hoeppner (25:34.337) back to this concept you and I are talking about of embodied embodiment and embodied cognition. Your sound in your body resonates differently in different parts of your body. When you have a cold and your nose is all stuffed up, your voice sounds different because you've altered how the sound can amplify in your sinus passages or not. So that's the fifth P placement. And in the chapter I talked about some research that we looked at, I did with some other academics around the country. And we looked at politicians and those who used these five Ps to speak were better evaluated by their audiences, more authentic, more real, more dominant, more competent, all kinds of good stuff. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (26:21.49) When you were doing that, Michael, which is very interesting, by the way, I can recall people, maybe we all can recall people who, women in particular, have very high voices and it's all the time. Do you think we can manipulate our voices in all communication? And you talk about habits and reinforcing them, learning these patterns. Do you have you seen people, I'll phrase it this way, that have been in a certain tone for whatever reason, and then through unlocking more communication range and expression, literally their voice drops down and they change. Because sometimes you think, is that person, is that their real voice? Were they born with a voice that high? And I'm sure people have that natural voice, but some people, almost feels like they're creating it. Michael Chad Hoeppner (27:15.405) I have only seen the dynamic that you're talking about every day that ends in the letter Y. Okay. Yeah. And by that, I mean that in the chapter on this, talk about, it's total misnomer how we speak about our voices. People say like, I hate the sound of my voice. I have a blank voice. I'm scratchy, shrill, annoying, whatever it is. And then what I write right after is like, you don't have a voice. Well. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (27:25.414) Well put, well put, okay. Michael Chad Hoeppner (27:52.747) That's not true. You do have a voice. But I try to be pretty provocative with my language and point out you don't have a voice as in like your voice. You create sound. You create, you turn air into sound and then shape that sound into words. And depending on how you're using your body, your voice changes and changes dramatically. And it's not even just like a lifetime from shrill to not shrill. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (28:06.608) Right. Michael Chad Hoeppner (28:21.152) Think of this, your voice sounds different when you wake up from a long nap and you're kind of groggy. Sounds different after maybe a glass of wine if you're having an evening conversation. Sounds different after exercising because you are a musical instrument. Takes more than 120 muscles to do this everyday miracle of turning air into sound and then sound into words. And your voice sounds different depending on how you use your body. So yeah, if people use their bodies differently, their voice changes and changes dramatically. So yes to your question. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (28:59.122) For listeners that have been hearing me do this podcast for a while or new listeners, just sort of this real time role play, you give us an experience, how you work with people. What would you say or there are any tips you would say about my voice? And I won't take offense, of course, like I'm very interested in how you can hone in. Michael Chad Hoeppner (29:22.092) Sure. Okay. Now to be clear, hey audience, everybody listening, is a fun thing because we did not exchange questions in advance. Kimberly did not send me a whole bunch of questions. I generally know what people are gonna ask because I wrote the darn book, okay? But this one is completely unscripted. We're just shooting from the hip with this as are all these questions, but I'll put it right back to you. How direct and how... Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (29:23.986) You're like, where do I start? Michael Chad Hoeppner (29:50.806) how straightforward you want me to be with my feedback. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (29:55.31) I'd love to hear how you would work with a client. Michael Chad Hoeppner (29:59.703) Sure, with you though or just any client? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (30:04.452) I mean, how you go again, I look at a new client coming to you. say, Hey, this is part of my work. love having a podcast. also do quite a bit of speaking and daily conversations. I would like to improve just like all of us listening to this. Even if, yeah. Michael Chad Hoeppner (30:27.092) Yeah. So I'm going to give you a bunch of compliments then. Please don't let it go to your head and then I'll give you a couple thoughts too. In general, I think your communication is an extraordinary asset. So why do I say that? One, you read the book. Two, you ask very, very intelligent, specific questions about the book. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (30:33.274) Okay. Yes. Michael Chad Hoeppner (30:49.898) but not just to make the author feel good. You ask questions that hopefully help your listeners gain something from this time they're investing in this podcast. So you're showing tremendous other focus, both with your attention on me and your intention on your audience. Opposite of the question you asked me earlier, you demonstrate tremendous listening too. You do have these sort of corroboration sounds used from time to time. Physically, you're responding to me all the time. You're also quite self-aware because at the very beginning you were able to say with full transparency, total lack of defensiveness, I'm feeling very self-conscious about this right now because I'm talking to a communication expert, but you did not let the self-consciousness of that prevent you from having the conversation. Self-consciousness gone too far really just becomes selfishness in a way. Because your audience doesn't actually care if you're nervous. They just care. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (31:26.738) you Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (31:43.026) Mmm. Michael Chad Hoeppner (31:47.723) Am I getting something out of this conversation or not? So these are some of the tremendous strengths you bring to the table. Beyond that, your enunciation is perfectly adequate. Adequate sounds like I'm being insulting, I'm not. What I mean is, there's no word that you've said in anywhere in this podcast that I had a difficult time understanding because of lack of enunciation. That's a strength. Physically, this is probably a lot of the work you've done on wellness anyway. If you look at your posture, your head is more or less like a helium balloon floating up off the long string of your spine. Your eyes are pretty much anchored in the middle of your head, so you're not like craning your neck back like so. From what I can tell, I can't really see your diaphragm and your lower part of your torso, but it looks as though you're breathing and your voice sounds like you're breathing. So a bunch of these boxes would just be like, check, check, check, check, check, check. Then of course, everyone's listening for, well, where's the butt, Michael? What are we gonna get to next? Yeah, yeah. So the place that would put your attention would actually be on these same five Ps, pace, pitch, pause, power, placement. And the reason I would bring your attention there is because you speak with a tremendous. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (32:45.744) We're getting to the good stuff. Michael Chad Hoeppner (33:04.886) facility in terms of choosing words, demonstrating patience, demonstrating listening. I mean, I've even noticed talking to you that because of the way in which you speak and because humans are reciprocal, my instinct has been to actually slow my rate of speech, dial back some of the sort of five Pisa vocal variety I might use to try to engage an audience to meet the kind of energy that you're using. But any vocal variety pattern taken too far becomes constancy. Constancy, I'll do constancy so you can hear it right now. Constancy would technically be that you never deviated any of the five P's no matter what it is. You don't sound like that, okay? And in fact, if you just listen to that, that was probably hard to even decipher what the heck I was saying. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (33:42.798) Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (34:02.844) Robotic. Michael Chad Hoeppner (34:03.838) Yeah, robotic, because you're speaking in absolute uniformity. So what this means is that if you have a strong impulse, you probably could afford to allow words to stream out of your mouth even more quickly at times. You could probably afford to use even more volume to reach your audience at times, not because you speak too softly or you speak too slowly. No, because we as humans use these five P's. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (34:18.482) Yeah Michael Chad Hoeppner (34:32.908) to reach each other. They can go too far, by the way. You can go from constancy, past coherence, all the way into chaos, like bad AI software in which the thing sounds like that and we don't know what we're hearing. It can be too much, right? But there's no world in which most people ever get to that category of chaos. So you could experiment with what is it like actually to allow Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (34:42.287) Right. Michael Chad Hoeppner (35:00.338) more energy, even though I'm working on like mindfulness, intentionality, physical bearing, you could experiment with what happens if I allow more of those five Ps to be included in my speech. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (35:14.802) love that. Thank you so much, Michael. That's really insightful, obviously, and interesting. And I agree, I meditate a lot, I do a lot of these heart practices. So I feel like I'm generally in a certain frequency. But to your point, I could still be calm and loving and all the ways in which I want to be in the world, but it can be a little more. It sounds more to even do higher or faster paced at times which you know, there's no reason that that energy can't be worked with and still consistent. Michael Chad Hoeppner (35:49.259) Yes, and here's the totally liberating thing for you, for me, for everyone listening. You know how to do this already, I promise you. I want you to imagine this thought experiment, okay? And it's in the book, so you know probably where I'm going with this, but still indulge me and let's do this thought experiment. A dear friend of yours comes to you and they're in a genuine crisis. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (35:56.433) Bye! Michael Chad Hoeppner (36:11.05) you know, considering bailing on their career and doing something radical, gonna leave their loved one, gonna do some rash decision, whatever it is, okay? They're in some kind of crisis and they come to you for some help and you speak with them for a while and what you're trying to do, whether you're even aware you're doing it or not, What you're trying to do is help them find some peace and some serenity so they can make a better decision. And you're so partially by trying to indicate and exude to them that kind of energy. But let's say it's not working, okay? It's not working at all. At a certain point, you would probably give up and change entirely. And then you would say like, whoa, stop, hang on, wait, time out. Let's get up, come on, let's go for a walk. We're gonna talk this out. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (36:36.816) Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (36:45.328) Wait. Michael Chad Hoeppner (36:57.248) you would change tactic, not because you were trying to do different communication styles. You would change because what you were doing previously wasn't working. And humans are resourceful. do this with five Ps all the Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (37:09.81) Beautiful. The way you explained it feels so organic and natural as well. Michael, I could ask you a million questions. I think this topic in your book is really fascinating. we close out, before we close out, is there one simple breathing tip perhaps or one sort of takeaway that you find in your work almost anyone, everyone could benefit from in their communication? Michael Chad Hoeppner (37:38.335) I do. It's called silent storytelling. I've mentioned two tools already on this one, the finger walking exercise for linguistic precision, the Lego block activity for learning how to pause and structure your thoughts. But this one is perhaps the most powerful of all because it tends to get people to do what they already do in real life when they're at their best, which is use more of themselves. Silent storytelling just means you speak but without sound. So it's like the exercise sound, silent storytelling. You talk on some subject matter, but you're essentially lip syncing. You're not allowed to make sound. You have to mouth the words. You have to allow your face to be as active as possible to indicate what you're thinking. You have to let your hands get in on the story too, because they have a story to tell as well. And you use all of your physical and vocal communication instrument. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (38:08.113) Mm-hmm. Michael Chad Hoeppner (38:37.568) but mouthing words the whole time. So almost like you're a very energized version of yourself that's been put on mute on television. Do that for a few minutes and then guess what? Put sound back into the equation and allow sound to come back in your voice and what you will find out is first, wow, my voice sounds completely different. But number two, I'm using so much more of myself than I typically do. And this might even feel more like how you actually talk in real life. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (38:46.652) Wow. Michael Chad Hoeppner (39:06.08) than how you have learned to talk in the various professional narratives that we live in in our life. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (39:11.792) Wow, that's an amazing exercise that I did read about and I will try. I read through and the Lego one stood out and now taking time to actually do the practices like you said will really bring this to life. And you also say in the book, a lot of people don't do exercises in books and it's sort of silly. Why wouldn't we want to benefit from the wisdom that we're learning? So Michael, this is all so interesting. Tell us. where we can find out more about you, of course, where we can get the book. And even if someone's maybe interested in becoming a client or going even deeper in your work. Michael Chad Hoeppner (39:50.645) Yeah. Well, the URL for my company is very simple. It's just GK Training. I'm the founder and head of GK Training. It's just gktraining.com. So if folks are interested in coaching or learning more about what we do, that's the place to go. The book you can find there, but you can also find it a very easy URL, which is don'tsayum.com. Don'tsayum.com. And then in terms of just personal, easiest for me is LinkedIn. That's Michael Chad Heppner at LinkedIn. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (40:24.078) Wonderful. Well, thank you again so much, Michael. Really appreciate it. And there's so many takeaways that I will be using myself. Everyone, thank you so much for tuning in. We will link directly to Michael's site and his book and his work at mysaloon.com. where you'll also find links to other articles, shows, resources that we think you'll enjoy. I will be back here in a few days. Otherwise, I'll also see you on socials at underscore Kimberly Snyder and also on our Saluna website. Till then, take great care. Thank you so much for being part of the community and sending you all so much love.

This Week’s Episode Special Guest: Dr. Ann Shippy Summary: In this conversation, Dr. Ann Shippy discusses the significance of infertility as a health indicator, likening it to a check engine light that signals underlying health issues. She emphasizes the importance of both partners’ health in enhancing fertility and ensuring the birth of healthier babies. About Dr. Ann Shippy Dr. Ann Shippy is a Board-Certified Internal Medicine physician and certified Functional Medicine practitioner based in Austin, Texas. With a background in chemical engineering and a successful career at IBM, she transitioned to medicine after facing her own complex health challenges—an experience that fuels her passion for uncovering and addressing the root causes of illness. Her work centers around four key areas of expertise: longevity, health span (increasing the number of years lived in vibrant, disease-free health), unlocking better outcomes through personalized, data-driven care, and preconception—supporting couples as they prepare to conceive the healthiest baby possible. Using advanced testing and epigenetic insights, Dr. Shippy empowers patients to activate the body’s innate ability to heal, thrive, and even reverse chronic conditions. Motivated by the alarming rise in childhood illness, Dr. Shippy felt a deep urgency to provide answers. That urgency led her to write The Preconception Revolution: A Science-Backed Path to Your Fertility and Generational Health—a hope-filled guide that empowers couples to take control of their fertility and future family health. The book offers a clear, actionable blueprint for reversing the childhood health crisis—one healthy baby at a time. With degrees from Washington University in St. Louis, Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, and the University of Texas, Dr. Shippy brings a unique blend of engineering precision and medical insight to her work. Her practice—Ann Shippy, MD— is dedicated to helping individuals live better—and get better—with age. Guest Resources: Book: THE PRECONCEPTION REVOLUTION: A Science-Backed Path to Fertility and Generational Health Website: annshippymd.com Social: @annshippymd   Episode Sponsors: FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY   ANIMA MUNDI OFFER: To get THE PUREST, MOST DELICIOUS, benefit driven Herbal Teas infused with harmonizing adaptogens go to Animamundiherbals.com and use code: KIM20 to get 20% off your purchase! USE LINK: Animamundiherbals.com and use code: KIM20 to get 20% off your purchase!   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Fertility and Generational Health 00:24 The Impact of Lifestyle on Fertility   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:01.446)Dr. Anne, thank you so much for joining us here today. Ann Shippy MD (00:05.646)excited for this conversation. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:08.049)I’m excited too, as I mentioned to you right before we got on the show, I actually did read your full book, which is very comprehensive, The Preconception Revolution, Science-Backed Path to Your Fertility and Generational Health. Can you tell us a little bit, just as we start, Dr. Anne, how you decided to focus on this specific subject in your career, in your work, helping women or helping families have… healthy children, how did that become the focus? Ann Shippy MD (00:39.51)It was kind of this accidental confluence of information. I feel so lucky that I was able to pull this all together for people. I had gone through my own infertility journey before medical school and then during residency. And then I started seeing these amazing things happen with my patients. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:03.271)Bye! Ann Shippy MD (01:05.23)around this topic. Like what does it actually take to have good fertility and healthy babies both, right? We don’t want to just get pregnant. We want to have our, you know, give our children the best shot at having a good healthy life, right? So one of my early patients, I had only been in practice a couple of years and she was 41 and she’d finally gotten married and had the love of her life. And she just had the intuition. She’d heard about me and she was like, Dr. Shippey, I know I really need to prepare my body more to be pregnant. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:16.059)Yes. Ann Shippy MD (01:34.91)And so we worked her up. We looked at her microbiome. We looked at her toxin levels. And she actually had really high mercury. Yeah. And so I loved that. That was a really early story of like, really need to listen to my patient’s intuitions. And so we worked together for six to nine months and finally gave her the green light go. And she had a healthy baby right away at 41, 42. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:42.727)BWOY! Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:00.967)Wow. Ann Shippy MD (02:03.05)So that taught me, okay, we can really help people to have healthy babies even into their 40s. And then a couple years later, I had a patient come in who also just found me by word of mouth and she had done IVF a couple times. was in her mid 30s and she failed IVF a couple of times. And so then nobody else wanted to give her another shot at it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:28.264)Mmm. Ann Shippy MD (02:28.556)So we did the same kind of thing. We worked her up, found out what was out of balance in her body, how we could really build the resources in her body. And long behold, less than a year later, she was pregnant and had a healthy baby. And then she actually got pregnant with twins while she was still nursing the first one. She got so pregnant. Yes. And then had a birth. So she had, she ended up with four children, under four, after being told that she couldn’t, you know. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:53.512)Wow. Ann Shippy MD (02:58.446)into her 30s. So my patients taught me that when we’re really healthy, can get past the fertility issues and have healthy babies. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:09.352)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:14.482)You know, it’s really interesting, Dr. Rans reading your book and just thinking about friends that I know that, you know, and there’s we’re in a time and you mentioned this in the book where some companies are, you know, giving a stipend for freezing your eggs and sort of going down that pathway. But it just seems like so many people are going right to IVF and they’re even late, like 20s. And I just say for me, it didn’t even it wasn’t in my consciousness, you know, and I don’t know, like I don’t know, it just seems like a time when IVF is becoming more and more popular at younger ages. And do you think that’s connected to the toxin level and people are struggling? Or do you think it’s just because women are wanting to delay having babies because of their careers? Combination. Ann Shippy MD (04:03.822)Yes, I think it’s all the confluence of things, right? The sperm counts are going down. They’ve gone down 50 % in 50 years and it’s accelerating. It was 1 % a year. Now it’s almost 2.5 % decline in sperm counts per year. So we’ve got that along with people waiting a little longer. And then… the drop in fertility. The latest number that I saw was one in six couples deal with infertility, which is not getting pregnant in a year. There is another number circulating, I haven’t found the source yet, of one in five, so this fertility issue’s accelerating. And then I think it’s the narrative of what the conversation is that we’re normalizing IVF, we’re normalizing IVOI, and using the clomid and other things. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:40.157)Mm. Ann Shippy MD (04:55.532)rather than being weight, infertility is actually a sign, it’s like a check engine light. It’s like the body saying, wait, we’re not, like something’s off because we’re born to like procreate the species. That’s been the amazing thing of how, you know, like it’s just part of our makeup to have children. And so I think… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:01.607)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:11.098)Yeah. Ann Shippy MD (05:24.32)If you’ve got that check engine light on, especially you want to pause and figure out what needs to happen in both partners to really enhance their health so that then they can not just have better fertility, but healthier babies. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:39.356)Right. Yes, and it’s like you said, it’s a natural biological function. We’re seeing that across the board where people are having trouble, know, digesting, they’re having trouble sleeping, they’re having trouble, you know, having energy, they’re pumped up with caffeine. So it seems like there’s many aspects of our lifestyle as a collective that need to be re-examined, this being one of them. Ann Shippy MD (06:02.766)So in addition to having all these patient experiences where I can see that people are often very fertile well into their 40s. My oldest patient is 47 right now. And after doing a few months of work, we’ve worked on her health for a little over three months. She gave me a little bit of time. She didn’t want to wait too long at 47. But she got pregnant on her first try, and she’s five months in now. So we don’t have a healthy baby yet, but it’s teaching me. what it takes to be fertile. So when we look at root causes of these things, you mentioned the environmental toxicity, I think that’s a really important piece for us to look at, not just for fertility, but the health of the future child, and then how important it is to eat the nutrient-dense foods. It’s really hard to… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:46.968)Yes. Ann Shippy MD (06:55.822)have a healthy sperm and healthy egg and then a healthy body to grow the baby in if you’re not just full of nutrients because all of these reproductive mechanisms run on nutrients. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:06.96)Right. Well, it’s funny, Dr. Anne, how, you know, I’m sure you see all types of people and different parts of their journey. I could say for myself, I wasn’t focused on pregnancy, but I was sort of turning my body around. had a lot of, you know, constipation and acne and bloating. And so I was eating so many greens and so much fiber. And so when I went to have Kids I did I was lucky enough to have them on the pretty much the first try each and then my grandmother from the Philippines Like your client she had babies to 48. So there’s these incredible possibilities we have but so much of the you conversation today is quite Negative and like again rushing to do IVF and everybody’s struggling and it’s so hard. So it’s nice to feel and to hear a bit of Ann Shippy MD (07:41.954)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:59.548)hopefulness and also that that doesn’t have to be the way. there’s a, you know, there’s this whole other healthy way we can make choices, we can re nourish the body and you know, so many of the different things that you talk about in the book, which we’ll get into in just a moment. Ann Shippy MD (08:16.086)It really is exciting. It’s, you know, IVF is so expensive. It’s so hard on women’s bodies. It’s stressful for the partner too, because they’re, you know, they’re feeling out of control. so when we can find a way to really restore the body and to help people to be fertile, that’s amazing. And then what I really see the big opportunity is to based on this is that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:26.182)Yeah. Ann Shippy MD (08:45.58)when people give themselves the three, six, 12 months before they get pregnant to really optimize their body. It’s like creating time capsules that the egg and the sperm are so that the baby has healthier epigenetics, how the genes are being dialed up and dialed down. really, for me, this is not just an infertility opportunity. This is helping to solve the children’s health crisis that we have with one in 31 children being diagnosed with. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:55.3)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:12.465)Yes. Ann Shippy MD (09:15.52)autism and the mental health and the diabetes and the autoimmunity, the cancer, all these things that we’re seeing happen in children. The research backs this up now how important the epigenetics are to really address before you get pregnant to help have a healthier baby. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:35.11)And one of the things that you talk about in the book is the correlation between boosting our mitochondrial health, specifically, independent of how old, maternal age. Can you talk a little bit about that and how we could do that specifically? Ann Shippy MD (09:49.996)That is one of my favorite topics because it applies to everybody. So even if people are listening and they’re like, yeah, I’ve already had my kids or I’m not going to have them for a while, this is something we all need to be focusing on. So mitochondria are the little organelles inside the cell that make energy. So they’re little powerhouses that really run everything. They help us to detoxify, to rebuild things. They do everything. And unfortunately, a lot of people’s mitochondria are getting Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:52.456)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:01.042)Yeah. Ann Shippy MD (10:20.288)injured or aren’t working optimally because of the environmental toxins that are building up in people’s bodies are not having all the right nutrients or having inflammation in the body. The mitochondria are responsible for keeping up with, you know, not having the fire go to get out of balance and basically be burning down LA. So Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:23.4)Okay. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:40.838)But what an analogy Dr. Edward, always so sensitive to fire that that really sinks in, you know. Ann Shippy MD (10:49.784)So we all need to be tending to our mitochondria. And there’s some amazing research around what we can do to help them. And it’s one of the things that I really see the impact with my patients, whether they have a chronic illness like Parkinson’s, or they’re just wanting to really work on their longevity, or we’re preparing for healthy babies. So there are things that help those mitochondria to Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:04.793)Ugh. Ann Shippy MD (11:18.904)work better. So things like CoQ10 and a special form of CoQ10 that I love called MitoQ, alpha lipoic acid, carnitine, B vitamins, D ribose. So there are so many things that you can put into your concoction of mitochondrial support and you can do some trial and error and see what you like the best. Astaxymetham’s another one, but you can’t go wrong with any of those things. They are all going to help your mitochondria be better. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:30.632)Hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:39.388)Yes. Ann Shippy MD (11:47.008)And then our cell membranes and our mitochondrial membranes all really benefit from something called phosphatidylcholine, or I call it PC for short. And it also is just one of the really good things, especially for women, great for men too, but to be taking to build healthy babies because a lot of what we’re doing as we’re growing a baby is making new mitochondria and new cells in their bodies. And so having plenty of phosphatidylcholine. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:53.981)Mm. Ann Shippy MD (12:13.656)can help in it, especially for people that are doing a plant-based diet. They may not be getting enough choline and phosphatidylcholine. So that would be my number one thing. If you’re just going to pick one thing to take in this preconception period, take the phosphatidylcholine because it’s going to help that baby to grow as well as help your agate sperm be healthier. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:17.735)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:36.924)I read then the book, Doctor, and we see a lot of prenatals that contain choline, but you say there’s, should also be taking the phosphatocolline. That’s a word. You should take both. You should specifically seek that out, or are there prenatals that contain both? Ann Shippy MD (12:48.43)Take them. Ann Shippy MD (12:53.652)I don’t know of any prenatals that have it yet. It has to be separate from what I’ve seen. That’s actually not a bad business idea. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:56.164)Got it. Because I hear a lot about colon, we hear that a lot, your literature, your book was the first I had heard about taking that as well. Also, we hear about taking DHA to make sure we’re early pregnancy or all of pregnancy. That’s also an important supplement for babies’ health. Ann Shippy MD (13:19.966)Yeah, you know, I tend to stay away from anything that’s hormonal, preconception and during pregnancy. Okay, perfect. Because yeah, DEA is something we make in our body and there are people that take it to support their bodies, but yeah, the DHA, I like really hesitant. But yes, the omega-3s are super important again for building those cell membranes and you know, brain heart, all the things. Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:26.408)I’m sorry, EEPA, D-A-S-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A-E-P-A- Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:36.226)make a fact. Yes, yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:49.576)So another thing that was really interesting in your book, Doctor, that I’ve been hearing more research around is NAD. And I remember I had an NAD infusion to help me get over COVID, which was amazing. I felt so clear. I felt so good. But I’m also hearing people talk about doing it for mitochondrial health as well. Can you share with us a little bit about that? And if people are interested, should they be doing NAD? while they’re pregnant, both the micro daily injections or oral NAD. Ann Shippy MD (14:24.268)Yeah, so just to give you a context, really think about if pregnancy is different than preconception versus like when you’re trying to conceive. there’s kind of preconception, trying to conceive and pregnancy. So NAD, I love preconception. Like some of my patients will actually come, they’ll do it orally to help with mitochondrial function, because it is a good booster for mitochondria. And then they’ll do… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:37.895)Right. Ann Shippy MD (14:53.196)do it IV because it’s kind of like a little bit of a car wash. You don’t have to do that, but if you have access to it and have the resources to do it, it is great. It’s a tool that I use if I’ve been traveling, if I’ve known I’ve gotten a toxic exposure, it’s my best reset. During COVID, it was amazing. Even now, I some patients that come in after the flu, COVID, anything to Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:57.477)Yeah, mega jokes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:14.472)Yes. Ann Shippy MD (15:22.626)just get a little reset. When we get into the trying to conceive period, I’m a little bit more conservative. Like I want men to be careful about what, know, anything that might push the body to detox a little bit too much or women to detox a little bit too much. So that is kind of an individual decision based on, you know, a patient for me, because I don’t want to do anything that’s kind of want to do it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:37.755)Okay. Ann Shippy MD (15:50.766)too big of a detox right around the time that we’re actually conceiving. And then during pregnancy, I’m very conservative. Like I really believe in a lot of the building block kinds of things, but we don’t want to push the body to be detoxifying too much. We really want to be, so anything that might help the body to detox too much. So I wouldn’t do like a glutathione IV, I wouldn’t do any significant IVs during. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:53.572)Okay. Ann Shippy MD (16:17.336)during pregnancy because I just don’t want to take, like I’m risk averse in that situation. If I don’t have data to know that the baby’s going to be okay, I’m going to look for other alternatives. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:21.178)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:28.786)So even the oral NAD you wouldn’t recommend during pregnancy. Okay. Ann Shippy MD (16:31.47)Actually the oral is fine. The IV just pushes the body a little bit more that you might do a little bit more detox. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:38.824)got it. Because I hear people doing, and I know you talk about in the book avoiding peptides and hormone replacement, but I know there’s brands that are doing like 30 micrograms a day, like tiny amounts of NAD. Do you think that would help with embryonic health potentially? Ann Shippy MD (16:58.338)before pregnancy and then after pregnancy, just would need some to feel and to see some data to feel comfortable with it. Yeah. So what I’d love to do is prime the body as much as possible in this preconception period and have it like everything supercharged. It’s like, you know, when I travel, I have my phone charged, my computer charged, and I have a backup battery that’s all charged. So we want to get all the charges in place and then say, go and then maintain. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:59.794)Don’t. Yeah, no, that’s clear. That’s good information. Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:17.809)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:25.286)Yeah, I got it. Ann Shippy MD (17:27.884)the charging, we don’t want to do too much supercharging. That could be a risk. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:34.534)What do you say to patients, Dr. Anne, they’ve done the program, they’ve cleansed, they’ve done a lot of your protocols. And I want to get into stress and autoimmune in just a moment, but they’re doing it and the program’s successful and they get pregnant. But then how do you counsel your clients about avoiding miscarriage or if some people have repeated miscarriage? I know you mentioned progesterone in the book. Ann Shippy MD (18:01.216)Yeah. So I do track progesterone really carefully right after conception. Because sometimes people need that. It’s interesting because I feel like there’s before the last couple of years, I thought that you were more likely to need the progesterone, you know, with the older age, right? Like maybe later thirties and early forties. But what I’ve seen happen now is like the more Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:21.959)Yeah. Ann Shippy MD (18:28.846)crime the body is, the better the, especially when we have partners that will also prep that a lot of times you don’t need the progesterone, but it is a really, I do like to monitor it in that first trimester and make sure that the body is making a good amount of progesterone. And then if somebody is having recurrent miscarriages, we got to dig deeper as to why. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:36.072)you Ann Shippy MD (18:58.326)So one of the more common things that can happen is the toxic exposure you don’t realize. toxic mold, the black mold, isn’t just an allergen, but it’s actually making chemicals that are very strong and very dangerous have been one of the root causes when we’ve dug into things to find out what’s going on with miscarriage. There can also be a genetic predisposition to clotting. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:03.88)Mmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:24.988)Mm-hmm. Ann Shippy MD (19:26.7)So then we wanna do some gene testing and see, do you have a predisposition where your body starts clotting really easily? And if that’s the case, it’s so treatable. just take, depending on what the gene is, you might take some aspirin or you might take an injection with lovinox. Then the other thing we wanna do is look for, is there a situation where there’s some autoimmunity? So antiphospholipid antibodies. Looking back at my story, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:51.836)Okay. Ann Shippy MD (19:54.988)that probably was one of the reasons that I wasn’t getting pregnant. was having super probably having super early miscarriages because I would feel like, okay, my body feels different. But then I would have ended up starting bleeding and then have a heavy period. So and then later on found that nobody was looking for looked at it for me. It was before I went to medical school and and then during residency before I had all this information. So then we wanna do those blood tests to look for autoimmune, it’s called anti-cardiolipin or anti-phospholipid. And again, it’s good news if you find it because then you know, okay, well, that’s at the root of it. And a lot of times what the traditional medical model will do is just band-aid that with a medication to thin the blood a little bit. But in… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:36.775)Yeah. Ann Shippy MD (20:48.834)my world with the functional medicine where we’re looking at the root causes of, wait, why did the body get confused and start attacking itself? So we find out why and we get those things healed. So a lot of times there’s a gluten sensitivity or celiac, or there’s a shift in the microbiome. There’s a low grade infection like Candida in the gut that the body’s trying to fight off and in that exuberance of trying to keep. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:07.9)Thank you. Ann Shippy MD (21:17.026)from being taken over, it’s gotten a little confused or there’s an environmental exposure like heavy metals, pesticides, toxic mold that the body’s like, wait, this is too much to deal with. I up regulate the immune system and then again get confused and attack itself with the thyroid or ANA or antiposyloquid are the most common ones. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:18.664)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:29.384)I Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:38.374)Hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:43.45)It’s amazing. The first thing you said was the mold, which means you must see it quite a bit in your work. Is there any product or any way you recommend for us to detox the black mold as well as Ann Shippy MD (21:54.464)Yes, I do. so this, so my friend

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Dr. Nathan S. Bryan Summary: In this conversation, Dr. Nathan S Bryan discusses the critical role of nitric oxide in preventing chronic diseases and promoting longevity. He emphasizes the importance of proactive dietary and lifestyle strategies to maintain health before symptoms arise. Dr. Bryan explains how nitric oxide influences cellular functions, including the activation of telomerase, which helps maintain telomere length, and promotes mitochondrial biogenesis, leading to increased energy production. He expresses why nitric oxide is essential for activating pathways that contribute to a long and healthy life. About Dr. Nathan S. Bryan Dr Nathan S. Bryan is an author and pioneering scientist transforming the way we think about health, longevity, and human performance. His groundbreaking nitric oxide research has challenged health myths, fueled a billion-dollar market, and empowered millions to reclaim their health and optimize performance. He was the first to describe nitrite and nitrate as indispensable nutrients required for optimal cardiovascular health. He was the first to demonstrate and discover an endocrine function of nitric oxide via the formation of S-nitrosoglutathione and inorganic nitrite. This technology is now validated in six published clinical trials. Dr. Bryan earned his undergraduate Bachelor of Science degree in Biochemistry from the University of Texas at Austin and his doctoral degree from Louisiana State University School of Medicine in Shreveport where he was the recipient of the Dean’s Award for Excellence in Research. He pursued his post-doctoral training as a Kirschstein Fellow at Boston University School of Medicine in the Whitaker Cardiovascular Institute. After a two year post-doctoral fellowship, in 2006 Dr. Bryan was recruited to join faculty at the University of Texas Health Science Center at Houston by Ferid Murad, M.D., Ph.D., 1998 Nobel Laureate in Medicine or Physiology. Guest Resources: Book: The Secret of Nitric Oxide: Bringing the Science To Life Website: drnathansbryan.com Social: @drnathansbryan   Episode Sponsors: ANIMA MUNDI OFFER: To get THE PUREST, MOST DELICIOUS, benefit driven Herbal Teas infused with harmonizing adaptogens go to Animamundiherbals.com and use code: KIM20 to get 20% off your purchase! USE LINK: Animamundiherbals.com and use code: KIM20 to get 20% off your purchase!   SBO PROBIOTICS OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. Episode Chapters 00:00 The Role of Nitric Oxide in Health and Longevity 00:20 Nitric Oxide and Cellular Function 00:38 Activating Longevity Pathways   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:00.77) Dr. Nathan, thank you so much for joining us here today.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (00:04.266) Kim, so great to be with you. Thanks for having me.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:06.51) I think I hear a little bit of a Texas twang, am I right?   Dr Nathan S Bryan (00:11.562) Probably a little. I grew up in Texas, spent a lot of time abroad. I trained it or went to school in Louisiana and then trained up in Boston before I came back to Texas.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:21.154) Wow, you sort of did a full circle back to your roots. Well, I really enjoyed reading your book, Doctor, The Secret of Nitric Oxide, Bringing the Science to Life. It was really interesting. And I also love how you wove so much about your personal story in and your education and your influences, because I think that brings the subject matter to life even more. And I have so many questions I wrote down.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (00:23.36) No place to go.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:50.54) Before we get into that, have to say Dr. Nathan, right before I came on, and we both modified the time a little bit, I actually took my dad to get a calcium scan. And it was something I had heard about on another podcast interview actually. And I thought, well, maybe it’s a good thing to do. And I can’t tell you how emotional it made me. I was very surprised to see the heart. He’s in his seventies.   So the doctor was going over with us and he’s like, look, he’s in a really good level, but just to see that there was any sort of clogging is scary. know, to think about, like it starts to feel really real when you’re actually looking at the heart and you’re looking at family members’ hearts and how important cardiovascular health is and this whole subject.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (01:24.853) Yeah.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (01:38.644) Well, it’s the number one killer of men and women worldwide. mean, so it’s a very serious subject. you know, think coronary calcium’s are good, but really that’s, you know, it’s good to have data, but we don’t worry about calcified plaque because that stable hard plaque, what you worry about is the soft, vulnerable plaque. That’s the point. Yeah. Yeah. So I think it’s important to put that in context. It’s good data. It’s good to know, but hard   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:50.21) Yes.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:57.43) Yes, and he also got an angiogram. He did that part too.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (02:08.096) A calcified plaque doesn’t kill anybody. It’s the soft plaque that ruptures that causes an MI.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:12.844) Yes, exactly. So at first, I booked him for that, the scan, and then I learned about the soft plaque angiogram and realized how much it seems like the technology has advanced from prior generations and how we can do these tests. So anyways, it was just even more interesting to me to read about nitric oxide being as it’s so related. I want to read this quote that’s in your book.   that was, first of all, a lot of people have heard of nitric oxide because as you talk about, it’s become a popular compound we hear in the wellness world. Some people are using it for working out. You’re talking about it in a much, much deeper way. And this quote, the discovery of nitric oxide and its function is one of the most important in the history of cardiovascular medicine.   and how many people might not even realize how nitric oxide led to the Nobel Prize, and I believe it was in 1998.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (03:16.416) 1998, yeah. And that quote was by Dr. Fuster, who was the president of American Heart Association at the time the Nobel Prize was awarded to. You that quote is, what, 1998? So what is that, 27-year-old quote? And it still rings true today.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:31.48) Can you share with us how the Nobel Peace Prize being awarded to Nitrogox, how the new discoveries and new research sort of changed the trajectory of your career and your focus?   Dr Nathan S Bryan (03:42.944) Yeah, well, was the Nobel Prize in Physiology and Medicine in 1998 that was awarded to Bob Furchcott, Lou Ignarro, and Fred Murad. But collectively, they came together and really it was three independent studies. So in 1977, Dr. Murad discovered that drugs like nitroglycerin release nitric oxide, dilate blood vessels, and that’s how they work. Those drugs had been used for more than 100 years prior to they understood how they worked.   but they dilate the blood vessels, they relieve the ischemic pain known as angel in patients with obstructive coronary disease. And so, I mean, that was an important discovery in pharmacology on understanding how certain drugs work. But really, I think the seminal discovery was by Bob Furchcott in 1980, where he discovered that our endothelial cells, the cells that line all blood vessels throughout the body, produced a molecule that caused these blood vessels to dilate or to relax. And he didn’t know what this molecule was.   So he called it endothelium derived relaxing factor. Obviously by naming this molecule, this unknown molecule, knew how or he knew where it was produced and what it did. It was a relaxing factor produced in our endothelial cells. And then, you the race was on what is this EDRF molecule? Because if you could identify that it would be revolutionary in basket biology. And it was Lou Ignaro who went on to later discover that EDRF is actually nitric oxide.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:41.614) Mm.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (05:07.358) So the story came together that whether if you give a nitric oxide releasing drug or you stimulate endogenous nitric oxide production, it dilates blood vessels, it improves oxygen and nutrient delivery, and it controls everything we know about the cardiovascular system. I think that’s why Val Fuster had made that quote because it was and is and will remain to be the greatest discovery in the history of cardiovascular medicine.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:32.866) Well, besides pharmaceutical or medications, doctor, you talk about in the book about eating green vegetables and how vegetables have nitric oxide and it’s related. This is really interesting oral bacteria. I keep hearing how bad mouthwash is for you, but just to keep, you know, the biology of your mouth intact, but also vegetables. can we, and I love how you talk about a plant-based diet in the book as well and all the research. And I want to show you, I’m drinking my glowing green smoothie right now.   I have a, my family has a tremendous amount of greens every day that made me really happy. My kids drink it, my dad drinks it, my husband drinks it. So is it enough to eat a vegetable, a pro-vegetable diet, given that of course levels may decrease over time, but is that the foundation of nitric oxide levels in the body?   Dr Nathan S Bryan (06:02.666) There you go.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (06:23.398) No, not really. mean, what we’re finding is that… So nitric oxide is a gas, right? Your body has to make it. So nitric oxide is not found in vegetables. It’s not found in beets. It’s not found in capsules or pills. And I think that’s the misconception because the general public doesn’t understand that nitric oxide, when it’s produced in the body, it’s a gas. And once it’s produced, it’s gone in less than a second. So really…   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:34.574) Mmm.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:44.054) Okay.   Yeah, I read that. It’s crazy!   Dr Nathan S Bryan (06:48.896) My challenge was, and really how I got involved in the field 25, 26 years ago, was trying to figure out once nitric oxide is produced and it’s gone in less than a second, where does it go, what does it become, and how does it signal? Because we knew that the physiological effects of nitric oxide lasted longer than one millisecond or two milliseconds. So then we had to create this fingerprint of N-O-Biology that once it’s produced, where does it go, what does it become, and how does it signal?   So once we understood that and then we started trying to figure out, how does the human body make nitric oxide? So as we discussed, it’s produced in the lining of the blood vessels and that production pathway gets, I guess, more dysfunctional with A. So we lose about 10 to 12 % of our nitric oxide production through that enzyme per decade. But you mentioned diet. Diet is an important contributor factor in the prevention, the treatment, and the curing of all disease.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:37.71) Mm.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (07:47.048) Diet and lifestyle are the number one things for this. So we discovered probably 25, 30 years ago, even dating back before that, it was recognized that there are bacteria that live on the crypts of the tongue in the oral cavity that were somehow responsible for nitric oxide being produced, nitric oxide gas being produced in the lumen of the stomach. So then you start to figure out, how do we get from bacteria in the mouth to producing nitric oxide gas?   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:09.506) Wow.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (08:15.87) And what it was later discovered was inorganic nitrate that’s found in green leafy vegetables, really anything grown in the soil, right? Because the soil has contained nitrogen. It’s either in the form of ammonia or nitrate. And then those plants assimilate the nitrate. Then when we consume those plants, that nitrate is taken up in our gut. It’s concentrated in our salivary glands. And now each time we salivate, we’re secreting nitrate.   these nitrate reducing bacteria that live on the crypts of the tongue activate or metabolize that nitrate into nitrite. And then we swallow our own saliva and that’s the source of the nitric oxide gas. But there’s many steps as you start to understand that are required. Number one, you must get enough nitrate in your diet. Number two, you must have the right oral bacteria because humans do not have the capacity to metabolize nitrate. We do not express the nitrate reductase enzyme.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:55.885) Wow.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (09:12.478) And then number three, you must have stomach acid production. When we started figuring out, the standard American diet, you’re only getting about 150 milligrams of nitrate per day, and you need at least 300 to 400 milligrams. Number two, and the major problem is two out of three Americans use mouthwash. Almost everybody has fluoride in their toothpaste. 73 %   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:15.81) Right.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:33.326) The fluoride will kill out the healthy microbiota.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (09:37.088) Now that’s right, fluoride is in toothpaste and mouthwash and drinking water because it kills bacteria. So it’s killing the good bacteria, it’s killing the bad bacteria, it’s a neurotoxin, it’s just on your thyroid function. And then the other… No, it’s awful. And then the other problem are antacids. know, 200 million prescriptions written for antacids every year and two out of three Americans report using an over-the-counter antacid.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:43.767) Yes.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:47.596) I’m so glad I won’t use that.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (10:03.988) So everything that we do, our diet, oral hygienic practices, pharmacotherapy, seems to disrupt and shut down nitric oxide production. And to me, that explains why people are so sick.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:13.399) Okay.   Can I ask you a question about oral health besides the fluoride doctor, if people have a lot of gum issues or cavities or just eating a really acidic diet in general, there’s a lot that can also throw that part of the equation off, I imagine.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (10:33.124) For sure. What we’re understanding now that the microbiome has been mapped on the humans, all the bacteria that live in and on the human body, there’s 10 times more bacteria than there are human cells. The problem is what we call dysbiosis. When the terrain or the ecology of that environment changes to where it doesn’t allow for the good guys to repopulate and it allows for the opportunistic pathogenic bacteria to show up and wreak havoc.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:44.182) What?   Dr Nathan S Bryan (11:01.598) So what we’re finding now is you can’t destroy the microbiome. We have to support it and we have to change the ecology. We have to change the environment to where the pathogens can’t grow. The good guys act as the cops. They keep the bad guys at bay. And that should really be the target. But you made a couple of interesting comments or spot on comments. A diet, an acidic diet, a high sugar diet. When we eat those types of food, it drops the pH of the saliva and it makes it more acidic.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:24.899) Yeah.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (11:30.814) And now an acidic saliva allows for the population of these caries causing bacteria, the gingival bacteria that cause gingivitis, periodontal disease. And so the solution, once upon a time, was just to kill the bacteria. Throw an atomic bomb in your mouth with fluoride wrenches, with alcohol wrenches, with chlorhexidine, and just kill all the bacteria. But now we know that’s causing more harm than it is providing benefit. So the strategy now is to change your diet.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:54.764) Right. Right.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (11:59.434) change your oral hygienic practices, create an environment that’s conducive to good diverse oral microbiome. Not only do you have better oral hygiene, but you maintain optimal nitric oxide production, you get better blood pressure management, and your body’s more healthy.   So back to the nitric oxide, we’ve been talking about the benefits for cardiovascular wellness. And you also talk about in your book, there’s a section about potentially helping to reduce systemic inflammation, telomeres, mitochondrial function. Can you talk about benefits in those areas as well?   Dr Nathan S Bryan (15:35.112) Yes, so the drivers, if you look at any, we’ll handle the of the drivers of chronic disease, then we’ll look at the hallmarks of longevity because I think they’re all related, but they’re typically two different kind of subject matters. But if you look at chronic disease, whether it’s heart disease, Alzheimer’s, diabetes, autoimmune disease, there’s always four things that are present in all of those disease. There’s always low blood flow to the affected organ. There’s always inflammation, oxidative stress and immune dysfunction.   And it’s the loss of nitric oxide that drives all four of those. Because if you can’t make nitric oxide, you don’t dilate the blood vessels until you get low blood flow, we it ischemia hypoxia. You get runaway inflammation. Your mitochondria become uncoupled. You generate a lot of superoxide and oxidative stress. And then our immune cells start attacking our body. We can develop autoimmune or we call immune dysfunction. And interestingly, if you can just restore the production of nitric oxide, it dilates the blood vessels.   It suppresses the inflammation. In fact, I have several patents on the methods of reducing inflammation by using nitric oxide. And it’s getting to the source of the oxidative stress. It’s recoupling the electron transport chain of the mitochondria. It’s shutting down superoxide production from NADPH oxidase and then even the enzyme that makes nitric oxide. We can suppress that enzyme from making superoxide. And then it corrects the immune dysfunction that we see.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:36.855) Wow.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:58.136) Wow.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (16:58.762) So nitric oxide is the foundation for preventing the onset and progression of chronic disease. But that’s medicine, right? And medicine is a reactive practice. What we hope to do is change the conversation of being proactive and start to implement dietary lifestyle strategies before you get sick and before you develop symptoms. But when we talk about longevity, we always look at the length of our telomeres, we always looked at the function of our mitochondria.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:19.873) Right.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (17:25.664) and then we look at how well our stem cells can mobilize and differentiate. And I talk about in the book, and this is published science that goes back 20 years now, nitric oxide activates an enzyme called telomerase, prevents telomeres from shortening. It activates mitochondrial biogenesis. So if you have nitric oxide, you have more mitochondria per cell generating more energy with less oxygen. And then it’s the signal that tells our own stem cells to mobilize and differentiate.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:29.997) Right.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (17:52.042) So if you want to a long, healthy life, you have to have nitric oxide to activate these longevity pathways.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:59.574) So one of the things that, and that’s all amazing, and I think there was some confusion you mentioned in the book, and I remember reading about this as well, where people thought, well, maybe I’ll take L-arginine as a supplement. Can you talk about, can you clarify that for us?   Dr Nathan S Bryan (18:11.146) day.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (18:15.648) Yeah, so this goes back to really the year the Nobel Prize was awarded because the pathway that was discovered, this enzyme, nitric oxide synthase, takes L-arginine and converts it to nitric oxide gas. And then we get little citrulline as a byproduct. But because L-arginine is a semi-essential amino acid, meaning that we get it from the breakdown of protein, whether you’re eating plant protein or animal protein, L-arginine is found in most proteins. So as long as we have stomach acid production, we’re constantly getting L-arginine through our diet.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:27.906) Right.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (18:45.792) But every cell in the human body makes arginine through the urea cycle. So we’re never deficient in L-arginine. There’s only one condition, and I’ll talk about it in the book, but it’s a rare inborn ear metabolism where these kids can’t generate L-arginine endogously. But the majority of us, all other humans on Earth, have excess arginine, have more than what’s needed to bind the enzyme to make nitric oxide.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:57.997) Right.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (19:13.856) So to me as a biochemist, it never made sense to supplement with L-Arginine. And in 2006 and 2007, two studies came out which showed that it should be contraindicated and really shouldn’t be given because in a clinical trial in patients who had just suffered a heart attack, they gave one group L-Arginine and one group of placebo. The group that got the L-Arginine had higher mortality, higher death.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:18.158) Right.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (19:40.992) And so the conclusion of 2006 study was you should not give L-Arginine to patients who have suffered heart attack. Why? Because it will kill them. It will kill them more so than giving a placebo. And then the next year in patients with peripheral arterial disease, they did the same study giving L-Arginine chronically and the patients get worse. Their disease gets worse. So…   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:41.366) What?   Dr Nathan S Bryan (20:06.62) Look again, arginine should never be used as a primer for nitric oxide production. Because number one, we’re never deficient in it. Number two, if you have endothelial dysfunction and uncoupled NOS, you make the patients worse. They get worse. And that’s published clinical data, randomized placebo control data. It’s indisputable.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:25.902) Wow, so much conflicting information that we hear. It could be potentially.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (20:32.064) Well, that’s the problem. I mean, that’s really the problem because you’ve got these companies out there as we increase the awareness and the importance of nitric oxide, more companies are entering this space trying to sell nitric oxide products. And if they don’t understand the science, they can actually do harm and first do no harm. then companies are putting citrulline in products and calling it nitric oxide. Citrulline is a byproduct of nitric oxide production.   And so it can be very dangerous and all this misinformation and really ignorance in some cases and in other cases it’s deception and fraud because these companies know better but yet they’re still promoting this.   Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:13.538) So as a baseline doctor, want to make sure our oral health is good. We want to make sure we’re taking in these vegetables. We have stomach acid. How do we know if we’re deficient or not in nitric oxide? Are there any symptoms? Are there any tests?   Dr Nathan S Bryan (21:19.667) Absolutely.   Dr Nathan S Bryan (21:32.426) Well, unfortunately, there’s not any clinical test in terms of drawing blood and getting a number and then sayin

This Week’s Episode Special Guest: Dr, Jenneffer Pulapaka Summary: In this episode, Kimberly and Dr. Jenneffer Pulapaka discuss the importance of heart health and the role of a plant-based diet in achieving it. She shares her journey into lifestyle medicine, emphasizing the need for a holistic approach to health that includes diet, exercise, and sleep. The discussion covers common misconceptions about protein intake, the impact of inflammation on health, and the benefits of cooking with whole foods. Dr. Pulapaka also highlights the affordability of healthy eating and the significance of understanding the nutritional value of everyday foods.   About Dr, Jenneffer Pulapaka JENNEFFER PULAPAKA, DPM, is a Board-Certified Podiatric Physician Diplomate from the American College of Lifestyle Medicine. A trained podiatric surgeon who specializes in diabetic limb salvage, she is the founder of DeLand Foot and Leg Center. She focuses on Peripheral Vascular Disease, holds a Plant-Based Nutrition Certificate, and is a Culinary Health Education Fundamentals (CHEF) Coach. A Certified Sommelier, she also has 15+ years of experience in menu planning and event design in the restaurant industry and has been a featured sommelier at the James Beard Foundation House. Along with her professional chef husband Hari Pulapaka, she founded Cress Restaurant and they both live in DeLand, FL. They are the co-authors of The Heart Healthy Plant-Based Cookbook.   Guest Resources: Website: www.delandpodiatry.com Book: The Heart Healthy Plant-Based Cookbook   Episode Sponsors: FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY   GLOWING GREENS POWDER OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order.   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Heart Health and Plant-Based Diets02:56 The Confusion Around Dietary Trends05:58 Understanding Protein and Kidney Health09:10 The Role of Inflammation in Heart Disease11:55 Personal Journey to Plant-Based Living14:47 Cooking with Whole Foods and Spices17:51 The Importance of Fiber and Gut Health20:58 Exploring Nutritional Benefits of Everyday Foods23:51 The Impact of Sleep on Health26:59 Affordable Healthy Eating29:48 Final Thoughts on Heart Health and Lifestyle SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:01.494)Hi Jennifer, thank you so much for coming on our show today. Jenneffer Pulapaka (00:06.162)Thank you for having me, Kimberly. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:09.282)You know, when your book came across my desk and once again, everyone’s called the Heart Healthy Plant-Based Cookbook, it really caught my eye because I’ve been so interested, especially in the heart lately, the heart, the physical heart, you know, from a health perspective, from a dietary perspective, also from an energetic perspective, a spiritual perspective, how the heart is mentioned in all these different traditions around the world. But I wondered… And you tell a little bit about this in the beginning of your book, but if you could share with us why your focus has really honed in on heart health in particular. Jenneffer Pulapaka (00:46.888)Well, for me, so I am the pioneer of podiatric lifestyle medicine. And a majority of the patients that I see have lower extremity vascular disease with cardiac complications. So that’s the over, the broad overreaching patient population that I treat. And when dealing with patients, I was a typical physician that would treat patients with conventional medicine, was, you want surgery or do you want a pill? And lifestyle medicine allowed me to handle patients more broader with treatments, such as using diet, using sleep, reducing stress, exercise. reducing substance abuse, things like that, that I started to be able to include pillars in their healthcare and see a better outcome in patients. So for me, that’s why it was important. Just because I think I was getting burned out with just, it was the same thing all the time, pills or surgery, pills or surgery, referral, cardiovascular, interventional, cardiologists, what are we doing? And we were not getting off the wheel. You’re just kind of stuck in that cycle. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:00.536)Great. Jenneffer Pulapaka (02:10.875)and you weren’t regaining ground, you weren’t regaining your health, nothing positive was coming out of it except for trying to prevent a catastrophic event. So that’s why a heart healthy cookbook is really key to a majority of my patients. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:21.974)Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:31.84)Right. And I want to get into that in a moment. There’s such great information here, but one of the things you said is that we’re on the wheel. Many people are on the wheel. And one of the reasons I think people are on the wheel is because they’re confused. And there’s so much information out there, Jennifer, as you know. And it feels like to me, you know, there is decades of And sort of this general idea that we should limit red meat in particular and these foods that have high cholesterol, foods that feel clogging and common sense as these are really dense foods. But now we’re in a time in culture where there’s, it’s sort of swung, feels like back when I started writing books 11 years ago, I was always talking about this protein question that would come up being plant-based myself. How do you end up protein? And now there’s this such an over emphasis on protein. And what I see, Jennifer, is confusion. People are eating tons of red meat and they’re like, well, I saw such and such and they say that can eat as much red meat as I want or I should sit down and have six eggs. Can you talk to us a little bit about this confusion about cholesterol, foods that are elevating blood pressure, all the research for many decades that don’t correlate necessarily with these health trends or I don’t say health trends. Jenneffer Pulapaka (03:52.72)I mean, that’s great. That is what they are, okay? Bell bottoms, they’re not in fashion right now. They have been in fashion. They went out of fashion. They came back in briefly and they’re out. That’s kind of what we cycle when we deal with food trends. Different diets will keep on coming up historically. But unfortunately, there’s not enough peer-reviewed literature to be behind them. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:53.954)dietary trends. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:06.082)Yes. Jenneffer Pulapaka (04:22.331)We don’t have a big enough population to evaluate certain diets that are out there and nor is there research behind it. So those for me are always risky when it comes to patients. So we’d like to stay when I’m looking at or evaluating diets with patients. I always tell my patients when they were talking about plant-based, they’re like, well, can I add chicken? I’m like, well, you’ve been adding chicken in it and we’re here right now. I’m the thing that’s gotta cause a bump. Why don’t we learn how to not add chicken and not use butter and use a substitute to make it a more healthy option for you? Because what you’ve been doing hasn’t been working. That’s kind of where we are. I only use peer-reviewed literature for the most part. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:05.11)Right. Jenneffer Pulapaka (05:16.677)And it’s for me, it’s very hard because right now I do see a trend of patients who come in, they think they’re on a ketogenic diet. They’re not on a ketogenic diet. They’re never in ketoacidosis. They’re never reducing their amount of carbs to get to that state. And most of my patients are complicated patients, meaning that they have diabetes, vascular disease. Chances are they have chronic kidney disease. When we’re dealing with a lot of comorbidities with patients, we have to be very cognizant when they’re taking high protein diets. One of my biggest concerns is my kidney patients. High protein diets does not bode well for kidney function long term. And Kidego, which Kidney Disease International, when they put out guidelines, the last several years, the primary treatment for Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:58.625)Right. Jenneffer Pulapaka (06:15.719)chronic kidney disease in patients was diet and lifestyle. So it was nice that we saw a really good bump or a really good change in how we’re addressing patients with chronic disease. So now that we had a patient with chronic disease, maybe they don’t even know they’re stage three chronic kidney disease. And now they’re just loading up on all these proteins, which kidneys have to strip off nitrogen and it really taxes the kidneys. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:39.467)Right. Jenneffer Pulapaka (06:46.853)And unfortunately, it usually puts them in a downward spiral towards stage four. And at stage three, we have some really good studies that look at, can we get an improvement in kidney function if we decrease the amount of unused proteins? For the most part, my patients are not active. I am usually negotiating, can I get three days a week? Just three days a week, can you do 30 minutes three days a week? And the standard of care is exercise is five days a week, 30 minutes, moderate intensity. So when my patients tell me I need the protein, I’m like, no, not to walk the Pomeranian, a half a block, that’s not really exercise. I’m glad we’re doing range of motion and I’m glad you’re not doing sedentary, but you’re not really in an exercise state to be getting a lot of benefit. I don’t need to worry about protein issues with you. Now, when I deal with wound care patients, I deal with them. Or if I deal with dialysis patients, when I have a nutritionist, registered dietician that’s on board, then we’re looking at protein loss, but we’re not talking about a majority of patients that are on that. We’re talking about they got a, they went on Pinterest and they got some keto balls, which are hugely high in fat and protein. And nothing about that is gonna help with inflammation, their heart, their blood flow, or their weight. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:58.806)Yeah. Jenneffer Pulapaka (08:13.201)Right? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:14.752)Yeah. Well, you what you say makes sense and it makes sense to me. And then there’s Dan Buettner, who’s been on our podcast several times. He’s coming back on in December, who’s saying, Hey, look at these human populations, which are eating really fiber rich diets. They’re not hyper fixating on protein. And yet their longevity numbers are the best in the world. Then you have Dr. Michael, Dr. Michael Greger, who also came on with all his thousands of studies. He’s referencing saying, Hey, Look at the research. So why do you think Dr. Jennifer, from your perspective as a physician, you know, it’s like people are going on Pinterest, but I’m also seeing some doctors being like, you know, double the amount of grams that you’re hearing, you know, the recommended doses, one gram per body weight. Where is this coming from? How can, in our culture, we can have such differing views of the research. Jenneffer Pulapaka (08:45.532)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:12.308)And to me, common sense, if you want to open up your blood flow, you don’t want to eat clogging foods and really fatty, dense animal foods all day. But how is this even happening in your opinion? Because it’s mind boggling to me. Jenneffer Pulapaka (09:25.489)Well, we have different specialists that are out there and everyone has a different way of treating patients. For example, okay, for a good example, I have a lot of patients who will come in for lower extremity arthritis and tendonitis and everyone will keep missing kind of the, I don’t wanna say the elephant in the room, but the fact that a lot of my patients have obesity class two, class three, and no one’s even discussed about an oral medication for them at that point in time. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:00.962)Wait. Jenneffer Pulapaka (10:04.165)Some physicians only want to treat with lifestyle medicine or diet or conservative options. So maybe that’s where these practitioners are trying to maybe cause a bump, but I still prefer to stay with evidence-based. I still want lifestyle medicine on my patients. I still talk about diet, but I’m also an advocate for GLP-1, GIPs, phenamine and topramate. I’m an advocate for that. And I’m also very realistic with them that usually when you get on a semi-glutide, you will have to stay on that for life. And then they get upset. And then I just remind them you’re not upset that you’re on lisinopril for life. So now can you look at the benefits of being on a medication long-term, how we’re going to reduce our comorbidities? Maybe you’re going to Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:44.887)Yeah. Jenneffer Pulapaka (11:03.105)reduce your diabetes, you’re going to reduce your arthritis and your tendonitis and your like my diabetic patients who have a collapse of the midfoot and I have to deal with all the bone deformity and the ulcerations. So we have a lot of comorbidities that are around obesity as a diagnosis and we haven’t allowed the patients yet flexibility to look at it as a disease and to be treated as such with medication or with diet. So I just don’t only do that. I’m there with conventional medicine, but that may explain why some doctors, like one of my patients today, she was in obesity class three and her doctor was telling her about fiber. Great, wonderful. I am glad he had that discussion, but she’s looking at one total knee on one side and now we have another total knee that’s possibly starting on the other leg. and I had all the tendonitis and tendinopathies in my ankle and in the foot. And he’s still trying to tell her to lose weight and she could lose about a good 75 pounds and then she’ll feel comfortable and then we may see start to see improvement. But he that was the way he wanted to approach it. So that may be the way some physicians want to approach it. It’s not I like better peer reviewed research and A lot of the high fat, high protein diets do not have large scale populations to be looking at. So we don’t hear the nuances. And you know, and I love the Blue Zones. We just had a dinner the other evening that my husband hosted and it was about the Blue Zones. And it was, you know, really… they just the way they eat is healthy. It’s not a planned thing. They don’t make a concerted effort to be like, I’m going to get my fiber in. I’m going to get those things. They actually just eat a more healthy way than we do. And they’ll do conservative, like they’ll have an occasional glass of wine or they’ll eat, you know, fish twice a week or meat every so often. But it’s a more realistic diet. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:07.009)Yeah, it’s Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:19.746)Well, it’s simple, I think, and it’s accessible when you’re cooking one-pot meals and you’re not hyper fixating on numbers. It starts to get really confusing when you start to get heady, I think, versus intuitive and more in your heart, what your body’s drawn to. There’s this section, Jennifer, in your book about inflammation. That’s also one of the things we know is a precursor to heart disease, to many different illnesses in the body. Jenneffer Pulapaka (13:29.084)Yeah. Jenneffer Pulapaka (13:40.807)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:47.53)And when you are eating more fiber, it’s feeding those short chain fatty acids, which is helping to reduce inflammation. I, one of my, I’m concerned when people are just focusing on overloading protein, I’ve noticed in people, it’s like protein no matter what. So more meat, more protein bars, more protein shakes. They naturally get less of these colorful fiber-filled anti-inflammatory foods. And so it starts to create this imbalance. Jenneffer Pulapaka (13:51.74)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:17.378)when you’re focusing, your compass is set towards something very different. Jenneffer Pulapaka (14:22.285)find that most patients when they’re focusing on proteins aren’t actually really talking about a whole food. They like to do bars or smoothies or supplements. They’re not actually thinking about food or whole food, whether it’s grains or beans, lentils, seeds, nuts. They’re not really there. They will with their protein. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:29.461)Right. Jenneffer Pulapaka (14:52.045)as in their meats, animal proteins, they will fixate on that. And some of that can be due to the fact that we live in a society that praises wealth and a sign of prosperity has been for a long time that if you eat meats, it’s a status symbol versus I’m going to have a bowl of grains and lentils. there are sometimes we have… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:13.73)Yeah. Jenneffer Pulapaka (15:17.767)food can be personal and there are barriers or boundaries that people have to get around when it comes to eating a more healthy way. Because sometimes those family recipes are not healthy. They haven’t been there and that’s why you have a family history of heart attacks, gout, kidney disease, diabetes. It’s, know, the family cycle keeps on feeding you the wrong information. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:39.053)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:44.076)Well, Dr. Jennifer, when did you become plant-based? And I know a lot of this was informed from research. And now, you your husband is, you know, a partner in ways. You guys host a lot of things together. He’s been honored by the James Beer Foundation as a featured chef, working with all these amazing foods. When did you come into this path exactly? Jenneffer Pulapaka (16:05.741)So I first took my turn at 21. I became vegetarian. I decided if I was going to eat meat, I needed to go to a slaughterhouse and appreciate or accept the way the animal was being brought to my table. So after I had that experience, I became a vegetarian. I was not comfortable with Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:18.413)Hmm? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:29.208)Yeah. Jenneffer Pulapaka (16:31.463)I was not comfortable and I could not do it and I wouldn’t do it. So I decided at that point in time to become a vegetarian. And that was a pretty rapid change for me. I gave up red meat first. gave up chicken was the last thing. And then I think I finally had like a steak as one last hurrah. And I couldn’t get through eating the steak that I wanted to because I knew it was gonna be great. I couldn’t do it knowing that I went to, it was a… It was a cattle slaughterhouse. I just was like, I can’t. So I’ve been a vegetarian since I was 21. I’m 55. So it’s been a few years. Vegan, I say as much as possible. In my house, I’m vegan. When I go out in public, it is always a battle with how much egg is going to be utilized, dairy. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:24.6)Yeah. Jenneffer Pulapaka (17:29.453)in some instances. I’m always able to get vegan vegetarian options, but vegan is a little bit difficult. And if I’m going to get it out in public, it’s usually pretty pretty bad, I say. I usually get pasta primavera. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:36.471)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:44.716)Well, that’s why Dr. Jennifer, I don’t need out very much because I feel like at home there’s, and you can eat these beautiful recipes in your cookbook. It does make it much easier when the more home meals you do eat. Jenneffer Pulapaka (17:56.008)Yeah, you get pasta primavera, plate of sides, you’ll get a salad, or now I can get like a black bean burger. That’s like the, that’s the standard that I get when I eat out. So for me, it’s hard because yes, I do have my husband who is like, you know, a super creative chef when it comes to that. And he was vegetarian until he was 21. After he came to the United States, he was here a few years and then He tried meat. in his professional career as being a chef, he’s been very broad. He cooks a lot of seafood. He’s notoriously known for producing fantastic fish dishes. But I think it was his upbringing that taught him about spice and seasoning and flavor that makes him so good about making plant-based cooking. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:55.786)Right, he grew up in India. Jenneffer Pulapaka (18:55.973)because it was second nature to him, correct. He grew up in India and he came here when he was young. And a lot of us, like I said, we do not have contact with food anymore. And when I do culinary and coaching classes with my patients, we do small group exams. I bring them in foods and we talk about things like that. Like I have an example. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:20.617)Well, and while you’re getting that, I want to mention there’s some call-outs in the book and I want to get into some of the specific information, which is really interesting. But even to educate people, there’s a spice section in the book, you know, and it’s, this is something that everyone in India might know, for example, but here it’s saying, you know, spices are using any part of the plant, but the leaves, if you’re using the leaves, you’re, then it’s considered an herb. And if you’re not using the leaves, it’s a spice. Jenneffer Pulapaka (19:30.961)Yeah. Jenneffer Pulapaka (19:46.737)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:49.006)So I think this appreciation and sort of deeper understanding when we’re looking at any sort of plant and the parts that we’re using starts to create a deeper connection when you’re working with herbs, when you’re working with spices, when you’re cooking. It can be really simple, but it starts to get more, it feels really connected. Jenneffer Pulapaka (19:52.807)Thank Jenneffer Pulapaka (20:08.871)He does a good job. think common spice substitutions like that. was originally we did this in one of the first books that we had. You know what? That’s great. I don’t know how many it’s on page 27. I don’t know how many times my patients will ask. Well, if I don’t have fennel and they get scared about cooking recipes and like, you know, if you don’t have fennel. you know, use a substitute, you know. And if you don’t have it, just don’t use it. Move on. Find something else. Do you like gilding? You know, move forward with something, you know, but they get nervous about substitutions. And I think as you start to cook more and do more and be more hands on, then you’ll realize, you know, I don’t have lemongrass, but yeah, I just use, I just had lemon zest and I use lemon zest and I felt good enough. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:40.926)Right. You said that you- Isn’t that funny? Jenneffer Pulapaka (21:05.957)And then I wanted a little bit more herbaceousness, so I put some basil in it and that was my lemongrass. Perfect. Great substitute. Did you like the food you ate? Yes. Then it was perfect, right? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:16.142)Yeah, exactly. Again, less rigid, less heady and confused and more in flow, you know, the energetic part of being living a heart led life. And what I really liked too about the recipes, and I made a bunch of notes if you guys are watching this on her YouTube channel, I’m holding them up. There’s really great information worked into the recipes, which I appreciate. So for example, on page 42, where you talk about kale, Jenneffer Pulapaka (21:23.686)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:45.164)And one of the things that you mentioned is nitrate and nitric oxide and how it helps to open up the blood vessels contributes to the, it’s a vasoactive effector. And then it says, eat it, don’t juice it. And I’ve always been more into smoothies and kale salad instead of juice. Yeah. If you could talk a little bit about that. Jenneffer Pulapaka (21:45.799)it. Jenneffer Pulapaka (21:57.896)Yeah, I love that. Jenneffer Pulapaka (22:06.311)So, and I lecture on this one all the time when I’m talking because you have that nitrate, nitrite, nitric oxide pathway. And nitrates start in the mouth. You start to break it down by chewing. You need mastication with the saliva in order for that enzyme to start as it’s breaking down to your end result is nitric oxide. So it starts in the mouth. So therefore that’s why I’m like, you can’t do it. interesting there was a study that recently came out that was looking at toothpaste and mouthwash. So they were they’re looking into the fact that sometimes when we have this 24-hour toothpaste, well sometimes the bacteria or the enzymes that are in your mouth have a purpose and sometimes those things you know can interfere with that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (22:35.192)Hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (22:42.966)yes, I read that in here. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (22:49.134)you Jenneffer Pulapaka (23:02.915)It wasn’t a robust enough study, not a big enough population, but it’s an interesting point to see how is that going to play out down the line? You know, are they going to be looking more into that? Because we know you talked about inflammation, gut biome. You know, they do poo samples all the time on people who eat vegetarian, vegan, and meat, you know, and they’re looking to see which ones had the healthiest. And out of all of them, when people Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (23:02.957)Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (23:24.483)Right? Jenneffer Pulapaka (23:30.213)have really aggressive disease states that they have to kill off a lot of their bacteria and restart. They’ve had surgeries, really complicated patients, and then they’re inocula

Episode Summary: In this conversation, Kimberly speaks with Dr. Ingrid Clayton who shares her journey of understanding complex trauma and the Fawn response. After years of therapy and personal work, she reflects on her struggles with self-acceptance and healthy relationships. Through her experiences and education in psychology, she has gained new perspectives that have facilitated her healing process.   Episode Sponsors LMNT: OFFER: To get THE PUREST, MOST DELICIOUS PLANT-POWERED protein blend, infused with real vanilla and harmonizing adaptogens go to Animamundiherbals.com and use code: KIM20 to get 20% off your purchase! USE LINK: Animamundiherbals.com and use code: KIM20 to get 20% off your purchase!   FEEL GOOD PROBIOTICS OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order.   Episode Chapters 00:00 Understanding the Fawn Response00:35 Signs of Fawning in Relationships   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS The Hidden Power of the Five Hearts Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! How to Believe in Your Self Worth with Jamie Kern Lima How to Raise Your Standards In Your Love Life with Matthew Hussey How to Eat to Beat Your Diet with New York Times best selling author Dr. William Li The issues with consuming vegetable and seed oils with Dr. Catherine Shanahan How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo How to Optimize Your Metabolic Health with Dr. Casey Means TRANSCRIPT: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:01.436)Hi Ingrid, thank you so much for joining us today. Ingrid (00:04.802)Thanks for having me! Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:07.834)You know, I think your book really stood out to me because I only recently heard of this word fawn and fawning. And we all hear about fight and flight quite a bit because of all the nervous discussion and then freeze. But this whole fawning aspect, which of course we’re going to get into really deeply today, seems to be newer, at least in its identification. Ingrid (00:21.891)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:34.556)Can you tell us a little bit as a clinical psychologist how you even started focusing on this aspect in your work? Ingrid (00:42.666)Yeah, it’s new on the scene to just about everyone, actually. We’ve long talked about fight, flight and freeze, but I feel like fawning has been kind of hiding in plain sight and there are lots of different reasons for that. But one, think when you think about fight, flight and freeze, they look like obvious sort of trauma responses, right? You’re going against the threat. But with fawning, you’re actually leaning in. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:02.138)Yes. Ingrid (01:07.832)the source of harm. And there’s this appeasement factor, which could look like flirting or flattering or going along to get along. There’s a caretaking aspect. So it looks like you have agency. It looks like conscious choice, but actually underneath that is just like a fight, flight and freeze responses and unconscious reflexive survival mechanism. And so, you know, Pete, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:29.519)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:34.864)And why did you focus on this? Ingrid (01:36.782)Yeah, well, so Pete Walker coined the term, the Fawn response, I think in like 2013, but it’s really just coming into the mainstream now. And I come at his work and through this lens of complex trauma, which is relational trauma, in part because I’m a clinical psychologist, but more than that, I’m a childhood trauma survivor. And the reason I became a psychologist to begin with is largely because I’ve been trying to crawl out from under something that I’ve Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:01.754)Yes. Ingrid (02:05.28)lived with my whole life and none of the other frameworks ever freed me, right? Whether you talked about people pleasing or codependency or, know, it just felt like those frameworks were keeping me just as stuck as everything else I tried. And so when I came upon Pete Walker’s work and understanding these behaviors, you know, what we’ve called sort of codependent or people pleasing behaviors, in this trauma-informed lens, it was like, my word, I finally make sense to myself, right? And it just kind of set off this cascade of not only personal understanding, but my work with my clients changed. And now here we have the book on fawning. So hopefully, honestly, more people can make sense to themselves too. That’s the whole point, yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:58.074)You know, I really, think there’s, I think this is a lot more common than we realize. And I also, you know, applaud your bravery and telling some of your story in the book and sharing client stories. And I have to say Ingrid, when I started to read your book, I got a very specific feeling in my body. You know, trauma can get stored somatically and I’ve done so much work on myself, but it brought me back to Ingrid (03:04.992)Yeah. Ingrid (03:10.999)Hmm. Ingrid (03:19.403)Mmm. Mmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:27.41)my childhood and very early adolescence where I know you talk about being 13 and 12, 13, 14. I just remember walking around in the world and being quite innocent. And I started my period later and I started to get, my aunt said this to me, oh, you’re getting all this attention from men. And they would sort of look and be like, you here’s this, you know, what they would be pretty little girl or teenager. And I didn’t know what to do. I would smile. Ingrid (03:28.59)Mmm. Ingrid (03:33.249)Yeah. Ingrid (03:39.918)Hmm. Ingrid (03:54.349)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:56.144)or sometimes even giggle like you talk about when you’re feeling uncomfortable. And my author said to me, stop smiling. And it was almost like this shame, know, every time we went into public, don’t smile. And I remember being very confused and feeling shame and feeling like I didn’t really know what was going on. And then reading your book and I thought about it, but it just feels very complicated. There’s a complication to finding, cause we’re not trying to flirt. Ingrid (04:00.035)Yeah. Ingrid (04:04.267)Wow. Ingrid (04:09.966)Mmm. Aww. Ingrid (04:19.416)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:24.828)We’re trying to be safe. We’re trying to get out of danger. It’s very uncomfortable. But then there’s this shame that can get wrapped into it. So I started to read the book and I was like, gosh, I didn’t really dig into fawning before, but I really think that’s what was going on. Ingrid (04:33.176)That’s right. Ingrid (04:39.277)Mm-hmm. Ingrid (04:43.438)I think it is very common and I think about it this way that fawning tends to come online when fight, flight and freeze are either unavailable or would make things worse. So if you think about your example there and certainly my childhood, right, fighting back to the powers that be to, you know, largely men or your parents, they’re twice your size, they hold all the power. Yeah, it’s not going, you know, they literally hold your life in their hands. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:56.251)Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:06.77)Yeah. Ingrid (05:13.454)The flight response, right, where are going to go? You’re going to be brought right back to the scene of the crime. Where are you going to go? This is wherever you go. This sort of male gaze, this threatening sort of, it’s the waters that we swim in day in, day out. And the freeze response, although also very common response to trauma, when things are so chronic and ongoing and it’s day in and it’s day out, the body found this way to adapt. I believe it is this ultimately genius adaptation to go, This is my reality, right? That I have to navigate. I can’t fight back. I can’t leave and I can’t freeze. I can’t be a deer in headlights. I got to get up and go to school every day and sit at the breakfast table and engage with these people. And so it really struck me, particularly when I was writing the book, just how many systems of power the body is navigating on any given day. And listen, the body knows where it resides in the pecking order. Like it knows that I’m not the one. at the top of the food chain. And so this reflexive thing of like, well, you hold the power. I need to make sure you’re happy in order for me to be safe and the body will always privilege safety and survival. Right? So all these historical ways that we’ve talked about some of these behaviors like, well, know, Kimberly just raised your self-esteem or smile or don’t smile. Right? It’s like you could get either side of the equation. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:22.02)Five. Yes. Ingrid (06:37.026)telling you to just do all of these things that maybe seem so obvious and yet they were not available to us. And this is where the shame comes in. It’s like, you know, well, how could you stay in that relationship or how could you smile when they were being so aggressive or how could you this? How could you that? you know, shame is a deep symptom. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:45.264)Yeah Ingrid (06:59.09)of complex trauma, but you can see why too. goes hand in hand with the Fawn response that in order to keep yourself safe often and not knowingly, sometimes you have a sense of it, but often not knowing, there is this level of self abandonment, of betrayal. We know that I can’t respond to all of my values or all of what’s going to sort of honor who I am. I have to privilege this one piece first and it comes at a cost. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:15.186)Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:27.268)Yes. Well, you know what it feels like Ingrid as you’re describing it and I can recall this. am feeling it and just trying to really process this trauma, which is obviously still stored somewhere in me is this feeling of being deeply misunderstood because when the Imam was saying, well, don’t smile like I was doing something wrong. It was like, wait, I didn’t ask for this attention and I don’t want this attention and I’m actually uncomfortable and I don’t know what to do. Ingrid (07:32.78)Mm. Ingrid (07:42.199)Yes. Ingrid (07:46.211)Yeah. Ingrid (07:53.996)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:54.052)And so it’s just feeling like no one else is looking after me, misunderstood on our like kind of on our own, like this feeling of aloneness, abandonment, you know? Ingrid (07:57.592)Mmm. Ingrid (08:03.032)That’s right. I think that that’s real, right? That you’re not really seen for being a whole person. And there tends to be this sort of hyper independence that develops alongside a chronic fawn response for that reason. It’s like, we’re never really fully or wholly seen by anybody else. It’s like, I’m the only one who has my back. So I have to sort of react accordingly. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:19.932)We’ll Ingrid (08:29.59)in the world. And there’s a real sadness even as you talk about it right now. think there’s such a heartbreak there that in order to keep yourself safe, you had to prioritize these men and how they were sort of looking at you. And often with fawning, it’s sort of like, don’t like you, but I need you to like me in order to stay safe. Or maybe if you do like me, you won’t hurt me. And when your body has a sense that you’re being sort of pursued or Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:51.6)Bye. Ingrid (08:56.974)and you don’t really feel safe, like you’re still a child and you’re an old man and you know, it’s like, yeah, it’s a lot. It’s a lot to hold. It’s like you said, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:08.07)Well, Ingrid, you I think like your experiences and my experiences, I imagine a lot of women listening to this would be like, wait, I wasn’t actually sexually assaulted. No one actually, you know, did something physical, but there was uncomfortability. Can you share a little bit about, you know, what happened with your stepdad where he was, you know, having you sit on his lap in the hot tub or going to Vegas and he didn’t actually physically assault you, but there was a lot of uncomfortability. Ingrid (09:14.029)Yeah. Mm-hmm. Ingrid (09:23.032)Yeah. Ingrid (09:27.342)Mm-hmm. Ingrid (09:36.397)Yeah. Yeah. I think it’s very common that a lot of us, and this is based on sort of the old idea of trauma by definition, we looked at it as though a certain event entitled you to use that word. And those events tended to be very clear and obvious and everyone would agree, right? It’s a vet coming back from war time. It’s a car crash. It’s sexual assault. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:37.532)that went on for years. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:52.412)Right. Ingrid (10:01.347)things along those lines. And so a lot of us now, it’s like we have this trauma measuring stick that’s like, well, mine wasn’t that bad, right? And when we do that, unfortunately, we say, well, now I’ve been, I’m not allowed, I can’t avail myself of all of these tools of trauma healing that would actually be the thing that would help me, right? And so A part of what I’m hoping to do is also just educate people on complex trauma generally. Complex trauma is relational trauma. It’s ongoing experiences of threat over time. And it might not be this overt thing that everyone could name. It might be your parents, whether it was culturally or they were doing the best that they could, or maybe there’s generational trauma, but you were left feeling invalidated, like chronically invalidated or unseen. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:36.741)Right. Ingrid (10:49.455)over time, this buildup, this residue, the body learns like, oh, I can’t be my full self. Oh, it’s not safe to be me. And this sort of, know, fawning looks like this masking element of like, well, who do you need me to be in order to be included and seen and valued? And I think, yeah, this misconception of like trauma looks a certain way. It kept me on the outside for a long time, even knowing my own story, because similarly, like you said, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:12.914)Right. Ingrid (11:19.531)My stepdad didn’t like overtly sexually assault me. He was grooming me for years and it started with these, you know, seemingly innocuous, but my body felt that it was not innocuous of, you know, come on over here and sit on my lap and I’m glad we can be this close. And I knew in those moments that I wasn’t safe, but I’m also sort of clocking like, would anyone else think this was bad? Like he’s Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:46.757)Right. Ingrid (11:47.501)He’s my stepdad and he’s being nice and he’s not always nice and I like it better when he’s nice. And so I’m also leaning into that. I knew I couldn’t embarrass him. I knew that I couldn’t push back. I knew that he had another side to him where he really could steamroll me. He could be a rager. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:04.402)What about your mom? You couldn’t go to your mom. Ingrid (12:07.565)I couldn’t go to my mom in part because I saw her disappear as he came into our lives. It was like she just was in his shadow, wouldn’t say anything unless she’d heard him literally say it before. I say in the book that it was like my mom went missing even when she was standing right in front of me. It was just she was not there. Ultimately, I did do the things that we’re all told to do as though we’re all entitled to having a voice and standing up for ourselves and setting healthy boundaries as though it’s that easy. I did attempt to do those things and it made things a lot worse because now I had a stepfather who was grooming me, parading me around as a girlfriend and a mom who didn’t believe me. They were like, you’re a liar. You made it all up. What are you talking about? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:51.825)Ugh. Ingrid (12:59.339)Again, a whole lot happened, but not a whole lot happened. Even when I turned to social services as a child, they were like, is it that bad? Right? And it sort of seemed like the collective, yeah, the collective response was like, well, no, it’s not that bad. We’re not really going to intervene. There’s not much we can do. So my body learned along with the cultural conditioning of what trauma is that it wasn’t that bad. know, this is normal. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:07.908)Right, we’re questioned. Ingrid (13:27.039)And you’re not safe, essentially. If I’m a nervous system perspective, I learned, boy, I am not relationally safe. The only thing I can do to be relationally safe is to go along with your narrative to a certain degree, don’t push back, to swallow this deeper truth that never really got fully validated or metabolized. And ultimately what I now know is that kept me stuck for decades, right? It was like, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:54.438)Yeah. Ingrid (13:55.435)imprisoned in my own body in a way that’s essentially what unmetabolized trauma really is, is that you’re stuck, you’re stuck. So understanding complex trauma and understanding the Fawn response, like I said, after decades, I sat on so many therapist couches, I’ve been sober for decades, I’ve done so much inner work, it wasn’t like I wasn’t trying, I got three degrees in psychology, right? It was like I did all of this to try to overcome Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:17.882)Right. The wounded here. Yeah. Yes. Ingrid (14:21.237)Yes, this feeling of like, what’s wrong with me? I’m still broken. Why can’t I have a healthy relationship? Why can’t I really have this loving relationship with myself? And these were the lenses that allowed me to see myself differently, to access myself differently, and actually to finally heal. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:40.722)Yes, and there’s this whole amazing section in the book about that. But before we go in, Ingrid, and someone’s listening to this, can you explain a little bit about the difference between fawning and people pleasing? Some signs of like, hey, you know, these are some real signs of the fawning. And also, part three, it’s this complex question is, what kind of patterns might you see in relationship where you haven’t addressed fawning or what types of Ingrid (14:53.432)Yeah. Ingrid (15:05.966)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:09.074)people might you attract if you’re in that fawning trauma cycle. So signs, difference with people pleasing and relationships. Ingrid (15:13.751)Yeah, so great questions. Ingrid (15:18.383)So for me, I think both actually people pleasing and the language of codependency, these were our best attempts to name something that is real, right? With whatever information we had at the time. But. the problem that I can have with some of these terms is that they sort of place the problem as it were in an individual’s body as though it just originated out of thin air for no reason, as though it’s a problem that they possess that they need to fix and solve. And to me, the Fawn response, I see it as sort of the engine of these behaviors. It’s the why, right? That’s what has gone. missing this notion that we are relational beings, we are hardwired, we co-regulate, we cohabitate, we literally need one another. So to divorce this notion of needing one another and our dependency, our literal dependency on one another is really shaming and blaming. First of all, to the caregivers, it’s like we go here, here’s the emotional load, do all the heavy lifting. And then when they do it, we go, what’s wrong with you? Why can’t you take care of yourself? Right? There’s this crazy double bind. so fawning to me is the heartbeat of these behaviors that allowed me to go, that’s why I’m privileging. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:31.1)Yeah. Ingrid (16:44.917)external validation or your opinion of me or I’m wondering why you’re mad at me. It’s why I’m so hypervigilant because my entire sense of safety in the world was built on needing to prioritize what was happening outside my body in order to keep my body safe. I had to be divorced from my internal sense of safety and orient to your need first and then come back to me. go, my gosh, that makes perfect sense. And the second thing that Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:49.722)Yeah. Ingrid (17:14.209)I think the fawn response tends to that people pleasing and codependency have not historically is the context that I am not just a dysfunctional person. My body adapted, I think in a very genius way to a deeply dysfunctional environment or context. And again, it’s the piece where I go, my gosh, okay, now it makes sense that I was doing this, right? It’s not just because I love to… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:34.651)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:41.286)Yeah, Ingrid (17:42.893)I’m obsessed with control, right? It’s like, no, I was obsessed with safety. I was obsessed with the feeling that I could exist in the world. And now I understand why. So to me, that’s the sort of, it’s like, we know more now. These terms arose before we understood trauma at all. And they were also steeped in this sort of disease model, which I think we just know better now. Let’s do better. Let’s help people understand where these… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:44.859)Wait! Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:50.63)Yes. Ingrid (18:09.913)these behaviors came from. And so some of the common signs and symptoms then are if I can’t have a voice because it makes it worse, right? It puts me as more of a target and maybe you’re gonna come for me. Well, we’re conflict avoidant, right? So a lot of chronic fauners have kind of lost access to a healthy fight response, which is all these things that we’re told to just go and do, right? Set a healthy boundary. Well, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:20.347)Yeah. Ingrid (18:34.849)setting a boundary might mean that I’m really going to get steamrolled. Saying a no might mean, now you’re really going to come for me. And so the body learned time and time again, like, no, no, no, no, it’s safer not to push back, right? It’s safer. But ultimately, what happened for me and what happens for a lot of my clients is like the FON response is almost 10 steps out ahead of you, like a perpetual protector or a shield. And it’s, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:41.692)Right. Ingrid (19:01.769)acting, even environments that might be perfectly safe, but the body goes, I’m not going to risk it. This is my way to safety. This is how I show up in the world. We tend to be conflict avoidant. We tend to prioritize everyone else’s needs, our own. think even this idea where we started the podcast of like, your trauma matters, but mine doesn’t really. That’s also kind of a common sort of fawning response. It’s like, you’re entitled to have Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:08.166)Well, yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:20.7)Yes. Ingrid (19:31.533)your story and experience and you should have all the resources, but mine don’t really matter that much. What else? Yes. Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:37.083)Yeah. So gets swung down over again, like for decades it took you, I think in the book you said it was 30 years, you know, for you to really sort of unpack that. there’s just, feels at least, you know, in my experience with myself, it feels like there’s all these different energies wrapped in. It’s sort of like that shame as guilty, should I have been doing that? Like, should I have been doing something else? But then fear, I didn’t know what else to do. And then this. Ingrid (19:46.358)Ugh. Ingrid (19:51.214)Yeah. Ingrid (19:58.926)Yeah. Hmm. Yeah. Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:09.02)hollowness in my throat or you can’t really express yourself. And, you know, it affects relationships for a long time, I think, until you can actually find center. Obviously, you when we we heal ourselves, we find that centeredness and compassion. Everything around us changes. But, you know, like you said, sometimes we don’t hear about this for a long time, or we don’t have tools for a while. So it does go on. It’s pervasive. Ingrid (20:11.119)Mmm, yep. Ingrid (20:29.624)Yeah. Ingrid (20:36.621)Well, look what the bind is, right? Because when you say center yourself to me, what that means is you start to grow a sense of internal safety, right? Which is that all my safety doesn’t reside outside of my body. But when your whole life has been built on this very foundation that your sense of safety resides outside of your own body, just telling someone to like center themselves, and it doesn’t make any sense. It’s like, what are you even talking about? Of course, logically, we go, well, I do love myself, right? Like, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:43.408)Yes. Ingrid (21:05.591)It’s not about these ideas that make sense. It’s about a felt sense. It’s a nervous system experience of, don’t care what you say and how you say it, my body is not safe in the world. And so we have to start from a place where we acknowledge someone’s lack of internal safety and go, yep, that’s where we’re starting. I’m not pretending like you have all this access, you’re just not using it. It’s you’ve never had the experience of really feeling autonomous, of feeling maybe like an adult, you know? This language that so many of us use, like you can see now with all this gray hair, I’m in my 50s, but half of the time I go, my God,

This Week’s Episode Special Guest: Dr. Juliana Lindsay Summary: In this episode, Kimberly and Dr. Julianna Lindsey explore the interconnectedness of emotional and physical health, emphasizing the importance of stability in relationships and the impact of lifestyle choices on overall well-being. They discuss cardiovascular health, the significance of dietary choices, the effects of alcohol, and the role of supplements like glutathione and NAD in promoting longevity. The dialogue highlights the need for self-awareness and critical thinking in navigating health trends and misinformation.   About Dr, Juliana Lindsay Dr. Julianna Lindsey is Board Certified in Internal Medicine with additional training and certifications in anti-aging and regenerative medicine, functional and integrative medicine, lifestyle medicine, bioidentical hormone optimization, and peptide therapy. In addition to her clinical work, she has spent the past fifteen years serving executive leadership roles at Fortune-level companies. During this time, she observed the dysfunction of our health care system on a large scale, an experience that contributed to her motivation in establishing her Radiant Longevity clinic in Southlake, Texas, where she dedicates her life to serving people through personalized care and attention. She is the author of Radiant Longevity: A Physician’s Protocol for Living Your Best Life.   Guest Resources: Website: www.radiantlongevity.com Book: Radiant Longevity: A Physician’s Protocol for Living Your Best Life.   Episode Sponsors: FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY   GLOWING GREENS POWDER OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order.   Episode Chapters 00:00 The Importance of Connection and Stability05:02 Understanding Cardiovascular Health and Screening10:05 Dietary Choices and Their Impact on Health14:54 The Role of Alcohol in Health and Wellness19:41 Exploring Supplements: Glutathione and NAD24:57 Navigating Health Trends and Misinformation SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:01.23)Hi, Juliana. I was going to say Dr. Lindsay, but I love in your book how you say to call you Juliana. Thank you so much for being here with us today. Calling in from Dallas, I believe. Julianna Lindsey (00:13.333)Yes, Dallas-Fort Worth Metroplex. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:15.502)Love technology. You are asking me where I’m calling in from, which is currently California. And I do travel a lot between Hawaii and here. yeah, it’s just so great that we can have these conversations and feel that connection no matter where we are. Also books, you know, we’re both authors that we can really connect with people on the subject matter beyond your realm of patients in Dallas, you can share your ideas in this form, which is really exciting, I think. Julianna Lindsey (00:51.347)It is wonderful and connection is so important. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:54.774)You know, I really liked how you talked about such a variety of subject matters in your new book, Radiant Longevity, a Physician’s Protocol for Living Your Best Life. And I wrote a couple notes of some of the things that really stood out to me. And talking about connection, there’s a whole section in the book where you talk about a stable home life. And I really love that because we hear a lot about social connections and community. And of course, that was really highlighted a lot, especially since COVID, when there was so much isolation. But sometimes I don’t think we talk enough about stability. And that’s true if someone’s married, if they have kids, or a lot of our listeners may be single. But this idea of stability and having less drama in our lives and more nervous system regulation. Can you talk a little bit about why you called that out is so important in your book. Julianna Lindsey (01:54.239)not sure that there’s anything more important to our quality of life than having stability in our relationships. And you don’t have to have 50 friends. If you have one person that you know you can count on when the chips are down. And for me, I’m very fortunate to have a few. And my main person is my husband, but also my children. We have a… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:03.041)and Julianna Lindsey (02:23.115)drama free life. I just don’t have time or space for drama in my life. I don’t see any benefit to it and I try to avoid it like the plague. don’t and it is a plague and I hate it to see people online get wrapped up and trying to get reactions from people and you can just you can opt to just stay out of all that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:34.424)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:47.394)Right. Julianna Lindsey (02:52.277)But you do need people in your life that you can absolutely count on. And I want to be that person for other people as well. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:01.708)Yeah. Well, I think it’s important to talk about that because when we talk about stress and we talk about cortisol levels and, I mean, there’s so many things in daily life that we can do. Like you said, we can create a lifestyle. Maybe some of us grew up and you talk about trauma in the book as well, but maybe we grew up in a home environment that did have a lot of drama or maybe we can start to be aware in our life now. I know for me, Juliana, I can get really triggered by news. Like don’t really, I don’t watch the news, you know, I’ll read selectively, but also what’s coming into our feed. Like you said, there’s a lot of negativity online. So there’s a lot of things that we can do to create that stability. If we just start to be aware relationships, you know, what’s coming in, like our total environment. And that’s really important. You say stability, I also say more calmness, more peace. And that has an obvious, you know, effect. on our physical health, our mental well-being, emotional well-being, spiritual well-being, and so on. Julianna Lindsey (04:05.173)And of course we can’t separate any of that. We can’t separate our emotional wellbeing from our physical wellbeing. It’s all so integrated. And we have be very intentional about the environment that we create around us and the events that we allow to go on in our atmosphere. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:10.584)Yeah, it’s That’s right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:23.842)That’s right. And so if someone is listening to this and they say, wow, you know, there are, there is a lot of drama in my friendships or in my relationship. It’s something to be aware of and something that, you know, we have to look within ourselves and there’s so many different tools and, you know, resources available that it doesn’t have to stay like that. We can, you know, move in transition and it’s an important marker of health and wellbeing stability. Julianna Lindsey (04:51.059)Indeed, and just the ability to an open conversation, an open, authentic conversation with people is an art. Sometimes crucial conversations need to occur, right? People, relationships are not problem free. And if you hit a bump in the road, it doesn’t have to mean there’s drama. know, people should be able to have open, honest, authentic relationships with one another without there being drama involved and just, you know, state the problem and figure out together collaboratively how you want to solve the problem. If it’s a relationship worth having. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:17.006)Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:34.123)Yes. Julianna Lindsey (05:34.281)that it’s worth it’s worth an open conversation. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:38.53)Yeah, it’s true and honesty and coming from the heart. Julianna Lindsey (05:42.963)Yes. And I think you can feel your intention, right? If your intentions are good, if you want the best for that other person, if you want the best for your relationship, people know that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:56.694)Yes, that’s right. Well, and then only a few pages prior, and this is another note I had in completely switching gears, which again, I really love a holistic approach. And even a few pages earlier, you were talking about coronary artery calcium scan, the CAES, which my husband had done. And so again, there’s relationships, there’s the things that we can’t see with our physical eyes. And then, okay, there’s plaque. Julianna Lindsey (06:13.493)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:23.97)There’s hardened, there’s calcified plaque. There’s the statistics that we know about cardiovascular incidences. We know that a lot of women and men, all different types of people have heart disease. Now, can you talk a little bit about this scan and this test? Because I remember talking to my husband about this a few months ago and it seems somewhat… recent, it seems that not everybody knows about this. It feels like it could prevent a lot of cardiovascular incidences. I’m not sure if it’s always covered by insurance, but can you just give us more information about this test? Julianna Lindsey (07:02.261)love that you bring up that topic because cardiovascular disease is the number one killer of men and it is the number one killer of women. We hear lot about breast cancer and certainly we want to be aware of our breast cancer risk and keep up on those screenings and breast health but the statistically most likely event to lead to death is cardiovascular disease in women. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:10.189)Wow. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:30.189)Mmm. Julianna Lindsey (07:31.681)And it has historically been underdiagnosed and undertreated in a preventative fashion in women. So women are less likely to get put on cholesterol-lowering medications. They’re less likely to get put on blood pressure-lowering medications. The moment a man’s testosterone drops below 800, somebody wants to start giving him pellets. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:57.795)Right. Julianna Lindsey (07:58.431)Women are allowed to go through periods of estrogen deprivation in perimenopause and menopause, which is so harmful to our cardiovascular health. And we need to raise awareness that that period of estrogen deprivation is when our disease risk of cardiovascular disease rises to equal that of men’s. So I very much try to avoid, want to avoid, and usually can periods of estrogen deprivation from my patients. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:06.382)Mmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:27.896)So you mean with hormone replacement. Julianna Lindsey (08:28.577)Yes, identical hormone optimization. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:32.94)And then when would you recommend someone start taking this? Is it CACS you would say test? Yes. Julianna Lindsey (08:39.669)The coronary artery calcium score. So I don’t use the coronary artery calcium scoring anymore. So I use a CT angiogram. We specifically opt for the, it’s a branded name, the CLEERLY scan, C-L-E-E-R-L-Y. The CLEERLY scan is a CT angiogram. It is a CT scan, so there is some ionizing radiation involved, but it’s a low amount. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:48.494)Julianna Lindsey (09:09.511)The that scan is superior to the coronary artery calcium score because they use AI algorithms and special cameras to detect both soft plaque and calcified plaque. 30 % of heart attacks occur in people with a calcium score of zero. The calcium score is paid for by insurance. The the CLEARLY scan is typically not paid for by insurance so that that is a barrier, it is absolutely the better test because soft plaque is kind of what gets us in trouble. That’s where the heart attacks happen, but it’s also, we see that as reversible, right? I try to see the glass is always half full. So I look at soft plaque as being a reversible condition and then with lipid lowering and other lifestyle measures, then we can help mitigate and lower people’s risk of developing heart disease. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:11.278)Well, thank you for clarifying that, Juliana. So around when would we consider getting this test and how often should you get this sort of test? And of course, you know, anyone listening to this or a loved one that, hmm, you you might want to inform about this because again, it doesn’t seem like a lot of the general masses know that these are available. Julianna Lindsey (10:35.673)That’s a great question. When to start screening? So we base our screening age on the risk factor of the patient in front of us. So if someone has a high LP little a, that’s a blood marker that you inherit from one of your parents. If you have a high LP little a, which everyone should get checked, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:39.297)Yes. Julianna Lindsey (11:02.579)then we absolutely begin screening much sooner than in someone who doesn’t have this high LP little a. LP little a is an independent risk factor for the development of cardiovascular disease. So if you have high LP little a, you are far more likely to have plaque in your arteries, making you more likely to have a heart attack or stroke or peripheral cardiovascular disease. So in the event that, let’s say a woman has Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:09.728)Okay. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:25.07)Mm. Julianna Lindsey (11:31.883)High LP little a I want to get her screened before the age of 50 I also want to get a man screen before the age of 50 with high LP little a if someone has had a history of prolonged like a familial high cholesterol condition then then we may start in early 40s also, so and Of course the family history is important in making these decisions as well, but Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:53.165)Mmm. Julianna Lindsey (12:01.087)You can’t rely solely on family history. We like to add all these variables together and really risk stratify people. And it’s better to get screened earlier than later. We use that screening test to help us determine how aggressive we need to be in lipid lowering. you commonly hear stories from ladies that Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:04.16)Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:23.574)Right. Julianna Lindsey (12:30.709)people didn’t want to put them on lipid lowering drugs because this, that, or the other. It’s usually there. Somebody said their cholesterol wasn’t that high because they’re premenopausal or, know, women can, women form plaque prior to menopause under the right conditions. There are also women and men who have very high cholesterol levels. They are very rare who Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:50.606)Mm. Julianna Lindsey (13:00.309)we find don’t have any plaque on their clearly scan. Now, if they don’t have plaque on their clearly scan, then we can often avoid pharmacologic therapy to lower their cholesterol. But those people are rare individuals. I would say maybe one in 500 people with high cholesterol will not be forming plaque. So they are very much the exception. not the rule. And I’m afraid that lot of physicians without having these test results assume that that is a way more common condition than it actually is. People need to get screened and risk stratified. If you’re not forming plaque, fantastic. But if you’re already forming plaque in your arteries, we can see the arteries around the heart with the CLEARLY scan. We cannot see the arteries in the brain. We don’t have good visual vision capability, but we absolutely use those heart arteries and the condition of those arteries as a surrogate marker for what’s going on in your brain. Our brain needs blood flow. Cognitive decline is an epidemic and it is a rising epidemic. We are very cognizant about our patients’ cognitive health. Just as much. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:00.0)it. Julianna Lindsey (14:27.321)as we are about their cardiovascular health because they are highly intertwined. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:33.228)Yes, thank you for explaining that. And then in another section, interrelated section of the book, where you talk about diet, and I love how you lead off with talking, you know, very similar dietary philosophy that we have here at Salona and Beauty Detox, lots of green vegetables, lots of nuts. And also a good friend of mine who’s been on this podcast many times, Dan Buettner, who discovered the blue zones, which you referenced in your book. you know, just having this Julianna Lindsey (14:57.846)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:00.046)whole food based diet and active lifestyle and so on. But I bring this up on the heels of us talking about the calcium scans because it gets really confusing for people, Juliana, as you know, where, you know, for a while it was sort of the general consensus about avoiding eating a lot of red meat. And then there’s sort of different dialogues being put out, especially in social media about, know, cholesterol isn’t really bad. And then there’s the rise of certain diets like the carnivore diet. lots of meat. And then I’ve heard people have even written into me saying, you know, I tried some of these diets and my plaque did go up, even though a lot of people that are pushing these very high meat diets are saying, well, no, it’s not actually going to raise your cholesterol. It just gets very confusing for people when there’s so many people talking about different ways of eating, you know. I don’t know, it sort of blows my mind. And then there’s these, again, these out of just certain studies, which can be extrapolated, they’re studying human populations, like the blue zones and seeing how a lot of these cultures are getting enough protein, but they’re also eating a large 90 % and over plant based. So can you speak a little bit in your work as a physician and your monitoring all these different patients and seeing what’s going on with plaque and just that relationship with eating a high red meat? animal protein diet in relation to what we’re talking about here. Julianna Lindsey (16:32.595)I can tell you with certainty that most people who are eating a high fat diet are going to have higher cholesterol levels. Now people’s bodies respond differently. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:42.978)Thank you. Yeah. Yes. But it sounds obvious and I’m sorry to bring it up this way, but it’s not when you’re listening to all these different dialogues, doctor. It sort of gets sort of bananas out there. Julianna Lindsey (16:59.285)Well, I would advise people to, if they hear something on social media, take that to your actual physician with hopefully with whom you have a relationship and then ask him or her questions about that. And please let it, first of all, let it pass the filter of common sense. Has, has humankind evolved eating solely meat? It’s It doesn’t pass the common sense filter to me. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:31.098)It doesn’t pass the common sense, but unfortunately, doctor, there are doctors like these carnivore MDs out there that are doctors that are also telling people some of these ways of eating, which I think can potentially cause a lot of harm and can certainly confuse a lot of people. So we’re moving away from fiber and anti-inflammatory antioxidant rich foods. And now there just becomes this huge focus on protein, protein, protein more and more. animal foods. Julianna Lindsey (18:02.645)Well, it’s the wrong direction. And if you look at the human microbiome, and we are in our infancy in knowing the power of our microbiome, but we do know that 70 % of our immune system lies in the lining of our gut. Those microorganisms that are in the lining of our gut control so much of what happens in our body. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:13.248)Yes. Julianna Lindsey (18:26.651)and those to have a healthy microbiome, you need those soluble and insoluble fibers that you can only get from non-meat sources. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:38.71)Yeah. And you were talking about, you know, opening up pathways to the brain, to the heart. There’s a clogging effect. Like you said, common sense that happens when we’re eating really dense, fatty, just, I can’t say it in words, but dense foods. Now, and then when we’re focusing on eating so much of those foods and filling our plate with that, then obviously there’s going to be less room for the fiber rich. Julianna Lindsey (18:45.301)Yes. Julianna Lindsey (18:56.682)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:06.346)foods, it just becomes less of a focus, unfortunately, in a lot of these diets. Julianna Lindsey (19:12.255)And if people have a, if they have doubt about that, I would just challenge them to go get your lipid profile checked regularly. Like we check our patients lipid profiles every 90 days because people will go on, you know, they’ll go off on tangents and I can, I can generally tell when they’ve gone off on a tangent and, and they’re, they’re eating it just like red meat every single day. I’m not against red meat. I eat meat myself. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:23.842)Wow. Julianna Lindsey (19:42.081)I also eat a lot of fruits and vegetables. So balance in all things. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:47.444)Yes. Yeah, I can say, I can share and I’ve talked about a little bit on here that actually was a personal experience with my husband. He eats meat, me and the kids are plant based, but he went on a full carnivore diet. And was a day where he was eating his chopped raw liver. And my older son looked at it he said, mama, would you eat papa’s food for a million dollars? And I said, no, he’s like two million. We were trying to come up with a number, but he does get regular blood work and he saw the actual, you know, the impact in his blood work. And I’m happy to say he’s gone back to eating a lot of fiber again. because yeah, to your point when you could measure and you can actually see that difference, instead of just theoretically or just because you want to look the way someone looks on social media and you think it’s because you need more and more and more. of protein and to build yourself up. Julianna Lindsey (20:47.553)Also, we have no idea what those people on social media who look like they look, what they’re doing. You know, we don’t really know what they’re eating. We don’t know what kind of hormones they’re putting in their body. They could be doing any number of unhealthy things. And I can tell you that I see a lot of 50-year-old men walking around, you know, all puffed up, who look horribly unhealthy. I know that they… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:02.091)Right. Julianna Lindsey (21:16.971)They probably perceive themselves as being healthy, but you can spot somebody who’s on too much testosterone and growth hormone, and it is a bad situation for their health. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:28.106)Right. I imagine long-term, especially taking growth hormone. Julianna Lindsey (21:32.255)Well, short and long term. I mean, those people tend to die early. Think about like Rich Piana, for instance. He was a internet craze. And then there’s like the liver king. know, all these people doing these crazy things. And it turns out, I guess the liver king wasn’t actually doing what he said he was doing. And then of course, Rich Piana died when he was relatively young. So. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:44.27)Right. Julianna Lindsey (21:58.933)I don’t think we need to be taking advice from people like that. And you have to always question people’s ulterior motives. What kind of secondary gain are they on social media to get? So the way to get likes and reactions and conversations on social media is to be extreme. The way to live a balanced, healthy life is to avoid extremes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (22:24.878)Right, centered. And you mentioned that in your protocols overall for eating is to eat less, right? Because we are able to digest more, our bodies utilize more nutrients when we’re not constantly overloading. And I know, know, Dr. you as well as many physicians, there’s a section where you did talk about semi-glutides and… Julianna Lindsey (22:26.815)Yes. Julianna Lindsey (22:34.582)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (22:51.246)and know, Zempik and you know, the crazes out there. And on one hand, people are eating less and they are dropping weight. I wonder, and I don’t know the answer and I haven’t taken, you know, I’m not a physician that’s taking a super deep dive on this, but I wonder doctor about long-term though. And people haven’t learned to eat healthy when they’re taking these drugs, or maybe they’re, you when they get off and then they still have to learn to eat healthy. What do you think about these other aspects? And I know primarily, you know, you’re seeing numbers improve, you’re seeing people eat a lot less. We know obesity is a killer, but long-term effects and then potentia

This Week’s Episode Special Guest: Dr. Mariza Snyder Summary: In this enlightening conversation, Kimberly speaks with Dr. Marisa Snyder who discusses her new book, ‘The Menopause Revolution,’ focusing on the importance of understanding perimenopause and the holistic approaches to women’s health during this transition. She emphasizes the need for education about hormonal changes, the role of lifestyle in managing symptoms, and the potential benefits of bioidentical hormones. The discussion also covers mental health, postpartum support, skin and hair changes, and the significance of maintaining bone health. Dr. Snyder encourages women to embrace this phase of life as an opportunity for empowerment and growth, redefining their midlife experience with intention and care About Dr. Mariza Snyder Dr. Jason Giles is a triple board-certified physician (Addiction Medicine, Anesthesiology, and Pain Medicine) who has revolutionized addiction treatment through both personal triumph and professional innovation. With 25+ years of sobriety and two decades practicing addiction medicine, Dr. Giles brings an unmatched combination of lived experience and clinical expertise to one of America’s most pressing health crises. As founder and director of Addiction Doctors, a multi-specialty telemedicine group, Dr. Giles oversees the detox and stabilization of hundreds of patients daily across both coasts, partnering with America’s premier treatment centers. His mission: reaching the vast underserved population struggling with addiction by developing technology and models that expand access to life-saving care. Dr. Giles’ journey began with his own fentanyl dependency during anesthesiology residency—a rock-bottom moment when he realized he couldn’t keep his word to himself about stopping. His recovery through a long-term monitored program (which boasts 90-95% ten-year success rates) catalyzed his career transformation from anesthesiologist to addiction medicine pioneer.For 15 years, Dr. Giles operated a boutique specialty practice treating everyone from championship athletes and Fortune 50 executives to billionaires and their families, hand-building long-term recovery programs focused on relationships rather than quick fixes. This elite-level experience, combined with his personal recovery journey, informs his contrarian yet highly effective treatment philosophy. Guest Resources: Website: drmariza.com Book: The Perimenopause Revolution: Reclaim Your Hormones, Metabolism & Energy   Episode Sponsors: ANIMA MUNDI OFFER: To get THE PUREST, MOST DELICIOUS PLANT-POWERED protein blend, infused with real vanilla and harmonizing adaptogens go to Animamundiherbals.com and use code: KIM20 to get 20% off your purchase! USE LINK: Animamundiherbals.com and use code: KIM20 to get 20% off your purchase!   POWER OF THE FIVE HEARTS: USE LINK: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/760283/the-hidden-power-of-the-five-hearts-by-kimberly-snyder/   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Dr. Marisa Snyder and Her Work02:14 Understanding Perimenopause: The Importance of Education04:39 Holistic Approaches to Health During Perimenopause09:05 The Role of Hormones: Natural Shifts vs. Bioidentical Hormones15:54 Navigating Mental Health: Hormones and Postpartum Support20:17 Empowering Women: Access to Hormonal Support and Care22:02 Reproductive Longevity and Choices23:58 Optimizing Cellular Energy for Pregnancy27:15 Navigating Hormonal Changes in Midlife29:03 Skin, Hair, and Hormonal Health33:25 The Importance of Estrogen in Women’s Health35:30 Nutrition and Lifestyle for Metabolic Health39:39 Setting Up for Future Success41:47 Empowerment in Midlife and Beyond   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:01.016)Hi, everyone. Welcome back to our Monday interview show. I am so excited for our very special guest here with us today, the lovely Dr. Marisa Snyder. She has a brand new book out, which I love, called The Harry Menopause Revolution, Reclaim Your Hormones, Metabolism, and Energy. Dr. Marisa has written many other books on female health, on hormonal health in particular. She is a powerhouse advocate for midlife women, leveraging 17 plus years as a practitioner, author and speaker to spark a massive movement for women in perimenopause and beyond. She is the host of the top rated Energize with Dr. Mariza podcast where we had a wonderful conversation about the heart last year. I’m getting goosebumps because Dr. Mariza, I always say Mariza because I know her personally. Dr. Mariza (00:48.363)Yes! Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:55.394)is a friend of mine and it’s really powerful when someone is really embodying the energy that’s coming forth in their work. She is such a passionate human. She is so in her heart. She’s so authentically cares about helping other women. She’s been through a lot of this herself. She’s coming from firsthand experience. So with all that, Dr. Marisa, thank you so much for joining our feel good community today and be back. Dr. Mariza (01:22.447)Kimberly, it is such a pleasure. Yes, I’m so happy to be back. I’m so happy to be a part of the beautiful feel good community that you have cultivated. You know, what an honor to get to be here and to just speak as two women, as two mamas, know, navigating this beautiful journey and, and really setting not only ourselves up for success in the second half of our lives, but also every single woman who gets to walk this beautiful journey with us. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:45.068)Yes. I love how there’s a lot of conversation. There’s just a lot out there about menopause. And you’re here highlighting in your new book about perimenopause, which I think can feel a little bit more nebulous for many. And there’s sort of this clear, you know, I haven’t gotten my period in a year, so I must be in menopause. But what I’m going to ask you questions as I was reading this, this book, Dr. Marisa, Dr. Mariza (01:51.971)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:14.83)It’s like, know, just sort of questions I think a lot of women have, including myself. So the first is, and I love in the beginning of the book, you say it’s really important that we educate ourselves about these processes even before we’re in them. So we have, you know, a sense of knowledge, we can empower ourselves. But if you’re in your 30s and 40s, and you’re still getting your period every 28 days, and you’re not experiencing symptoms like hot flashes or you some of you have a whole quiz in here. Yes. Exactly. like, you know, like myself where I’m like, Hey, I’m still getting my period and I don’t have any symptoms. Then we say we’re not in perimenopause yet, but it’s still good to know about it. Dr. Mariza (02:45.327)kind of the classic menopause, late perimenopause symptoms. Dr. Mariza (02:55.043)Me too. Dr. Mariza (03:01.899)Absolutely. Just like it’s important for us to know as little girls what puberty is, you know, being prepared for your first bleed and also those four to six years where our brain is coming online for our reproductive years. That’s a huge neuroendocrine transition that I think we could even do a better job at preparing our girls for. But then, you know, we prepare women for pregnancy and postpartum. And equally as important, we should be preparing women Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:26.338)Yes. Dr. Mariza (03:30.681)for perimenopause. Anytime we go through a big hormone shift that deserves our attention and a new level of support, women should be educated about their bodies and what to expect and how they can really shore up their health and feel amazing as they move through that journey. I mean, I think that every woman deserves that pathway through. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:54.35)Yes. So a lot of, and I love how holistic your book is covering things like diet and sleep and exercise. And a question I have for you, and this is a really broad question, before perimenopause, see during perimenopause and after perimenopause, a lot of these amazing suggestions, eating more fiber, you talk about gut health, you talk about all these things. Dr. Mariza (04:05.901)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:18.424)How is it different within the perimenopause? Because wouldn’t we already be wanting to focus on whole foods and exercise? What is the specific shift, if any? And for many, maybe it’s saying, hey, everything’s changing. I have no choice but to focus on this as my protocol is because I’m starting to feel more moody or I’m starting to get these hot flashes. Dr. Mariza (04:28.792)Mm-hmm. Dr. Mariza (04:34.691)Yes. Dr. Mariza (04:39.021)Yeah, I think that’s what it is. You’re absolutely right, Kimberly. If we could, as soon as we have a cycle, we have a menstrual cycle, we are optimizing our blood sugar, we are sleeping like our life depends on it, we are managing our heart, we are regulating our nervous system, girl, I would say start as early as you can. However, the truth is that a lot of us can get away with cheats. You we can get away with a little less sleep. You maybe we’re in grad school or maybe we have kids early or, you know, we just have some wiggle. You know, when I was growing up, I was taught that I diet to stay thin. That was a big part. That was like, okay, we, you put on a little bit of weight, you get on that treadmill. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:16.321)Yes. Dr. Mariza (05:21.121)treadmill or your that treadmaster, you calorie restrict a little bit for a couple of weeks, you get back down to that size, right? And then you just, and then you go back to doing what you’re doing. And you kind of, you kind of go into these loops where you’re like, okay, I need to like really buckle down and get disciplined. And then you lose the weight. And then, you know, again, you go back to doing life. But in pre-menopause, and mind you, I always believed that we should be eating for our gut health and our metabolic health, but this was just the narrative in the 80s and the 90s and even 2000s when we weren’t talking about the profound changes that were going on. And also we were just, it was all about being thin or whatever that goal was that the magazines were touting. But as we step, yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:02.35)Well, the I was laughing because now it’s like people are just taking ozempic before. I everybody’s just like, let me take ozempic and lose the weight and then I’ll change how I eat, you know. Dr. Mariza (06:07.042)Right, yeah. Dr. Mariza (06:13.679)Exactly, yeah, I mean, there’s always a new strategy, right? But when we go through perimenopause, we have to understand that the hormones that are changing, these are hormones that have been rhythmically showing up every single month throughout our menstrual cycle to run hundreds of physiological processes. We’re talking about estrogen and progesterone being immune system modulators. metabolic boosters. They are managing water retention and gut microbiome diversity. They’re helping us to grow our bones and our muscles. They’re protecting our heart. They’re helping our brain to function. They’re getting us to sleep at night. They’re helping us to regulate our mood and help us to feel more peaceful and calm during parts of our cycle. You know, I always joke that everybody loves Day 12 us, right? Two days before ovulation, estrogen is peaking at our highest peak. We feel energized. We want to be out and about. We feel sensual. We’re connected with our partners. And mind you, can it be that way a lot through our cycle? Sure. But there’s something about that pre-ovulation boost that feels so good. You know, we were taught to not really honor and appreciate day 27 us. You know, the one that wants the girl version of us that wants to go inward, that wants to have some time to herself, that needs a little alone time to kind of regulate because progesterone and estrogen are declining. Well, in perimenopause, now these hormones are not rhythmically regulating and releasing the way that they were for the last 25 to 30 years. Now these hormones are erratically declining. And as a result, these protective shill hormones that are doing so much more than bikini medicine. For a long time, we used to believe that the only difference between us and men was the parts of the bikini cupboard. So our boobs and our ovaries and our uterus, and that was it. But now we know that these hormones are helping to modulate and regulate multiple areas of the body, including the brain. And as they begin to falter, for each and every one of us, it’s gonna be a unique journey. But as they begin to decline, and it’s not linear linearly, and it definitely doesn’t announce itself, Dr. Mariza (08:28.207)we’re gonna feel that protective shield begin to falter. And we may realize that that, you only six hours of sleep on a Saturday night or us just randomly dieting, it just isn’t working anymore. Our bodies are calling in a new level of support and a deeper understanding of our bodies. And that’s what perimenopause really ushers in, is having to understand our bodies in a new way, having to really honor what our body is going through. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:45.677)Hmm. Dr. Mariza (08:57.684)and be more consistent with the lifestyle strategies that are going to support our bodies along the way. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:05.484)Yes, I love that. There’s more, and I don’t ever like to use the word mindfulness, right? Because we talk so much about intuition in the heart, but there’s more, let’s say, intention around what we’re eating. And we’ll get into that in a moment and about the metabolic changes. But right off the bat, Dr. Maurice, I’m reading this and thinking about it within myself, and a lot of women have this question. was talking to my hairdresser about this and she’s in full menopause. Dr. Mariza (09:14.434)intention. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:35.06)And there’s this sort of balance between really honoring the natural lifestyle. of course, know, whole foods were about organic, were about great soil, were about exercise and lifting weights, more all these things. And then there’s the bio-identical hormone conversation, which You know, we had Dr. Erica Schwartz on here as well, who’s like a big advocate for bioidentical hormones. And so there’s the side of, hey, the women are having these symptoms and the bioidentical hormones can help. It’s like another, you know, medicinal strategy. And then there’s the other side and other people having the conversation or say, mother nature knows that we go through these shifts. And then there’s a decline of certain hormones. And why are we as a culture manipulating taking hormones when nature decided these hormones to shift. Dr. Mariza (10:28.015)Hmm, I love this question. You know, there’s a, it’s a big one. It’s a huge one. Let me, I wanna first just share where I’d land on this is that I believe that women deserve all the tools in the toolbox. Whatever is gonna move you towards feeling more alive in your body and feeling more optimized, I would never deny a woman anything that is gonna move the needle in that meaningful way. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:30.606)It’s a big one. It’s a big Get out. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:37.314)Yes. Dr. Mariza (10:54.425)You know, we live in a modern day world where our soil is impacted and where we are living in, you know, dark boxes most of the time of the day. And, and, there’s a lot of things about this life, this modern day life that isn’t conducive to optimized hormones or even an optimized body. If we aren’t intentional about it, right. We can easily get sucked into all the blue light and eating. packaged foods and doing a lot of takeout and not really honoring our heart and our nervous system. Like, you know, that can really wear on us. And I will say that as our hormones are declining erratically, you know, we didn’t kind of live with the same stressors that we’re living in today. And so I think that that’s a major part of this conversation is that we kind of weren’t being bombarded as hard. as we are with all of the different chemical, physical, and emotional stressors that we are contending with today. And so I feel like our menopause and perimenopause journey can feel even more intense, can feel more exacerbated due to these other stressors that oftentimes some of us aren’t able to mitigate. You I think about all the single mamas out there who, you know, I wish, I know, I wish for them that they had more free time, that they had, you know, more, more… resources to make some of the changes. if bioidentical, you know, hormone replacement therapy or oral micronized progesterone can help get the sleep that they desperately need so that they can show up to be the best mama that they can be for morning routine the next day, then I am a full body yes to that option for them. And so I think that it’s a yes and hormones are powerful optimizers, but we need lifestyle in place as well. 100%. Could I tell you that hormones have been the game changer, the end all be all for me in terms of this journey? No. I would say that honoring my heart and my nervous system has been huge part of this journey. Moving my body meaningfully has been a beautiful part of this journey. Having community and eating towards having less inflammation in my body, those have been the biggest levers. And hormones have been super helpful too. I think it is very much a yes end depending on your journey. Dr. Mariza (13:13.517)but that women should not be denied any level of care. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:17.944)beautifully said, you know, I had a few friends over for dinner the other day and one of them is in, you know, she would define perimenopause and she said she just sort of woke up feeling very tired and off for a while. And then she did get her blood work done and she was working with a doctor and she got the hormones and you know, she, but then she was struggling with this question, you know, aren’t we supposed to have these natural hormonal shifts? And everybody was kind of talking about it. And I said to her, But do you feel better? She said, yeah. infinite possibilities. There isn’t a right or wrong, right? We step into that field of just there is and where y’all have unique bodies and unique journeys. And so I think it’s really, and I think about my grandmother, my mother, who didn’t really talk about menopause. And when I did ask my mother once, she just said, it wasn’t a big deal. But to your point, maybe she didn’t. Dr. Mariza (13:51.683)Well, there we go. Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:17.754)wasn’t aware of certain things and maybe there was less microplastics and it affected her in a different way, who knows? But there is a, you there are lots of possibilities out there. There’s a lot of conversation, including your wonderful book, and everybody has to decide for their bodies. Dr. Mariza (14:34.713)what’s gonna help them feel amazing, absolutely. Yeah, I think, you there’s a couple of reasons why we women, lot of the generations before us, especially our grandmothers, maybe even our mothers, my mom, she knew. She knew about perimetapos and metapos, it was very obvious. And she, yeah, she was like, what is happening right now to me? And she made some really powerful pivots that changed the course of her life in such a positive way. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:49.262)I knew you knew. Dr. Mariza (15:02.091)But she had to, know, again, we’re all kind of mitigating some of these big constants that a lot of us are working and maybe some of us don’t even necessarily love what we’re doing every single day, but we got to show up. And then we’ve got our families to take care of and we have our households to take care of. so, you know, anything that can help a woman feel, again, better, help her to mitigate her symptoms and really future proof her health is… to me is the number one priority. And when we look at the statistics, you know, just whether it’s hormone replacement therapy or not, although we do live longer than men, you 25 % more of our lives are spent in debilitating health. And, you know, one could argue that it’s 100 % because of hormones. Others could argue that it’s lifestyle, but I have a feeling that it’s a combination of the two. And so whatever we can do to support women, I will always be a yes to that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:56.366)There are some sobering statistics about women, particularly with brain health, mental health, you mentioned in here, dementia, Alzheimer’s. So can you talk a little bit about how this knowledge and working with perimenopause and menopause can help protect us and hormones potentially, and lifestyle of course, can help protect us against these neurodegenerative conditions. Dr. Mariza (16:22.977)I love this question. As I mentioned earlier, whether it’s puberty or postpartum or perimenopause, these are all big neuroendocrine transitions. And what a gift that our brains can go through such massive upgrades to be mothers, to step into childbearing years, and to step into our wise woman years. Now in this upgrade, I will tell you, it doesn’t always feel like an upgrade. My first couple of weeks of postpartum, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:33.25)Dr. Mariza (16:52.623)It didn’t really feel like an upgrade. I was like, I need some sleep. you know, and when you step into motherhood in that big, beautiful way, as your hormones are, know, postpartum is where we have some of our lowest hormone states and women really experience that and feel that. Same thing with perimenopause. When we are going through that… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:11.63)Dr. Mariza, sorry to interrupt Dr. Mariza. On that point, if anyone’s listening to this and they’re having a lot of struggles postpartum, are some doctors, such as yourself, prescribing progesterone and hormones to help with postpartum? Dr. Mariza (17:17.411)Mm-hmm. Dr. Mariza (17:25.271)Yes, absolutely. Yes, oral micronized progesterone or even progesterone injections in those really difficult times, those first three months of postpartum can completely change the game in terms of a woman’s mental health outcomes, pulling them out of suicidal ideation. And again, that really severe postpartum depression. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:31.148)Mmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:40.418)Wow, thank you for. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:46.488)Thank you. And for anyone listening to that, think that’s important to know. I certainly didn’t know that was an option. And I remember feeling a lot of moods and I don’t know if it was strong postpartum depression, but I think there was blues, there was just all sorts of feelings. Dr. Mariza (18:00.665)Yeah, all sorts of feelings that we’re trying to grapple with, right? Because the society tells us we should be so grateful that we have these beautiful babies. And we are. It’s a very conflicting and confusing time where you want to be so present for your baby. You want to make sure you keep them alive. That’s the number one. That’s what our brains are literally rewired for is their survival. We want to be appreciative and loving and being this beautiful heart centered place. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:11.106)Yeah. Dr. Mariza (18:30.347)And then we’re also having these conflicting emotions, these really intense emotions from baby blues to maybe even more severe depression, anxiety, and really this level of things are feeling insurmountable. And we have to understand that the brain is still massively reorganizing in postpartum big time to rewire for that baby. And it’s also depleted of some of the most critical hormones that it needs, including allopregnenolone. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:44.29)Yeah. Dr. Mariza (18:58.261)And if we can give women a little bit of a booster to kind of get over that hump, then why wouldn’t we do that? So I’m a big fan. I also was on oral micronized progesterone in the beginning, because I was, I think more so it felt like deeper sleep deprivation in the beginning. It’s so hard to tell. You’re like, am I just losing it because I’m not getting enough sleep or am I losing it because I’m just feeling very low? It’s a challenging time. It’s just all over the place. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:04.758)Amazing. Thank Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:22.798)It’s so cool. Dr. Mariza (19:26.927)It breaks my heart that so many women don’t necessarily feel as supported as they should. And that these tools are not easily and readily accessible when they come and report these types of symptoms. But I want you to know that oral micronized progesterone or even progesterone injections are so inexpensive. They’re so cheap. We’re talking about less than 12 bucks for a prescription for a month. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:37.997)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:48.952)Mm-hmm. Dr. Mariza (19:54.575)So it can really change the game. if you are listening to this and you’ve got either you’re in your postpartum, especially perimenopausal postpartum, like I was, like so many women today are, we’re having children later and what a blessing that is that we can get to do that. But that comes with perimenopause and postpartum together. So if you’re listening to this and either you’re thinking about having a child or you’re in postpartum right now, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:09.07)Yeah. Dr. Mariza (20:18.989)I just, hope you hear this and know that you deserve support and that there are doctors out there that will absolutely give it to you. And that solution of oral micronized progesterone or even injections is very easy to get your hands on in terms of accessibility. It’s FDA approved, it’s been proven safe time and time again. It’s what I use to even get pregnant at 41 years old. So I just want women to know that that should be available to them. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:44.096)naturally you got pregnant. Dr. Mariza (20:45.839)I did, well, I naturally got pregnant my first month trying when I was 40 years old. Mind you, I primed up for an entire year. So I was very aware that I was prepping to get pregnant for a long time. I got pregnant and I lost that baby about six weeks in, six or seven weeks in. By the time we did the ultrasound, I already lost the baby. And we weren’t sure if it was low levels of progesterone or maybe it was genetics. I wasn’t sure. Bu

This Week’s Episode Special Guest: Dr. Jason Giles Summary: In this enlightening conversation, Dr. Jason Giles shares his personal journey from addiction to recovery, emphasizing the importance of connection, spirituality, and understanding the complexities of addiction. He discusses how his experiences as a patient have shaped his approach to addiction medicine, highlighting the need for empathy and individualized care. The discussion also touches on modern solutions for addiction, the role of community support, and the deeper emotional and spiritual aspects of recovery.   About Dr, Jason Giles Dr. Jason Giles is a triple board-certified physician (Addiction Medicine, Anesthesiology, and Pain Medicine) who has revolutionized addiction treatment through both personal triumph and professional innovation. With 25+ years of sobriety and two decades practicing addiction medicine, Dr. Giles brings an unmatched combination of lived experience and clinical expertise to one of America’s most pressing health crises. As founder and director of Addiction Doctors, a multi-specialty telemedicine group, Dr. Giles oversees the detox and stabilization of hundreds of patients daily across both coasts, partnering with America’s premier treatment centers. His mission: reaching the vast underserved population struggling with addiction by developing technology and models that expand access to life-saving care. Dr. Giles’ journey began with his own fentanyl dependency during anesthesiology residency—a rock-bottom moment when he realized he couldn’t keep his word to himself about stopping. His recovery through a long-term monitored program (which boasts 90-95% ten-year success rates) catalyzed his career transformation from anesthesiologist to addiction medicine pioneer.For 15 years, Dr. Giles operated a boutique specialty practice treating everyone from championship athletes and Fortune 50 executives to billionaires and their families, hand-building long-term recovery programs focused on relationships rather than quick fixes. This elite-level experience, combined with his personal recovery journey, informs his contrarian yet highly effective treatment philosophy. Guest Resources: Website: www.ororecovery.com/dr-jason-giles/ Book: Outsmart Your Addiction   Episode Sponsors: FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY MOMENTOUS: OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription.   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction and Background02:10 Journey into Addiction Medicine09:20 Personal Experience with Addiction13:01 Combining Science and Heart in Treatment16:46 Recognizing Addiction: Signs and Symptoms22:55 Addiction in Professionals: A Common Struggle26:08 Breaking the Silence on Addiction28:43 Understanding Food Addiction and GLP-131:56 The Complexity of Weight Loss and Hormonal Signals34:19 The Role of Spirituality in Recovery43:09 The Journey of Self-Discovery and Healing   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:01.863)So great to have you, Dr. Giles. Thank you so much for being here with our feel good community. Jason Giles MD (00:07.31)Thank you for having me. It’s my honor to be here. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:10.267)Where are you calling in from today? Jason Giles MD (00:13.96)I am in my office. currently I’m at the, place on the East coast in New Hampshire, enjoying, enjoying beautiful weather. The leaves are just starting to turn in the fall here, although it’s still warm. It’s not, it’s not chilly yet. It’s not sweater weather, but we had a bit of a drought this summer. So I think the trees are just ready for a rest. That’s how they’re acting. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:21.543)I’m giggling because I grew up on the East Coast too, Dr. Dries, I’m from Connecticut, but I don’t miss that. are like, love fall season. I don’t, sorry, I’m between now Southern California and Hawaii. Once I could choose, I really just wanted sunshine, but I appreciate the beautiful leaves. I think when people love winter, I know people that love skiing. Jason Giles MD (00:43.626)down the road. You don’t miss the weather. Yeah. Jason Giles MD (00:55.086)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:06.961)We all like different things, don’t we? Jason Giles MD (01:08.654)It’s a funny paradox. I’m from Southern California and moved here just a few years ago. And it was a shock. It was a shock dealing with the seasons and it gets very cold here in the winter. But I figured it out. I look forward to the change and I’m in Southern California a lot. So I haven’t had time to completely miss it. My mother is still there. So I visit her. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:12.637)are ill. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:23.773)Yeah! Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:28.689)Okay. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:33.935)Are you scared? Jason Giles MD (01:36.32)I used to be, and then I had two kids, one played baseball eventually at a very high level. One did ballet, eventually professionally. And so the kids didn’t want to get hurt. So we, we, we set that aside, but I do like being outside. like, I like, I like the snow. I like a good, I like a good hike. do snow shoeing here. I did some snowmobiling some years ago. I hope to get back to that. That’s, that’s super fun. Maybe skiing. don’t know. There’s it’s just hard. It’s. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:49.628)Yeah. Jason Giles MD (02:05.198)I’m not in a ski group, but I do like it. It’s super fun. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:08.902)was available. Jason Giles MD (02:10.85)Yes. Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:12.027)Dr. Giles, coming down to business here, you have a really interesting focus in your work on addiction. And even when I hear that word, it feels like there’s so many ways in which we can get addicted. We can addicted to coffee, to sugar, to drugs, to sex, to working overtime. Well, first of all, tell us how you sort of narrowed into this. focus in your work, I imagine it wasn’t something you may have set out to do when you were starting out. Jason Giles MD (02:47.186)no, that’s good pickup. Not, not, not at all. I, I went a traditional route college and then medical school and my, Achilles heel, suppose is that I was interested in all sorts of things. liked pretty much every rotation I went through when I was on pediatrics. I wanted to be a pediatrician. And when I was on neurology, I was going to be a neurologist. I liked all kinds of stuff. There is a specialty that embraces all the specialties and it’s anesthesia. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:16.669)Mmm. Jason Giles MD (03:16.994)And that’s, that’s, that’s what I wound up doing. And anesthesia is, you know, taking away pain and awareness so that the surgeons can work their magic, fix whatever needs to be done. And I, I liked it. It was really, it was great. All different people, right? So from newborns or premature newborns all the way up to centenarians, ever, ever need surgery. They all have all different medical problems. So pretty much everything in the book. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:40.562)Wow. Jason Giles MD (03:46.85)can be a complicating factor. And then there’s all different surgery. So I liked it all. I wound up doing a specialty that I liked it all. But two things happened along the way. I wound up being a cardiac anesthesiologist. So doing the big cases, transplants and heart surgery and stuff like that. But along the way, two things happened. One, I went through the recovery process myself. So I developed my own addiction and needed to get help for that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:03.229)That was intense. Jason Giles MD (04:14.24)And that changed my perspective. That was sort of the first blow. then there’s a drug that many, years ago when I was telling this little story, I would have to repeat it because people hadn’t heard of it before. So I would say it again and they would say, well, what’s that? What does that do? But unfortunately, I’ll say it that way. I don’t have to repeat it anymore. It’s the drug that I was on was called fentanyl. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:17.329)What were you addicted to? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:38.651)When we hear that term, think, that’s what’s in drugs that kills people. Jason Giles MD (04:42.466)That’s what’s in drugs that kills people. And it nearly killed me. I got very extremely fortunate that it didn’t. Very, very lucky. Due in large part to my department chairman who had his snivers out or his antenna. And I thought I was being clever and only using after work and, you know, being meticulous. But… He w he watched my decline over, over about a year and made, made a move and, suggested that maybe I had a problem and it was well deep up to my neck by that point. And this is grace here, by the way, this is, this is a divine part, which is I accepted to help. didn’t, I didn’t try to keep running. So that led me on a journey of self discovery. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:28.53)Yeah. Jason Giles MD (05:37.006)The stuff that you talk about in your show, it runs through all of that, right? So early motivations and self-concept and the drive to become one of the most difficult types of specialty doctors is the same drive that I didn’t feel comfortable with myself. I didn’t think I was okay. I thought there was something missing. In some part, the fentanyl is what I thought was missing because… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:01.021)Mm-hmm. Jason Giles MD (06:05.036)I couldn’t relax. couldn’t settle down after work. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:08.231)How does it make you feel? it like a painkiller in that? Jason Giles MD (06:11.214)Yeah, it’s like a super, yeah, super intense painkiller, like super like the kills all the pain, all the suffering, all the worry. Say again. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:21.703)like Valium? Jason Giles MD (06:23.678)different, different. It’s if, if Valium gave you energy, it’d be kind of like that a little bit. So if it gave, if it, if it made you feel, safe and comfortable as well as, alert and capable, like at ease. So those are all the feelings that I wanted. I wanted those feelings. That’s why I went in through academics. That’s why I went to medicine. That’s why, that’s why I worked so hard was to get that sense of being okay. And of course. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:40.455)So how do some people. Jason Giles MD (06:53.102)that doesn’t come that way. You don’t get it that way. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:54.575)Exactly. You get it from the identity and the job titles and everybody, you know, saying, you’re so smart, Dr. Giles, even though you are, it’s all this. Jason Giles MD (07:04.558)You know, because inside you say, if you only knew, if you knew the real story, you wouldn’t say that I was smart, which is of course, arrogant, very arrogant to reject compliments, to reject reality. And that’s where I was. I was miserable and cut off and isolated and separate. And my work performance was fantastic. I overdid at work, I over-prepared. But that’s like being on farther and farther out on that bar that they carry to get across the high wire. It was like being on both ends of it at the same time. Fortunately, I had a very gentle intervention in the form of a loving phone call and. I was terrified when I got that call. My heart’s pounding and my mouth is dry and my palms are sweaty because I could not see that there was anything good going to come of this. couldn’t see that there was a life on the other side that I was about to go on a different kind of adventure. I didn’t know that. I was really, really scared. But Dr. Moore was my department chair. It’s very warm. Australian fellow, super achieved academic himself. And he told me, said, we saw this before. had another doctor in the department a few years ago who we found too late. He overdosed and died and we found him in the morning in the call room. And I could see that the things that you were doing, the way you looked, your responses, while your work was preserved, while you’re… Jason Giles MD (08:57.094)you know, your casework was still great. That frightened him enough, he could see the pattern. And so that was my exit. in beginning, so was step one, was this new life as a sober person. Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:14.813)Dr. Giles. Jason Giles MD (09:19.586)Are we having bad internet? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:24.797)Hold on, I’m gonna log off and log back in. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:46.874)Hey, so we were 10 minutes into the show and it froze and it kicked him off. So I just logged off and logged back in. Can you call him to come back? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:00.268)Okay, thank you. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:25.486)Dr. Giles. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:33.656)There you are. You know, technology, it’s okay. Our editor will fix it. It happens sometimes. It’s not all the time, but don’t worry. So go back to your story. Remember, yeah, when we got cut off. And we’ll just patch this part right back. Jason Giles MD (12:36.531)There I am. I don’t know what happened. We had problems. Jason Giles MD (12:45.682)Okay. Jason Giles MD (12:52.211)Yeah. So I was, I, I, I got very lucky. and I owe, some of that for good fortune, to a fellow who preceded me at the department and wound up, you know, not, not making it. I never met him. I didn’t, didn’t, didn’t know him, but he set the, set the pattern so that when I followed fell into the same, trap or fell into the same, yeah, addiction fentanyl. I had somebody who was looking out for me. So, enormously fortunate there. So that was step one. Second part was when I came back, I, at that. I fell in love with, that’s crazy. I fell in love with talking to people because anesthesia, of course, there’s not much talking going on. It’s a little bit of consent and then staring at the top of somebody’s head for an hour or two while the surgeon does her thing and. and I, I enjoyed talking with the patients and so talking with the patients and then going through my own experience where I became a patient is what finally I stayed in anesthesia for awhile, but it finally convinced me to let that go and pursue this really very new field. know that things like alcoholics, anonymous and stuff had been around for almost a hundred years, but as an organized, discipline or specialty in medicine, addiction medicine is really very new. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:20.472)Yeah. Jason Giles MD (14:20.717)And our understanding of it is very rudimentary. It’s not very sophisticated compared with other specialties like nephrology or that sort of thing. So it’s a frontier and that excites me. And the same drive that I had of wanting to know and wanting to learn, wanting to grow and do something exciting, now I get to do that with this. And I’ll say one last thing about it, which is… The cool part about this field, so if you haven’t, heaven forbid, break a bone and go to the bone doctor to get it fixed, if everything goes perfectly, then you get your, let’s say broken arm back like it was. That’s the best thing that can happen. But in this field, what happens when people turn their lives around is their lives come out way better than how they started. Way better. Same with what you’re doing, right? Same with what you’re doing. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:13.721)Yeah. Well, my gosh, Dr. Giles. Well, the first thing I want to say is thank you for sharing that amazing story with us. The second thing, and I got a lot of goosebumps when you literally use the phrase, I let it go, right? Because our mind has these ideas. I’m going to have this job and then I’m going to get this specialty and I’m going to get these accolades. I’m going to go this way and this way. And it’s, you know, whether you to use the term God, spirit, universe, higher intelligence, whatever it is. There’s the greater plan that we’re part of and you went through this experience and then you let go of your mind’s ideas. And then you, it’s like you got led into this pathway where you can really, not that you weren’t helping people before, but because you’ve been through addiction. I imagine now, can you tell me how you approach it as a, know, obviously as a doctor, with science, as a clinician, but also, Jason Giles MD (16:04.425)Changed everything. Changed everything. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:15.138)your heart, working with people, knowing what it feels like to be addicted, to be in the throes of feeling out of control. And obviously people are because they’re feeling that lack inside of themselves, which you had experienced. How do you combine that, your intuition, your heart with the science? Jason Giles MD (16:26.429)Yeah. Yeah. Jason Giles MD (16:34.779)Excellent question. Excellent question. Yeah. And every person’s unique. That’s the thing. It’s a, is one of the, one of the challenges of the field is it doesn’t, it doesn’t standardize very easily. So you can’t just say, okay, everybody do these, these, the, you know, these, 10 exercises and it’ll, and you’ll, you’ll come out great on the other side or have this, have this surgery will cut out the cancer and then you won’t have cancer. It’s not, it’s not like that because everyone’s relationship to their story is. is, is individual, it’s unique. So what has to change in order to get better, and this doesn’t sound very scientific, it doesn’t sound, it doesn’t sound very medical maybe, but what has to change is the story you tell yourself about yourself and all aspects, things you tell yourself about your past, things you tell yourself about your family, about your, about your future. And so to use me as exhibit A again, I was telling myself that I wasn’t okay. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:21.924)So yeah. Jason Giles MD (17:32.519)didn’t have all the compliment of things that normal human beings had, that there was something missing, that I wasn’t good enough and that I didn’t fit. Now, those turn out to be pretty common things. A lot of people feel that way from time to time, pretty much everybody from time to time. But what’s really bad is when you think like I did, I know how to fix this. And then you set off to… In my case, was, you know, achieve academically, be really great at work. You talked about that, about addictions to work. I definitely had that. And the better I got at work, the more that feeling grew. was like scratching poison oak. It just felt good at the time, but then a worse feeling came afterwards. So the question about connecting with people, think that’s, you know, Johan Hari says the opposite of. addiction is connection, right? It’s this sense of alienation that we, that we amend by connecting to one another. Honestly, I think that’s critical ingredient. You know, this office has all this paper. That’s my medical degree behind me, but there’s all this stuff that says, you know, I got board certified in this and that and whatever. Nobody cares about that. Those, those things are not what matters. What matters is whether or not you care about the patient you’re talking to or the person suffering through the addiction. and whether or not the person you’re talking to trust you. And there’s something that’s really strange. So I told you at the beginning, this story of feeling like it was that my life was over when my fentanyl addiction came to light, but really it was the beginning of my life. So the patients, there’s been tens of thousands of patients that I’ve been able to work with since then and admit and help along their way. And Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:15.672)Mm. Jason Giles MD (19:23.931)The thing that gives me the most credibility is not the academic achievements. It’s the personal failing that then I got help with, but that turned my life around. So they know I’m not judging. I think that’s one of the most important ingredients is to meet people where they are and to not prejudice your opinions of them based on how they present or what you think you know is going on. Everyone has his own story of suffering. Everyone’s going through something you have no idea. So coming to it from that standpoint is probably half the journey. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:02.554)So along those lines, doctor, for anyone listening to this now, and they think, well, how do I know I’m addicted? And I like how you mentioned the opposite is connection. And I can say for myself, and I’ve shared this with the community many times, when I was in high school and I became bulimic, feel good, it was a sort of addiction to binging and then purging. And I can definitely say there was a complete disconnection from my body. Jason Giles MD (20:28.494)Butter croissants, if I recall. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:31.33)my god. Anything like fatty butter. And you know, sometimes there’d be blood throwing up and no connection, right? So someone is saying, okay, because sometimes we throw around the word addiction a little bit, casually, like I’m really addicted to coffee or this or that. How do we know or how does anyone know or they’d be like, okay, I’m doing, you know, doing the Jason Giles MD (20:35.677)Mm-hmm. Jason Giles MD (20:41.161)Sure. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:56.95)whatever, weed, cocaine sometimes, and like you said, you thought you were in control. What are some of the defining signs that we can say, hey, we need to take this a bit more seriously? Jason Giles MD (21:09.149)Sure. Excellent question. Well, first of all, what we think of addiction, think of as addiction is actually, it’s actually normal behavior. So it’s, it’s normal to do something over and over again, until you get good at it. That’s what we all did when we learned to walk or learn to speak. Certainly when you learn to ride a bicycle or learn to host a hit podcast, you know, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:32.505)Yeah. Jason Giles MD (21:38.409)We’re bad at it in the beginning and we’re awkward and we’re crummy and we don’t know what we’re doing. And then one foot in front of the other. And the next thing you know, you start to get some speed and you figure it out and you can ride your bike around the neighborhood or, or help, you know, help many, many people. And, and it’s the same with when you, when you pick up a substance. So alcohol is probably the most common one. I don’t know. I don’t know anybody who the first drink was delicious and it went down great. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:59.31)Yeah, good example. Jason Giles MD (22:05.957)Everybody is like, this doesn’t taste very good. And they, they work through it and overshoot or causes them embarrassment. to develop a problem with alcohol, you have to keep at it. You have to keep learning how to use it and keep pursuing that feeling until you’re really good at drinking to manage your feelings or using fentanyl to manage your feelings or eating butter croissants until you feel like I can do this. The rules don’t apply. And I’m just. I’m putting words in your mouth, but the rules don’t apply to me. I’m different. And then, look, I can eat and not have the consequences if I just do this thing, but then the thing makes you feel bad. And that whole, that whole nexus of emotions that go together, that is something that we figure out when I do this, I feel a certain way. The reason that’s important is we want to control our feelings. want to manage our internal world. That’s what success is. Yes, that’s what success is. We want love in our lives. And so we present a certain way, we say certain things, we go to the gym, we get good at whatever, and then we attract love in our lives and then we feel that’s a lot of work. But that’s what’s necessary to have a authentic good relationship is to be the best you can be in the relationship, which is a lot of effort. But we pursue the feeling. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (23:05.216)Control. Jason Giles MD (23:31.441)Addiction is just pursuing the feeling. It’s just another learning loop. So that’s why it’s not a disease. You know, people give me dirty looks when I say that because it’s so popular to say, it’s a disease. It’s just something that you learn. Unfortunately, the things that we use too much of or too many, it could be anything, right? I’m drinking a little glass of water, but if I was drinking gallons and gallons of water, I would get sick. And if you, if you… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (23:59.086)Yeah, exercise too much. Jason Giles MD (24:01.979)If you eat a croissant, you’re probably okay. But if you eat 20, you’re definitely not. If you exercise to the point where you break down your body and you develop all sorts of problems or where you cost you other things, right? some like ultra marathoners or triathlon people or people pursuing excellence in the Olympics or professional realms, those things take a lot of time. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (24:31.268)Yeah. Jason Giles MD (24:31.569)And they affect the rest of your life. There’s only so much time. So it affects your relationships. It affects your earning power. It affects your health. All these things are affected by whatever we’re disproportionately doing. Drinking, cocaine, work, religion, even religion can become ripe where people are murdered to be around. They’re insufferable because they’re just, everything is that and they’re over. They’re over invested in it and they don’t, and it, and it ruins their relationship. So addiction is just like that. And everybody has something. Everybody has something. Your question is, how do you know if right? I get this question all the time. So if I go to a party and it gets around to the, do you do? What do you do? And I tell them people have a glass of wine or they, or something. And they say, well, do I have a problem? So this is very, very common question. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (25:11.587)Yeah. Jason Giles MD (25:30.118)And The way to answer that question is, know. So if you’re asking that question, you know, you know, you know. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (25:36.121)Bye. I agree, you know, and maybe you don’t wanna know because it’s giving you that comfort, you know. Jason Giles MD (25:44.989)You can, yeah,

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Alyssa Trask Campbell Summary: In this episode, Kimberly and Alyssa Black Campbell discuss her journey as a parenting expert and author, focusing on the emotional landscape of parenting. She emphasizes the importance of understanding emotions, connection, and the needs behind children’s behaviors. The discussion covers various topics including self-regulation, co-regulation, the significance of creating safe spaces for communication, and navigating challenges like lying and bullying. Alyssa shares insights from her personal experiences and highlights the role of neuroscience in understanding children’s emotional needs.   About Alyssa Blask Campbell Alyssa Blask Campbell is CEO of Seed & Sew, a platform that offers consultations and courses on emotional intelligence, as well as creating a modern parenting village. She has a master’s degree in early childhood education and is a leading expert in emotional development and travels the globe speaking on the topic. Her first book, Tiny Humans, Big Emotions, published in October 2023 from HarperCollins. Follow @seed.and.sew.   Guest Resources: Website: Seed & Sew Book: Big Kids, Bigger Feelings: Navigating Defiance, Meltdowns, Anxiety to Raise Confident, Connected Kids   Episode Sponsors: LMNT OFFER: Right now, for my listeners LMNT is offering a free sample pack with any LMNT drink mix purchase at DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD. That’s 8 single serving packets FREE with any LMNT any LMNT drink mix purchase. This deal is only available through my link so. Also try the new LMNT Sparkling — a bold, 16-ounce can of sparkling electrolyte water. USE LINK: DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD ANIMA MUNDI OFFER: To get THE PUREST, MOST DELICIOUS PLANT-POWERED protein blend, infused with real vanilla and harmonizing adaptogens go to Animamundiherbals.com and use code: KIM20 to get 20% off your purchase! USE LINK: Animamundiherbals.com and use code: KIM20 to get 20% off your purchase!   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Parenting and Emotions02:48 Understanding Emotions in Parenting06:01 The Role of Connection in Parenting08:50 Identifying Needs Behind Behaviors12:09 Navigating Punishment and Connection14:48 The Importance of Self-Regulation17:51 Co-Regulation and Emotional Intelligence21:09 Addressing Lying and Trust23:47 Creating a Safe Space for Sharing27:00 Understanding Fear and Vulnerability29:45 The Impact of Trauma on Parenting32:59 Conclusion and Resources   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Welcome to the Feel Good Podcast, which is all about heart-led living and wellness. When we awaken the power of our hearts and let that guide us through our daily choices and decisions, through our four cornerstones, food, body, emotional well-being, and spiritual growth, we will experience the most incredible results and create more vitality, health, strength, peace, abundance, and love in our lives. I am your host, Kimberly Snyder, New York Times bestselling author, founder of Solluna, creator of the research-based Heart Aligned Meditation, wellness expert, nutritionist, and international speaker. I am passionate about supporting you on your unique heart and wellness journey. For more information on todays show please go to mysolluna.com for show notes and links. Let’s get started. Speaker 1 (01:29.13)So thank you so much for being here with us today and congrats on your new book. This is your second one. Speaker 2 (01:30.73) Yeah, yeah, my first one, Tiny Human’s Big Emotions came out in 2023. I was like 32 weeks pregnant when that one published, was a whirlwind. Wow. Yeah, that one hit the New York Times bestseller list, which was exciting. Yeah. And then a few weeks after it published, was doing well. Our editor reached out and was like, Alyssa, will you write another book? I was like, actually, I just need a nap. I’m so tired. And so I turned to Rachel, who I’ve worked with, had the privilege of working with now for seven years. And she works with me at my company. And I asked her she would write this bad boy with me. And she said, yeah. So we were able to do it. Well, I think this is so great because many of us are parents in the community or are thinking about being parents in the future or even not. feel like parenting books help us understand ourselves. And I can say as a parent, there’s been this incredible experience of feeling like I’m reparenting myself. And most of us are not learned. You we don’t learn. to handle emotions, have tools as you talk about in your book. And I went through this period of this, where it’s like, hmm, you know, it just felt a little sad and I had to process that. But I also think we’re given the, you know, the childhoods that were meant to be given. But I feel like this is, you know, this is big stuff we’re talking about here. Yeah, people often say they like come for their kids, but they stay for themselves. That so much of this work. We say if you have a nervous system like this works for you. We are really just talking about neuroscience and what it’s like to be a human on planet Earth and be in relationship with other humans. And man, it’s doozy sometimes. Yeah. Speaker 1 (02:55.63)Yeah, and I like how you talk about upfront. It’s not about trying to shield ourselves or our children from hardships because you know my nine-year-old now I can see him being more self-conscious about what he wears to school and Then he told me that there was a child like in one of the older grades who kind of made fun of his dog man sure now he won’t wear it and it just brings up stuff and It’s a lot like all the layers of kind of reliving what we’ve been through as parents. 100%. And I find for myself as a parent, there’s nothing harder than just watching your child experience something hard, like being made fun of, feeling left out, feeling that shame or embarrassment. And knowing that it’s not our job to take it away, but instead to be with them through those hard things to let them know that they can navigate this and survive it. It’s so hard. to do in practice as a parent is allowing it. Well, I’m not sure that all of us were even raised with parents that were aware that there was hardship. I wasn’t. I’m not just blaming my parents or anything. just I don’t think that’s how they were raised either. So I just know that there was a lot of things that I pushed down because I couldn’t handle them. Speaker 1 (04:26.614)And I think that’s ultimately why I turned to certain things like bulimia and eating disorders. I couldn’t digest life. And, you know, as adults, we continue to learn and grow and pass on, you know, more tools to our children. Totally, and we’re not gonna heal all the things and that’s okay too. I think of my friend, Dr. Linietta Willis, she’s an intergenerational trauma therapist. And she talks about our legacy blessings and our legacy burdens. And our legacy blessings are those things that we wanna pass on, that we inherited and that we want to pass on to our children in the next gen. And our legacy burdens are those things that maybe we don’t want to pass on, but also knowing that we’re not going to heal all the burdens, that some of them will get passed on and that’s okay. We get to give our kids the tools and the outlets to continue to heal and process. Yeah Speaker 1 (05:24.078)Well, I love how, and we’ll get into some of the more specific tools you talk about, but there’s a underlying theme of connection, which is, you know, in my work with the heart and just being connected to self and always, even if we’re not perfect parents, if we can stay empathetic, we can be connected. Our children will really feel that. 100%. And when we’re talking about different topics in big kids in this book, we talk about a number of different topics, but you’re right, the through line is not it. The goal isn’t to say, Hey, say this script at this time, or say these exact words or do this exact thing. The through line for us is how do you maintain connection and just stay in relationship with each other and recognizing that Yeah. Speaker 2 (06:13.336)Sometimes relationship is messy and hard and sometimes it feels good and easy and you’re not failing if you’re in conflict in relationship or you’re in the messy hard parts. That’s just a part of being in relationship with each other. Right. Well, you know, as you say, these tiny humans and then middle childhood, there’s different things happening on in their brain and their prefrontal cortex and the way that they process information. So I want to ask you as a parent, you know, some real questions. And then of course, it will illustrate some of the information that you share in big kids, bigger, bigger feelings. either you or Rachel use an example where, obviously paraphrasing here, but I think it was one of the daughters. was teasing the sibling. then the mama, which was you, Rachel, said, well, no screen time tomorrow, if you remember this. And I think as a parent, sometimes we see behaviors in our children. And in our family dynamic, our older son, who’s four years older than our younger son, who’s now five, sometimes he’ll take his choice because he can, and he’s bigger, or he’ll do things. And as hard as a parent, like we don’t know. Sometimes you wanna say, because my kids don’t get screen time except on the weekends. So sometimes I’ll say something, well, next Saturday you’re not gonna get your 30 minutes of screen time. like you said, it’s punishment, give, take, but sometimes you don’t know what else to do. Totally, yeah. Well, and that’s real and a part of just being a human on planet Earth too, that you’re not always gonna in the moment have the answers. So giving ourselves grace is so key here too. But in an ideal world, what we’re looking at is trying to identify, we get to be like a detective and see what’s the need that’s driving this behavior. So when your older son comes and takes that toy from his younger son, is it a need for connection? Speaker 2 (08:08.768)Is he really trying to connect or engage or get somebody’s attention, which is a connection? You get so much attention though. Some of our kids, it’s like a leaky cup. It can feel like a leaky cup for connection. I have a high connection seeker. My daughter’s a high connection seeker. And it can feel like there’s not enough connection in the world that will be enough for her. And my son is not a high connection seeker. It’s almost like it feels easier to fill his connection cup. But also for him, his sensory needs are more demanding than hers. we all just have our own little blueprint walking through this world. But when we can look at what is the need driving the behavior and we break these down into two categories. We have sensory needs and we talk about the nervous system, the nine sensory systems which we can get into. But when we’re looking at that, we’re really looking at are they under stimulated or overstimulated? Are they hungry? Are they tired? Do they need to move their body? Do they need a break from stim? They need to chill. Right, okay. That’s more easier to decode in a way. Speaker 2 (09:11.822)For a lot of us, we grew up in cultures where sensory needs were seen as needs. Food, water, movement, were seen as needs. And connection needs were often seen as wants. It was like attention-seeking behavior, and that was a negative thing. And it wasn’t seen as, you need attention, that you have this need for inclusion or belonging or knowing that you’re loved or worthy or valued. so for a lot of us, the connection needs can actually be quite triggering. where it can feel like, my gosh, this kid’s so needy. They need so much. And that’s our own bias coming up into play and being able to recognize that is half the battle. And then really being able to see like, okay, this is a need for connection. And maybe I just spent a bunch of time connecting with this kiddo and maybe they’re a high connection needs kid. And so what are the outlets for that? Great. Speaker 2 (10:07.154)And we give some examples in the book. And I was actually, was just at an event down in LA where we were, I was met with a group of a hundred moms and we were talking about exactly this. Like what are ways that we can help our kids? Like if I can’t give them more connection in this moment, I’m cooking dinner or I’m trying to do something. What are outlets for that? And we have things like journaling back and forth or being able to call a friend and chat with them on the phone or. FaceTime a grandparent or a cousin or a friend or an aunt or uncle and find ways to have that outlet that’s not always directly from you as the parent or maybe even from the sibling who might have lower connection needs and kind of needs a break to be by themselves for a little bit. Right. Okay. So would you say as a parenting expert, Alyssa, punishment or taking things away doesn’t really work? It just doesn’t solve the problem. What we’re going to do is we’re responding to the behavior on the surface. As long as we’re not meeting that need, you’re going to keep seeing new behaviors pop up because the need doesn’t go away. Right? In the same way that if you had like a baby who was hungry, you could bounce them and shush them all day long, but until you feed them, they’re not going to stop crying because they’re hungry. And if we have a child who needs to move their body or a child who needs to connect, we might put out the fires on the surface, but until we meet that need, you’re just gonna see new ones pop up. Speaker 1 (11:40.226)Do you think that there’s some children in the way that they’re, you know, finding their way in the world? Like my older son is very mischievous, for example. Slime in my farm boots and he thinks it’s hilarious and he laughs like he’s always… Pranks like he loves it. And he just thinks it’s hilarious. And he gets so much attention. Again, like always, all the time. Do you feel like maybe some of this behavior is, you he wants his… He would. Speaker 2 (11:54.888)Such a connection seeker. Speaker 1 (12:09.57)get a rise out of his brother and. really from a place of connection. I want your attention. want you to notice me. brother. From anybody, right? Our high connection seekers, they’ll seek it out anywhere. we can help them identify that. I would say things like, that was a silly prank that you did, or that was silly joke. Did you want me to laugh? Were you trying to connect with me and help kind of bridge that awareness for them of when you’re doing these things, it’s because you want to connect. That’s how we help build their awareness of what is my need. So then when they grow up in the world, they can move through the world knowing, when I feel this way, it’s because I’m hungry. When I feel that way, it’s because I’m tired. When I feel this way, I need to move my body. When I’m doing these things, it’s because I need to connect with somebody, because I need to feel that sense of connection and belong. you Speaker 1 (13:07.278)As many of you know, I’ve been drinking our beloved Power Protein Smoothie Community Recipe for many years. And I do this day to day as a great way to get energizing protein into my day without feeling too heavy. Usually I drink it in the early or mid afternoons. And lately for the protein, I’ve been using the most pure, delicious vanilla chai plant-based protein blend that I want to share with you by Anima Mundi. This protein is made from pumpkin seeds, brown rice, sacha inchi, and pea, and it contains adaptogens like astralagus, ashwagandha, and aluthero, which all have been known to help support recovery, enhance performance, and help the body adapt to everyday stress. It also has digestion-boosting warming ingredients. You know we love that, like cardamom, cinnamon, and ginger. This protein tastes delicious and there’s a subtle sweetness to it which comes from the vanilla and the monk fruit. It’s a way to deeply nourish your cells with amino acids, complete plant-based protein. To get this delicious plant-based blend, please go to anemamundiherbals.com and use code Kim20 to get 20 % off your purchase. Again, we’re talking about the amazing vanilla chai protein powder. That’s anemomundierbals.com code Kim20, A-N-I-M-A-M-U-N-D-I-H-E-R-B-A-L-S.com code Kim20 to get 20 % off your purchase. In a world that is constantly promoting health fads and quick fixes, we can never get past the importance of the basics, such as creating optimal digestion, eating whole foods, and hydration. Yes, hydration. When we are optimally hydrated, our skin glows and is nourished, and it greatly helps us avoid headaches, cramps, fatigue, brain fog, and weakness. Besides water, we need electrolytes, which need to be replenished like probiotics. Every morning in my room temperature water that I drink first thing, Speaker 1 (15:27.99)I add a packet of Element electrolytes, usually the watermelon or raspberry flavors, which contain a science-backed mix of magnesium, potassium, and sodium. Element contains no sugar or artificial colors or fillers. I highly recommend that you also incorporate electrolytes into your routine as well to optimize your hydration, which your body, mind, and heart will greatly benefit from. And for now, our amazing community listeners, We’ll get a free sample pack with any element drink mix at www.drinkelement.com slash feel good. That’s eight single serving packets for free with any element drink mix purchase. Please go to www.drinkelement.com slash feel good. That’s www.drinklmnt.com slash feel good. Also check out the new element sparkling, which is a sparkly, fizzy electrolyte water if you love fizzy drinks. Speaker 1 (16:34.958)I’ll just tell you a fear as a parent hearing this is, again, he gets so much attention. Again, everybody says it, right? I pay so much attention to E. So I guess my fear is if he’s still wanting more, what if when he grows up, he gets into unhealthy relationships or he just always has to be in a relationship because of that. I want to reframe, like, you’re looking at intimate relationships. I see most often with our high connection seekers, they often actually seek it out even much outside of intimate relationships in friendships and in other spaces where, like, they might be the human who corrals kids to, like, all get together and play a game or they can often be, like, leaders in a pack where they… are so many outlets for connection that it’s not just an intimate one-to-one relationship. There are so many avenues for it. And as they continue to grow, they’ll find places to connect in different ways to make that happen. And we can support them along the way. But these are humans who it’s a superpower and we need them in this world. My daughter is like this. She is a high connection seeker. She walks into a room of 100 people she doesn’t know. And she’s like, my God, yes, 100 new friends. She’s 20 months. And she’s four? my gosh. and do you think that correlates with being an extrovert? Yeah, a lot of way. Speaker 2 (18:00.494)A lot of our high connection seeking kiddos are also extroverted. You a little bit have to be because it’s going to fill that cup, right? That like when you’re in that, although I just had a kid pop into my head who I when I was teaching and he was five years old and he had high connection needs, but he was an introvert and he would seek out more one to one like peer connection connection for me as a teacher. But he would look forward in those kind of smaller groups. activities and avenues, but he would glom on to like other kids and just want to be near them and want to talk to them and want to share and yada yada. But it was like he had one or two good friends in each space. He wasn’t like, I want to hang out with everyone in the class. Well, so there’s natural extroverts, introverts, connectors, like you said. How do you think this relates to, and you know, this is sort of on a spiritual level and in yogic traditions, you talk about the true self and self connection, which is self-effulgence and fulfilling and being so connected to the love inside that you wanna share it with people, but you’re not needing it. Yeah, I think that we’re, I’m going to pull in the like neuroscience and too. When we’re looking at this, I want to recognize that there’s not a human on the planet where there’s a one size fits all. Right? all of us, our nervous systems operate differently in the way that we integrate stimuli, the way that we integrate the world around us and make sense of it is different for all of us. And for some kids, they are their superpowers. I can noticing the details. or they know if something moves in their environment. They can get really dysregulated by like piles or clutter or things like that because they’re super attuned to the visual stimuli in their space. Some humans who sound, they’re really aware of the sounds in their environment and they can get really overstimulated by sound, especially if there’s competing sounds happening. Some kids who notice the details of how clothing feels in a heightened way. It’s too itchy, it’s too tight, it’s too something. Speaker 2 (20:02.378)And I look at these as superpowers, that they’re really good at noticing, they’re very attuned to those senses. And there are some humans who aren’t as attuned, and for them, can, it then appears as though they can maybe be more easygoing or they can move through the world differently, because their brain isn’t so hyper-focused on like, my gosh, what is that noise? I can’t stop hearing that clicking sound in the background and kind of tuning into those things in different ways. And so when we’re looking at the integration of all of that stimuli. We go through the nine senses in the book and outline it. But I think it’s really important in then saying like how you integrate them then determines how you show up in the world and what you need from the world around you based on how your nervous system is integrating that stimuli, because it’s going to find kind of homeostasis and regulation in different ways based on your unique nervous system. Does that make sense? It does to me. It sounds a little complicated to explain to a child. for sure. I’m going to break it down in different words to Yeah, to a kid. we this so the bulk of the work that we do at Seed is in school systems. I work in schools, elementary, middle schools, and then in childcare programs. And we teach teachers like how to talk to kids about this. How do you teach them about their nervous system? Totally. Well, there’s this idea of self-regulation even is something I think we need to really break down that and self-regulation. Speaker 2 (21:32.404)You teach self-regulation through co-regulation and self-regulation isn’t one size fits all. Wait, so say that again for a moment. mean co-regulation, you regulate yourself and then you’re in the space and then… You know, it’s like goosebumps. It’s almost like the science of heart coherence. Well, our hearts are giving off a magnetic field that’s 100 times stronger than the brain. So when we’re more emotionally calm, you talk about emotional intelligence and the more coherent, our heart rhythms are smooth and our… borrowing your comms. Speaker 2 (21:52.108)Not anymore. Speaker 1 (22:06.306)Brains are nervous, everything’s in sync. People around you feel that. Totally. So as we calm ourselves, we can calm our children more. That’s right. I think of it like the difference between a thermometer and a thermostat. A thermometer is just going to read the temperature of the room, you’re going to join it. A thermostat sets that temperature. And in order to set that temperature, you have to be mindful of your own regulation. So often we want kids to regulate for us. We want them to get calm for us when we can’t. Right. Yeah, I see parents who are literally screaming in public. Yeah. And they’re like, you calm down. We’re at the playground and I heard this, this mom didn’t know we were there. We were in the bathroom and she was like talking to her two girls and then me and my younger son came out and she was like embarrassed. I mean, I felt bad for her because obviously she didn’t want, no one wants to be that person. Nobody wants to be in that state where their body feels so out of control that you’re like, need the humans around me to change their behavior so I can feel in control. And so so much, that’s why I said so many folks, they come for the kids, but stay for themselves that we dive into what is, how does your nervous system work? What does it look like to learn how to build your own self-awareness and self-regulation so that we can then navigate co-regulation with our kids so that Speaker 2 (23:28.098)when our kid comes in and they roll their eyes and they slam the door and they give a sass or the sarcasm or whatever, that we can be the calm force in that moment. And it doesn’t mean I don’t hold boundaries. It doesn’t mean that any behavior is allowed. It does mean that I am really working on, okay, how do I calm my body so that I can respond with intention instead of react from a place of dysregulation. So let’s play this out for any mamas out there who have teenagers or getting close to teenagers, not there yet. But although I’ve seen some behavior from my nine-year-old defiance and disrespect, which you talk about in the book. Let’s say your teenager comes home and you say, or, hey, I’ll be the teenager. Well, it seems like something happened at school today. I’m fine. Yeah, I am here if you want to chat. Would you like space or do you want to talk about? Speaker 1 (24:30.862)Why are you so annoying? Why are you always trying to say that to me? I love you so much. I’m going to be cooking in the kitchen. If you want to come touch base, that’s where I’ll be That’s not a fun. Okay. Let’s do another one. Yeah. I mean, so it’s a center. You’re the center and you’re not trying to grab. Okay. I love it. I’m not taking the bait. Right? Like the bait is all, that would be me joining their energy. And I’m saying like, I’ve got you. I’m still calm in your storm. Okay, let’s do this one, which I have experienced where my son will call me by my first name and I don’t like it. Sure. Okay, so I’ll be the teenager tween, okay? Yeah. Comes home from school. Hey, Alyssa. Speaker 2 (25:15.544)Hey, did you want my attention? I heard you use my first name. Alisha? Yeah, it does sound like you want my attention. I’m here if you want to chat or hang. Lyssa, Lyssa! Yeah, come

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Henry Abbott Summary: In this episode Kimberly Snyder speaks with Henry Abbott, a former ESPN journalist and physical movement expert, discussing his new book ‘Ballistic: The New Science of Injury-Free Athletic Performance.’ They explore the importance of heart-led living, the connection between movement and emotional well-being, and the significance of understanding our body’s mechanics to prevent injuries. The conversation emphasizes the need for diverse movement practices, the role of weightlifting, and the impact of hydration and nutrition on overall health. Abbott shares insights on how to improve mobility and stability, particularly focusing on the hips, and the importance of trusting our bodies to move freely and joyfully. About Henry Abbott Henry Abbott is an award-winning journalist and founder of TrueHoop. He led ESPN’s Networks 60-person NBA (National Basketball Association) digital and print team, which published several groundbreaking articles on sports science and body injury prevention. He also won a National Magazine Award. Abbott currently lives in New Jersey.   Guest Resources: Website: treuhoop.com Book: Ballistic: The New Science of Injury-Free Athletic Performance   Episode Sponsors: LMNT OFFER: Right now, for my listeners LMNT is offering a free sample pack with any LMNT drink mix purchase at DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD. That’s 8 single serving packets FREE with any LMNT any LMNT drink mix purchase. This deal is only available through my link so. Also try the new LMNT Sparkling — a bold, 16-ounce can of sparkling electrolyte water. USE LINK: DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY   Episode Chapters 00:00 Heart-Led Living and Wellness Introduction00:53 Exploring Athletic Performance and Injury Prevention03:06 The Importance of Connection to Movement05:42 Understanding Movement Patterns and Injury Risks09:01 The Role of Hips in Mobility and Stability12:00 Weightlifting and Its Benefits for Women15:00 Hydration and Nutrition for Optimal Performance17:38 The Science of Movement and Body Awareness20:50 Fascial Release and Its Impact on Mobility23:31 The Interconnection of Physical and Emotional Health26:35 Embracing Diverse Movement Practices29:31 The Role of Animals in Understanding Movement32:41 Conclusion and Call to Action SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Speaker 1 (00:00.302)Welcome to the Feel Good Podcast, which is all about heart led living and wellness. When we awaken the power of our hearts and let that guide us through our daily choices and decisions, through our four cornerstones, food, body, emotional well being and spiritual growth, we will experience the most incredible results and create more vitality, health, strength, peace. abundance and love in our lives. I am your host, Kimberly Snyder, New York Times bestselling author, founder of Saluna, creator of the research-based Heart Aligned Meditation, wellness expert, nutritionist and international speaker. I am passionate about supporting you on your unique heart and wellness journey. Let’s get started. Speaker 1 (00:57.518)Hi everyone, welcome back to our Monday interview show. I am so excited for our very special guest. Joining us here today, Henry Abbott, who is a former ESPN journalist, a physical movement expert, and he has a new bestselling book out called Ballistic, the New Science of Injury-Free Athletic Performance. He talks about research on pain, psychology, biomechanics, and neuroplasticity. And as we all know, this is such an important topic today to increasing our mobility, keeping our mobility going for decades to come, to really enjoying our lives, to living with our hearts, to living with passion, to avoiding injuries and aches and pains, which really detract so much from our enjoyment of life, our spiritual growth, so many things. So Henry, thank you so much for being here with us today. It’s a delight. Thank you for having me. And so you and I were chatting a little bit before about your daughter, who I know is involved in soccer, and I was saying, Henry, I love your book. Really cool cover, by the way. If any of you guys are watching this on YouTube or if you’re listening, check out our YouTube so you can see the beautiful cover. And I said, you know, at first, you you say, oh, athletic performance. And some could say, hey, well, I’m not really an athlete. So this doesn’t apply to me. But as I got into the research and the book, and there’s some really interesting things that you’ll talk about here about glutes, really helping with back pain, hips, like lots of things. I said, you know, this is such an important topic for women and everyday women like me and moms. So that’s, you know, it just, it’s a lot broader. It’s really for everyone actually, we could say. Speaker 2 (02:41.718)I know this sounds like super salesy and woo woo or whatever, this really is like these people that we’ll talk about have a different lens for looking at the human body. They’re looking at it with biomechanical, granular biomechanical movement data. Who cares? Why is that fun? like, if you look this way, you start unlocking all kinds of crazy stuff about how to manage your body a little better. You kind of end up with a better owner’s manual to your own body. and get to age better. I’m trying to do it myself right now, right? So I feel like we have MRIs, we have x-rays, they solve a bunch of problems, but they don’t solve all the problems. And a lot of us are struggling with things that we can see in how we move. And that’s kind of, I think, important revelation for all of us moving forward. Well, one of the things we talk about here so much, Henry, in the community is connection, right? Connection to your heart, connection to your intuition, connection to what foods would best serve you and so on. And I think a lot of us develop movement patterns that maybe we’re not really connected to or fully aware of that form from an early age or some sort of emotional trauma or something can. cause our feet to turn out, or I know I can dump a lot in my hips, or I lean on one side, and I noticed a lot, you know, I held my babies on one side of my body. And so I think it’s really important to bring that connection back to movement because we’re in this physical bodily temple to house us through. And if we’re abusing it in these microwaves or not really nourishing proper movement, it does have a profound effect on our life’s experience. It’s super real and your doctor doesn’t know about this, unless you have a really good doctor, right? But like they, there’s a kind of a dumb example in the book of the guy who’s the founder of P3 that the book is about. His name is Marcus Elliott. was suspecting there was a better way to prevent injury while he was training to become an elite triathlete. And he would reach his hand forward in the pool and, you know, end up with pain in his shoulder. And then his coach was like, just move your hand a little bit out to the side, right? Speaker 2 (04:52.34)and all the pain went away. We all understand this could happen, right? Of course how you move can have these effects, right? But he was like, well, look at that. That’s kind of like he was going to have an injury and then he moved a little differently and then he was fine. I think so that’s one little super basic example. We all are doing this to ourselves. I think we’re open to the idea that maybe if you jog the way that you land on the ground or the way that you know, there’s People debate should you land on your heels or on the ball of your foot or on your toes or should you get these shoes or those shoes. Like we’re used to the idea that these things could, with all those steps, pounding again and again, end up with like maybe your knees hurt or maybe your hips hurt, right? And so I think we’re used to the idea that how you move can inform whether or not you get injured. These are the people who are just taking that and really making a scientific approach out of it, making a systematic scientific study of like what kinds of movements tend to connect to what kinds of outcomes. You know, it’s interesting in the beginning of the book, you say, know, trainers say that we often go back to the type of movement that we did in high school or earlier. And it’s funny because I played soccer, you know, when I was younger and then I stopped. And now my older son is nine and we play a lot of soccer and I’m experiencing some those knee pains. I’m oh, don’t run like this anymore. It’s sort of taking me back to that period in time. And I just stopped Henry, right? Instead of trying to figure out like maybe I’m not really running correctly or, I did some marathons too. And I don’t know. It was just interesting because it’s like, huh, I don’t know if this is the pounding or my son’s place a little rough, it’s, you know, it’s funny. He’s a rough nine year old, that’s what’s happening. Speaker 1 (06:33.422)He’s a rough nine-year-old. We have a lawn and we love to, know, anyways, sort of rough house. But I think it’s amazing when we can sort of say, like you said, I think what’s interesting is micro shifts. You know, people are experiencing towards injury, but so many aches and pains. As you know, Henry, it’s really common back pain. For me, a lot of women, hip pain. And so how do we sort of take this research and some of the things you talk about in the book and apply it to, again, the everyday movement and our workouts so we can benefit? Yeah, so I think there’s so much to unpack there. One for me is just thinking about the goal. And after spending three years marinating in all of this super geeky stuff about, you know, hips and knees and ankles and how we move and all this stuff, you know, I think it was important for me to kind of think about what is the real goal of all this. to me, my personal answer is like two dogs playing on the beach, like off leash dogs just romping around. maybe they’re in the ocean, maybe they aren’t, they’re covered in sand, they’re throwing each other down, but they’re having the time of their lives, right? And that’s movement, right? That’s really moving, right? And so to me, moving with joy, I’m not a dog, but to me, that kind of fun, driving that amount of fun from how you move is to me the goal. And so I’ve done a lot of physical therapy in my life. I’ve done a bunch of, injured myself a bunch of different ways. And I know that sometimes you have to go, or this place from writing about P3, know, NBA players, NFL players, MLB players, WNBA players, they’re in there doing their prescribed workouts with coaches watching carefully and it’s work, it’s real work. But that’s not the goal, right? The goal is for you to play soccer with your son, hopefully to be feeling great doing that, right? Like the goal is to have this body just move how you want it to move. And so what’s keeping us from that? Speaker 2 (08:36.662)And it’s tricky. We all have different bodies and there’s not going to be one answer for all of us. But some big themes do emerge from all of the thousands of athletes that they’ve studied. And one of the big ones is that basically every single one of us needs to work on our hips. Yes. In different ways. your hips, women tend to be more mobile than men, but plenty of women are not mobile enough. And so either your hips need work on mobility or stability. when mobility is not exactly the same as yoga, but you could think of it as a yoga type move or stability would be more weightlifting. You need to put muscles around your hips to keep them from being dangerously unstable. It’s to know which one of those you’re in. Yes. when you say that, obviously men, everybody has a different body, but in general, can say women’s hips, you know, kind of go out and they don’t align with your waist and they don’t drop straight down to your knees. So how does that affect injuries for women, whether we’re talking about stabilizing or mobility versus a man’s body, which is more linear. There’s all kinds of, like we’re hundreds of years into kind of guessing around that issue, right? And one of the big topics is ACL tears, right? This is where women athletes tend to have eight times the ACL tear rate of men. So why is that? It’s like a big mystery, right? And if you want that, you can go and watch like the finest experts in the land have given lectures on this and like they’re all like one theory is hormones. One theory is exactly as you described, like the just the geometry, right? There’s theories about how big is the actual ligament, right? Women tend to have a smaller ligament or how big is the canal the ligament sits in and on and on. All these things that are easy to study with MRI and x-ray or blood tests, they’ve been studied. if you go and look at these lectures, the answer is everything is wrong. Every single theory has a study that proves it and one that disproves it. It’s all messy. Speaker 2 (10:45.454)It’s hard to find a bright thing. So when you just look at movement, you see that there is like 100 % of NBA players who tour the ACL land on the outside of their foot and then roll to the inside. It’s a little movement that no one studies that is 100 % or like another very common thing. Big theory that’s gone around and probably we all have trainers who will cite this, right, is about cue angles. Do you know about cue angles? Have you heard this phrase before? Okay, so this is exactly what you’re describing with like if your hips are wider, there’s a chance for your legs to like your knees to basically have a can travel in towards each other as you squat. Yeah, it’s like they call it valgus collapse. Please explain. Speaker 1 (11:34.177)I Speaker 2 (11:37.964)Right? And so if you were to squat in front of a trainer and your knees were to dive in together, they would like have a cow. They would be very upset about this. Right? So this Q angle thing is seen as like a major risk factor for catastrophic knee injury. what they found in a bazillion, studying thousands, literally thousands of athletes and how they move at P3 is that just having your knees dive in like that is not a giant risk factor. Instead, Some of those cases where you need to dive in, have something happening that’s very hard to see with the naked eye, which is your femur, your upper leg bone, is rotating. And it ends up being kind of like twisting the drumstick off the turkey. And it like, that tears your ACL, is your upper leg bone rotating. And so when I talked about needing hip stability, this is what we’re talking about, is like, you can literally lift weights to build the muscles to hold your femur in place so it doesn’t rotate. That’s like the kind of work we should all be doing, but that so far most of us don’t even know to think about. you Healthy fats are essential for our health and wellbeing. And I’m so excited to share with you a very exciting scientific breakthrough to support our long-term health, wellness, and beauty. C15. This is the first essential fatty acid to be discovered in 90 years. Studies have confirmed that C15 is three times better, broader, and safer than taking omega-3s. Speaker 1 (13:14.254)C15 works by strengthening our cells, improving our mitochondrial function, and protecting us against damaging free radicals. The result is better long-term metabolic, liver, and heart health. Taking C15 can help to slow aging, boost your sleep and your skin, hair, and nail health. The most pure brand that I found that I absolutely love and take every day is Fatty 15. This is a vegan friendly supplement of pure C15. It’s a tiny little capsule that you take every day and it helps to replenish your cells with essential C15. You can get 15 % off your Fatty 15 subscription or 90 day subscription when you go to fatty15.com slash Kimberly and use code Kimberly at checkout. Please check it out for yourself and take it every day as I do. Once again, that’s fatty15.com slash Kimberly. That’s fatty15.com slash Kimberly to get 15 % off your 90 day subscription. It’s the small consistent things that we do on a regular basis that give us great results over the long term. And one of the easiest and most effective steps that we can do on a regular basis is to create optimal hydration in our body. It’s really the difference between a grape and a raisin. Of course, the grape is beautiful and looks supple and is full of water. And that’s what we want our energy to feel like. That’s what we want our skin to look like, glowy and supple and just full of that beautiful hydration. So it comes down to water, of course. That’s quite obvious. But also electrolytes, right? Electrolytes are a really important part of hydration and we need to replace them regularly. And I’ve been talking about certain foods for years, like celery and chard and certain foods, which are really great to help with electrolyte levels. But in our modern busy days, and because we’re running around and we’re sweating and there’s stress, I also recommend adding a packet of electrolyte to your room temperature water every day as I do. And the reason for this is that in one packet, you’ll get a hefty dose of science-backed electrolytes. Speaker 1 (15:38.894)including sodium, potassium, and magnesium. It has no added sugars or filler. And it’s just a great way to ensure that you’re really staying hydrated. And this is one of the easiest, I find, and most effective wellness steps because hydration is fundamental to our organs functioning at their best and also to enhance detoxification and many other things. So right now, Element is offering our amazing feel-good community. free sample pack with any element drink mix that’s drink element comm slash feel good D R I N K LM NT comm slash feel good to get your eight single serving packets for free once again drink element comm slash feel good Speaker 1 (16:36.012)the diagrams in the book as well. The visual because unless we’re, you know, a trainer or we studied a lot, it’s like it can be hard to visualize on a level with these detailed bones and the muscles. Yeah, no, this guy, John Early did these illustrations and they were like, they’re hard to do because they have to be like medically accurate, but also hopefully kind of like fun to look at. Right. This one is I think maybe important. I don’t know if you’re if you’re watching. Yes. OK. So when I mentioned that everybody’s hips need help with mobility or stability, you can do a little test. Right. If you can side plank all 10 toes pointing forward with your leg elevated, your body like in a big X. If you can hold that for 30 seconds, just lock it out, then they would say that your hip stability is sufficient, right? Like your hips are stable enough. Similarly, if you can do this standing figure four, so you’re like, take your, let’s say your right ankle and hook it over your left knee, rest it on top of your left knee, and then sit down and get so that like your hips are are level with your knees. If you can sit down like that, then your hips are mobile enough. But If you’re like me, then you can’t do either of those things and you have to work on it. Right? So we all got to work on these things. Yeah, it’s cool. These are both yoga poses or asanas that can be incorporated in a routine. This is a version of an ukta asana. Yeah, and that’s, I love that. That’s really interesting, seeing the diagrams, because I’m like, hey, I’ve done these movements before. I never thought about them in terms of this language, but they’re kind of fun to do. Speaker 2 (18:21.688)Do think you can lock out that side plank like that for 30 seconds? Gosh, Henry, it’s, you I used to have such a serious asana practice. It was every day, hour and a half. And then I started shifting to walking for different reasons, to getting outside. It’s just a break in the middle of my day. And it’s really hilly where I live. I live in the mountains, so it’s like quite a tough walk. But, you know, my husband keeps saying, you know, got to do more upper body lifting, you know, for bone health. And I got some weights. And so I’m… thinking about shifting the routine. So I’ll report back to you because I don’t know. Honestly, I used to do it a lot and definitely hold it for that long, but it’s been some years. So it’ll be interesting to see what I try. I’d be interested to know. It’s hard. I mean, it’s hard. My wife is amazing at that kind of stuff. She can do it. She can do all that stuff. she’s very, she can go to any yoga class and just fall right into whatever the teacher is doing and just fine with it. But me, I don’t have that kind of, that’s not my forte. Well, know, injuries even within yoga in the last few years of my practice, I noticed when you’re doing the warrior poses, because people think, yoga is great for injuries and it doesn’t have slow impact. But I would experience towards the end hip pain from doing the warriors. And again, I don’t know if that’s dumping into my hip or not having enough hip stability, but I did experience some pain from the asanas. What do you think about that? Speaker 2 (19:54.54)Yeah, that brings up an interesting point. I grew up, my family, have, parents and sister, we have really tight hamstrings. And so to me, anyone with hip mobility is like a magician. And clearly you’re better off, clearly you’re better injury resistance, et cetera. So I’m always working on trying to get more hip mobility. And so I’ve been to a bunch of yoga classes and I always think the teacher is probably someone who’s just in a better category than me in terms of injury risk, right? But Marcus Elliott, who this book is largely about, he was explaining that when his first yoga teacher in Santa Barbara, where he lives, she had the most incredibly mobile hips and she would show off. She could do all these crazy yoga moves that no one else could do. But she had both hips replaced in her early 50s. he would explain the reason why is because she didn’t have hip stability. Right? Like she worked crazy on hip mobility, he’s like, but if she had just done basic weightlifting to just, you know, she could move that hip super mobile, but like she didn’t have the control of it to keep it from getting out of place. And for things like our femur rotating other lots of other things from hips ability, like she didn’t have very stable hips and you want both. What kind of weightlifting would you do to stabilize your hips? There’s a fair amount of that kind of stuff in the book. I think there’s different flavors of hip instability, but they do recommend basically for everyone really good form as you squat and do hinging motions. I follow their routines now and I spend a lot of time doing single leg RDLs. There’s also in the book, most of what they prescribe is individual to the athlete. Speaker 2 (21:44.28)The warm up is the same. There’s a 13 step warm up, includes a fair amount. Your hips will be like, the hips will notice the warm up. I don’t know, it takes 15 minutes maybe depending how careful you do it. But there’s a ton of like Romanian dead lifts. You know this move, the Romanian dead lift? It’s like the most basic form is you stand on one leg and then you keep your torso and the other leg in a line as you like. pitch forward and touch the floor in front of you. You’ve done something like this, I’m sure, a bazillion times. And you can do that with a weight, starting with a lightweight, et cetera. But that’s a hinging motion, right? Which will put a pretty good bunch of tension on the back of your hip. I’ll tell you, for me, they obsess about the form of how you do that. And I would tend to do it leaning a little too far forward, which means I wasn’t using the proper muscles in my hip. they have to have me like… Yes. Speaker 2 (22:42.018)I mean now I still as a little cue like when I get in the form for that I like try to really like shift back a little bit so that when I bend over and come back up I’m pulling on like the very back of my glute as opposed to recruiting other muscles from your hips to kind of cheat. Right. You know, this is so, it’s so interesting we’re talking about this, Henry, because I can say, you for me, I really like walking in nature and it feels good or doing my yoga poses sort of like that teacher you described where I could put both of my feet behind my head and do these crazy poses. But sometimes it’s like what we need is not, not to say our favorite thing or the other thing that we’re most drawn to, but it is the balance. And Dr. Suhas was an Ayurvedic teacher and doctor came on here and he was talking about how, he talks about in different contexts, weightlifting is really important to women for that cough of that groundedness to balance. we’re in our heads and Vata energy and it actually makes you feel strong so you can feel strong on the decisions you make in your life. And, know, in terms of what you’re talking about preventing injury and just feeling really stable. So maybe it’s, you if you’re like me and you’re like, well, I don’t know, like I never, I never go to these like weight, I don’t go to the gym and I don’t really lift, you know, I’m not drawn to weightlifting classes or whatever. But what you’re talking about the book is things that we can incorporate and you can make a huge difference in balance. Because if we’re just doing the things that we like, can, that’s, that’s probably why I started to feel some injuries from yoga because I wasn’t doing the stabilizing aspect. Yeah, that’s definitely a factor. I think they do. There aren’t a lot of things they recommend for everybody at this place, but like they do recommend there’s some kind of weights in everybody’s program, right? Like it’s just, it’s just maybe there are ways around it, but I think it’s, it’s, you know, your husband’s probably right, which I hate to say, you know what I mean? There’s all these studies and stuff, you know, like, Speaker 1 (24:40.226)Right? But then it’s like, again, you’re talking about patterns. It’s making space in our life and creating a new habit. It’s also I mean, I never thought I’d be a weightlifter. I was a runner and just like never had any interest in that. And then I started having like hip trouble basically. And and a friend of mine, she is a kinesiologist who runs a gym. And so I started going to her gym and it’s I don’t know, it’s 75 % women and like, which matters to me because like, it’s fun as hell to go there because everyone’s very supportive, right? Like, like, it’s just not it is not the like, it is technically a CrossFit gym. But I don’t know, they got that certification for whatever reason. the fact is, no

Summary: In the September Solluna Power Hour, Kimberly Snyder discusses the essential rhythms and rituals needed to feel grounded, clear, and energized as we transition from summer to fall. She emphasizes the importance of maintaining balance through food, body care, emotional well-being, and spiritual growth. The conversation highlights the significance of daily practices, nourishing foods, and emotional processing to enhance overall well-being and resilience during this seasonal shift. Episode Sponsors MOMENTOUS: MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. GLOWING GREENS POWDER OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order.   Episode Chapters Chapters 00:00 Transitioning into Fall: Grounding and Clarity 10:14 The Importance of Rhythms and Rituals 20:26 Nourishing the Body: Food Cornerstone 26:04 Body Care: Rituals for Well-Being 34:04 Emotional Well-Being: Processing Feelings 42:14 Spiritual Growth: Cultivating Stillness and Gratitude   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS The Hidden Power of the Five Hearts Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! How to Believe in Your Self Worth with Jamie Kern Lima How to Raise Your Standards In Your Love Life with Matthew Hussey How to Eat to Beat Your Diet with New York Times best selling author Dr. William Li The issues with consuming vegetable and seed oils with Dr. Catherine Shanahan How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo How to Optimize Your Metabolic Health with Dr. Casey Means TRANSCRIPT: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:00.888)Hi everyone, welcome back to our September Power Hour show. I’m so excited for this very relevant topic this month, which is essential rhythms and rituals to feel grounded, clear, and energized. And I know for myself, transitioning from summer into the fall, with the busyness of school ramping back up and work, and there’s just so much more on the schedule. Can you relate that these three words grounded, clear, and energized are really important, especially right now. There’s always a shift between seasons and between months, as we know, but there’s a really big shift in particular from summer into fall. And I’ll share that personally, I just, we just got back a few days ago from Hawaii and there’s a very different. rhythm that we have on the island. There’s a lot of physical labor and farm work and expansiveness and just running through the woods and freedom. And now there is a reality into coming back to LA and there’s still a lot of road work in our area from the fires and our kids’ school burned. I mentioned here to our beloved community a few months ago and now there’s a new campus, there’s a longer drive, there’s just many things. And so I’m really feeling the call, maybe along with you, to ground in to have these really sacred rhythms and routines and rituals which really do help us stay healthy and they help to regulate our bodily systems such as digestion and immunity. And they regulate our mind and they regulate our emotions and they allow us to stay connected to our hearts even as things in the external world around us become more full, can we say, and there’s just a bit more going on or a lot more going on. And what I’ve been doing is I’ve gotten back the last few days is really we will talk about this when we get to some of the later quarterstones. We’ll talk about this in emotional and spiritual. Is this idea of surrendering the resistance to our preferences more and more? Maybe I don’t want to be driving so much or why does it have to be so busy right now? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:20.418)you know, why can’t it still be summer? And starting to sink into this deeper place of connection and resilience inside of us, in our hearts, in the center of our being, so that even as we glide around the world and maybe things aren’t our preference, we can find a deep sense of well-being and root into our own energy and our own true self connection. So we’re going to be covering all of this today through the lens, of course, of our Four Cornerstones, our power hour show, has a theme. And then we’re still gonna cover food, body, emotional well-being, and spiritual growth during this show, which is at the top of each month, to give you the best tips and tools to really utilize throughout the month. So I’ll say right here, right now, if there’s anyone that you think would benefit from this show, please forward it to them. We really wanna share this information and to get it out in the world. We also really appreciate reviews. If you could just take a moment to write us a review on Spotify or Apple, wherever you listen to our podcast. It’s such a wonderful way to support the mission of the podcast, of our feel good community, which is to support others. And that has been the mission, by the way, since I started my free Kimberly Snyder.net blog many years ago now and wrote my first book, The Beauty Detox Solution. And I really want to stay rooted in that mission. And I think our community attracts like-minded souls that really do want to spread love and support for others. So sharing the show, whether it’s a screenshot or a link to a direct episode, is such a wonderful way to support. Okay, let’s get right into our… and another quick thing I want to mention is you can also join our newsletter at mysaloona.com to stay more connected to the community as well. So what does it mean to feel more grounded and clear and energized? I really love this word grounded. And what it means to me is that we are complex beings. have so many different layers of our being. We have the emotional body, the soul or the Atman or the spiritual body. We have the mental part of us. We have the physicality. And when we’re grounded, it means that every part of us Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:43.118)centered and synergized and we feel very much present where we are. We’re having an embodied experience and so what that means is that in this particular lifetime in this dimension, depending on what you believe in, we’re here in a there’s a you know a physicality to the realm that we’re in and so when we’re grounded it means that we are connected to all layers of our being, included very much our bodies. And we can be really connected to the present moment, which means we’re looking into the person’s eyes that we’re talking to, whether it’s our child or the teacher at our child’s school or a coworker or someone that you’re chatting to on a Zoom for work or whatever it is. Instead of not really being in conversations or not really being where your body happens to be, you know, those experiences where you’re sort of, you know… how did I just go shopping at the grocery store and I’m walking out with my bags? I don’t even remember being there, right? That’s when we’re disassociated from the body and we feel so hurried or life is so fast paced that we start to miss the magic of the moments and things start to get faster and faster, which creates a sense of incoherence, which means our nervous systems start to go into overdrive. We start to feel more tension perhaps in our bodies. And this disables our ability to be in flow and efficiency and energy efficiency. So what happens as this cascade of all different sorts of biochemical processes starts to get a little bit off kilter is that we end up aging more quickly and we end up feeling more depleted in our energy. So this sense of groundedness is a very important theme as we go into fall. because one of the things that ancient wisdom teaches us through Aryaveda in particular is this is the season of Vata. So Pitta is what we’re coming from through August and the summer, which is a lot of fire element. The sun is very strong. And now we’re moving into more of the wind, air, energy. And when it’s not balanced, what happens, the potential is there for anxiety, for confusion. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:00.216)for feeling excess stress, for our digestion getting thrown off, for our immunity getting thrown off. So we want to eat in a way and live in a way that really grounds our energy through this very important transition. So the important of rhythms and rituals is that, again, there’s so much fullness in our schedule and we don’t control the traffic and we don’t control so many after school events coming on. And right now I’m trying to just figure out with my boys. you know, the swim class overlapping with the chess classes. So, you know, one has to sit at one event and then I drive to the next and the other one has to read or sit during the other event. And there’s just a lot of scheduling. If you can relate to that, whether you’re a mom or you just have a lot going on in your plate, getting together with friends, different work projects, you know, lots of, things that are calling us and calling for our attention. So let’s, let’s start to. talk about our first cornerstone now because when we have these rhythms and rituals it helps to ground us so that we don’t get swept up in the vata in the air and also I want to mention from another ancient wisdom system traditional Chinese medicine that fall is associated with the metal element and the lungs so again back to that air coming in through the lungs, there’s a focus in this area, and we need to create inner strength in order to feel that balance and carry us through the fall. It’s interesting because lungs also govern the heart chakra and all energies related to the heart, this whole area right here. And so as we move into more fullness, I don’t really like to say the word busyness because busy can imply just getting things. done off a to-do list versus just there’s fullness that requires our presence and our energy and our love, right? So we can lean, it’s an opportunity to lean more into our inner connection and to strengthen our heart coherence and the power of our heart and allowing that to keep us rooted in our bodies, right? Rooted into making decisions that are really the best decisions for us and having these sacred Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:18.516)rituals through the day, these touch points to bring us back if we start to go up into our head too much or we start to believe some of the incoherent thoughts or we just start to get overwhelmed by how much there is going on. We want the rhythms and the rituals to keep pulling us back, pulling us back. And this is part of Dinacharya, the Ayurvedic daily rhythm, which I’ve also spoken about quite a bit on the podcast. which is this idea that as we regulate these simple daily practices and we consistently follow them, in turn we become more regulated in our nervous system, in our coherence, our heart-brain nervous system connection, in our overall bodily efficiency, in our overall bodily well-being, and we start to feel more flow as we glide through a very full day. And there’s just a deeper sense of peace and we can be really engaged, but also a bit from the inside, less caught up in the ups and downs and feeling so reactive about things that don’t go according to our expectations. I was in a really beautiful, I was at a baby shower over the weekend and one of the women was talking about her perspective of how important it was to dance in the gap. between how you expect things to go and how life is really showing up. And I love that, you know, that symbology, this idea of dancing between that and finding a way to meld and flow with life. And when we feel more grounded in our bodies through the Four Cornerstones, I think it’s easier to have more of that lightness and to be able to dance with whatever life is doling out to us versus feeling really frustrated and easily triggered and worn down, which is What can happen when we don’t have our rituals to carry us through? So from a food perspective, let’s jump into our first cornerstone now. Remember that how you eat has a profound effect on these different layers of your being. And this is what ancient wisdom has always talked about. It’s not this reductionist approach to food, but really seeing that how we eat affects us emotionally, mentally, physically, and even spiritually. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:42.284)So our bodies during the fall are in September are craving a sense of steadiness. And there’s a very different feeling in your body when you start to feel full, satiated from having, let’s say a hot bowl of soup, something very grounding, feeling very comforting versus just reaching for a bag of, you know, a processed snack, even if it’s You know, the numbers add up, let’s just say like a processed protein bar, this cold processed item just going into your body. There’s a very different energetic quality to it. And I’m not saying we have to be perfect all the time and there’s times where you’re traveling or you’re in a bind and that protein bar may be the best option, but more and more we want to develop rhythms of creating stability in the body. I also want to mention that my friend this month, Dan Buettner, who is the founder of the Blue Zones. We’re actually doing a, depending when you listen to this, you check my socials at underscore Kimberly Snyder. We’ll be doing a live together to talk about his new Blue Zones book, which is all about one pot meals. So I’m really excited about that because we have to find and utilize really easy ways to eat in a way that feels really grounding, which stabilization means healthy fats. It means lots of fiber, lots of nutrients, and as natural and whole as possible. We also have some fantastic recipes, which are on our website, mysaluna.com. And one of my intentions for the fall is to get more organized with meal planning for the family because it is getting so full so that I will focus on what we’re eating for dinner. And of course, packing all the school lunches and have a general plan for at least Monday through Friday and get organized. So I myself have been looking back at our vast storehouse of recipes. And there’s ones that I, you know, created years ago. I kind of forgot about that and bringing it back in. On my Instagram, I recently posted about our gorilla wraps, which are these amazing walnut tacos, basically. And it was a recipe that I got away from. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:04.702)and I brought it back in and it just felt so grounding and great to have the healthy fats from the walnuts and all those beautiful oils and the collard greens. So we definitely want to have that stabilizing food. And I mentioned hot soups because one of the things that happens in the vata season is that there’s a coolness. When you think about wind blowing through, it’s very welcome in the summer when it’s 100 degrees outside and we want a nice cool breeze. But as the wind starts to pick up, it can start to bring a chill into the bones, into the body, into the throat. And so sipping on warm elixirs and having more warm foods, particularly for lunch and dinner, becomes a very important ritual and routine. So I’ll be planning lots of one pot meals. I’ll be going back to dahl, which is, you know, a wonderful recipe that we also offer on the website. And so, It’s, and also if you go to our podcast tab, just for being a member of a beloved member of our community, you can also get a free download, which we’ve created recently, which has all different, recipes for you. the doll version is one of them. So it’s, I believe, or you could email love at mysaloon.com and ask about the, download. So we still want to have. raw nutrients. So I do start the day with a nice warm hot water with ginger and lemon, particularly a hot water with lemon. And then I like to drink my smoothies room temperature, including the Glowing Green smoothie. I’ve never been a icy smoothie person. And I know some people love iced coffee and my kids love coconut ice cream and cold smoothies, but I just I’ve gotten used to over the years really having things closer to room temperature. So if that works for you to have your beautiful glowing green smoothie, hopefully with a glowing greens powder added in, that’s wonderful, or at least a little bit less cool and moving towards that as we start to go into fall and also winter. Another great rhythm and routine. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:23.68)is to bring in more grounding root vegetables right now, which naturally start to become more seasonal. And I’m talking about certain squashes and also things grown into the earth, beets and carrots and so on and so forth, which are really great for your digestion. And they bring in that kaffa quality, which means earthness, earthiness, and they’re literally grown in the earth. And besides grounding root vegetables, another great rhythm and routine to get back into or into is almonds and almond milk and nuts. So I’ve been posting about almond milk lately because I’ve gotten back into it and I feel so much vitality from making my own almond milk to get that essential o-just, that incredible vitality enhancing the essence of the almonds. And so it feels really grounding to my body. make almond milk maybe every other day or every two days or so. And it’s, know, when you think about nuts and the property of nuts, there is a stabilizing quality to them. So I just want to point out a bit of research from this one is from the journal BMC microbiology from 2020 and it found significant seasonal variability in gut microbiota. So what this means is that as we essentially what it means, and you can read the study if you would like to, we will link to it in the show notes at mysaluna.com. And I’ve read other similar studies with similar results is that as we adjust to seasonal foods and we shift our diet, just like we shift our clothes between season to season, we will see a greater strengthening and resilience in our microbiota, which is really important. for feeling grounded, our gut health is so important as we talk about quite a bit here. And so it’s important to again, reaching for seasonal veggies and shifting our diet. And this is the moment again, besides the seasonal root veggies and a bit more heaviness to also have warmer foods to start bringing that in. And I know for some of us here in LA, September can still be quite hot. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:38.51)but starting to bring it in because it will start to increase as the season continues. There was another great review in 2025 in the International Ayurvedic Medical Journal showing how Agni, which I love this word, or digestive fire, naturally fluctuates as the environment changes around us. And Ritucharya is the Ayurvedic principle of living in tune with seasonal shifts. And we want to emphasize supporting our digestion right now with warm, grounding foods. So there’s something really beautiful about attuning to the environment around us instead of just plowing forward and not really considering that, which I know you can maybe think of some people that eat the same way completely all year round or start to follow a diet or something they see and they don’t really take into account seasonal foods or how their body’s really feeling in a particular environment or what needs to shift. I know that years ago when I lived in New York and I was following a raw food diet for a couple years, and I really wanted to follow this diet and it worked really well for me for a while, but I remember being so cold at times in New York City and just really wanting a hot vegetable soup. Be no, no, no, I can’t because it has to be raw. And these rigid rules don’t always serve us. Maybe sometimes we want to shift over or clear something in the body or heal our gut or candida or whatever it is. And so we have to be a little bit more regimented. But I really do believe part of listening to our bodies is listening to our hearts intuition about what our body needs. So over time it very well may shift how we eat, particularly around your menstrual cycle, around seasons, like we’re talking about here. And I do think it’s important to have those natural fluctuations. And finally, a 2019 publication in Frontiers and Immunology from 2019 found that greater daily dietary diversity is linked to a more stable, resilient gut microbiome composition. So for again, we listen to the autumn root vegetables, which actually actively support our digestive health. A podcast that I did some months ago, maybe a year or so ago with Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:01.484)Dr. B, who was a plant-based gastroenterologist, we discussed how in an ideal world, he said we should have 30 to 35 different vegetables in a week, which is creating that real diversity. And maybe that sounds like a lot, but if you think about the vegetables that are in the Glowing Green Smoothie, for example, if you put romaine and spinach and parsley and cilantro, it starts to add up. And maybe 30 is just seems completely out of the ballpark right now. But, you know, if you’re just, if you notice you’re only having, you know, three, five, six, seven, you can start to work to stretch towards, let’s say 11, 12, and then maybe 15 and start to see ways in which you can create more of that diversity, which will make your gut very happy and your body very resilient. So just start to notice. If you’re feeling anxious, you’re feeling spacey, if you’re feeling, you’re just craving so much sugar, you’re feeling bloated in your body, you’re feeling like there’s just an irregularity to any of your bodily systems, but especially digestion. And now that your body’s calling for these sacred rhythms and rituals to feel more grounded. So just to review for some of the top tips is to start and end the day with warm elixirs. It’s very easy to make some of these elixirs. Again, you can go to our website, mysaluna.com to get some recipes, but even simple hot water with lemon in the morning and hot water with ginger sliced in it in the evening is a really great place to start. And then leaning into seasonal grounding foods such as the root vegetables, such as the nuts. warmer dishes, particularly for lunch and dinner. You could have something like a salad and a lentil veggie soup with quinoa or rice. This is something that we eat a lot as a family. Dinner last night was a kale salad. I’m really happy to say that both my kids are really into kale right now. Again, who knows how things shift and change, but both my kids really love the Dharma’s kale salad. And then I made a soup with lentils and all the veggies that we had in the house. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (23:17.132)broccoli and carrots and spinach. I made a soup and then rice and that was our dinner and it was really easy, relatively easy to make and felt really grounding. It’s also important to avoid stimulating foods. So this is not a great time. I mean, it’s never really a great time, but particularly now to have excess caffeine to overload your body with processed foods or sugary foods. We want to keep that groundedness with the wholeness that can come from foods. And we want to bring a rhythm to meal times. So as much as possible, if you can eat around the same time every day, if you can say grace or a gratitude practice to create a ritual to sitting down, hopefully without devices or screens in a hopefully non-rushed way, and to enjoy the time that you’re eating and time with your family, that would be really beautiful. I would also encourage you in particular to go back to the fiber-filled glowing green smoothie if you got away from it and to check the recipe on my site if you’ve never tried it and to add the glowing greens powder into it. There is a lot of powerful greens in this whole combination and ones that you wouldn’t have fresh in the glowing greens powder such as Amalaki, Ashitaba, Moringa. I’m actually starting this week going into double doses. of the glowing greens powder, so two scoops instead of one, which I do sometimes when I feel the call to ground, but also cleanse at the same time. There’s a relationship between cleansing out heavy metals and wastes and then re-revifying, just nourishing yourself with very deep, nutrient-tense plants, which is what is in the glowing greens powder. So I just… I’m feeling like I need that right now as I move from summer to fall. So I’ll be having two scoops a day of the Glowing Greens powder, which will help again cleanse the heavy metals and the toxins, but also really nourish. And you’ll start to see even more of a glow to your skin. You’ll see an even more bounce to your hair, your hair’s growth, just across every cell of your being. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (25:39.128)And if you’re also feeling like the need to support greater digestion, mean, you know, you’re getting, there’s more bloating and we want to absorb more nutrients, I highly recommend adding in the digestive enzymes as an important way to absorb more nutrition from your food. You take them right before you eat. And then also, which has been really important, I’ve been taking it more often in the fall because my vata can definitely get imbalanced. is detoxi. And that one you take in the evening, it’s magnesium and oxygen and stable vitamin C. And it helps you have larger bowel movements without being a laxative and without being habit forming. So let’s move on to our next cornerstone, is body. Your sacred, unique, amazing body needs to be cared for, especially in the season. Why? Because Vata and winds and, you know, more full schedules and lots going on tends to drive the energy up, up into the mind, up into our, you know, We’re in our heads where anxiety can start to manifest and excess worry and excess fears and

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Estelle Bingham Summary: In this conversation, Kimberly and Brittany Piper delve into the profound impact of trauma on the nervous system and the importance of somatic healing. Brittany shares insights from her new book, ‘Body First Healing,’ discussing how trauma is stored in the body and how somatic work can help individuals reconnect with their bodies to facilitate healing. They explore the concept of intergenerational trauma, the natural responses to trauma observed in animals, and the significance of body awareness in the healing process. Brittany also shares her personal journey of overcoming trauma and the tools that can aid in navigating trauma responses, emphasizing the importance of building resilience and capacity for emotions. The conversation concludes with a message of empowerment, encouraging individuals to trust their bodies and recognize their innate ability to heal. About Britt Piper Brittany Piper is a renowned speaker, author, and Somatic Experiencing® Practitioner specializing in sexual violence prevention and trauma-informed care. As a survivor and leading advocate, she has educated thousands worldwide, including the U.S. Army and Department of Justice. Her book, Body-First Healing: A Revolutionary Guide to Nervous System Recovery, offers a groundbreaking approach to nervous system regulation and recovery through harnessing the wisdom of the body. Guest Resources: Website: https://www.bodyfirsthealing.com/about Book: Body-First Healing: A Revolutionary Guide to Nervous System Recovery Episode Sponsors:   LMNT OFFER: Right now, for my listeners LMNT is offering a free sample pack with any LMNT drink mix purchase at DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD. That’s 8 single serving packets FREE with any LMNT any LMNT drink mix purchase. This deal is only available through my link so. Also try the new LMNT Sparkling — a bold, 16-ounce can of sparkling electrolyte water. USE LINK: DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD   FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Somatic Healing and Trauma02:59 Understanding Trauma and the Nervous System06:07 The Role of Body Memory in Healing08:56 Intergenerational Trauma and Its Impact11:57 Lessons from Animal Behavior on Trauma Recovery14:50 Cultural Disconnection from Somatic Practices17:52 Personal Stories of Healing and Resilience21:05 Justice and Advocacy for Survivors of Trauma24:31 The Journey Through Trauma and Justice28:49 Understanding the Body’s Response to Trauma33:51 Navigating Anger and Emotional Regulation39:32 Empowerment Through Somatic Healing46:41 The Path to Self-Healing   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Kimberly Snyder (00:00.718)Hi everyone and welcome back to our Monday interview show. I am so excited for our very special guest today and our conversation with Brittany Piper, who is a speaker and somatic and trauma trained practitioner specializing in somatic experiencing. She has a brand new book out called Body First Healing, Get Unstuck and Recover from Trauma with Somatic Healing. Brittany and I were speaking just a little bit before the podcast about how amazing it is to talk about trauma and healing on such a deep level now, which wasn’t really happening a generation earlier. So Brittany, thank you so much. Welcome to our show and congratulations on your new book all at the same time. Brittany Piper (00:43.95)Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, I’m excited to have a conversation today. So I appreciate you having me here. Kimberly Snyder (00:51.118)You know, it’s very close to my heart, literally. My recent book was about the heart and dropping into this deeper place beyond the linear mind. And I found that really reflected in your book as well, this idea that things happen to us, challenging experiences happen of all different degrees, and we can’t just think our way out of it. Can you talk a little bit about how experiences can actually get stored? in our nervous system and in our body, similarly to how we might not properly digest certain foods. Brittany Piper (01:26.124)Yeah. Yeah, the, so I think that there’ve been so many different definitions surrounding trauma over the years. And I think that the one that lands best with me is that trauma is any experience that overwhelms the nervous system’s capacity to cope. And when that happens, your nervous system can get stuck in chronic states of survival. Or in other words, it gets stuck. Kimberly Snyder (01:42.381)Mm. Kimberly Snyder (01:50.062)Okay. Brittany Piper (01:54.016)in the states or the responses that it used in the past. And it’s as if somatic work, which is body-based healing work, we work with the nervous system and with the body, and more specifically body memory rather than verbal memory to help the body and the nervous system to know that the trauma is over, essentially catching up with what the mind already knows. Like the mind knows that the trauma was, you know, maybe seemingly back then, but maybe the nervous system doesn’t know that. Kimberly Snyder (02:14.473)Right. Brittany Piper (02:23.714)and it’s not a rational system. Yeah, it’s a system that operates through experience, through this felt sense. And so what we really try to do is help people in their nervous system to kind of disarm and to recognize you don’t have to be stuck in survival mode anymore. So, yeah. Kimberly Snyder (02:25.516)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (02:43.904)Survival mode is that feeling of almost, when you say that word, it conjures up frantic, irrational, big emotions, freezing, like all sorts of ways that can manifest and not feeling safe. Brittany Piper (02:59.01)Yes, yeah. Yeah, it’s kind of the best way I describe it is like an analogy I like to use is like, we’re armored up, but you can think of like this night suit of armor. It’s like we’re battled up to go or we’re armored up to go into battle. But at some point it’s like our nervous system didn’t get the memo that the battle is over. And so we kind of remain with like this armor on and this armor can start to, know, what once started off as self protective in nature. Kimberly Snyder (03:06.582)Yes. Brittany Piper (03:25.486)it can start to show up in almost the self-destructive or self-sabotaging ways, which I think is such a more compassionate way to look at it as this is self-protection, not self-sabotage. And we can kind of like lose sight of ourselves. We can disconnect from ourselves because we get so lost in this armor. Yeah, and I’m sure you experienced the same. A lot of the people that I work with, they come to me and they’re like, I just feel stuck. Kimberly Snyder (03:43.854)Right. Brittany Piper (03:52.168)And I feel like I’m not myself and I don’t know how to get out of this. And that stuckness is really what it boils down to is a nervous system that is stuck in those active defenses still. Kimberly Snyder (04:03.99)And has it been your experience that no matter what we’ve been through, we can reteach the nervous system through some of the tools that are in your book, which we’ll talk about in a moment and through this more body-based experience, because I’ve met people, and I’m sure you talk about in the book, that have been in therapy, because we’ve been talking, go to therapy, but they’ve been talking about the same story. for years and years. I’ve met people that seem to have the same narrative, victimhood, I wasn’t treated like this, and they almost still sound angry. So it’s like, are we really clearing it out by continuing to reinforce and talk about it? Brittany Piper (04:35.0)Yeah. Brittany Piper (04:39.992)Mm-hmm. Brittany Piper (04:46.54)Yeah, exactly. So I think what I can maybe like describe a little bit is what we call the stress or the threat response cycle. And so when your nervous system goes into an active state of survival, know, fight, flight, shut down, freeze, fawn or functional freeze, what happens is first, your body is kind of inundated or flooded with survival hormones, stress hormones, adrenaline and cortisol. Kimberly Snyder (04:54.231)Yes, please. Kimberly Snyder (05:13.644)Yes. Brittany Piper (05:13.74)and this helps to mobilize you to fight or flee. And so when you have an experience though that overwhelms that stress response, you can kind of think of it like a pressure cooker. All of that adrenaline and cortisol is still stuck within the body and the physiology. And so there’s no amount of talking that out of your body. You have to be able to move through that experience and express or what we call discharge all of that adrenaline and cortisol. So. You you see this, I’ll use an example of maybe abuse or, you know, something that was violent in nature where you weren’t able to fight back. You might find that you now have what we call a thwarted fight response. And so you have likely a lot of suppressed anger that’s being held down within the body and the system. And so the work actually starts with not throwing someone into the deep end of their trauma. Kimberly Snyder (05:50.765)Right. Brittany Piper (06:07.276)like we commonly do in therapy, right? That’s what we’re used to. I just wanna talk about it. I wanna get into it. Instead, we actually walk them into like the shallow end and we’re like, hey, what would it be like to think about a moment recently where you felt a little frustrated, a little angry by something and maybe it’s, yeah, someone cut me off the other day and it kind of like pissed me off. And you’re like, okay, and as you’re thinking about that, what do you notice in your body? Wow, there’s some heat here and I’m actually noticing my jaw is clenching. And so, we touch into more gentle moments of activation, which allows that, again, that pressure cooker, we just gently open the lid for a second and close it back down. And it lets out and discharges some of that adrenaline and cortisol, getting these chronic stress hormones out of the body. And we do that consistently over time. But what’s also great about that is that you’re showing the nervous system or you’re giving it evidence that, hey, you can be with an experience of anger. Kimberly Snyder (06:54.627)Mm. Brittany Piper (07:05.358)maybe like you weren’t able to do in the past and you can be okay. And so it’s this evidence that over time is like, yeah, when I do feel anger in my body, like this frustration of, don’t like the way that person talked to me. Instead of shutting it down like it automatically do, or instead of running away or avoiding conflict, my body now has this muscle memory of like, I can be with that anger and I can express it. so trauma work doesn’t necessarily mean that we have to go back into all the hard stuff. Kimberly Snyder (07:28.078)Well. Brittany Piper (07:35.692)Right? We’re working with the body memory here in the present and untethering that, like, from the past. If that makes sense, Kimberly Snyder (07:42.851)Mm. And it’s, imagine it’s different for each person. noticed in, you know, the heart work awakening, the heart or heart coherence, it’s not linear. Like, you had this much trauma, so it’s going to take this prescribed amount of time to reteach. It could be big awakenings or big realizations. Certain junctures are maybe a little bit more time to work through. that? Yeah. Brittany Piper (07:48.611)Yes. Brittany Piper (08:01.998)Mm-hmm. Brittany Piper (08:05.804)Exactly. Yeah, yeah, because every year you’re working with each individual person, their nervous system, but also the nervous systems that came before them. So like a lot of the work that we do is we work with a lot of, you know, it’s important to know like intergenerationally, what was your life like in your earliest years, because our first three years of life really lay the foundation for our nervous system. Kimberly Snyder (08:23.286)Yes. Brittany Piper (08:30.306)And so that surprises people when they get into somatic work. They’re like, well, I can’t even remember that. And it’s like, your body remembers. And yeah. And then even before that, even when you’re, exactly. Yeah. And even, you know, what were the experiences of your mother and your grandmother? So, and that’s something I, you know, deeply explored in my book with my experience was that journey of intergenerational trauma, you know, cause I’m not. Kimberly Snyder (08:32.535)Thank Kimberly Snyder (08:36.724)so much or even when you were pregnant or when your mother was pregnant with you. Brittany Piper (08:56.578)I’m not sure if people probably come to you with this of like, think I have the signs and symptoms of trauma, but like, I don’t think I’ve experienced anything. And so we explore indirect trauma, which is like, yeah, but I think there’s also like, you know, getting to the, well, trauma might not be what you think it is. I think we have these ideas of, yeah. Kimberly Snyder (09:05.058)Kimberly Snyder (09:15.982)Well, when I read the body keeps the score, it blew me away that statistic, which really stayed in my head from Bessel van der Kolk, that was 75 % of Americans experience some form of trauma. Because I think some of us hear that word and we think about accidents or a one-time incident. one of the things that, because I wouldn’t have used that word in the past, Brittany, but for me, it was learning, not being seen and heard, like different levels of neglect is actually a really big form of trauma throughout childhood, which is something that I did go through. well-intentioned parents that were busy, were hustling, they were working, but there was a lot of coping mechanisms and perfectionism and eating disorders and just constant achieving to sort of fill that unworthiness feeling. So. Brittany Piper (10:02.99)Yeah. Brittany Piper (10:09.027)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (10:09.688)Thank you for bringing up that it is actually much more than we realize. And I love how you delve into Peter Levine’s work. We could touch on that for a moment where he researched animals to see that, you know, they don’t have trauma the same way we do and they’re like naturally shaking and trembling after something happens. Can you share a little bit about, you know, that work and how we can, what we can learn from it as humans? Brittany Piper (10:33.888)Yeah. Yeah. So I first want to touch on what you just mentioned is, you know, in hearing about your experience, it reminds me a little bit. So in the somatic experiencing world, we use the definition of trauma is that it’s anything that feels like too much, too fast, too soon, or not enough. And so like when you talk about neglect or things like that, those are things that often get overlooked. Kimberly Snyder (10:54.156)Mmm. Kimberly Snyder (11:00.993)Yeah. Brittany Piper (11:01.026)You there are such experiences that are overlooked in our culture today. And I think because they kind of fly below the radar, they sometimes can fester, you know, in our lives in much more intense ways. And so, yeah, just thank you for mentioning that. Yeah, Peter’s work was profound for me to the point where I became a somatic experiencing practitioner. So, SE is what I’m professionally trained in, but… Kimberly Snyder (11:10.647)Yes. Brittany Piper (11:28.31)Yeah, his book, Waking the Tiger, he explored how animals in the wild, they experience threat all the time. They go into these survival responses, yet they don’t remain, and I’m using air quotes, traumatized in the way that humans do. And humans, mean, we have the same primal systems, subcortical systems that animals in the wild do. In other words, our nervous systems are nearly identical to nervous systems of animals in the wild. And what he found is that animals in the wild don’t have this wonderful conscious human brain, right? And so they’re often not talking themselves out of their feelings. So animals, when they experience activation and they go into fight or flight and they have that adrenaline and cortisol, they will naturally discharge all of these, know, press hormones. And I remember in my SE training, they’re like, okay, we’re gonna watch some animal videos today. And I’m like, we’re all looking at each other like we’re watching animal videos. Kimberly Snyder (12:18.06)Wait. Brittany Piper (12:27.202)But it was fascinating to see how a gazelle would run from a cheetah, would get away, but it would go into a shutdown or a freeze response and it would faint. And then we watched this video as it would kind of seemingly come back to life and it would lay there and it would do this labored breathing and then it would start trembling and shaking. And then you see the mouth kind of salivating. And then the next thing you know, it’s standing up, shaking its body and it’s running off. Kimberly Snyder (12:55.402)All innately, it’s just in their knowing, their intuitive knowing. Brittany Piper (12:58.56)Exactly. Yes, exactly. And we have those same mechanisms and those same responses. So like, you know, as a professional speaker, I had debilitating stage fright. And for years I was like, I need to go to Toastmasters to figure out how to get over my fear. I need to do like exposure therapy. Like I got to figure this out because I would freeze on stage. Like I’d get dry mouth. I wouldn’t be able to talk. And when I learned that it was less about like calming down and like making the shakes go away, and it was more so like, how can I actually allow some of that to be here and move it through my body? Like our body naturally knows how to metabolize the charge of emotions. If we just stopped getting in our way and overriding what the body knows how to do, or… And I don’t want to say that we always consciously do that. Sometimes it’s done to us and we remain kind of stuck, dissociated, and our body doesn’t know how to contain or move through those emotions. But yeah, the study of animals in the wild is a really big part of the SE framework. Kimberly Snyder (14:10.126)You know, I think about these ancient cultures where there was a lot of tribal dancing and gathering around fires. And I wonder if that was embedded in these earlier cultures. We’ve unfortunately moved away from a lot of that innate knowing. when I was backpacking in Africa, I saw almost, I think it was a funeral gathering and it was, the dancing was like so, intense and it was just beautiful, but dramatic. And it was. Brittany Piper (14:23.084)Yeah, absolutely. Brittany Piper (14:29.613)Hmm. Kimberly Snyder (14:40.11)Like they were moving the grief through their body. I had never seen anything like that in any sort of funeral. And it was amazing. It was somatic as you were describing. Brittany Piper (14:50.51)Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah, even as you’re talking about that, I’m getting goosebumps now because that’s, I feel like in this world that we live in, in kind of a modernized culture, we’ve become so disconnected and associated and detached from our bodies. You know, this fast-paced world that we live in, we’re very mind heavy, which is fine. However, our body in many ways, a lot of the upgraded science shows that our body is really in the driver’s seat. the vagus nerve, which is like the longest nerve in the body. It’s known as the information superhighway. But in the early 2000s, we found that this bidirectional informational nerve, 80 % of those messages go from the body up to the brain and only 20 % go from the brain down to the body. And so, yeah, the body holds so much ancient. Kimberly Snyder (15:40.279)Yes. Brittany Piper (15:45.934)primal wisdom and I feel like we oftentimes we’re scared of our bodies. We don’t know how to connect with our bodies and that’s why like in my book, but also if you were to work with any somatic experiencing practitioner, they give you a vocabulary of sensations to like learn the language of the body and I feel like this is something that I do believe is innately built within us, but it’s become so we’re so disconnected from it that it feels so foreign. Kimberly Snyder (16:00.728)Mmm. Brittany Piper (16:14.351)We kind of forget that we have bodies sometimes and then we… Kimberly Snyder (16:18.11)Yeah, it becomes very heady. It’s the same thing with the heart work. know, so surprised to learn the heart is another brain with 40,000 neurons and it too is sending more messages up because we do get so rational and linear. You know, how we started the conversation trying to think our way rationally, well, I’m not in danger anymore or this is safe, but it’s still in there until we feel. And I want to get into some of those tools you share, but first I just want to acknowledge Britt how vulnerable and Brittany Piper (16:28.91)Mm-hmm. Brittany Piper (16:37.421)Mm-hmm. Kimberly Snyder (16:47.49)beautiful it was that you shared parts of your story as not someone just teaching about this, but someone that’s gone through profound healing and embodies what it can be like to live in far more peace in your body. And you mentioned about your brother’s car accident and also your, you know, the sexual assault, which, know, is, you know, as a woman, could say it’s like the, you know, one of the worst things that we could imagine happening to our sense of safety. Brittany Piper (17:17.016)Mm-hmm. Kimberly Snyder (17:17.462)And to have gone through that and teach about it now is amazing. Brittany Piper (17:22.263)Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, I always say a lot of my work started off as me search. You know, I would say probably most of us in this space, right, where a lot of our work is informed by our own personal experiences. And, you know, I had been in and out of conventional therapy for a lot of my life and on different medications. And it was supportive, but I felt like it would bring temporary relief, but I never found like resolution. And I would get in these cycles of like, Kimberly Snyder (17:27.66)Sure. Brittany Piper (17:52.44)Britney’s drinking again or, Britney’s in jail now or, Britney’s in the hospital. And I just felt like every couple of years I was in this cycle of self-destruction, like just destroying myself from within. And I had an experience, which I share about in the book, when I ended up in a jail cell. And it was in that jail cell over three days that my body was able, I feel like, to process decades old grief and trauma. that I had become such an expert at running from. And I also came from a family where we just put everything under the rug. You just muscle through, you armor through, right? And in my early 20s, I realized that avoiding isn’t the same thing as healing and that eventually you have to do the work. So yeah, coming out of that jail cell, I felt like a literal different person. And I remember the judge, this was shortly after my sexual assault case, she remembered who I was. And she said, we’re gonna drop the charges, but she said, you need to learn to live with your pain better. And that was kind of like a big moment because she didn’t say, get over it, get past it. She said, learn to with, yes, with it. Which was a totally new concept, right? Like that’s not what I, you you muscle through, you move on, you get past it. And that was also a message that was passed down. Kimberly Snyder (19:03.775)with Brittany Piper (19:15.95)through generations in my family, in my lineage. And when I looked at the history of the women in my family, we’re all very much the same, right? We just, keep it pushing, we keep going, we stay busy, we focus on work, we overachieve, we’re perfectionist, kind of like you said. But the masking could only last for so long. And so I got into somatic healing back in 2012, just on my personal. in my own personal journey, because I was like, what happened to me in that jail cell? My body felt different. Something happened. And as I started to learn about the literature and also started experiencing it myself as a client, I was like, how does the world not know about this? And so that’s kind of what started that process for me of just trying to share with anyone that I could, because I was like, this needs to be more widely known. Kimberly Snyder (20:08.589)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (20:12.428)Before we move on from your story, Britt, I also want to acknowledge, and what an amazing judge to have been put in your path. It was like a messenger, right, from the divine to say that. But I also want to acknowledge in our society when these sorts of things happen, how easy it is to pretend, like you said, like to not take someone to trial for rape. I have a friend who was raped in college and her parents were like, no, this is going to be too big a deal, just get over it. And so she never pressed charges. And now, you know, a couple of decades later, I don’t know if she ever fully healed. She has never had any other long-term relationships. And so the bravery it must have took to go on trial for two years. And there was a short trauma from that, but maybe a healing that you actually saw it all the way through. Brittany Piper (21:05.26)Yeah. Yeah, there was. I think justice looks so different for every survivor. My work in the trauma space started. I was working in sexual violence and rape crisis centers here in the States, but mainly abroad. And justice shows up in so many ways. unfortunately, we live in a time where favor is not in the hands of the victim. It’s often most times in the hands of the perpetrator. It’s a systemic issue and one that I still fight to end. Like every day this past week, I was in Pennsylvania. I had three programs talking to college students through different universities in Pennsylvania. And I always ask this question at the beginning of every program, like, will you please quietly stand if you know someone who’s experienced sexual violence? And usually it’s like, I’m just tearing up talking about it. Usually it’s like, I don’t know, 50 to 75 % of the audience will stand, which is like gut wrenching. The second question is then, for those of you standing, will you please stay standing if you know that that person reported it? Half of them sit down. And then the people that are still standing all then ask, if you know that the perpetrator received justice, please stay standing. If they did not, can you quietly sit down? And usually it’s a handful. And I’ll talk to audience of like hundreds, thousands, handful of people. An event I had this past week, there were probably about 250 people standing. <

This Week’s Episode Special Guest: Dr. Nicole Cain About Dr. Nicole Cain Nicole Cain, ND, MA, is a pioneer in integrative approaches for mental and emotional wellness. With a degree in clinical psychology, training in EMDR, and a license as a Naturopathic Physician in the state of Arizona, her approach to mental health is multidisciplinary: medical, psychological, and holistic. A sought after speaker and writer, Dr. Nicole Cain has shared her expertise on the Tamron Hall Show and presented alongside renowned doctors like Deepak Chopra. Her insights have been regularly featured in such publications as Psychology Today, Health Magazine, Huff Post, The Daily Mail, Katie Couric Media, Salon, Spirituality & Health Magazine, and more. Dr. Nicole Cain has been a guest on popular podcasts such as This Genius Life, Brendan Burchard’s Growth Day, Therapy Jeff, Heal Thyself, Well with Arielle, Love Happiness and Success, KPCW’s Cool Science, Just Between Us, and many more. A comprehensive list of media appearances by Dr. Nicole Cain, ND MA. Dr. Nicole is also the founder of the Holistic Wellness Collective, a one-stop-shop membership program designed to support self-healers. This program guides users through the practical application of Panic Proof’s wisdom, offering helpful videos and a supportive community. Guest Resources: Website: drnicolecain.com Book: Panic Proof: The New Holistic Solutions to End Your Anxiety Forever! Social: @drnicolecain   Episode Sponsors: MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription.   FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Hormonal Health and Dr. Erica Schwartz01:52 The Importance of Bioidentical Hormones05:57 Misconceptions and Historical Context of Hormone Therapy09:50 Empowering Women to Understand Their Bodies13:53 Navigating Hormone Therapy: Timing and Longevity17:40 Balancing Hormones for Fertility and Overall Health19:30 Understanding Hormone Supplementation21:46 The Role of Hormones in Aging25:39 Proactive vs. Reactive Hormone Use28:11 Hormones and Disease Prevention30:30 Muscle Health and Aging33:53 The Importance of Supplements and Lifestyle   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Kimberly Snyder (00:00.57)Hi everyone and welcome back to our Monday interview show. I am so excited for our very special guest today, Dr. Nicole Kane. She has this newly published book called Panic Proof, The New Holistic Solution to End Your Anxiety Forever. Very powerful title. Dr. Nicole is a pioneer in integrative approaches for mental and emotional wellness. She holds a degree in clinical psychology and is trained in EMDR. She’s also licensed as a naturopathic physician. So Dr. Nicole, thank you so much first of all for being with us on the show and congratulations on your new book, Dr. Nicole Cain (00:41.314)Thank you so much. I’m really happy to be here and I love talking about emotional well-being more than almost anything else. So we’re gonna have, I think, beautiful conversation. Kimberly Snyder (00:52.436)I know we will, especially after reading your book. And emotional wellbeing is one of our four cornerstones. And it just came about so organically creating these cornerstones, Dr. Nicole. I worked with clients, there was always this focus on food initially, but then it started to become so clear. Our wellness is holistic. And that really was how my journey unfolded into these cornerstones. It’s like, okay, food, then we have our body. And then there’s this emotional piece, which we know affects our hormones, it affects our digestion. So before we go into the book and some of your tools and teachings, can you tell us a little bit about your story? Just a little bit why you were drawn to focus so much on emotional wellness and a little bit about your own journey with anxiety and panic. Dr. Nicole Cain (01:46.688)Yes, yeah, I’m a wounded healer as many of us are. And we were really intentional when creating the title, End Anxiety Forever. Wow, that activates a lot in a lot of us. End anxiety forever. It’s not just manage anxiety or suppress anxiety or how to stay calm all the time, but end anxiety forever. And Kimberly Snyder (01:51.138)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (02:02.938)you Dr. Nicole Cain (02:16.554)It started with a question. I remember asking myself, can I actually heal from anxiety or is this something I’m gonna have for the rest of my life? And it began with a lot of stress in childhood and thank goodness when we’re kids that we are so adaptable. And I grew up in a stressful household and my little self learned how to adapt. I became hypervigilant. Kimberly Snyder (02:24.282)Mmm. Dr. Nicole Cain (02:45.582)I noticed everything that was happening around me. could see changes in the environment. I could see changes in facial expressions. So I was really good at being hyper aware. And I developed all these skills to then try to manage my environment, whether by fawning or cleaning the house for my parents or whatever it was. But those same traits for those who are listening, if you resonate with that, Kimberly Snyder (03:00.13)Right. Dr. Nicole Cain (03:12.342)that yeah, I grew up and I was really hyper aware. I was really attuned. I’m a people pleaser. We always say people pleasers often start out as parent pleasers that those very adaptations that helped us survive could be the seeds that produce feelings of fear or disempowerment or anxiety or panic. Or as you talk about a lack of that coherence in the mind, the body and the spirit. Kimberly Snyder (03:22.499)Right. Dr. Nicole Cain (03:41.864)And so when I would go to the doctor, the doctor was all about management. And the doctor would say, know, Nicole, anxiety is just a part of the human experience. You just have to deal with it. Our ways of dealing with it is you use top-down strategies, try to talk yourself out of it, or we correct the chemical imbalance with antidepressants. And then going into counseling, I realized that there is Kimberly Snyder (04:04.314)Mm-hmm. Dr. Nicole Cain (04:11.63)a limit to how much we could talk ourselves out of things. I don’t know if you’ve ever experienced it, but I sure have where my body may be having an experience and it doesn’t really care what my logical brain has to say. so for those who feel frustrated and they’ve had people say, you know, just calm down, good vibes only think positively. That doesn’t always work, especially Kimberly Snyder (04:25.977)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (04:38.444)Yes. Dr. Nicole Cain (04:39.788)because these adaptations can get stored in non-logical parts of the mind, body, and spirit, non-temporal meaning they could feel like they’re happening inside and outside of time. So as I’m kind of saying that, it sounds like I see you nodding. I feel like you’re kind of resonating with us. Kimberly Snyder (04:57.602)Yes. I mean, first of all, when we define a stressful household or things that happened in our childhood, it wasn’t until I started to read the first book that really sort of woke me up to this was The Body Keeps the Score by Wiesel van der Kolk. And it’s amazing, I think, how much people are talking about trauma now and maladaptive coping mechanisms from childhood. you know, it really doesn’t, it can be Dr. Nicole Cain (05:14.68)Bessel van der Kolk, yeah. Kimberly Snyder (05:27.34)an accident or one particular thing, but it can also be these ways in which our parents made us feel like we had to vie for love or attention. There’s so many ways I think that we develop patterns that can create anxiety. So I think now we realize how widespread this really is. And so that’s why I think it’s really amazing that this conversation is happening between us and also in the collective. And the second thing I wanted to say about this mental idea is yes, we can be logical in our mind, but the body work has been so powerful for me personally and being able to shift out of patterns, including eating disorders and just anxiety myself. And really for me, it’s been going into the heart, the physical heart. Dr. Nicole Cain (05:56.451)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (06:21.336)like focusing on the heart and work with heart coherence and also the energetic heart and taking that pause. And I think it’s powerful to have these other strategies because to your point, I know people that have been in talk therapy for many years and they seem to be still trapped in that victim mindset or just the same story. So I think it’s great that this is becoming something that so many people are talking about. Dr. Nicole Cain (06:44.055)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (06:50.714)And I’m also interested, you know, because we’re talking about anxiety in your subtitle, but then panic in your title. So it’s almost like you’re using them synonymously or how would you actually define the difference? Because now a lot of us can say, you know, I feel anxious or I have anxiety, but then panic and panic attacks almost seems to be a separate thing. Dr. Nicole Cain (06:57.005)Yeah. Dr. Nicole Cain (07:11.192)Yes, that’s a really wise question. And when we’re talking about ending anxiety, what does that actually mean? And what does that look like? And how does panic fit into all of this? And if we look at the conventional medical model, they use a book called the DSM, the Diagnostic Statistical Manual, we’re on number five at this point, it’s a big purple book. And they categorize anxiety into agoraphobia, which would be anxiety in public places like bus stops or baseball games. You know, when we’re outside amongst lots of people, they may say, it’s generalized anxiety, or they may say you have panic attacks or panic disorder. And so they look at those separately. But if we were to put on our researcher hat and go into downtown LA, or New York or any city and ask Kimberly Snyder (07:46.927)Yeah. Dr. Nicole Cain (08:07.114)everybody, what does it feel like when you get a little bit stressed, overwhelmed, or activated? They’ll give you a whole list of symptoms that can affect them from head to toe. And if we reorganize and recategorize all of those symptoms, which I did, is we can put them into approximately nine categories, and I call those the nine types of anxiety. Kimberly Snyder (08:28.43)Why? Dr. Nicole Cain (08:31.272)And then now that we know all the different types of ways people can experience arousal and activation, then we look at how it can occur on a continuum. Because we see from the research that it isn’t distinct separate, now I’m anxious, now I’m not anxious, now I’m panicking, that it’s an ever-growing process. And if we can learn how to hear the body when it whispers, we’ll be able to Kimberly Snyder (08:42.468)Mm. Dr. Nicole Cain (09:00.384)understand its language, listen to it, and then meet the needs that it’s telling us it has before it has to accelerate and amplify into a shout, which would be mild annoyance, mild overwhelm, all the way up into panic, rage, crisis. Kimberly Snyder (09:16.938)Okay, so even annoyance is a type of, I’m getting thrown off, like this is a type of anxiety all the way to the extreme panic. Dr. Nicole Cain (09:26.57)And exactly, I teach it like stoplight strategies. So green light is when you’re feeling really good. You’re in the flow, you have good coherence, you’re creative, it’s that alpha state centered. And then as you get a little bit like more maybe happening more stimuli, maybe from the screen, or maybe your head’s just facing forward and you’re reading a book, but the body is like, I’m getting a little stressed, like it’s a deer in headlight position in that Kimberly Snyder (09:37.248)Yes, sector. Dr. Nicole Cain (09:56.248)feedback loop gets activated. And then there’s a moment, I call that the pay attention zone, where, ooh, I’m not feeling calm and creative and relaxed anymore. I’m feeling a little activated. And if that activation is paired with a sense of a lack of personal power or agency, then that’s fear, that’s anxiety. And so then as that mounts, maybe you started with a little butterfly in your chest. Kimberly Snyder (10:08.633)Mm-hmm. Kimberly Snyder (10:19.704)Hmm. Dr. Nicole Cain (10:25.43)Or maybe your worry brain started going a little faster. And if that continues to amplify more and more and more, we’ll get into the yellow zone, which is moderate activation. And if it goes from there and goes into the red light zone, that’s crisis. weak, like a panic attack. Yes. And we can actually stop, reliably stop panic attacks from happening. Kimberly Snyder (10:43.258)Like a panic attack. Dr. Nicole Cain (10:54.924)And we can often teach people how to reprogram the mind, the body, and the other complementary systems so that anxiety is more data and it’s no longer anxiety. It’s just data like, I’m feeling a little tension in my chest. What could that be about? I’ve got this. I’m not afraid. I’m listening. And so suddenly the whole conversation changes. Kimberly Snyder (11:08.334)Okay. Kimberly Snyder (11:20.138)let’s use a real example so we can break that down because then it starts to feel like we’re still talking and I think what you’re referencing is more of this somatic experience. So two of my family members, Dr. Nicole, have very intense plane phobia. One of them is my grandmother and one time she tried to get back on the plane and she caused such a fuss they actually had to stop the plane. Dr. Nicole Cain (11:32.056)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (11:47.512)It hadn’t taken off yet, but you when you’re going down the runway and go back and let her off, like super intense. So if someone has, and we have a friend who’s really, really anxious about getting in elevators, right? These are like very tangible examples. Even if he’s in New York, he will walk up 20 flights of stairs. So someone starts to feel, and what David described to me is this claustrophobia. Dr. Nicole Cain (11:52.163)Yeah. Dr. Nicole Cain (12:01.528)Yeah. Yes. Dr. Nicole Cain (12:06.766)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (12:14.136)I don’t know where did it get created, maybe something else from their childhood. But if someone’s feeling that feeling on the extreme end of your scale, I imagine, what are some of the very things we do? Because you’ve been sitting on the plane, you can tell yourself, hey, there’s not a threat, but your body is registering a pretty big threat at that time. Dr. Nicole Cain (12:25.4)Yeah. Dr. Nicole Cain (12:37.25)love how in sync we are with this Kimberly. I was thinking about a tangible example of flying because I used to have a horrible fear of flying. I was on a plane and we’re coming into Phoenix and there’s a lot of mountain air like hot air rising from the mountains. We hit a pocket of air in the plane like did this really quick kind of side tip and everyone around me had a very big emotional reaction which set my nervous system into like, Kimberly Snyder (12:42.701)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (12:47.682)Bye. Kimberly Snyder (13:05.57)Dr. Nicole Cain (13:06.434)we’re gonna die. So I PTSD for over a decade flying, but I travel all the time. So I just had to keep getting on these flights and I just cry in the fetal position the whole time. And so I love the example of the flying and the way that it’s different for me. And then we could kind of unpack this a little bit more. Kimberly Snyder (13:09.305)Yeah Kimberly Snyder (13:17.124)Wow. Dr. Nicole Cain (13:26.744)But the way that it’s different for me now is I actually just flew into Michigan two days ago and we followed this huge storm front. There were tornadoes in Michigan. It was like this giant storm front that went through like the entire north part of the US all the way across. And so I’m getting alerts like tornadoes, severe weather, and I’m getting on a plane and I’m in recovery from really horrible fear of flying. So my body remembered that a little bit. So I’m on the plane and I notice that the skin of my hand is starting to feel a little hot. And that’s my pay attention is oftentimes it will start with like a little bit my body is heating up. And then if I don’t address it and back in the day it would then turn into burning, which would then turn into electric zaps running through my teeth and claustrophobia and like, Kimberly Snyder (14:05.274)Mmm. Kimberly Snyder (14:20.354)Hmm. Yes. Like I’m s- Dr. Nicole Cain (14:23.362)chewing on ice, trapped in there, right? And so there’s a couple of things if we unpack what happens in that moment for those who are like, my gosh, I’m here, happens to me in the highway, Kane’s talking about a plane, it’s the same biological process. So in that moment, there’s something, a memory or an activating event, an adaptation. that in that moment when the plane starts bumping or whatever it is, that the amygdala, that emotional processing part of the brain decides that we’re in danger for whatever reason. And we could totally unpack whatever those root causes are. And we do that in the book. But we’ll walk through kind of the biology of it first. And so the amygdala is like, we might be in danger. We’re getting alerts and there’s storms. what if this? What if that? And so that sends an automatic cascade down to the body, which will result in cortisol, stress hormone being produced, adrenaline being produced. And so we experience this autonomic arousal, this kind of fight, flight, freeze, flop, fawn, or fracture response. And what will happen then as a result of all those chemicals is the logical brain gets down-regulated. So that top down, when you go to the therapist and they’re like, just think logically, you know that the plane loves to fly, can go through hurricanes, it’s fine, it’s all safe, you’re just feeling nervous. That part of your brain isn’t accessible. So like your grandmother, when she gets really frightened on the flight, she doesn’t have access to this logical part of herself because the body is like, we’re not analyzing the tiger. We don’t care about your wellbeing. We care about your safety. So we’re just gonna run away. Kimberly Snyder (16:08.729)Right. Dr. Nicole Cain (16:16.824)but she’s stuck on a plane, right? So I have a four step process for how to reprogram this. And so that when I was on the flight yesterday after practicing these four steps, I noticed my skin getting a little hot and I didn’t have the fear or the anxiety paired with it. And that’s the key difference is how can we feel the information from the body with compassion and curiosity Kimberly Snyder (16:41.113)Mm. Dr. Nicole Cain (16:45.814)and then respond to that. So what I knew is that my amygdala was getting a little louder. And instead of almost jumping in the stream and being carried downstream is I was like, I need to activate my logical brain. so using before things become red light zone, once we’re in that little pay attention zone, we still have the opportunity to activate logical brain. and logical brain can shut down that fear cascade. So I was on the plane, I noticed a little heat, I was like, thank you, body. And then I started doing some of these techniques and I had a great flight and I didn’t cry and I didn’t have a panic attack and it was wonderful. So there’s the beginning and we can totally unpack that more. Kimberly Snyder (17:17.306)Mm. Kimberly Snyder (17:31.992)Mm-hmm. Kimberly Snyder (17:36.802)Yeah, I really have that personal experience of the thoughts spinning. I think a lot of us start to feel like, you know, there’s nowhere to go. I can’t get off. We’re up in the air. I’m trapped in here. And it can start to feel so terrifying to even be in your body. So yeah, that whole brain. so, you know, for me, with this body work, Dr. Nicole, it has been so much. Dr. Nicole Cain (17:42.478)Yeah. Dr. Nicole Cain (17:55.053)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (18:03.236)coming to this other brain, right? Because the heart is a brain too with 40,000 neurons. And all this research helped me with, first of the spiritual, but then Dr. Roland McCready, who’s with HeartMath, is that we can change our perceptions in this other way of dropping in, because then there’s actually more messages from the heart up to the brain. So it’s like these tools, which I’m really interested in learning about all the heart work and other ones, where it’s not just relying. on the brain. And then of course, as we get regulated, then it does start to bring in that common sense thinking again, and not the circular thinking and, you know, going around and around. I noticed it this weekend, Dr. Nicole, because I was at a very crowded chess tournament. My older son plays chess, and I don’t like crowds, like you were saying back to your spectrum. It’s not that I don’t, I do a lot of speaking or, you I’ll be on stage, but then there’s kind of like, it’s like organized. There’s a book signing afterwards or whatever, but I’ve never liked music festivals where I’m sort of in the throes of everyone moving around. And that’s what this chess tournament was, like the jostling of all the parents and the kids. and I did notice that activation. And then I dropped in and soothed myself where I think in the past, and if we don’t have these tools, it’s easy to just spend. Dr. Nicole Cain (19:10.327)Mm. Dr. Nicole Cain (19:16.91)Mm. Kimberly Snyder (19:23.474)And then like you said, the cortisol, the hormones can get out of whack. So what’s an actual physical practice? You know, I talk a lot about the heart coherence work that you have, that you talk about in your book. As you mentioned, a bottom-up approach, not just talk therapy, but how we can regulate the nervous system in our bodies when we notice we’re activated. Dr. Nicole Cain (19:38.872)Yeah. Yeah. Dr. Nicole Cain (19:46.648)I want to begin by honoring you for noticing that and allowing yourself. Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (19:50.106)It’s like in time, Because we learn, as you said, to listen to our bodies again. Dr. Nicole Cain (19:55.572)Yeah, yeah, you could have just popped a Xanax and suppressed it and or you could have been like, what is an herb like theanine or kava kava. And so I want to honor you for doing the harder work that takes the time to listen to notice to honor, and then to soothe. So I honor that. And so in that moment, it sounds like what you were describing is a little bit of yellow light. So you’re a little bit more activated. It wasn’t at that moment where it was still like, ooh, I’m noticing I can still cognitively manage this. It sounds like your body was getting a little bit more yellow light. So in that yellow light zone, we want to do exactly what you said. We want to use bottom up because that logical brain, it’s not going to change the body. We just start with the body. And so I’d love to actually just to make it Kimberly Snyder (20:37.315)Yeah. Dr. Nicole Cain (20:53.748)organized for people who may be newer to this conversation is go through it one step at a time, each of the four steps of what that bottom up might look like. Would that be okay? Super. step one is any time that we notice that we’re activated, we want to go to the body. And the best way I found to go to the body is with sound, touch, taste, temperature, breath. Kimberly Snyder (21:00.9)Okay. Air. Dr. Nicole Cain (21:21.142)And you mentioned that you went to the heart, you went to the breath. Our breath is always with us. Our breath is free and it can be very powerful. And just like for those who’ve seen heart math, you can actually watch how the breath can change your heart coherence. You can watch out, can change the way that your nervous system is responding in real time. And so for those who need the proof, who need to see it, heart math is good for that. I also have a hack for how you can do that. Kimberly Snyder (21:21.274)Mm. Dr. Nicole Cain (21:51.104)if you don’t have an aura ring, if you don’t have a biofeedback device, and it’s by feeling our very own pulse. May I show you? Kimberly Snyder (21:59.404)Yes. And when I say heart math, we did a research study with heart math and you’re not that you ever have to, you know, do an H, you don’t have to have any sort of HRV device. Although HR, you know, heart math does have their wave pro equipment. it’s more about, you know, tuning in to how your heart, starts to calm your thoughts, but you don’t have to have, just to be clear, I don’t mean you need any sort of numerical feedback device, cause I don’t use one myself. Dr. Nicole Cain (22:08.6)Yeah, yeah. Dr. Nicole Cain (22:15.406)Mm. Dr. Nicole Cain (22:27.988)my gosh, it’s so brilliant. I actually, when I was learning about all this, I loved heart math because I needed to see it. I was like, don’t tell me to breathe. I don’t feel any differe

This Week’s Episode Special Guest: Oliver Niño Summary: In this enlightening conversation, Oliver Nino, a New York Times bestselling author and energy healer, shares his insights on the importance of energy in self-healing and personal growth. He discusses his journey from skepticism to becoming a healer, emphasizing that everyone has the potential to tap into their own healing abilities. The conversation explores the significance of setting intentions, the role of love in healing, and practical nighttime practices to manage energy effectively. Oliver also highlights the importance of relationships in the healing process and how love can facilitate deeper healing. The discussion concludes with practical tips for energy cleansing and the transformative power of intention in finding love and purpose. About Oliver Niño Oliver Niño is a New York Times best-selling author, entrepreneur, energy healer, and spiritual activation expert and the creator of Geo Love Healing, an online company designed to help individuals master their energy and unblock themselves. His latest book is called Spiritual Activator: 5 Steps to Clearing, Unblocking, and Protecting Your Energy to Attract More Love, Joy, and Purpose. Guest Resources: Website: dothisbeforebed.com Book: Book Do This Before Bed: Simple 5-Minute Practices That Will Change Your Life     Episode Sponsors: LMNT OFFER: Right now, for my listeners LMNT is offering a free sample pack with any LMNT drink mix purchase at DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD. That’s 8 single serving packets FREE with any LMNT any LMNT drink mix purchase. This deal is only available through my link so. Also try the new LMNT Sparkling — a bold, 16-ounce can of sparkling electrolyte water. USE LINK: DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD   FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Energy Healing and Oliver Nino 02:00 The Importance of Energy in Self-Healing 05:59 Personal Journey into Energy Work 09:53 Becoming Your Own Healer 11:51 The Role of Relationships in Healing 18:08 Setting Intentions for Transformation 21:58 The Power of Love in Healing 30:02 Mastering Nighttime Practices for Energy Management 36:04 Practical Tips for Energy Cleansing and Self-Care 39:58 Finding Love Through Healing and Intention   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:00.876)Hi everyone, welcome back to our Monday show. I am so excited for our very special guest here with me today, Oliver Nino, who is a New York Times bestselling author, an entrepreneur, energy healer, spiritual activation expert, and creator of Geo Love Healing, an online company designed to help individuals master their energy and unblock themselves. Such a powerful word, unblock. His new Oliver Nino (00:25.071)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:29.868)His latest book is called Spiritual Activator, Five Steps to Clearing, Unblocking and Protecting Your Energy to Attract More Love, Joy and Purpose. And his other book, which I also want to talk about today, Do This Before Bed, Simple Five Minute Practices That Will Change Your Life. Oliver, thank you so much for being here with us today. Oliver Nino (00:50.028)Kimberly, thank you so much. I’ve been so excited for this. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:53.07)I’m so excited. I love your background, by the way. If you guys are listening to this, please hop on our YouTube channel to see this very cosmic, expansive background behind Oliver. just matches energy wise, what you’re talking about in your books. just, you feel this openness, right? Oliver Nino (01:13.61)Yeah, mean, honestly, like to me, I wanted something that’s like, what can I have in the background that’s kind of like gets people’s energy kind of like in a good place. So we, know, chalk in our tech folk or the tech folk behind there. They’re the ones that are making sure everyone’s like visual experience is also amazing, right? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:30.808)So I love, know, even talking about energy just feels so expansive. And some people may say like, energy healing, what’s that? So I love how in your books you go right into, hey, everything’s energy, right? And we’ve been, we’ve heard so much about quantum physics now and just how this limited Newtonian view of separation has been so outdated for so long and this interconnectivity. In my last book, all it was about the heart and heart coherence and how all these fields intersect. So can you first tell us a little bit about, you know, energy in general, how energy, mean, such a big question, but just, you know, just top line, why it’s so fundamental that we’re working with energy when we’re talking about self healing, unblocking, expansion, attraction, and also a little bit about how you came into this work in the first place. Oliver Nino (02:21.142)Mm. Oliver Nino (02:25.28)Yeah. Yeah. to me, the way I look at energy, it’s almost like it’s, it’s oxygen, it’s sunlight, right? Whether people believe in it or not, it’s something that affects us. And to me, I think the unique thing about my background is like, I didn’t start out with, with energy. Actually, I started out as an entrepreneur, very successful in different ventures, you know, and, and, and throughout the process, you know, wanting to better myself, wanting to heal, wanting to have abundance in all areas of life. felt like. You know, I felt like there was more to life than what I was experiencing, but I couldn’t experience what, you know, what that was. And I didn’t know why it wasn’t for lack of trying out. I tried a lot of different modalities, but you know, some work, some work for the moment, but nothing really got me to where I wanted to go. And that was my first focus is I just wanted a better life. I just wanted to heal from pain, heal from trauma. You know, I just wanted, you know, to like release resentment and anger. wanted to feel good in my body. wanted to, you know, have. better finances and then better relationships and the whole thing. And what I realized is energy is the one thing that affects us all that nobody talks about. Because to me, funny enough, like you mentioned, you’re in California, my first awakening was, gosh, was 20 years ago, I had a energy healing from a healer in Tabanga Canyon. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:51.405)Hmm Oliver Nino (03:52.29)For the very first time, I was very, very skeptical. cause I, and that was before, like right before the secret came out, before energy was even a thing. And I was very skeptical, but I was open-minded. I was like, I’m going to try it once. If you come highly. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:02.744)with absence or hands-on healing. Oliver Nino (04:05.57)Um, I went to see him, this person, he was visiting from Australia and he didn’t touch me. He was like, he was close. He had crystals and doing all those different things, but he didn’t, he, he wasn’t hands on like a massage, like a body worker. It was just waving a lot of crystals, making a lot of sounds. And I thought I was like, gosh, one is, is this a, is this a cult? And what, kind of stuff did I sign up for? My mind was very, very negative the entire time. And, and I was skeptical. didn’t see anything. I didn’t feel anything. I was very, very irritated. And at of the healing, I remember he said, you know what? I released a lot of abundance blocks that you had in your heart. And these abundance blocks were passed on to you generationally. Your dad had it, his dad had it. And that was what was stopping you. And for me, went to one ear, came out the other. I was like, okay, sure. Now I’ve got abundance blocks. Great. you know, not only did I get a healing, I got his Australian fortune cookie too. Tell him you my fortune, right? so I left there and he goes like, before I left, he was like, the next four to five weeks, you’re going to have a windfall of abundance. And I’m like, okay, you know, walked out, didn’t think anything of it. You know, four to five weeks later, you know, I, opportunity came and I ended up making more in one day than in an entire year. Right. And I was like, what is this energy thing? What’s going on? What, how can it do this? How can it do something that is so impossible in my mind and do it even if I’m Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:20.216)Mmm. Oliver Nino (05:31.458)skeptical, right? So to me, that’s my first introduction to it. That’s that got me down the rabbit hole of like, if this is what one session can do, then what do I not know about energy? What else can it do? How else can it change my life? And that started my passion and earlier on obsession and passion, for, energy work. But to me, energy is the thing that affects us all. Like if you think about it, even if you don’t believe in energy, you can all relate to, if you go into a mall, right. And next thing you know, there’s a little bit. too many people around you or someone’s anxious, we tend to feel it. Like not only in energetic system, sometimes some people is like the nervous system feels it and our body reacts, right? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:09.154)I feel it very much. I’m like, yes, I understand. Oliver Nino (06:11.97)Yeah. And to me, it’s almost, it’s the same thing. I hear people all the time, but I don’t believe in energy. then they, don’t know what it is, but then they’re the type of people where, someone’s, you know, you feel like someone’s staring at you and you look and they are staring at you. can feel it. Like they’re looking at you. Or for me, it’s like those crazy things to where you’re thinking of somebody you haven’t thought of them for a while. Next thing you know, they call, they text, you bump into them and you’re like, what’s going on? Cause to us, there’s this invisible field that connects us all. And that’s energy. And to me, I think it’s one of the things that’s always been there since the beginning of time. And the more we become aware of it, I think the better we’re able to navigate life itself, you know? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:49.238)Absolutely. I also love that this was your first experience was going to someone and you were skeptical and then you had this incredible experience and now you’re working with energy all the time and doing healings and having all these events and teaching people and teaching teachers. So do you believe Oliver, we all have this potential to tune in or do you think in this lifetime, some maybe more, depending on what we believe with reincarnation like Oliver Nino (06:57.12)Yep. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:18.964)know, able to tune in more and be, I’ll use the word healers. Oliver Nino (07:24.704)Yeah. Yeah. It was, it was interesting because like, most healers that you see out there, like, you know, they’re, I’m, I’m, I’m a little bit different in a way to, I’m mostly left brain. I’m mostly analytical. I’m mostly in business. I’m mostly ground. I, kind of figured out all the other stuff before I jumped into it. and what I realized is I met so many people, and maybe because I’m a little bit more biased. but everyone that I’ve met in my experience in the last, in the last 20 years, are people that. are gifted. The question is, will they step into their gift in this lifetime is another question. Because I’ve met people that are, you know, their lives have spiraled and they’re in a dark place. And when people are around them, they’re like, they feel like they get drained of energy. And when I’m around that person, I’m like, person has a gift, right? But are they willing to explore? Are they willing to heal? Are they willing to step into it is another question. So to me, I’ve come from the belief based on what I’ve seen. And what I’ve, you what I’ve, what I’ve known is that everybody has it within them. Right. And at certain times, you know, whether it’s a heartbreak, like, you know, you know, you get a diagnosis, like you can do an accident, midlife crisis, like, something happens in your life where we reevaluate and we’re like, you know, things have to be better. And we tap into what we have within the light within sometimes things have to happen for us to tap into it. And sometimes we just seek it out because we feel like life’s Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:46.775)Yes. Oliver Nino (08:50.9)not as fulfilling as it can be, right? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:53.174)Yes. And also, you know, back to your story, for many of us listening, we’re like, that sounds great. I can just go to a guy and he can wave crystals over me and I get all this money. It sounds amazing. But in your books, you also talk about, you know, working with our own self-conscious, subconscious work we have to do, doing the affirmations, doing practices before bed. So there is, you know, free will involved. It’s not that we want to show up at You know the healers and keep going or Oliver Nino (09:24.778)Yeah. I mean, I, I tell people I’m a big believer because this is what I did. To me, I’m glad and thankful that there are people out there that, you know, shine their light and did healing back then. And I was able to experience, but I’m, I’ve been in the very beginning. I was a little bit more of a control freak in a way to like, that’s great. But what if I need healing every week or every other week or every other day? Cause life happens. I don’t want to, you know, be at the mercy of somebody doing a healing. Right. And cause I wanted to. have the skills. that’s that led me that opened my eyes, show me what was possible. you know, shortly after that, I went deep dive into how can I become my own healer? How can and what I realized is we all have the ability to affect our energetic fields, you know, and, and really cause our bodies, our minds, our emotions and to go into a self healing state to where it rectifies things and we, you know, we feel better, think better, you know, and and experience good things as a result of it. So to me, I am a big believer that yes, the beginning, yeah, you can have people show you the way, you can have crystals, you can have things that are training wheels, but ultimately I believe that we all have it within and we are our own healers. And that’s a journey that I wish a lot of people took up more. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:44.59)You know, it’s unfolding all the time, right Oliver? I’ll give you an example. When I met my husband and it was this like incredible love and then we got together and there was this closeness and then this trauma came up that wasn’t, I wasn’t aware of in my prior relationships and I hadn’t loved in the same way. And then in front of all this old stuff, was like unfolding and then that comes up, old patterns, right? And then, you know, it’s that awareness and working with that energy. And I wouldn’t have worked with that energy, you know, 10 years ago. So it’s like, we just keep evolving, I think, as humans. And like you said, modalities and tools to keep supporting ourselves. It’s such an important part of self care. Oliver Nino (11:24.866)Yeah, it’s super important because to me, I feel like we’re never done growing. mean, yeah. Can you get to a place to where you’ve got everything that you want in life? And I have people that I’ve helped that you would look at their lives and you’re like, they have everything they want in life. What else could they possibly have? And to me, a lot of times when you have it all and then you’re supported and when you have that bandwidth is at times when the next layer of healing shows up because you’re strong enough to handle it. Because in the past, you’re not You know, if you haven’t, you don’t have the resources, whether it’s the environment or internal, right. then you’re the toughest stuff won’t, won’t come up to heal because it’s not ready to be healed. The environment’s not there to heal it, or it’s not relevant to be healed. But to me, a lot of my biggest growth happened, you know, happens in relationships, right? It, it, makes us feel safe enough at times to be like, I can now process this stuff. And then when we process it, life gets better, right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:09.005)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:18.126)So when you’re working with energy, Oliver, and I’m getting goosebumps now, is it something you’re just feeling or are you seeing colors or is there any visual component or is it more, is it just a different type of sense? Oliver Nino (12:25.729)Mm. Oliver Nino (12:33.938)It’s different because like, so I teach people how to do it as well. And it’s very, very different for everybody. I, I, I look at it as people have different ways they process energy. I’m more of a feeler. So when I’m working with somebody, I can try to imagine stuff, but to me, I feel the heat. I feel where the block is. feel, you know, where the resistance, I feel where trauma is stuck. I might have another healer, you know, that I’ve trained and they don’t feel stuff when they’re doing that. They can see it. They can see it vividly. They can see it clearly. I might have other people like when they’re doing. You know, when they’re running their hands over, you know, they get the information, like it’s just coming to them what it is. Not even, not even seeing, not even feeling it’s snowing. Right. So to me, the way I look at it is we’re all different. some people see, some people feel, some people know, some people smell, some people hear. And we, but just because that’s where you start, doesn’t mean that’s all available to you. To me, that’s, those are like the ones that are awake right now. And as you explore more can actually open up for you. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:31.158)And can you turn it on and off? Or you just start looking at the grocery store and you’re like, this person in line ahead of me is like some big drop. Oliver Nino (13:33.899)Yo. Mm, mm. Well, to me, honestly, like, I feel like we are all born with it on. If you look at kids, they’re very, you know, in tune, very sensitive, very in tune, very just knowledgeable. And they, they, they’re high vibrational and through life, we actually turn it off. We actually dim our lights to, fit in so that we’re not judged or maybe as a kid, we feel too much and it’s no one gave us a tool. So we shut it off. So we’re not feeling too much. Right. Or at times I’ve seen it to where. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:44.045)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:06.253)Yeah. Oliver Nino (14:08.789)You you might, you might get rejected or ridiculed for it or your parents or someone’s afraid of it. So you turn it off just to fit in. So there’s a lot of reasons why we turn it. We try to turn it off, but to me, it’s, it’s, it’s running underneath the surface. It always, it’s always there and it’s going to visit us later, later in life to remind us that we have it. But yeah, to me at the very beginning, it’s tough. went to when, when I was the very beginning of my journey. I would go to grocery stores and I would feel everyone’s energy. would, you know, and I would, I would be affected by it. And I want to protect myself. Right. And the longer I’ve done this, I realized that that was one way of doing it. And at different levels, like, you know, your, your, your vibration becomes your protection. So when you, when you work on yourself in a lot, you’re in a high vibration, you walk into that store. And in the past, if people are negative, they’re affecting you. But when you’re in a high vibration, it kind of flips. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:53.602)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:04.824)Yes. Oliver Nino (15:04.916)You’re affecting people positively because energy goes both ways. If they can drag you down, you can lift them up. So to me, what I’ve realized long-term is working on your vibration, your energy puts you high to where that becomes your best protection. Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:18.872)my gosh, it’s so funny, Oliver, when I used to teach yoga, when I first got back from backpacking, I would go in the bathroom before I would teach and I would do these Reiki protection symbols over myself. And then I realized over time, like you’re saying, like when I feel really strong in my energy, I’m not scared to be around people or touch them. I may notice, like you said, like, this person feels a little bit, you know. Oliver Nino (15:42.562)Yeah. And it kind of becomes more empowering because at the very beginning, think, you know, a lot of people go through it for like, they, they take on energy and they’re like, Ooh, people can affect me. But then I’ve seen people, I’m like, how is it that there are people that walk into the room and they just lift the whole room up with their energy? And that fascinated me. mean, the first experience that I’ve had was, um, have you heard of, um, The hugging saints. So I know we, got, I got exposed to her in 2005 and I was just, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:05.302)Yes, on the hug. Oliver Nino (16:12.662)baffled to where like, know, in LA, when she landed, I would feel the energy shift and I was, you know, 30, 40 minutes away from the hotel. would feel the energy of the city shift and I would walk into the hotel room, you know, and see people and they were crying before they even saw her because her energy field was so healing. She has done a lot of work that anyone that’s in that field, they experienced the shifts. So to me, That was one of my first, examples of like, wow, there are people that can actually impact other people by just their presence without even talking to them. Right. So I kind of started seeing two parts of the picture or more than one of just like, wow, they can affect me negatively. was like, Hmm. People can also affect you positively. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:01.198)So back to your practical work and your books. And there’s a part in the book, and it’s in the beginning where you talk about to manifest, to create what we want. There’s also this, I’m paraphrasing here, this detoxing, healing that’s also so important because we’re saying we want something, but our underlying subconscious beliefs are blocking us. And then it’s not really working. Oliver Nino (17:27.413)Yes. Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:30.51)How would we even get started? What are some of really preliminary ways in which you would tell people, Is the unblocking first? Is the expanding? Is there a practice that does both? Oliver Nino (17:41.189)Right. so it’s a good example. Like some people that are like, you know, they might be like, I want to find love, like, you know, I want to find love and I want to just someone to love me and I want them to be healthy and I want them to be a happy relationship. Right. And then maybe one of their, their beliefs, conscious or unconscious is like, everyone’s going to hurt me. They can see me, they can hurt me. Right. Or it could even be like, I want to make more money. But then one of their beliefs that I heard from their parents is like, money’s a root of all evil or you’re lonely at top. Right. So To me, there’s these conflicting things. And a lot of the times, you you’d be surprised when somebody just sets an intention of like, you know, I don’t know what’s blocking me, right? But I want to release them. Anything that’s blocking me, anything that’s blocking me from more love of abundance, I’m ready to release them. When people set an intention, to me, it’s like the power of prayer. Like, and I’ve seen a lot of stories, you know, of it to where people… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:21.23)Mm. Oliver Nino (18:37.346)pray and they have strong intentions and then somebody has spontaneous healing or this miracle happens and they didn’t do any energy work other than prayer and intention, which to me is a form of energy work. When you’re sending an intention and a prayer, it’s not your illogical mind asking, it’s your soul making the request at the highest level. to me, it gets processed at higher levels. to me, You know, if you, if you want to change at times, you can just start with the intention of like, I don’t know what the next steps are, but I am open. And when things show up, I’ll take action on it. And you’d be surprised with how many people that that step alone starts this ripple effect of, of transformation and change, right? It doesn’t have to be, you know, you got to do this and this and this and that. I mean, that can come up, but to me, it all starts with the intention and decision that, you know, what I want to, I want my life to be better and I’m open for it to be better. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:29.518)Well, and it sounds so genuine the way you’re putting it, right? It’s sort of like I’m down on my knees. I know something’s not working. I really want my life to shift. It feels so heartfelt. Oliver Nino (19:39.217)It’s heartfelt. It’s surrender. It is surrender. is us being like, you know, I’m not going to use my mind to figure it out. I surrender it to a higher power or whatever people believe in. I’m just getting out of the way to let, you know, to be led. And to me, it’s one of the most powerful things I’ve seen cross culture, cross country, cross time is like power of intention and prayer. I mean, of course there’s a lot of other things people can do, but to me, that’s probably one of the most underrated things because it’s so simple. You know, we think we think we got to do 10 steps, but in reality, like my wife, the same thing to me, you know, when I met her, she was the master of intention and prayer, right? She, you know, in her life, she leaned on that a lot and it moved mountains for her. and to me, it’s one of the things to where people think, it’s step number one to me. can be, like, yeah, it’s that number one, but it can also be the only set that you do. I’ve seen people’s lives change. just that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:32.522)And do you think, like, you know, we’re talking about heartfelt, like, it’s kind of like superseding the mind, we’re going into the soul, that it’s not necessary for some, maybe for some it can be important, but to kind of delve into all the trauma and like understand or try to understand mentally all the things that happened. And I’m not saying bypass, but if you surrender and say, well, I know there’s all these blocks and I want to change my energy. Can you go that way? Oliver Nino (20:58.314)Yeah. I mean, to me,

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Dr. Erika Schwartz About Dr. Erika Schwartz In this engaging conversation, Kimberly Snyder interviews Dr. Caroline Leaf, a renowned neuroscientist and author, about her latest book, ‘Help in a Hurry.’ They explore the profound distinction between the mind and the brain, emphasizing the importance of understanding the non-conscious mind and its role in managing thoughts and emotions. Dr. Leaf shares practical tools for self-regulation, particularly in moments of stress and regret, and discusses the impact of our thoughts on our physical health. The conversation highlights the power of self-awareness and the ability to create positive energy in the world. Guest Resources: Website: https://drerika.com/ Podcast: Redefining Medicine podcast Book: Don’t Let Your Doctor Kill You: How to Beat Physician Arrogance, Corporate Greed and a Broken System   Episode Sponsors: MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription.   FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Hormonal Health and Dr. Erica Schwartz01:52 The Importance of Bioidentical Hormones05:57 Misconceptions and Historical Context of Hormone Therapy09:50 Empowering Women to Understand Their Bodies13:53 Navigating Hormone Therapy: Timing and Longevity17:40 Balancing Hormones for Fertility and Overall Health19:30 Understanding Hormone Supplementation21:46 The Role of Hormones in Aging25:39 Proactive vs. Reactive Hormone Use28:11 Hormones and Disease Prevention30:30 Muscle Health and Aging33:53 The Importance of Supplements and Lifestyle   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:02.595)Hi everyone and welcome back for our Monday show. We have a very special guest here with us today. I’m so excited to chat with Dr. Erica Schwartz, who is a bestselling author. She’s the founder of Evolved Science, a world renowned medical practice based in New York City, built on the recognition that bioidentical hormones are the foundation for better health. She has eight books out. She’s been featured in the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, Daily Mail, Vogue. Town and Country, the New York Post, and regularly on many television shows. goes on and on. Dr. Erica, thank you so much for being here with us today and sharing some of your wisdom. Dr Erika (00:44.782)Kimberly, thank you for having me. It’s such a pleasure. kidding? I think you have accomplished just as much, if not more, than I have. So I think that’s pretty impressive. You’re impressive. And I’m really honored to be on your show. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:55.631)your energy is so beautiful, Dr. Erica. I can feel your heart. I can feel your authentic, really wanting to support, especially women. I feel like, you now, Dr. Erica, there’s so much discussion around hormones. When I think about my mom’s generation and my grandmother, especially in different parts of the world, you my mom’s side is from the Philippines. I feel like we didn’t talk about hormones that much. And now all of a sudden it’s sort of like everywhere. You’ve been talking about this for, wow, yeah. Dr Erika (01:30.798)30 years. So yes, it’s, you know what I say, I am thrilled to have lived long enough to see it happen. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:39.822)Yes. Dr Erika (01:39.886)because 30 years ago when I started working with hormones, people thought I had lost my mind. And I was like, no, all this data is wrong. Everything that they’re coming up with is wrong. And it was really rough. now it turns out that I have patients who’ve been with me for more than 30 years, that I’ve been taking hormones more than 30 years. And it turns out that it was the right thing. And it’s just… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:56.877)Wow. Dr Erika (02:04.82)unfair for these poor women who still suffering because the information is still missing. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:11.661)Yes. Well, let me ask you, Dr. Erica, let’s talk about some of this information because I know you’re a proponent of lifestyle as well and healthy food and exercise and all these aspects, which I want to talk about. But since, you know, the bioidentical hormones, is this something that we should pursue only when we start to feel adverse symptoms? Is it possible for many women to not feel those symptoms, to sort of glide through perimenopause and menopause? Dr Erika (02:21.07)Thank you. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:39.339)Or is it something that’s more your opinion proactive? Dr Erika (02:44.6)Kimberly, that’s such a great question. So this is the thing. I think that everybody should be on hormones. I think that when you go on hormones, depends on your own individual needs. I think that because there’s such confusing and mixed messaging coming around, but there’s more and more realistic stuff coming through. I think it depends on, you know, there are a lot of women who don’t even know that there are such things as symptoms around menopause. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:50.244)Mmm. Dr Erika (03:13.262)They don’t even know that that exists. So if you start having symptoms, by all means you should be on hormones. You should see a doctor or a provider, nurse practitioner, SPAs, they know how to provide services because they know how to take the bloods. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:13.646)Right. Dr Erika (03:32.438)evaluate you, you want to find somebody who cares about you, individual, the person, and who actually knows what they’re talking about. Because recently, there’s like a total on, you know, onslaught of Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:36.845)Yes. Dr Erika (03:49.464)hormone experts. And the truth is they’re not because they haven’t known about it long enough to know what do. You know, I teach at the American College of Anti-Aging Medicine, A4M, and we train a lot of doctors and a lot of providers. But the thing is, there’s still many, many more who need help. And in the conventional medical system, the medical education is completely zero on it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:54.945)Wait! Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:11.097)Right? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:19.001)Wait. Dr Erika (04:19.408)no education, the North American Menopause Society, the menopause practitioners, they really are very, far behind. And I’ll give you an example that when this whole thing started in 2002 with that study that really put us behind the eight ball, was the, they sent out, and this is the American College of Obstetrics and Gynecology in North America Menopause Society, where all women turned to, and I’m a conventional doctor, trained doctor and what they did is they sent out this like a pamphlet telling women that what you should tell your patients since you couldn’t give them hormones anymore was that they should wear layers they should stay in dark rooms Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:50.093)Yes. Dr Erika (05:12.078)It was so offensive to me because I was working with hormones already. I couldn’t believe it. But you have to think that this is where they’re coming from. And that was only in 2003. So you’re talking about 23 years, 22 years ago. So there’s a long way to go to get the information out to everybody and get the right information out. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:34.848)That study you’re referring to, doctor, was linking hormones to cancer, correct? Dr Erika (05:41.482)It was a study that did not use bioidentical hormones. They used a synthetic form of hormones that came from Franklin Horse’s urine. And that study said that came out stopped early because supposedly there was an increased incidence of breast cancer. in the study and strokes and, you know, strokes and blood clots. The truth is that the study was wrong. The women that were studied in the study were women that were older. They were more than 10 years after menopause. They were, a lot of them had pre-existing conditions, meaning like there were smokers, they had all kinds of other medical problems. So, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:19.567)Huh. Dr Erika (06:30.05)the study was just wrong. The fact that it was wrong, it just was wrong. And then what happened is that the principal investigators did take back the information, but unfortunately the media never covered that. So doctors never knew about it. The women never knew about it. And it took until in the past four or five years, 10 years maybe that Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:31.695)It was spewed. Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:45.827)Hmm. Dr Erika (06:58.344)Women are now talking about menopause, peri-menopause, they’re talking about hormones, and the information is very clear. And you know, the surgeon general and the FDA right now, they’re taking off the black box warning off of estrogens because there was no connection between taking estrogen and breast cancer and taking estrogen and getting ovarian cancer or whatever. It was just crazy. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:00.45)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:22.829)Great. Dr Erika (07:26.816)The truth behind it is that it was all about money and it was about Big Pharma having paid for the study that was supposedly the government sponsored study, but it wasn’t. It was Big Pharma paid for it. And Big Pharma paid for the hormones that they were using in the study. And then they thought that it was going to be the eternal, you know, the fountain of use, but it turns out that it wasn’t. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:36.047)Mmm. Dr Erika (07:54.198)It wasn’t even right because it was the wrong population. So anyway, make our long story short, they got scared because the last thing they wanted was for the public to know that it was the government had taken money from big pharma to conduct a study that wasn’t right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:14.937)So Big Pharma didn’t want women to know about bioidentical hormones so they could potentially sell other medications or aids for women to deal with the symptoms. Is that sort of the gist? Dr Erika (08:26.784)Right. So, yeah, that’s the gist because essentially, and this is the funny thing, know, women get antidepressants when they’re perimenopause. I mean, women take more antidepressants than anything else. And you think about it, are we missing antidepressants in our system? Well, I don’t think so. I bet you don’t think so. We don’t have antidepressants there. There are a lot of ways to get rid of the depression and Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:54.671)Great. Dr Erika (08:55.342)lifestyle being the number one that you talk about so eloquently and so correctly and Diet exercise stress management everything you talk about and talking about for 30 years So I agree with you a hundred percent and then hormones you missing hormones when the hormones start going out of whack Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:06.018)Yes. Dr Erika (09:17.878)That’s what you need to do is balance the hormones, not give women antidepressants and basically take them out of the workforce, take them out of society, make them basically unnecessary. It’s terrible. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:23.18)Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:33.325)Let’s get a little specific, Dr. Erica, when you say hormones, you mentioned estrogen. Are we also talking about progesterone, testosterone? Dr Erika (09:42.306)Thyroid, adrenal, yes. We’re talking. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:44.495)So there’s a whole mix that you would have to meet with a doctor such as yourself to see what’s right for your body. Dr Erika (09:50.124)Well, I think it would be best to do that. People become their own doctors. you know, sometimes that’s not so bad, because I think that in the conventional world, we’re not helping our patients. You know, I have this book coming out, re-released actually, September 2nd, it’s called Don’t Let Your Doctor Kill You. And it’s the truth. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:57.465)right Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:07.524)Hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:15.915)What a great title. Dr Erika (10:17.886)Thanks. But you know, it’s coming back out and we’ve expanded. The first time it came out was like 10 years ago. And then we added COVID and AI and a lot of pieces to it and more stories. And the thing is that in the conventional world, you really don’t get the help you need. And women, and I think that one of the most important messages is you live in your own body. I don’t live in your body. The doctor doesn’t live in your body. So listen to your body, learn to listen. And once you listen to your body, then you can actually follow advice or not. It’s your decision. And in the conventional world, unfortunately, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:36.239)Mmm. Dr Erika (11:02.892)That decision is based on fear because it’s about intimidating the woman, scaring her into, my God, I might have cancer that I’m missing so I can have a million tests. But at the end of the day, nobody stops to see what’s going on inside. How could I improve my life because I live in here? So that’s kind of the goal. My goal is to eliminate fear. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:19.748)Wait. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:29.944)Yes. Dr Erika (11:30.08)and to empower women to learn as much as possible about themselves. And yes, you’re right. You do need a prescription for estrogen. You might not necessarily need a prescription for progesterone. You do need a prescription for testosterone, for thyroid, adrenal. You may not need a prescription because they’re supplements. But the thing is you want to work with someone who cares about you. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:52.587)Yeah, it’s just even hearing you say all these things, Dr. Erica, it just, I don’t know, for me, and I haven’t gone into this yet, it just feels like someone being their own doctor when hormones are so specific, that feels scary, like you’re just kind of prescribing to yourself. So let me ask you some specific, yes. Dr Erika (12:01.801)Yeah. Dr Erika (12:11.192)Well, can’t. You can’t prescribe for yourself. But if you understand how your body’s functioning, you’ll start living inside your body, right? That’s what you teach, is live inside your body. Be present, understand. Don’t react to the outside, react to the inside. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:24.749)Yes, be present. Dr Erika (12:32.593)then you can get right help because then you can, you’ll go to a doctor, let’s say, or some kind of provider and they say stuff that doesn’t make sense. You’re not going to be intimidated. You’re not going to be afraid. You’re not going to make a mistake of like, okay, I’m going to follow it. You’re going to say, well, that doesn’t make sense. Let me run. Go somewhere else. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:55.631)So Dr. Schwartz, I’m gonna ask you a three-part question. And if you forget one of them, don’t worry, we’ll go back. as you’re… Oh, sorry, sorry. I’m so sorry. Dr. Erica. Dr Erika (13:01.736)This is not much work, it’s my god. I’m just kidding. I just have people to call me like the shorts as much as I don’t like it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:10.959)Might sound so formal, right? We’re sisters here. Yes, yes. So three parts. Number one, which is a fear women have once you start taking the hormones, do you have to be on them for the rest of your life? So we’ll talk about timing a little bit, because I read something recently, you have to start before 60. Number two, the symptoms. Dr Erika (13:14.154)Yes, we are. We’re all one. We’re all one. That’s it. Dr Erika (13:21.463)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:37.453)that we keep referring to, if we could elaborate a little bit more about when we know something’s off. And number three, I’d love to know not just about alleviating symptoms, but potential further benefits, whether that’s protecting our bone health. Like you talked about mental health, physical health. So if we could go into those three more specific things, Erica, I’d love to hear. First one, do we have to be on hormones forever? Dr Erika (13:53.774)Great job. Dr Erika (14:00.302)Okay. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:06.593)timing wise, like some people may experience symptoms in perimenopause. Some people, I think my mother went through menopause in her mid-50s. Dr Erika (14:16.862)Yeah, that’s because you’re half Filipino. The Filipinos go into menopause later in general. But let’s answer. So first of all, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:20.184)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:25.752)Okay. Dr Erika (14:29.684)Yeah, you should stay on hormones forever because you want to stay young and healthy, right? It’s not about chronologic age. It’s about physiologic age. I’m 75. I don’t think my body looks or feels or I feel the same I felt when I was 40 only maybe 35 only I work a lot harder at it. You know what I mean? What I do Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:32.345)Got it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:42.702)Wow. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:54.721)Adrienne, it’s amazing. I mean, you look like you’re in your 40s. Dr Erika (14:58.674)I love you. you know what? They have that new app that my one of my grandchildren had and about what your age is, right? And you put it up and it said 48. It’s funny that you said that. That was the sweet. No, but I have to tell you. So yeah, if you stay on hormones, your chances of staying healthy and staying well. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:06.349)yeah, yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:10.18)Wow. Dr Erika (15:20.982)are much higher. So why would I ever stop hormones? I started at 46 and I can promise you, I will die with my taking hormones because look at how I feel, look at what happens. But it’s not just the hormones. We’ll talk about that. So anyway, so the other part of it is you don’t have to stay on hormones or anything forever. You could do whatever you want. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:36.856)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:52.152)Yeah. Dr Erika (15:55.146)And I mean, most of my patients are now 30. You start having symptoms of hormone imbalances as a teenager. When you get acne, when you first take the period, you get PMS, those are hormone imbalances. And they’re all very easily treated with very low dose progesterone, very low dose. And it’s really easy. So if you have somebody like my first book, The Hormone Solution, that… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:03.801)Right. Dr Erika (16:20.662)That’s what I wrote in it and that came out in 1999. think about, no, maybe 2002. So it’s so obvious that it’s a continuum, right? I mean, why don’t we address the fact that it’s a continuum and it’s okay. Yeah, go for it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:36.889)But Dr. Schwarz, now you’re talking about that young, what about worries with fertility if you start taking progesterone or messing with hormones, let’s say before you have your kids? Dr Erika (16:51.128)Kimberly, you’re not messing with them, I promise you, because what I’m gonna teach you is how to support your system. You know, when you’re messing with them is when you’re taking birth control pills. And when you take birth control pills, it suppresses everything and you’re creating a menopausal hormone levels, which is not okay, right? So when you’re taking progesterone, by the way, that’ll help with fertility. As a matter of fact, if you do IVF or something like that, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:02.539)Yes, which… Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:10.797)Yes. Dr Erika (17:20.172)they will give you additional progesterone. And most women who get pregnant that are under like really good medical care will take supplemental progesterone for up to 20 weeks of the pregnancy. So progesterone will never harm any future pregnancies. that’s… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:34.424)Really? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:38.979)Well, my doctors who were very, I just say conventional, never prescribed for my pregnancies. I never took any of that. Dr Erika (17:45.39)I think we should move you away from that. Yeah, I’m sure, but you know what? Maybe we should move away from that, because that didn’t work out well. It worked out well for you, but it doesn’t work out. I have patients right now, I have three patients who are in their 30s and they’re all three pregnant. And we have them all three couldn’t get pregnant, they were gonna do IVF. They wound up not doing IVF because we balanced their hormones. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:55.63)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:13.411)Wow. Dr Erika (18:13.632)And one of the things they got was progesterone. The other one was thyroid. The other one was DHE. But there are a lot of things you could do to help women get pregnant by balancing their hormones. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:18.142)yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:25.807)That’s amazing, doctor, and that gives people a lot of hope. Is there any downside to taking progesterone, let’s say that young, you start in your 30s for the next 60 years? Dr Erika (18:28.846)the end Dr Erika (18:34.094)No, no, no, you know what, but you take it when you need it. You take it like when you’re in need. Yeah, or you take it just like for PMS, you take it for four or five days before your period. That’s the only time you need it. So it’s not gonna stay in your system. It leaves your system. It goes away, goodbye, it doesn’t exist. So it just supports, it makes your system better. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:39.859)you cycle it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:46.703)Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:54.927)Wow. Dr Erika (18:59.106)You know what I mean? So that’s one thing. The other thing is, remember, when you think birth control pills, you’re putting women into menopause. So all this stuff. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:07.297)Yeah, I never did it, doctor. It always felt, for me, not the right choice. Dr Erika (19:12.396)Right. No, I agree with you. Me too. I agree. But women will take it because what other options do you have? I mean, I tell everybody to put an IUD and, without hormones. But the thing is, it’s really hard. And think about it. We, you need something. You don’t want to get pregnant anytime, really. So think about that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:35.819)There’s always good old, you know, we call pull and pray. Dr Erika (19:39.19)Yeah, pull and pray. The rhythm method, yes. There’s a lot of praying going on there. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:47.543)Not so exacting, yeah. Dr Erika (19:49.836)No, right. all right, so we’re still on number one. Okay, so number one was, can you take it forever? You should take it forever. If you don’t wanna take it, you could stop any time, and that’s what you were saying, right? You could stop any time. Nothing will happen because… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:53.358)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:00.109)Wow. Dr Erika (20:12.64)It goes out of your system within a few days. So within a few days, you go back to what your baseline is. So if you have symptoms, they’ll come back. If you don’t have symptoms, they won’t come back. The thing is that I have a lot of patients that I’ve encouraged over the years when they said, I don’t think I need it anymore. I don’t think this, you know, cause once you feel good, everybody thinks, I don’t need anything. So I will say stop taking them. And then within a month, a week, three weeks, three months, they’ll be back and they’ll say, okay, well, you know, what do you think? Now, to go to number three. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:50.533)wait, hold on, before we move on from number one, Dr. Erica, this is so interesting. Can I ask you one more detailed question? So sometimes you hear this, and I know it’s different sorts of compounds and hormones, know, with melatonin, for instance, what you take, you don’t make. So there’s, know, people are taking so much melatonin and then they get off it and then it sort of messes up their sleep. And I know it’s different for men. My husband was on testosterone. Dr Erika (20:56.128)You can ask me as many as you want. Dr Erika (21:07.982)Thank you. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:18.103)and then he tried to get off it, he got off it so we could get pregnant and then his levels went down because he was on it so long. So he had to get back on it. So what about this idea that, yeah, when your body gets used to not making something when you’re taking it. Dr Erika (21:34.786)But I’m not suggesting that we’re overriding the system. So melatonin, I’m not a big fan of, especially as you get older. Whereas the problem with melatonin is that we’ve been giving the dosing that you could get, that you buy from whatever stor

This Week’s Episode Special Guest: Dr. Caroline Leaf About Dr. Caroline Leaf In this engaging conversation, Kimberly Snyder interviews Dr. Caroline Leaf, a renowned neuroscientist and author, about her latest book, ‘Help in a Hurry.’ They explore the profound distinction between the mind and the brain, emphasizing the importance of understanding the non-conscious mind and its role in managing thoughts and emotions. Dr. Leaf shares practical tools for self-regulation, particularly in moments of stress and regret, and discusses the impact of our thoughts on our physical health. The conversation highlights the power of self-awareness and the ability to create positive energy in the world.   Guest Resources: Website: drleaf.com   New Book: Help in a Hurry: Simple Tips for Finding Peace When You’re Overwhelmed, Anxious, or Stressed   Social Media: @drcaolineleaf   Episode Sponsors: MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription.   GLOWING GREENS POWDER OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order.   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Dr. Caroline Lee and Her Work 02:53 The Mind vs. The Brain: Understanding the Distinction 06:00 The Non-Conscious Mind: Tapping into True Self 08:48 The Role of Thoughts in Shaping Reality 12:05 The Tree Analogy: Visualizing Mind and Brain Connections 15:00 Managing Emotions and Patterns for Mental Strength 18:00 Practical Tools for Overcoming Emotional Challenges 20:47 Conclusion: Integrating Techniques for Mind Management 23:05 The Power of 63 Seconds 24:58 Self-Regulation Techniques for Emotional Control 27:46 Understanding and Managing Regret 30:08 Practical Tools for Emotional Clarity 32:50 Breathing Techniques for Stress Relief 35:38 The Camera Technique for Perspective 38:41 Harnessing Personal Power for Positive Change 44:57 Introduction to Intimacy and Sexuality Coaching 46:42 The Power of Partnership in Coaching 49:05 Dismantling Masks and Embracing Vulnerability 52:49 Body Image and Sexual Confidence 55:45 Cultivating Erotic Energy and Self-Expression 58:29 The Connection Between Sexual Energy and Overall Wellness 01:01:08 Healing from Shame and Cultural Beliefs 01:04:30 Daily Practices for Sexual Energy and Connection 01:07:32 Navigating Pornography and Intimacy in Relationships 01:08:00 Exploring Intimacy Through Pornography 01:09:03 The Connection Between Vulnerability and Sexuality 01:12:47 Overcoming Blocks to Sexual Energy 01:16:52 The Evolution of Sexual Desires Over Time 01:20:14 Understanding Trauma and Fantasy in Sexuality 01:24:40 Empowerment Through Self-Connection and Healing   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Kimberly Snyder (00:00.75)Hi everyone, welcome back to our Monday interview show. I am so excited to have back on our show, sitting right next to me, the amazing, brilliant, beautiful Dr. Caroline Lee, who I love so much. I love you so She’s one of my favorite authors, one of my favorite people, a dear friend of mine. She also happens to be a researcher, communication pathologist, audiologist, am I saying that right? Yes, you are. Author of how many books now? 19. 19, 24 languages. my gosh. I’m getting goosebumps. I have read so many of Dr. Carolyn’s books, but when I read this new one, which is out now, by the time we’re listening to this, help in a hurry, simple tips for finding peace when you’re overwhelmed, anxious or stressed. I said, Carolyn, this is your best book. thank you. That’s really a lot coming from you. Thank you. Well, I it was a lot of love and emotion. I felt like it was written. in connection with what’s so needed now. And I love how you make it simple, but really practical and really powerful and based as a researcher. What I love about you is you’re full of heart and that’s a very rare combination. Thank you. think, you know, often what I feel, I’m a clinical research neuroscientist as well. And my field is psychoneurobiology and that’s really heavy science. Right. But that’s where I find my spirituality. And people often ask, you know, are they die quite? They almost sound like a dichotomy, but they’re not because they’re two sides of the same coin. the more when you see science and you see how incredible things work, how the mind changes the brain and the field that you cannot know that there’s more than just this physical time, this little bit of time that being on physical bodies and that soul is just so much bigger than unconscious mind is just so much bigger. There’s just so much more. And it’s so important that we know how to manage our mind because it’s such a responsibility. You know, one of the things that you talk about in this book that really stood out to me is how you really make the distinction that the mind is not the physical brain. Yes, that is that is so important. Because a lot of people say it’s synonymously. Well, that’s the thing. And that’s been a 40 year journey. So basically in the 80s, the mind and the brain were still spoken about separately. So up until about the 80s, it was mind and brain. But they didn’t believe that the brain could change. I’ve been in this field 40 years now. I’m 61. Kimberly Snyder (02:27.382)So I’m old now. Don’t feel old. Yeah, you’re ageless. As Yogananda says, your energy and your vitality and just your skin, like everything just shows how this, you know, biological age or, know, chronologically is not our reality. I agree with you. We can. And we know epigenetics. I mean, there’s so much that’s influenced by, you know, your living this work. It’s coming through your heart. managing your mind, which controls so much stress. And here you are. Thank you. It’s well, I’ve had some of the research you’ve done works on telomeres and yes, the telomere research up until quite recently said that you can’t change telomeres over shorter than a five year time period. And generally with exercise and, and diet and that kind of thing. And so I saw Lisa Apple, is Elizabeth Blackburn and Lisa Apple I’ve interviewed, they, the leaders in telomere research and they started talking about maybe my meditation may change telomeres and so on. So I well, let me do a clinical trial, add a component in where we teach mind management. let’s see, because mind management, the whole system that I’ve developed around mind management includes meditation and preparing the brain and all those kinds of things and preparing the neurophysiology. And then it goes further into mind management techniques. And we show that you can change your telomeres in nine weeks, which is wow, and it’s significantly and your telomeres are the things that respond to your mind, your mind does everything. And they basically telomeres are, are needed for other ends of chromosomes. And that’s what we need to make cells. And we make 800,000 to a million new cells every second. And those, the ability to make those cells is based on telomeres, but the ability, the thing that makes the telomeres work are our thoughts. the energy from our thoughts, So we are not managing our mind and our thoughts are chaotic. We send chaotic energy through to the telomeres and this is science. This is not anything weird. is pure science. Science and spirituality are the same thing. Yeah, I love this. They’re the same thing. And that energy from our thoughts is going to influence how the telomeres function and how the telomeres function determines how your cells are formed, which is how your organs are formed and your systems and therefore physically how we function. And that’s why Kimberly Snyder (04:44.194)mind is not the brain. mean, the brain is simply a host. We need to think in a particular model here. The is simply a host and our body is a host to something much bigger. And that is the word that is, I use the word mind because it’s been used for thousands of words by so many ancient spiritual wisdom. And in current day science, we use mind. incorrectly, it tends to be used, and not all scientists, but it tends to be used synonymously with the brain. But the brain is not the mind. The brain is a physical organ. It weighs around about three and half pounds. And it is when you die, your brain just disintegrates. When your heart stops within 10 seconds, your brain flatlines. And all the energy then reverses. the minute that your heart stops, there’s no energy flowing through the physical anymore. And that energy is your mind. So when we Physically when our body dies physically our energy moves out and what is that energy? That’s your mind So your mind drives your psychology So it’s your your intelligence your ability to love your personality your preferences how you see life how you have this conversation your choices that is mind and then the brain is the host that Hosted so it’s simply a host It responds to the brain. I mean, sorry, it responds to the mind. So the brain responds to the mind. makes sense. it’s only one percent. The brain and body are one percent. The mind is infinite energy. And when we’re on this earth in this physical body, our mind can’t even encapsulate all of our brain can’t even encapsulate all of the mind because the mind is too big. So we have a big portion called the non conscious mind. You in not unconscious, unconscious is when you’re asleep or in anesthesia. Or yoga would call the true self. The non-conscious would be the true self. The non-conscious is the true self. So the unconscious is a sleep state. the non, that would be your true self. The non-conscious is your deepest spiritual wisdom. where every experience you have all day long is absorbed and every memory that you’ve ever had, that’s where it is. And that’s the part of you that drives you. It’s an energy force that is connected to the source of energy, whatever you believe that is. Kimberly Snyder (07:00.832)everyone, God, whether it’s God, the source, the universe, whatever you believe, we, there’s more than just us, but us, the true Kimberly, the true Caroline is in the non-conscious. And in the non-conscious, it’s infinite beyond space and time, so fast that it’s faster than 400 billion actions per second, way faster than the speed of light. And it basically generates electromagnetic fields. the heart field, the heart field, So their heart field is coming from the non-conscious. The non-conscious puts that into the heart. And the heart is basically generating from the non-conscious, generating the true self. You know, it’s so amazing about this, work and the science and what we talked about with my last book on your podcast. Yes, your beautiful book. Is how, you know, this managing the mind that you give such practical tips about is so important because if we’re in reactivity, If we’re in our old memories all the time and just reacting in patterns, it keeps us from being that true self. keeps us from living with love and kindness and compassion because we’re sort of in survival, you know, just these states. We are, we are. And I can, and I can describe that. can give you the simple science explanation. That’s okay. bouncing off what you’ve just said now of your first question, the difference between mind and the brain. So they talk about the mind for a moment and then they this question. So the mind, then we’ve got the non-conscious level and then you’ve got the conscious level and in between you’ve got the subconscious. So it’s non-conscious, subconscious and conscious. Conscious is tiny. It’s messy. It’s chaotic. It’s where we make our decisions. It’s very powerful because it’s where we make our decisions. We can choose to do the work of change. We can choose to love. We can choose to hate. We can choose to… our non conscious has no no hatred, pure love, and it’s pure wisdom. And everything we need is inside the non conscious. Yes. And that we’ve got to learn to tap into it. Now the subconscious is like a waiting room. So what the non conscious does a true self is going through all of our experiences, which become memories inside thoughts. So every experience is broken down into memories and encapsulated into a thought. And that’s what’s in the non conscious, all these thoughts, which are all our experiences that we’ve had. Plus, Kimberly Snyder (09:19.448)from whatever your belief system or everything about you, which could be include all kinds of things that pass. Every thought is stored somewhere. Every single thought that you have, every experience becomes a thought. Every thought is stored in the non conscious and the non conscious then basically process it’s received by the conscious mind. So the experience is received by the conscious mind and the non conscious mind at the same time. But the conscious mind is very limited. can only, for example, the conscious mind can only handle one. conversation at a time. The non conscious can handle an infinite number of conversations. So when as we sitting here, we having one conversation, that’s what the conscious mind is dealing with. But the non conscious or non conscious is absorbing everything else, the energy, the everything in this room, all the things that you’re going through, the things that I’m going through, the connection, but all the things that are unseen, right, which is most things unseen by the physical. Exactly. And Dr. Kailin, this is like again, with the third eye. It’s like the vision opens up perception. Exactly. That’s exactly. So that’s what the non-conscious, that third eye, that wisdom, that spiritual part of us, that is on our side. And it looks through at the patterns that we’ve chosen to make with our conscious mind into habits, the way we’ve chosen a thought pathway and we haven’t dealt with something. And they get strengthened. And it gets strengthened and it goes into the non-conscious, but the non-conscious sees it as like a wound. So then it tries to, it basically grabs that and puts it into the subconscious. And then the subconscious, because it’s much slower than the non-conscious, it’s at some interim level. the non-conscious subconscious then sends messages to the conscious mind via our emotions, how we feel in our body, which they are coming from the, the heart generates signals, our behaviors, our perceptions, that to grab our attention. And when we pay attention to those signals, then we can start tuning back into the wisdom of the non conscious mind. And then it influences eventually the consciously how we’re behaving, we’re behaving, loving, loving. Exactly. So if we, if we exactly, so if we learn to listen to those signals and we learn to listen to the messages of the non conscious mind, which identifies these disrupt the most disruptive thought in the moment in our lives in order and puts them into the subconscious is around about the subconscious can hold about Kimberly Snyder (11:40.75)four to seven of these disruptive thoughts. Also what’s good thoughts in that you, that’s non-conscious minds want you to think about because gratitude and joy and those great experience because those increase your resilience. So that subconscious is holding those and then the subconscious as I said, send signals to get your attention. Now what we need to do as humans is we need to listen to those signals so that we grow the good thoughts because it increases our resilience and helps us to get stronger in our base, which is our non-conscious. And then we function at a high level and it wants us to break down, deconstruct and reconstruct the toxic thoughts. If we don’t, if they go into and we ignore the signal or we hear the signal, but we just stay in that same pattern, it goes back stronger into the non-conscious than before. And then we feel worse because now it’s this boil in the non-conscious. It’s not right. It’s not right. It’s this kind of thing. Oh yeah. love that. The tree is awesome. If you guys are listening to this, please check out the YouTube as well. to see these amazing tools that Dr. Caroline has brought, which really bring the work to life. I love analogies, I love physical. So tell us about the tree. So basically, as I said, the brain is 1%. The brain and body are 1%. The mind is 99%. So the 99 % brain, which has these three levels, conscious, subconscious, non-conscious, is energy. It’s electromagnetic and gravitational fields and quantum energy and whatever. When we do something like an EKG of your heart or an ECG when you do QEEG in the brain, when you have a sonogram when you’re pregnant, if you have MRI, all of those machines, that technology is just measuring the mind. So the mind is the thing that not only is your psychology, your ability to love, feel, intelligence, personality, preferences, it’s also the thing that runs your heart and your brain. So it runs your physiology. So it does two things, the mind, it runs your physiology. which is your body and it runs your brain, which is your body and it runs your psychology. It’s you. And so what we’re supposed to do is we are supposed to listen to the non-conscious, but we can ignore the messages of the non-conscious via the subconscious because the non-conscious puts the messages, the four to seven top priorities into the subconscious. And if we ignore them, then we’re going to get worse. We’re not going to get stronger. to, so before I explain these to you, you had your one question was we get stuck in these patterns. Kimberly Snyder (14:03.662)So when you say stronger, mean mentally stronger, like physically stronger and mentally stronger. they get, and I’m going to explain that whole route exactly. I’m going to give you a really strong visual leading to this visual, but you asked a question earlier on. want to make sure that I answer that and link it all into this. You mentioned about how we can get stuck in those patterns. Notice how we both did this with our fingers. That’s so accurate because the conscious mind is kind of up here and the non-conscious mind is. everywhere. subconscious, the non-conscious mind is, mean, the non-conscious mind is massive. It’s, it’s, it’s this field all around us. It’s the crown chakra, like everyone. It’s almost like a big, we’ve got a biofield and it’s connected to the universe. The conscious mind is a tiny little part of it and the conscious mind is only awake when you’re awake. The subconscious is this bridge in between. So conscious mind can handle one conversation, subconscious can handle about four to seven conversations. When I say conversation, it’s in really common, it’s a thought. and then non conscious infinite. Okay. So that’s all energy. And then that energy of the three minds then uses the brain and the body so that we can be in life, that we can talk to each other, that we can eat and live and be physical. So what the mind does, the non conscious mind working with the conscious mind is it takes an experience or conversation now. And that’s a whole bunch of energy. And it grabs the details of the energy and builds it into like a little thought pattern that looks like a cloud. So imagine around me or around you, those that are listening, that there’s a circle of energy around you. If you stretch your arms out, this is kind of the circle all around you. That’s your mind and it’s around and through you, even in your toes and in your fingers, the mind is all of it. And so that mind and that’s composed of the three different levels. Okay. The conscious being small and awake when you’re awake, the unconscious, infinite subconscious in between. So this conversation comes in as words, those words cluster together to form thoughts. Those thoughts are like clouds. So imagine all these clouds around me. Those are all my experiences that are happening currently. And then what the mind does is it takes the thought that first the information comes in, it builds the cloud, and then it makes a photocopy, copies, and it puts it into the brain. And then the brain as an energy force. Kimberly Snyder (16:21.29)little cluster of energy force. So it’s a copy. So it’s still in the mind. There’s still the cloud floating around, but a copy of it’s put into the brain. And that causes a reaction in the brain, a chemical, neurochemical, genetic, and a tree is formed, a tree like network. So we talk about net, sorry, we talk about networks. Yes. So this is a protein network. So our words now are clouds in the mind. and copies are being made at 400 million actions per second into a tree in the brain. there’s infinite trees in your brain, infinite trees in your brain, because you’re going to infinite trees in your mind. And so there’s, and there’s, so the brain just hosts and it just creates these networks. So this is as a tree has roots, lots of roots, and it has lots of branches. So our conversation, we’re saying lots of words, like each little branches, like a word or a phrase or a concept. So as we keep adding more and more and more, By end of our conversation, we’ll have maybe two or three thousand words that we’ve spoken or concepts we’ve spoken. They’re all going to build into this tree. But what we say is the root. What we say and the listeners and viewers, are taking that into what our words become the root and the branches of their interpretation of what we’re saying, because their mind filters what we’re saying to their unique tree. So everyone listening is building. So this is what it looks like inside the brain. So the cloud in the mind and then it’s net copy into the brain and it’s connected. Then then the mind then makes copies of this and puts it in every cell of the body as a tiny little hedge. So take this and squish it up into a little hedge and inside the inside every cell and you have 37 to 100 trillion cells in our brain and between our brain and our body. And there’s a copy in the brain. It looks like a tree in the body. It looks like a little hedge. So every thought, every single, well, Dr. Kiran, it’s crazy. also one of the things that I’ve always felt intuitively, and we talked about here before is really managing what you’re taking in. Like, our uvata says digestion is the senses, right? So who you’re following on social media, the news you’re watching, everything is affecting these trees. It all goes into that minefield. Right. And it’s all forming clouds. and that’s the conscious mind is not very good at filtering. Kimberly Snyder (18:29.186)That’s why the conscious mind needs the non-conscious and the conscious mind is like a toddler. You’ve got young children. Imagine if you just didn’t watch your children. They’ve hurt themselves. They would burn themselves. They would get up to all kinds of things. That’s what our conscious mind does. So when we get stuck, our conscious mind doesn’t listen to the subconscious or the non-conscious. It’s just doing its thing. just So it’s taking the social media. It’s taking the toxic thoughts. It’s taking the experiences. It’s taking the arguments. It’s taking the politics. It’s taking whatever. And those clouds are not beautiful clouds. They’re ugly stormy rain clouds. And it’s making those ugly stormy. So instead of this, it’s building this. Right. And then those are the hedges in the body. And now that’s counter to our mind, brain, body connection because we want it for love. So we have a worldwide web between the clouds of our mind, the trees of our brain and the hedges in our souls. It’s a network. So every experience is in the mind, brain and entire body. So it’s not your brain that’s doing anything. Right. It’s just the host. It’s all of it. So that’s that and that process is happening all the time. And your brain and your body is plastic, which means it can change. Yeah. So if you’ve got these in your brain, the good news is that you can change them and that’s neuroplasticity and you can direct that change. And so everybody listening to this, what Dr. Carol was saying, it looks like this, it’s this ugly sort of gray. Worry. Right, that’s, know, again, these, what we say in terms of the heart, incoherence, just feeling like you’re not really connected to your, you’re not living your truth, you’re not living in love, there’s a lot of fear, there’s a lot of sadness. In the book, you actually write down topics, which is what I love how practical this book is, you talked about, you kn

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Kate O’Donnell Summary: Kimberly interviews Kate O’Donnell, an Ayurvedic practitioner and author, about the principles of Ayurveda and its application in modern life. They discuss the timeless nature of Ayurvedic practices, the importance of food energetics, and how to incorporate these principles into busy lifestyles. Kate shares practical tips for balancing the doshas, the significance of digestion in overall wellness, and how to cook with spices to enhance health. The conversation emphasizes the connection between food, consciousness, and self-care, making Ayurveda accessible to everyone.   About Kate O’Donnell is the author of three Ayurvedic Cookbooks, including The Everyday Ayurveda Guide to Self-Care, The Everyday Ayurveda Cookbook: A Seasonal Guide to Eating and Living Well and Everyday Ayurvedic Cooking for a Calm, Clear Mind: 100 Sattvic Recipes. She is a nationally certified Ayurvedic Practitioner and the founder of the Ayurvedic Living Institute. Kate began to travel in South India at age 20. More than a dozen extended trips to India and twenty years studying the wisdom traditions of the sub-continent support Kate’s practice of Ayurveda.She also specializes in Ayurvedic education, cooking skills, and cleansing programs, offering on-line programs, occasional in-person workshops on the road, and professional trainings. Her offerings aim to help others come closer to their true nature.   Guest Resources: Website: Kate O’Donnell Book: The Everyday Ayurveda Cookbook: A Seasonal Guide to Eating and Living Well   EPSIODE SPONSORS: MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription.   FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY Episode Chapters C00:00 Introduction to Ayurveda and Kate O’Donnell 02:48 The Timelessness of Ayurveda 05:56 Understanding Food Energetics 08:59 The Flexibility of Ayurvedic Practices 11:58 The Connection Between Digestion and Consciousness 14:59 The Role of Food in Yoga and Ayurveda 18:00 Engaging with Food and Nature 20:59 Practical Tips for Balancing Vata Energy 24:02 Managing Pitta Imbalances 28:04 The Impact of Diet on Emotions 29:46 Balancing the Doshas through Food 31:35 Digestibility and Food Preparation Techniques 33:20 Incorporating Spices for Better Digestion 37:12 Practical Tips for Integrating Ayurveda into Daily Life 44:05 Traveling and Maintaining Ayurvedic Practices 48:05 Streamlining Cooking for Busy Lives SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:00.6)Hi everyone and welcome back to our Monday interview show. I am so excited for our very special guest here with me today. Her name is Kate O’Donnell and she is an author, international presenter, Ayurvedic practitioner, the founder of the Ayurvedic Living Institute. So you might guess that we’re talking about Ayurveda today and she is celebrating the 10 year anniversary with her revised edition of the Everyday Ayurvedic Cookbook. a seasonal guide to eating and living well with over 100 recipes for simple, which we love, healing foods. Kate, thank you so much for being here with us today. Kate ODonnell (00:39.681)It’s my pleasure, Kimberly. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:42.178)You know, there’s so many things that I’m excited to chat with you about. Arivada is one of my favorite subjects. But I just want to say congratulations for having this amazing book and reiterating it and re- you creating it. But the foundation, just like Arivada has been around for thousands of years. And I love how timeless this is, you know, in a world that’s always sort of grasping for the next pill or the next fad or what can we do that’s, you know, we’re missing something. I love that this is taking us to the roots and keeping it again, really simple, foundational for busy working moms like myself and busy people in general. And yeah, so it’s just, I love that, you know, this rebirthing of something that’s so timeless. Kate ODonnell (01:37.039)Me too. Yeah. Thanks for bringing that up. It’s something that for myself, you know, there were so many fads as I was growing up, you know, and I sort of started a vegetarian diet when I was 16. I was on my own there trying to figure out what to eat in my family home. So I took an interest in cookbooks and learning about cooking and it just Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:45.431)Yeah. Kate ODonnell (01:58.659)There was so much information, and it’s even more so now. And so when I found Ayurveda and I was already a yoga practitioner, and I thought, this makes so much sense. It all goes together, and it’s all thousands of years old, so they’re not going to change their mind in five years about whether avocados are good for me or not. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:09.079)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:18.094)Well, it’s funny because I was reading your book and I loved how because, you know, there’s many different ways to use Ayurvedic principles and to interpret them. But you mentioned that you don’t use a lot of onions and garlic because they’re so rajastic. And if I look back in my books, Kate, because I had a food focus on my first three and then still, you know, as it continues to evolve spiritually and emotionally, there’s still always been that cornerstone of food. But my second book, which is called the Beauty Detox Foods, had onions and garlic in so many recipes. And I was freeing myself from calorie counting and I was working on digestion. And it was at that moment after that book was published, I started studying Arubato myself. And then if you look at all the recipes I created after that, there isn’t a lot of onions and garlic because while some of us may need some of that extra, you know, oomph, a lot of us in this modern world living in urban centers, having a lot of overstimulation. I found in myself how much it supported me in feeling centered, which is a testament to how powerful food is as a medicine when we realize it really, every food has an energetic quality to it. Kate ODonnell (03:37.431)Right, right. And onion and garlic are the, sort of feed our excitability and our passions, which can be a good thing if we’re channeling it well. But I think your point, Kimberly, is that we are all pretty excited already. So maybe we don’t need foods with those qualities. And it’s not to say that onion and garlic is not included in the pharmacopoeia of Ayurveda. mean, it’s there. It’s absolutely part of the diet. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:44.108)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:54.176)Exactly. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:02.86)Right. Kate ODonnell (04:05.793)It’s just about having that knowledge of when we want to eat more of that and when we want to eat less of that. What I was finding is that so many of my students didn’t know how to cook without using onion and garlic as the flavor foundation. Right? So that was what I was trying to like, how do we flavor our food without using those like every single time we cook something? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:12.812)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:21.548)Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:29.986)Yes. And what I love, so your book has a lot of information about Ayurveda in the beginning, and then it goes into the recipes. And what I love about Ayurveda and how it’s presented here as well is it’s not, you know, hard, rigid rules. It feels nourishing when you even read about Ayurveda, the seasonality, the balancing of energy. Can you just explain, you know, from your standpoint, Kate, just you know, your approach to Ayurveda and how it can help someone who’s already really busy, but just start to bring in a deeper level of, I’ll say, self-care. Kate ODonnell (05:12.845)Right, by I think putting some of our attention on the energetics of our food. So that’s where Ayurveda’s so much information, like in the early part of the text about the energies of foods, whether they make us hot or cold, whether they slow us down or sort of make us lighter and faster. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:34.989)Yes. Kate ODonnell (05:36.565)And so we sort of the average person with a little bit of that knowledge, you know, like we already talked, brought up onions and garlic, right? So onions and garlic, they’re, they’re hot. You know, they get you moving. They get you excited. They get you passionate. They’re great for libido. That’s one of the ways we might use them. They’re great for kicking colds. That’s why so many of our medicines will use onions and garlic. But if somebody is feeling overheated or having trouble falling asleep or is feeling really irritable, maybe we want to reduce onion and garlic at that time. So with a little bit of the knowledge of how a food affects the body, then you know. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:52.034)Mmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:56.792)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:05.208)Right. Yes. Kate ODonnell (06:20.045)And it’s not to say, you know, I think what we want to do so much of the time, Kimberly is, you know, what is Ayurveda say about almonds? Are they, are they a yes or a no? You know, and it’s, it’s all, the answer is always, well, this is what almonds will do in a body. Is that what you need or is that not what you need? And so we can gravitate towards things that we need and away from things that we don’t at any given time. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:38.423)Great. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:44.194)Yes, and I love, know, everybody is so unique and everybody’s Agni, their digestion is unique, their blueprint is different and their goals are different. So I remember at a certain point, Kate, I was actually a raw foodist for a couple of years and it worked really well for me for a time. And then I was learning about Argue Veda and then I was like, you know what works really well for me almost every night for dinner, my family eats, you know, we have a lot of Kate ODonnell (06:47.236)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:11.816)soup and stews and very warming foods. But what works really well for me and has for years is to have the glowing green smoothie in the morning. Now I still have my hot water with lemon and ginger first. I don’t drink it super cold. I drink it room temperature. And my Ayurvedic teacher, Vidya J, actually prescribes green smoothies. And he also says don’t drink them too cold. So there is this flexibility. because life is infinite that I really appreciate about Ayurveda where you can take it to match your own constitution. And, you know, whilst Ayurveda says, you know, eat mostly raw foods in the spring, if something’s working and you’re adding other elements to help digestion, you know, for me, I noticed in my body and many others having raw foods and cooked foods can still work really well. Kate ODonnell (08:02.999)Right, right. Yeah. And this is one of those examples where people might hear some rule, you know, like Ayurveda says, don’t eat raw food, which is not true, but Ayurveda will say that raw food may be harder to digest. So going into it, you know, if it say it’s a time where we’re really stressed out or we’re really busy or we’re grieving, you know, so the, all the body’s prana, you know, our energy may not be present for the digestion. So during a time like that, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:12.706)Great. Kate ODonnell (08:31.265)Maybe we have soup, you know, instead of a raw thing, you know, and smoothies are, you know, again, you hear that Ayurveda says no smoothies, you know, but honestly, if we, if we go back in time to the beginning of the word smoothie, smoothies always had yogurt and bananas in them and ice cream. Do you know, do you remember that when the smoothie first became a thing? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:33.868)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:54.898)well then there’s like, you know, Jamba Juice and these smoothie king and places that have a lot of unhealthy ingredients. I thought you were gonna say, Kate, smooth because it’s blended in effect. is pre-digested. So it’s not like trying to break up these really huge raw leaves in your body, you know, in that sense. Kate ODonnell (08:59.119)Yep. Kate ODonnell (09:16.727)Exactly. That’s so true. It’s so true. I, you if you look at my books, you’ll find a lot of smooth recipes. Like I do a lot of blender soup. It’s the same idea, you know? So if a person’s taking greenery that is very voluminous when it’s in its raw form and we sort of, you know, we churn it, you know, we grind it down in a smooth form, you’re definitely going to find that the absorption and the bioavailability of the nutrition there is like, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:24.269)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:32.897)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:38.967)Yes. Kate ODonnell (09:45.901)tenfold of what it is if you’re sitting there chewing and chewing, trying to get all this voluminous leaf, you know, into your gut in a, cause once the food goes into your belly, it turns into that liquid, you know. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:58.12)Right, exactly. Exactly. And again, a lot of people in the modern world aren’t chewing well enough or eating or taking the time to even put aside, you know, I’m guilty of it myself. I’m pointing to my desk because there’s times where I do have to, you know, I drop the kids off at school and only have so many hours until I pick them up and bring them to activities. So I try not to eat while I’m working. But That’s where smoothies have also helped me as well. just, I bless my food, I try. But the truth is none of us are going to be perfect all the time. So we wanna have the knowledge. We wanna utilize some of these seasonal practices and spices, but it’s not about being perfect. Kate ODonnell (10:44.489)Not at all. Not at all. It’s so funny when I hang out with my Ayurveda friends, someone will pull out something crazy. Yeah, someone will have, let’s say, a big smoothie with bananas in it. And they’re like, this is so delicious. And someone will say, well, you have a good ugliness. You can handle it. Because we take good care of ourselves. That what we want to indulge, we’re up to the task. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:02.434)Wait. Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:09.059)Yeah. Kate ODonnell (11:10.317)You know, and I think that’s important that we, you put all this money in the bank every time you do self care for your digestion. And then sometimes you want to do a withdrawal, you know, take some of that money out and enjoy. So it’s like, I’ll have cheesecake or something. And before I was working with Ayurveda and really working on my digestion, I went through many years where I couldn’t eat that stuff. You know, I couldn’t eat like a big dessert or ice cream Sunday or something. I can totally eat that now. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:22.893)Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:33.517)Yeah. Kate ODonnell (11:38.807)I don’t crave it like I used to. still don’t eat it much because it doesn’t sound good. But if I wanted to, I would process that. And I have confidence in my body’s ability to digest whatever goes in. And that’s because of all the good work. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:49.164)Wait, wait. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:58.526)One, the other thing I love about Arjuveda is it takes it out of this reductionist approach, which is how many grams of protein are we eating, calories, no sugar. And a lot of the recipes are using some of these really classic Arjuvedic ingredients. For example, I love the, know, the OJUS building with dates and ingredients with, know, recipes with dates, which was, you know, when I gave birth. To my sons, I had a lot of those date smoothies to just build up again. Honey, we actually have a little farm in Hawaii, Kate. I have honey almost every day now, raw honey, just a little bit, which works really well for me. So for me, getting out of the numbers, which feel really restrictive and understanding that, again, we’re energy and food is energy, is really powerful healing because I think we get led away from what’s truly well, if we’re just trying to pack in the protein, having all the, you know, the processed bars all day and the protein products, and now we’re not really getting nourished with nature. Kate ODonnell (13:09.249)I agree. I agree. It’s like the further that our food comes from nature, the further we each come from our own nature. That’s the Ayurveda teaching. And so the more that we are connected to food in its natural form, you know, so taking like, you know, a bunch of kale and putting it in the blender and making a smoothie out of it, that works because it’s still kale, you know? And I think Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:18.125)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:32.291)Yeah. Kate ODonnell (13:35.447)We’re outsourcing what we’re doing with the numbers is we’re outsourcing our consciousness. You know, we’re not inhabiting our body and saying, I just ate that. How did that feel? saying, I just ate that. had this much protein. So that means it’s good. You know, so it’s an awareness practice of the body. And that’s where we get our information from. It’s not something someone else is feeding us from the outside. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:47.266)right? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:51.404)Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:02.882)Well, I love this quote. Speaking of that reminds me of a quote that I underlined on page six, which is good digestion results not only in a glowing healthy body, but in a glowing consciousness as well. And I think what’s so powerful about yoga, Ayurveda, just the whole lifestyle is that we recognize that everything affects everything else. So I did start very heavily focused on food in my wellness journey and became a nutritionist. But then it was like, wow, questioning old ideas, trauma coming up, feeling my feelings, emotional wellness, emotional resiliency, spiritual growth, all these amazing things happened. And I don’t think Kate, unless I had really cleaned up my digestion and started really nourishing myself, I’m not sure I would. be where I am today and I’m really grateful for that. So can you talk a little bit about that line because we know digestion is food of course, but it’s also senses and everything else and this consciousness that you’re talking about. Kate ODonnell (15:13.847)Yeah. I think it’s one of the places where, you know, something you and I have in common is we’re both very much involved in yoga as well. You know, it’s like the yoga of food. So I was practicing yoga for years before I got into Ayurveda, but I started to think like, and I noticed as a teacher as well that the foods my students were eating weren’t really supporting the yoga. You know, a lot of the. At that time I was in Boston. Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:21.079)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:37.774)Where do you teach, Okay. Kate ODonnell (15:43.585)Yeah. I was, you know, and it was like a daily, I was there every day with the students and I was just like, wow. So we’re doing this practice that is to sort of evolve the state of the consciousness in the body, through the body, you know, where we’re working towards being our, the true self, you know, we want that Purusha, that true self to shine. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:59.276)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:05.165)Yes. Kate ODonnell (16:08.695)And so when the body is bogged down, this is something we’ll hear from yoga as well as Ayurveda that when we’re bogged down with sort of a sickness or a stagnation or any kind of imbalance in the body, it’s like a crutch, know, or it gets in the way. It’s like a wrench in the gears of our evolution. And that really spoke to me because I thought, this makes, this is so great because I’m very practical person. I thought, well, I’m eating. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:30.231)Yes. Kate ODonnell (16:38.551)all the time anyway, so this may as well support the yoga, know, the, the, the evolution and what I really feel is like the purpose of life. Like I want my food to feed into and be a part of that journey, you know, towards being a fuller person, you know, a fuller expression. So the, that’s what I found in Ayurveda is that the, because the food in, in the, the food builds the body and the body is the microcosm of Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:43.18)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:54.616)Mm. Kate ODonnell (17:07.811)the macrocosm. So the idea is that, you know, nature and the world around us that nourishes us and that supports us is composed of the same building blocks as the body. So I’m just like a figment, you know, I’m made of the same stuff as that cloud, that tree, that squirrel. So when I eat food that comes from nature that I can recognize as natural, you know, it didn’t come out of a pill or Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:09.378)Mmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:22.979)Yes. Mmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:34.571)Yes. Kate ODonnell (17:37.795)You know, so it’s a piece of nature that comes into my field. You know, I’m looking at it, I’m smelling it, I’m tasting it. You know, I’m engaging with it in the same way that I would sit on a mountain top and enjoy the view. Like, I am truly like that about my food. It’s like a sacred experience when I am with it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:54.317)Yes. Kate ODonnell (18:00.215)And so I’m engaging all the senses. I’m smelling it and I’m feeling the different textures, whether it’s smooth or hard, crunchy. So I’m engaged with all that. So my whole consciousness is absorbed in the activity of being one with nature in that time while I’m eating. And then when the food goes into the body, it’s transmuted by the fire element. Just like when you’ve Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:17.294)Mmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:25.248)Yes. Yes. Kate ODonnell (18:30.063)practice yoga and you get this little, you know, sometimes the fire comes on and you get this little pocket of a release, you know, or a little flame is, is like ignited in your core. It’s the same thing with the food, you know, it meets the fire element in the body. And then the, that nature from out there is transmuted and becomes the tissue of my body. And so I become one with nature. And according to both yoga and Ayurveda traditions, that’s actually what we’re going for. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:54.456)Mmm. Kate ODonnell (18:59.597)That’s like, that’s the state of fulfillment, santosha, happiness. And so the denaturing of the self, you know, it’s happening to us from our food in many cases and not only what we eat, but also are we paying attention? Are we present with the food? Is the consciousness present? Are we paying attention to our food? Cause when you are, you know, you get that link where you get, you get linked into the flow of nature. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:13.474)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:23.308)Great. Kate ODonnell (19:28.911)through the activity of eating the food. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:31.694)It’s so beautifully stated and again, emphasizing how simple this can be because I think one of the reasons that we do get denatured or choose the denatured option is convenience, cost, because we’re busy, but with simple practices and I can say for myself, you know, because I cook very simply, I use a lot of one pot meals, but there’s certain principles that you can learn. and you teach in your book as well. So it’s not necessarily taking more time, maybe a little more planning to make sure that you have the ingredients stocked in your fridge and your pantry. But I mean, it’s just so much infinitely healthier. It feels so much more fulfilling. It’s so funny because I was at someone’s house. It was my son’s friend’s house and we were in the garage and I was just looking at all the boxes of the stuff that I think came from like, you know, I don’t know, just bulk, like bulk protein bars and bulk protein drinks and all the things. And I was like, wow, like, you know, just, you know, how easy it is to get that stuff. And the information that a lot of us are fed is that, the numbers add up. But then you think about energetically how, you know, the potential. And I can just say this, I get so Worked out because of my personal experience from feeling really, you know, just hung up on numbers and calorie counting all day to this, let’s say this blossoming feeling, you know, this just more light coming in, more joy, and we don’t get there from just the numbers. Kate ODonnell (21:16.585)No, yeah, I think that’s what you’re pointing out with the question of consciousness. No, yeah. So again, mean, when the, you make your simple one pot meal and all your senses show up at the table to taste it, you know, and smell it and really be there for it. It’s the most delicious thing. Simple food is delicious when you show up for it, you know, so I think sometimes we’re not there, you know, we’re driving and eating and you don’t even know you Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:22.187)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:33.005)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:42.605)Yes. Kate ODonnell (21:46.509)and so you don’t necessarily feel satiated by your food. So you’re wondering, what else can I eat? Because you didn’t notice it going in. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:50.349)Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:54.312)So let’s go practical for a moment, Kate. And you talk about the different qualities and how we have all these energies inside of us, but sometimes we can get imbalanced. So in late, we’ll talk about Vata for a minute. So let’s say an imbalance. We can talk about Vata for six hours, but we know that those of us that are living in the modern world, sometimes we can get spacey. Sometimes, and this is my tendency, I have a lot of Vata energy in my body. sometimes we can get just feeling grounded. So for anyone listening to this, what are some simple foods, spices, even go to recipes that you talk about in your book if you’re just wanting to feel more resilient and grounded and clear. Kate ODonnell (22:43.483)Mm-hmm. Yeah. I mean, this is a great example of where cooked foods, things that are served warm and that are a little

  This Week’s Episode Special Guest: Suzanne O’Brien Summary: In this conversation, Suzanne O’Brien RN discusses the profound themes surrounding end of life, emphasizing the importance of forgiveness, acceptance, and living well. She shares her journey as a doula for the dying, the phases of dying with dignity, and the significance of community support for caregivers. The discussion also touches on cultural perspectives on death, empowering conversations about end of life, and the need for planning and voluntary choices. Ultimately, the conversation highlights the interconnectedness of life and death, encouraging listeners to embrace both with love and understanding.   About Suzanne B. O’Brien, RN is and author and Founder & CEO of Doulagivers Institute. Her life’s mission is to increase access to high quality end of life education and care for patients and families throughout the world. She has developed free resources and trainings for family caregivers and practitioners from her firsthand experience as a hospice and oncology nurse and palliative care professional at the bedsides of more than 1,000 end of life patients. Suzanne has been awarded “Worldwide Leader in Healthcare” by the International Nurses Association for creating Doulagivers Institute and was named Humanitarian Ambassador for Oprah Magazine in 2019 for her work to bring peace and comfort to those facing the end of life around the world. She has a degree in Transpersonal Counseling and Spiritual Ministry from the Association for the Integration of the Whole Person in Los Alamitos, California. She is also a founding member of the National Hospice and Palliative Care Organization’s End of Life Doula Council and a founding member and Former VP of the National End of Life Doula Alliance.   Guest Resources: Website: Doulagivers Institute Book: The Good Death: Supporting Your Loved One Through the End of Life   EPSIODE SPONSORS: MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription.   LMNT OFFER: Right now, for my listeners LMNT is offering a free sample pack with any LMNT drink mix purchase at DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD. That’s 8 single serving packets FREE with any LMNT any LMNT drink mix purchase. This deal is only available through my link so. Also try the new LMNT Sparkling — a bold, 16-ounce can of sparkling electrolyte water. USE LINK: DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to End of Life Care02:47 The Journey to Hospice and Doula Work05:58 Phases of Dying and the Importance of Forgiveness08:55 Understanding Death Across All Ages11:48 The Shift in Perspective on Death15:02 The Spiritual Aspect of Dying18:11 Practical Approaches to End of Life Planning20:53 Living Well Aging Plans and Family Dynamics26:58 The Burden of Caregiving28:32 Quality of Life vs. Longevity30:29 Living Wills and Quality of Life Decisions32:46 Holistic Approaches to End-of-Life Care34:35 The Essence of Life and Death36:28 Lessons from the Dying37:52 Choosing Love Over Fear39:57 The Power of Presence and Service41:44 Empowerment Through Knowledge43:29 Voluntary Choices at End of Life46:21 Dula Givers Institute and Community Support SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:00.792)Welcome back everyone to our Monday interview show. I am so excited for our very special guest here with us today, the lovely Suzanne O’Brien RN. She has this new book out, which I have read cover to cover and I’ll add it did make me cry. I parts, which we’ll talk about in just a little bit. It’s called The Good Death, a guide for supporting your loved one through the end of life. Suzanne is the founder and CEO of the Dula Givers Institute. In 2019, she was named humanitarian ambassador for Oprah magazine for her work to bring peace and comfort to those facing the end of life around the world. Suzanne is also a founding member of the National Hospice and Palliative Care Network, organization of life doula council and a founding member and former vice president of the National End of Life Doula Alliance. Suzanne, thank you so much for being here with us today. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (00:46.631)Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. You got it. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (01:00.669)Thank you for having me and I love the title of your podcast and everything you talk about because really when we talk about a good death, we’re talking about a good life. They’re not exclusive of one another. So I just want to invite people to have an open mind for this conversation. It’s not going to be depressing. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:09.518)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:15.798)No, it’s certainly not. And thank you for pointing that out. I love how you talk about that in the book about this, you the beauty of life, but also the beauty of acceptance and non-resistance and death. And it’s interesting. So much was created in the wake of my mother’s somewhat abrupt passing, Suzanne, including saloon on my brands and getting serious about the feel good podcast, which is really to me feeling good is this natural connection. that we have inside of ourselves. And it’s not dependent on trying to get things from the outside or validation, but just this natural birth rate I think we really have in our hearts and our ability to care for ourselves. And your book is so aligned with that. And yeah, I’d love to share, there were so many moments in your book that it brought me back to that time with my mother where I really was shocked. She passed six weeks after her diagnosis and… My son wasn’t a year old and my older son, like all sorts of things were going on. and your book is so thorough and it really goes from all aspects into even the very practical. But before we jump into that, know, even reading your bio and as a registered nurse, seeing how you shifted and reading the book, it’s just interesting how, or what brought you specifically to focus on hospice care and. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (02:16.188)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:42.104)being a doula for the dying and working through this aspect of life. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (02:47.643)It chooses you. It chooses you. And I think you really started this conversation with exactly what I feel like we’ve learned about life is working with those at the end of life allowed me to immediately realize that we are a human and a being. There’s two parts to us. There’s the human experience that we go through this journey, all the life lessons, all of the experiences to grow for growth, for learning. And then there’s the being part of us. And when you said that the happiness and the joy is not found outside. You’re right, it’s found inside with a connection to that being part, which is always at home, which is always at peace. And it’s like a muscle that you need to, you know, exercise and strengthen. But I think in our world today, we don’t even know about the two parts. We know about the ego part, we know about the separate part, and you can see the chaos that it’s leading to. So, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:24.206)Hmm. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (03:43.559)To answer your question, I am a registered nurse by trade and I was six months out of nursing school in the mainstream hospital and I realized I will never get the fulfillment. This is awful. I had very little time with patients. It was about pushing medications, doing paperwork. The patient and the family were really sometimes the last in the discussion in the meetings. And I thought, what am I gonna do? I’m three years in, student loans, what am I gonna do? And I heard this little voice that said, to hospice. And I said, why am I hearing that? I have no end of life experience. But when I heard that there was a piece, there was an excitement, there was an expansion. And I said, you know what? I’ve tried everything that people say. I followed all of the things that they said. And I said, I don’t know what this is, but I’m just gonna follow it and see. And the very first day I went out to see hospice patients, I knew I was in the exact place I was supposed to be in my life. And I also said, that’s how life works. Not what do I think I’m supposed to be doing, but where am I being guided? What do I know? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:19.566)and then. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:38.914)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:42.678)What a beautiful heart story, Suzanne. I love that and that clarity. I was reading this. We have these comic books of great figures and I was reading the one about Mother Teresa to my sons. And there was this moment when she was on the bus, or no, she was on a train and she heard a voice similarly to you saying, move to the slums. You were meant to move out of the convent and go there. And she was like, no other nun has gone there. Like, what do I do? But it’s that when we open up to that, Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (04:43.965)Mmm. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (04:55.027)Mm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:12.558)that light, that intuition, whatever we want to call it, that voice, it does lead us to this life of great purpose and fulfillment, which clearly you have found so much purpose in your work, Suzanne. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (05:27.207)And Kimberly, it’s so interesting because that day, you know, I had found it being in this end of life space. And if you had told me today that I wouldn’t be a bedside hospice nurse, I wouldn’t have believed you then. But because I knew that when this voice comes in, this is the higher guidance system. And I was always going to listen to it. And it’s just when you trust in that, when you follow your heart guidance, it will lead you on a journey that is not only fulfilled and full of purpose and service, but just miracles big and small and joy and just the splendor of what’s available in this experience. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:58.402)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:02.038)And you talk about these three phases of dying with dignity and having a good death, shock, stabilization and transition. And we could talk about these more, but what really stood out to me was how much in the stabilization phase you talked about forgiveness. And I was reading that and I was thinking, oh my gosh, how key. And there was a lot of exchanges between me and my mother when she was passing. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (06:06.994)Mmm. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (06:12.647)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:30.018)But also, Suzanne, back to living well, how important that is even when we’re not confronted with death, right? Instead of this big wake up call. Of course, for some, it’s going to come at that moment, but there’s lessons in here for, I think, just on the flip side, like living to that fullness in life. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (06:49.873)Yeah, Kimberly, when people are at the end of life and they’re sharing with you what they want you to know about how to make life the best experience possible, they’re not trying to sell you anything. They don’t care if you take it or not. They’re just purely, it’s the wisdom. I immediately changed my life. mean, every day I live like one little lifetime, like knowing that time is my greatest commodity. I don’t miss the joyful moments, the connection, presence, but also forgiveness. So when I saw the transformation at the end of life, and I really feel as people’s physical bodies are diminishing, their spiritual body’s growing, and you can see that things wanna be worked out with acceptance and processed before they leave if it’s possible, the profound transformations that I saw led to the most beautiful end of life with forgiveness. And I said, okay, I am making a list. I am thinking about what am I not addressing or what have I been carrying with me that I’m not even aware of? And I’m gonna forgive. And I will tell you, it- Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:15.566)Mmm. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (07:44.421)sets you free in a way to design and co-create your life with no limitations and with just the most beautiful energy possible. And so yeah, it changed my life completely. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:56.782)Amazing. know, and I, there’s so much in your book where you talk about this, kind of this, I don’t say falsity, but this idea that we must prolong life as much as possible. And I remember with my own mother having to be faced with things like do not resuscitate, which I learned could break their bones and only extend life for a short amount of time. And, you know, there’s just so much, Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (07:58.002)Hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:26.44)reframing life. But this is, you know, it’s a little bit, not more clear, but we can say, okay, our elderly, our parents, and you talk about in the book how the statistics are going to skyrocket with the elderly ratio of the United States. But what about Suzanne? Surely you’ve worked with families where it’s people in their 20s, their 30s, their 40s, children, teenagers, right? Where it’s not the end of life. And it feels, there’s that other element of like, feel a little robbed, right? Because it’s one thing to, if you’re dealing with an elderly parent, but to have that peace when you realize someone may have a terminal illness and they’re only 23 years old. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (09:05.116)Yeah, absolutely. And I’ve had, you know, all ages. And I think that if I may, think that one of the main things that I’m always trying to say, okay, what is the ask, right, of the big picture for what I’m supposed to be doing here and teaching. I really believe it’s to remind people and have them remember that death used to be revered and is a sacred natural rite of passage. And with the awareness of that, it opens us up to really, I feel like expanding like, well, what is life about and what are the important things? But to make sure that we’re not missing it. Cause the number one thing I hear from people at the end of life is I thought I had more time and the regrets. And it’s not what they did do so much as what they didn’t do. And even if you, and then if Kimberly, if I can go really high up in big vision about the gifts within. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:44.824)What? Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (09:56.613)every experience that we have and some do not look like gifts by any means. But when we have those, what I call the little masters, when there is somebody who’s having their end of life, I believe that there is teachings for all of us that are part of that, not just for the comfort, but just to come to place of acceptance. And I remember there was this one little girl and she was dying and she told everyone what exactly what she wanted them to do, how she wanted to be celebrated. She wanted them to dress in pink. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:19.118)Thank you. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (10:25.703)that she wanted them to sing songs. Like she was guiding all of them. It’s pretty amazing what you experience in this space or can. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:36.17)Yes, and there’s this transcendence, right? And goes back to our personal beliefs. I personally believe this isn’t it and that we have, there’s life beyond and so there’s a higher plan. Sometimes we don’t understand it and that can, hell, mean, in the moment there’s so much pain, but kind of smooth over the unfairness aspect. it is, we can come to peace if we can believe it. In some way, somehow it’s someone’s time to go. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (10:45.469)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:04.618)And I remember Suzanne with my mom, the moment my prayers changed from, you know, please heal her. She had this cancer diagnosis, seemingly out of nowhere. I was in February, like the day after my birthday, my parents called. We’d seen her at Christmas and only once did she say, I’m kind of tired. She just sort of held it in. And I was like, no, no, we can heal her. We could do this with the diet and da da. And then there was this moment. It was just something inside me realized and accepted and it switched to, you know, God, please grant her peace. And it was such a big shift and acceptance and all these profound gifts did open up because I think, like you said, it’s the number one fear. have so much resistance and we want to hold on. And that’s not always the plan. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (11:50.099)I think that goes back to the fact of us being human beings, right? The human part of us wants to kind of control the show, right? And then we also have a lot of things happening at the same time. We have doctors that are trained to fix it and they’re expected to fix it, which is an impossible goal that they have to meet. But we’re not even talking about this because the time to choose, and I’ll use myself as an example, what quality of life is to me and realizing that one day the journey will not be as I know it today. allows me when I get there to already have a pathway for it, to already know, like for instance, I’m here with my parents, they’re both 86, God bless, and I’m so grateful that I have them. But there’s a level of gratitude and patience that I have with every minute that we’re together, because it’s a gift. And I know that one day that won’t be there. And so it won’t be such a shock and it won’t be me grasping and us grasping for different things because we talked about it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:42.786)Thank Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (12:45.479)So what about again, bringing back the awareness that one day the journey will not be as I know it today so that when we get there, we hopefully don’t go down pathways and roads that we don’t want to that we know won’t reverse it, but could also be causing more suffering or even false hope for people. Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:01.186)Right. And part of that is sort of just, let’s never talk about this. Like it’s taboo. Let’s like pretend we’re going to live forever. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (13:08.742)Yeah. That, yeah, and that doesn’t work. I mean, if anyone knows anything differently, I’ve never seen anyone, but I also know that I’ve seen the most beautiful things happen at the end of life. You’re literally at the veil. And I’ve had people share with me what they’re seeing, the peace that they’re seeing, the love and what I have felt in the room, and time disappears as you and I know it. There is no doubt. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:25.004)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:30.519)Huh. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (13:37.757)that there is something so incredibly in my mind beautiful that’s gonna happen after because I’ve been with over a thousand people at the end of life. So what is this life about? What are we missing from that awareness and education and wisdom of end of life to make life as rich and beautiful and connected as possible? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:56.408)can only imagine Suzanne being with so many souls that have passed. For me, was only my mother, well, only, but I did have the gift of holding her in my arms as she passed. And then, my dad was near the window. And as you describe in the book, the breath just started to slow and then expire. But it was really profound moment where it didn’t feel like death. I felt like her energy just kind of like moved and forever. I think of death very differently, just as a transition. I know she’s still somewhere. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (14:33.075)Absolutely. Absolutely. like, you know, when we talk about cultures for thousands of years, knowing this and having this be a sacred ritual, you know, we’ve lost the ritual around it. We’ve lost the time thinking of bringing a baby into the world. Very similar in the same importance and sacredness as helping somebody to leave with love and with comfort. There were two times, Kimberly, in my journey that I literally saw someone leave their body, what I would say, leave their body. You know, the things you see and what you feel, let you know that there’s so much more going on. And that to me is so healing and people the end of life talking about how we’re all connected to one unconditional loving energy. Yeah, it’s just, you know, we need to bring that education back, that awareness back to our world. And also we’re suffering from such traumatic grief as a collective, because we’re not talking about end of life, it shows up, it’s a shock. usually doesn’t go that well because of scrambling and then people are stuck in this grief. We need to talk about this and it teaches us about life. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:40.578)Well, you know, what was so clear to me, Suzanne, was when my prayer changed as I explained, it was about me. I was like, please heal her because I want her here. And then when it changed to let her have peace, it was like, this soul is ready to go. And they’re seeing amazing things and they’re at that veil. So I think what your book sort of reframes as well is stepping out of that Mimi, because let’s face it, a lot of the losses. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (15:48.765)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:09.102)you know, we want to talk to that person and we miss having them around and there’s validity in that. And I feel that too. And there’s moments I was like, gosh, I can’t call my mom. But then when we expand into the oneness, into the eternalness, it’s like, the non-attachment comes in, which is such a profound lesson. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (16:12.635)Of course. Of course. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (16:26.181)It’s such a profound lesson what you just shared, you know, the grace in which you brought into this experience and the re focusing on her and the love that was there and how how may I show up to support her in this dynamic and it just changed. all the frequency around everything. But I do honor you because when something shows up quickly, there’s a process, there’s a shock right now. And this is really one of my main platforms is to try and educate before we ever get there. Even children have their pets dying. so age appropriately, think one of the best things we could ever do is talk about the cycle of life with nature and animals and how we’re all connected. because what we’re seeing right now is the removal of that and then the fear that has been ingrained in people that is unfortunately again preventing them from having these meaningful last chapters with their loved ones as they’re leaving the physical body, which is so important for us to be able to have if that’s what we can do. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:26.414)What would you say to someone listening or watching this, Suzanne, if they’re like, oh, I want to know, but reading about this, I don’t want to manifest death. I don’t want to think about losing my mom or losing my dad or losing a loved one. What would you say about how on the flip side, this could actually be really empowering to have this information? Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (17:45.777)Yeah. Yeah. So I would say that it’s not going to bring it on. It’s not talking about sex doesn’t make us pregnant. you know, talking about end of life doesn’t. But I will say this from a very, and you really talked about this, book being very practical in its education, but also sacred and spiritual as well. That the we’re all going to be called to show up to care for somebody at the end of life at some point in the journey, knowing how to do that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:12.908)Yeah. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (18:14.267)knowing how to do that changes everything. And I also want to remind us that a hundred years ago, this was a skill that a grandmother used to teach to a grandchild. People died at home, they had home wakes. This is a holistic skill. This is not medical. And we’ve given over our end of life to the medical profession. First of all, they can’t fix it. They’re not supposed to, but it also allows us to not be able to be in that process with our loved one. Knowing what my mom wants, where she wants to be, warm blankets, what kind of music, having those conversations, that’s something that I want to provide for her and it’s so healing and we can all do that. And you’re going to feel as much as it’s going to be difficult, and I know it is, when we say goodbye to that physical person, knowing that you were there, helping them to lead this world in comfort, you’re going to hold that in your heart for absolutely ever in the most beautiful way. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:45.838)Mm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:02.232)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:10.646)You know, when I had this, every time I keep referencing your book to my experience because it comes from such direct knowing about this experience, Suzanne, like this, can feel your heart in this book and how, you know, how you’ve really been leading people through this. Cause I’m like, yes, I remember that moment. I remember that moment. And there was a time where my mom stopped speaking and I just said, Hey, squeeze your hand. If you can hear what I’m saying. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (19:20.317)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:37.482)She squeezed and squeezed and she looked me in the eye and I had two hours to just tell her everything. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (19:47.165)There’s a few things that I want to share with your listeners and with you now is that people, want to make sure that you understand people can hear you even when they’re in a deep sleep coma. But I want to take it a step further. People can hear you now. You know, if we think about quantum physics, right? And we talk about energy and they’re really finding out a lot in this world. But I always go with what is your heart saying, right? What is your gut saying? Energy cannot be destroyed. It has to be a solid, a liquid or a gas. Your loved one has changed for. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:56.109)Hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:59.66)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:16.237)Yes. Suzanne B. O’Brien RN (20:16.591)Your loved one is still around you. Maybe as Oprah says, and I have to give her a little bit of props here, she talks about when her birth mother died, she feels her now more loving and stronger in a relationship than she ever did. And I know that I have heard that from families as well, when their loved one has stopped breathing in the body and they’ve slowed down and taken time, hours, if not hopefully days,

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Dr. Margie Warrell In this conversation, Margie Warrell discusses her book ‘The Courage Gap’ and explores the themes of courage, fear, and self-discovery. She emphasizes the importance of understanding the courage gap, which is the space between knowing what we should do and actually taking action. Margie shares insights on how to overcome fear, the significance of being authentic, and the relationship between courage and love. She also reflects on her personal journey, including her struggles with an eating disorder and the loss of loved ones, and how these experiences have shaped her mission to empower others.   About Dr. Margie Warrell Dr. Margie Warrell is a five-time best-selling author, keynote speaker, leadership coach, and Forbes columnist. With twenty-five years of experience living and working around the world, she has dedicated her life to helping others overcome fear and unlock their potential. From her humble beginnings on a small farm in rural Australia to her current role as a Senior Partner at Korn Ferry and Advisory Board member for the Forbes School of Business & Technology, Margie has learned that courage is essential for every worthwhile endeavor. A mother of four and an advocate for women’s empowerment, she inspires others to live bravely and refuse to settle in any aspect of life.   Episode Sponsors: MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription.   FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY Guest Resources Website: margiewarrell.com Social Media: margie@margiewarrell.com   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to the Impact of Synthetic Dyes01:23 Personal Journey: The Catalyst for Change06:12 The Science Behind Synthetic Dyes and Their Effects10:49 Regulatory Challenges and the FDA’s Role13:58 The Power of Awareness and Advocacy18:40 The Broader Implications of Food Dyes in Society26:10 Legislative Efforts Against Synthetic Dyes28:05 Challenges in National Regulation29:20 Impact of Synthetic Dyes on Children30:24 Finding Alternatives to Dyes32:15 The Cost of Healthier Choices34:09 The Struggles of Medical Dependency35:51 Elimination and Its Immediate Benefits38:41 The Broader Implications of Dyes40:11 Adult Reactions to Synthetic Dyes43:03 The Journey of Creating the Documentary48:41 Where to Watch the Documentary   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:00.691)Hi everyone and welcome back to our show. I have a very special guest here with me today from across the country in Washington DC. I’m so excited to chat with her after reading her brand new book called The Courage Gap, Five Steps to Braver Action, Margie Worrell, PhD, who is a five-time bestselling author, a keynote speaker, leadership advisor, And I can’t help but also add from reading her book, Mother of Four. Margie, thank you so much for being here. I felt like that should be part of the bio and I just wanted to it in organically because it’s really amazing that you’ve created so much. And that was one of the things you talked about in the book, but also breaking this idea of limitation that you couldn’t be successful in your career and also be a mother of four. So congratulations on all fronts. Margie Warrell (00:40.392)Yeah. Margie Warrell (00:59.106)Thanks, Kimberly. It’s great to be with you. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:02.661)Margie, so much to say about courage and fear. And I want to dive a little bit deeper. You and I were chatting before about how much of the conversation in our Feel Good podcast community has been about the heart and you really connect courage and the heart. But before we get that far, tell us about this gap, the courage gap and what that really means. Margie Warrell (01:30.222)Well, I know I’ve had this experience myself many times, Kimberly, but I’ve also had many people share their own of knowing there was something that they should do, something they wanted to do, something they knew they needed to do. Maybe it was a difficult conversation. Maybe it was disentangling themselves from a relationship they knew was just sucking the life blood out of them. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:42.045)Mm. Margie Warrell (01:55.882)maybe it was going after something they really wanted and they just had so much doubt and yet they were holding back, they were hesitating, they were procrastinating, they were coming up with all sorts of great reasons and it’s my observation that our fear creates the gap between what we’re doing on a daily basis but also over the course of our lives and what it is we’re capable of doing between having an insight going know I should do that and actually doing it and it takes courage to close that gap. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:22.567)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:30.663)Mm-hmm. Margie Warrell (02:31.054)And so many people I’ve met in my work and travels around the world, Kimberly, are living smaller lives than they’re capable of living because they’re afraid of what will happen if they step forward into that gap, if they take that action when there’s a chance that they might fall short or mess up, make a mistake, make a fool of themselves. And so I wanted to write a book that would be really, really practical to help people in those moments when you’re like, do I don’t Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:58.951)Yes. Margie Warrell (03:00.938)I do I don’t I to just step forward and do it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:06.139)I resonate with those moments. Like you said, it could be something you can pinpoint, like, this relationship or this conversation. But one of the things that I started to feel into when I was reading your book is also the courage to be yourself. And what I mean by that is it’s really easy to wear different masks because we think that’s how we’re gonna be liked or accepted. You know, for me, Margie, there’s been a lot of… Like dismantling wanting to be seen as serious and smart and overcoming perfectionism through my childhood. so just like putting things out there in a certain way, right? And it takes courage to be like, hey, but I have this whole side of me that’s more alive and silly and wacky and letting that show too in some situations except for like now my kids and my husband see it. And it feels… scary sometimes to really let yourself be seen. But wow, the life force, Margie, right? So this quote, there’s so many quotes, first of all, in the book that I just think are like spectacular. And I was sharing with you how many I had highlighted, but there’s one in particular that resonates here. And I’ll paraphrase it. was something about when you connect to who you want to be, it informs your doing. So was reading this and I was like, who I wanna be is free. My freedom and wholeness are like my two guiding lights. And if I wanna be free and whole, means not being fearful people aren’t gonna like me if I show these parts of me, right? And so it informs how I’m expressing, it informs how I’m writing, it informs how I’m speaking. And it feels scary at times, but it also feels really good. Margie Warrell (04:50.146)Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Margie Warrell (04:55.426)Yeah well just because it’s scary sure doesn’t mean it’s bad right in fact often that’s the very thing we have to do and I like to frame it this way Kimberly that whenever we are letting what other people might think about us be pulling the strings and directing our decisions and kind of in charge of how shaping how we show up. We’re essentially held captive to other people’s opinions and approval. We’re held captive to what I call impression management. Do they like me? You know, do they think I’m cool? Do they think I’m funny? Do they think I’m pretty? Do they think I’m smart? And that’s part of the human condition, right? Like we all long to belong. We want to be approved of. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:14.844)in Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:34.845)Managing. Yeah. Margie Warrell (05:43.014)We want people to think well of us and so there’s nothing wrong with that because it is wired into us but really our own human journey is developing the awareness that reclaims that power. recognizing I’m giving this away right now. I’m trying to sound really smart. I’m trying to look really hip. I’m trying to look like my family’s a perfect family or whatever it is versus you who am I when I strip all that you know impression management and caring about approval seeking and pleasing away and I think it’s a lifelong journey Kimberly. I don’t feel like you can just flick a switch and go that’s it. I don’t care what anyone thinks because people have to say that really loudly. I’m like okay you care a lot what everyone thinks. So I think just that’s a self-awareness piece, right? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:28.284)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:32.371)Well, so your book has these questions and introspecting and sort of telling stories about other people’s courage and vulnerability because it can feel like a lot in there, right? Like there’s a reason why we’re wearing masks. There’s a reason why you don’t leave a relationship even though it’s crappy. There’s a reason you stay in a job that, you know, isn’t serving your life purpose. So it’s like, ugh, it’s like a lot of energy and fear. So when you’re coaching, when you’re working with people and how you dismantle it in the book, Margie, what are some of the tips you would say to someone that’s even, you know, it feels like a lot to even broach the subject in the first place? Margie Warrell (07:18.314)It is a, I think it can be a lot and it’s like at what point, where do you even start? And before we pressed record, you and I talked about just that holistic even connecting in with our body and we can get there in a moment. But I think a really key thing that requires. getting really just sometimes pressing pause on the business of our lives and zooming up and going, who is it I want to be in my one and only precious life? Thank you, Mary Oliver. Like, how do I want to show up? What are the values that want to define how I want to live my life and getting some clarity on that? Because when our values are clear, like for instance, I want to be kind or I want to be generous or I want to be a great mother. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:46.973)Yeah. Margie Warrell (08:05.232)or a good friend. I want to be living using my gifts in ways that are meaningful and purposeful for me. When we get clarity on that it helps acts like a North Star. Like you know what I need to step away a little bit from this over here because it’s not nourishing me and I need to invest more time in this over here. Maybe it’s we’re building a skill, maybe we’re building a new web of of relationships but Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:32.498)Yes. Margie Warrell (08:33.742)the clearer we are on the values that we want to define our lives by and who it is we want to be, then it makes it easier, not easy, but to rise above those very self-protective instincts that keep us stuck and playing it safe. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:39.847)Wait. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:47.858)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:51.837)Well, you know, to echo something you just said, which I did think was an important part of the book, and I did write it down somewhere here, was inhabiting the body. Because sometimes when fear hits, we’re kind of like frozen or like taking, you know, going elsewhere. Tell us what you mean about inhabiting the body and how it can help us as a tool for overcoming fear. Margie Warrell (09:15.928)Well. We all know that our thoughts can impact the emotions we feel and then how we feel in our body. But our body, it’s not a one way street. Our physiology, these earth suits that we have, they also impact how we think and how we feel. And so just recognizing that, that our physiology impacts our psychology, gives us a portal, a doorway to enter there. There’s a lever there. And so, okay, well, where is it that I’m holding onto? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:25.393)Okay. Margie Warrell (09:47.124)fear in my body and what would it look like and feel like and sound like and move like if I was embodying the courage that I wanted to have? you know, it’s called a nervous system for a reason because we are our default is to be defensive, you know, on alert for, you know, who might who might threaten our sense of safety or our identity or reputation or our place in our social pack. And so just recognizing that that we can be moving through the world kind of in a defensive, anxious mode. And so connecting in with our bodies helps connect that head and heart and hands and recognizing, okay, you know, what is it, where am I living from the neck up? Where am I stuck in my head, maybe? And I think that most powerful and easiest way to start with that is simply through our breath. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:34.65)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:45.756)Mm-hmm. Margie Warrell (10:46.318)And I’m sure you’ve had many moments Kimberly where just pausing and taking the longest breath you’ve taken all day and just breathing in and I sort of like to couple this with a cognitive reframe. Breathe in courage, breathe out fear sort of allows us to reset you know that that vagus nerve that kind of goes down through us just to go okay where do I need to just tell my brain it’s okay right now. Right now, in this moment, it’s okay. And to stand tall and put our shoulders back and put a smile on our face and like that, what is that telling our brain is that it’s okay, I got this, I don’t have to be going into full flight, you know, fight mode. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:31.079)Well, a couple of things, I love how you do talk about posture in the book and you talk about standing up straight and really embodying, inhabiting that, you know, courage. And I remember there was a Ted talk a couple of years ago, some researcher from Princeton was talking about this body language that really did help you feel, as you also referenced in the book, just feeling more strong and brave. So I love that. And also, Margie, you talk about the heart a lot in the book, which I resonate with so much. And my last book I mentioned before was about heart coherence and how the heart sends more messages to the brain. So when you work with the heart and you start to entrain the heart, brain, nervous system, you can really change your thoughts. And so there’s a certain point in the book where you talk about courage. being a really high form of love. So before I read that part, Margie, I wrote back here, said, ask Margie about the relationship between courage and being loving and love, and then you hit on it. Because being courageous doesn’t mean cowering higher, being just like nice and not having challenging conversations and sort of being like people pleasing. There’s a power in lovingness that can be very courageous. Can you talk a little bit about that relationship? Margie Warrell (12:49.036)Yeah well the word courage comes from the word core French for heart and I know Brené Brown talked a lot about this like what it is to live a wholehearted life and the reason that I say that courage is love in its highest form and vice versa love is courage its highest form is it is living with our heart wide open to the full spectrum of human emotion. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:01.159)Hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:13.341)Hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:17.81)Mm. Margie Warrell (13:18.066)And let’s face it, most of us would rather not feel the really painful emotions. Like, can we just have the good stuff? Like not that bad. I don’t want to feel, don’t my heart to be broken? I don’t want people to disappoint me. I don’t want to be rejected. I don’t want to be judged. And so to live with our heart wide open is to be fully open to that full spectrum of life’s experiences. And at the same time, deeply grounded. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:22.844)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:35.869)Mm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:41.138)Beautiful. Margie Warrell (13:45.466)in ourselves, our own worthiness at a really kind of primal and sacred level that who we are is beyond what anyone might say about us, it’s also beyond our bodies too, that our bodies aren’t, that who we are is not our bodies, it’s not our emotional state, it’s not our mental and cognitive function because lord knows that goes down over time, our bodies won’t stay this, won’t be looking the same when we’re 90 and so just being able to connect at that real heart level that often knows what it is we should do before our mind is willing to concede defeat. Because often we know what we should do and yet we’re like coming up with 3,000 really good reasons why not and our heart is like… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:29.575)Right. Margie Warrell (14:31.252)you know it, you know what you need to do. And I think that’s where, you know, living with our heart wide open is obviously easier said than done because we’re wired for protecting ourselves against pain or perceived pain or emotional injury. And yet it’s a very liberating place to live from because when we can trust ourselves and our hearts to handle anything, it actually empowers us for everything. We’re more secure. We’re not less secure. We’re more secure in our lives. And that’s a work in progress sometimes, you know, two steps forward, one step back. But I like to ask people. If you were not afraid of something happening that you couldn’t handle, if you could trust in your heart’s ability to handle anything, what is it that you would do? You know, what is it that you would change? What would you go after? And like, well, if I wasn’t afraid of rejection, I’d do this. And if I wasn’t afraid of just making a fool of myself on the global stage, I’d do that. And it can just open up our aperture of what’s possible for us and be a really, yeah, very empowering, liberating space to be going through the world. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:52.115)Mm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:56.595)You know, it’s, where is that quote? It’s be before do, grounding yourself in the certainty of who you want to be elevates what you do. Coupled with this other one, when you’re willing to feel anything, this is the one I really wanted, you embolden yourself for everything. So as children, Margie, a lot of us are, you we have these patterns, we’ve been hurt. What is it? 75 % of us. according to Bessel van der Kolk and the body keeps the score, say we have a form of trauma. So we like, you’re right, we don’t want to feel rejected. We don’t like to feel outcast or that we don’t belong. So what happens, Margie, if we put ourselves out there, let’s say we decide to ask someone on a date and we do get rejected. And you do talk about learning from the courage, but what if that makes someone just want to go back into their hole? Margie Warrell (16:54.734)you And that’s where our work lies, right? And that’s a natural response, because we’re giving other people’s opinion of us in some moment of time and they don’t even know us necessarily. We ask them out on a date and they’re like, no, maybe they don’t like our hair color. Who knows? But we’re giving them power because we’re saying, I care so much about your judgment of me. So again, we’re giving them the power to determine how we will feel about ourselves. And that’s where Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:24.957)Right. Margie Warrell (17:26.09)there is so much power in us defining and being self-defining. I know I am worthy. Whether or not you think I’m worthy, I know I’m deeply and innately lovable and loved and loving and whether you see that or not is actually beside the point that I know I am. And so if someone else isn’t seeing that okay great on you go on your journey and on I go on mine. I thought maybe it could be a thing here but okay clearly not. But the most attractive thing about people, sorry, let me rephrase that. The most attractive people are people who are not letting their worth be defined by everybody else. They’re not outsourcing their self-esteem to how many likes they have on their post or to what invite list they’re on or how the guy they’re going out with looks. They’re really, they’re so at home in themselves. And that’s an incredibly attractive thing. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:09.298)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:27.347)Yes. So I think we have all met people like that and we can admire that. I can think of someone in my mind, she just kind of says whatever she wants. And sometimes it’s like a little bit too much, but still like she really, like you said, doesn’t, when people, she gets negative comments or at a party, people disagree with her, doesn’t affect her that much. So let’s say for anyone listening, Margie, we’re point A. Because it’s easy, we can say, know I’m lovable, I have this self-worth, but we’re trying to cross over to be where we aren’t so suede and we’re not outsourcing. There’s a journey there. Margie Warrell (19:08.792)There is absolutely a journey and that’s our work. I mean, there’s various things we can do, tools we can use. I think I know myself, journaling over the course of my life has been a really powerful tool for reminding me of what at the deepest level I already know. You know, it’s like, you’re chasing. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:22.003)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:25.681)Me too. Margie Warrell (19:33.554)likes or approval, you’re chasing something out there that actually, no matter how much you get of it, it will never be enough. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:42.78)Right. Margie Warrell (19:44.334)It’s just you’re on this treadmill. It’ll never be enough. I mean, you might think it’s going to be enough, but then you get it and you know it’s still not going to be enough. So I think journaling can be a great way to just explore that the inner regions of our lives and go, what is it that here that’s in my way and what does love look like today? And you know, maybe there’s people we need to step away from hanging out with so much. Maybe there’s people we need to set a boundary with. Maybe there’s other people over here we we need to invest more time with. we’re not treating ourselves with as much love and respect. Maybe we’re abusing ourselves in some way because we just keep putting rubbish in ourselves. or we’re not taking care of ourselves the way we’d like to be. Or we’re letting a particular person get under our skin and we’re not setting a boundary on them and saying hey please don’t speak to me that way. You know I I don’t want you having those conversations. But that that concept of be before do that I wrote about in the book. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:37.531)Yes. Margie Warrell (20:44.274)you know when you’re clear about who you want to be and you reset because that’s a choice we make every day then you know you’re doing your high grade you’re doing when i’m clear about who i want to be and so you know i have many moments where i’m like my doubts will be really loud in my head and i’ll be starting to go down this like rabbit hole of you’re never going to do this and you’re left behind and you don’t have what it takes and And then I will take myself out for a walk for me getting out in nature, exercising, sometimes music all at once out in nature, exercising and listening to music that just really speaks to, I call it the God within me. That’s like what I really know. You know, that will just do that will shift the space I’m in. And then, you know what, how do I want to show up today? I want to show up. I want to I want to know that I’m here. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:21.159)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:27.815)Right. Margie Warrell (21:33.74)for great things and I show up as someone that lifts everyone around me and I’m not letting whether or not I landed that deal or got invited to speak at that event or XYZ, that is not going to determine how I feel about myself today and how I show up. And coming from that place, it’s like reclaiming our power and going, no, I will not be captive of my circumstances. I’m going to be the captain of my life and I will decide and I’m not going to give that away. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (21:40.595)you Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (22:02.755)you know, there’s a couple amazingly powerful things in there, Margie. The first thing is, you know, it isn’t like a switch. There is a journey, but I do think there is great power. You you used the term doing the work a couple of times. I think part of doing the work is considering what we’re talking about. And then reading a book like yours, where there really are these sort of standout introspective quotes. I circled a bunch in the book, as I mentioned to you. And you can just sort of pause and say, hmm, what does this mean in my life? And journal. And I wanted to share, I’m a huge journaler. I hear my office. I have so many journals going back from when I was backpacking around the world. And it really is amazing. I don’t just write. I like to go back and read, Margie. And you could sort of see, wow, I overcame that fear. Or I had this realization afterwards. So I think there’s something really powerful in reading. the book and looking at the quotes and also these stories that you tell inside. Because sometimes when we read other people’s stories, that’s why we’re so connected to each other. It can inspire us. And then the next part is quote on 120, ability to lift people up and affect positive change begins where your comfort zone ends. So, so much of our self doubt and fear is very me focused and very like, you know, there’s an, you know, there’s an egoic quality to it. But when we kind of radiate out and focus on how we can be of service to others and how we can help other people be more enthusiastic, where we can give praise, where we can give encouragemen

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Brandon and Whitney Cawood In this conversation, Kimberly interviews Brandon and Whitney Cawood, the creators of the documentary ‘To Die For,’ which explores the impact of synthetic dyes on children’s health. They share their personal journey of discovering the effects of these dyes on their son, the scientific research behind the issue, and the challenges of navigating the regulatory landscape. The discussion emphasizes the importance of awareness, advocacy, and community support in driving change, as well as practical solutions for parents seeking to eliminate synthetic dyes from their children’s diets.   About Brandon and Whitney Cawood After discovering their child’s life-altering sensitivity to synthetic dyes, parents and first-time filmmakers Brandon and Whitney Cawood set out to uncover the impacts of these additives. There journey led them to meet with the world’s leading synthetic dye experts, scientists, researchers, and impacted families in the revelatory documentary To Dye For which revealed a series of shocking stories, surprising discoveries and the truth about how synthetic food colorings.   Episode Sponsors: MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription.   SOLLUNA SBO PROBIOTICS OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. Guest Resources Website: https://www.todyeforthedocumentary.com/ Social Media: @ todyeforthedocumentary   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to the Impact of Synthetic Dyes01:23 Personal Journey: The Catalyst for Change06:12 The Science Behind Synthetic Dyes and Their Effects10:49 Regulatory Challenges and the FDA’s Role13:58 The Power of Awareness and Advocacy18:40 The Broader Implications of Food Dyes in Society26:10 Legislative Efforts Against Synthetic Dyes28:05 Challenges in National Regulation29:20 Impact of Synthetic Dyes on Children30:24 Finding Alternatives to Dyes32:15 The Cost of Healthier Choices34:09 The Struggles of Medical Dependency35:51 Elimination and Its Immediate Benefits38:41 The Broader Implications of Dyes40:11 Adult Reactions to Synthetic Dyes43:03 The Journey of Creating the Documentary48:41 Where to Watch the Documentary   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:01.091)Hi everyone and welcome back to our Monday interview. I am so excited for these very special humans that I have with me here today, Whitney and Brandon Kaywood. And they are the power couple behind the new film, To Die For, which I have to say was very powerful for me and very emotional. It explores the impact on our children and really all humans. that synthetic dyes have. They interview experts, scientists, researchers. I’m getting goosebumps even as I talk about it. Stories from families made a lot of news a couple of months ago when red dye was banned and a lot of us hadn’t really thought about the impact of food colorings and dyes. And just more and more is starting to come out and this incredible film really takes a deep dive. I encourage everyone to watch this. and especially if you are parents. So guys, thank you so much for being here with us today. You know, it’s very impactful, your work, this film, you guys are first time filmmakers. Tell us a little bit about the passion that drove you to spending so much energy on bringing this particular subject to life. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (01:23.308)Well, first of all, thank you for having us. That was a beautiful intro. All right. So our story, I guess, was really the beginning of this entire journey. So our son has a profound reaction to synthetic dyes. so between the ages of one and three, he was having a lot of trouble keeping his hands to himself with impulse control. And, you know, in that age, it’s kind of the biting, the hitting, the inability to Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:25.686)you Yeah. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (01:51.928)to cope with the word no, like all of that is normal within reason. how often it was happening per day and just the duration of our fits, it was like pause for concern. And it was an issue, and you really knew it was an issue when every time we took them to church, when they stayed in childcare, it was an issue, play dates or… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:56.463)Yes. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (02:15.48)He did a mother’s morning out where he was just there a couple of hours, a couple of days a week, and there is an issue every single day, write ups, and I have to pick them up. it was obviously worse than his peers in that the way that his teachers described it. And so we were doing our due diligence. We were doing behavior therapy. We were consulting doctors, but it was so early, obviously. We had referrals to a children’s hospital, but but it was so early we didn’t want to pursue a diagnosis or something like that. And so we decided to look into diet. I have a lot of autoimmune predispositions and food allergies. So I knew the power of eliminating certain foods. It was completely transformative for me. So I was hoping to eliminate something and just to help him just slightly. And because that’s how my healing, my healing was like one thing at a time. And then over time my healing happened. But for him, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:54.766)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:03.886)Yes. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (03:11.886)I found an article that suggested eliminating wheat, dairy and synthetic dyes. And so I decided to do that and we were actually on vacation. Actually, that’s how desperate we were. were on vacation and we like, we got to do this. We got to help him. And so we eliminated those things. And initially we thought that the wheat and the dairy would have the biggest impact because that’s, he consumed most of that. And when we, when we really looked at our food, we really only found synthetic dyes in his daily allergy medicine or his Benadryl or Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:16.207)Mm. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (03:40.974)He at that time had chronic ear infections. And so he was kind of on a red 40 loop with amoxicillin and just things to try to conquer his, issues with his ears. And he eventually had tubes, which helped that. But we eliminated those things. And then obviously the occasional treat at a birthday party, we would look at that. within 48 hours, we had a child that was so easy going and Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:47.651)Mm-hmm. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (04:06.422)And so one reason why we didn’t pursue like a diagnosis with a doctor initially is because most of his days were really rough, but we would occasionally have a day where he was like, it was like Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde, like who is this kid? He’s so easy. And so when we eliminated dies within 48 hours, all of those symptoms went away. It was like he was easy going and easy to reason with. It was almost unbelievable. And it was almost like you, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:18.968)Yeah. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (04:35.458)didn’t want to hold your breath, it was actually going to stick. And so we did the elimination diet for 30 days and then we reintroduced wheat and we saw no effect and we reintroduced dairy and we saw no effect. And then when we reintroduced dyes, we saw within 15 minutes, all those behaviors came flooding back. The irritability, the inability to cope, had poor sleeping and then even some things like stimming and things like that, it just like almost immediately came back. And so we knew for him synthetic dyes had a really big impact. And so we, I was really shocked and I almost didn’t want to tell people because it sounds crazy. If you were to tell me that story, I would say, it must’ve been developmental or something else must’ve changed. I would’ve been so skeptical. But I decided to tell people about it. And I was surprised about how many people in my immediate friend group had reactions or knew people that have reactions like that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:20.15)Right. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (05:32.918)And so I decided to start a Facebook group and within just a couple of years, it went from zero to 900,000 people with similar reactions to ours. so around the time we started our Facebook group, I decided to like look at the research and initially I thought it was kind of this hippie hippie thing that, you know, science hadn’t caught up with, but I was really surprised that there was so much scientific evidence and so much research. And so I decided to ask Brandon if he would be willing to document our journey to interview researchers and impacted families so that we could share the information that we learned with those impacted. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:12.525)Wow. Well, you know, what’s really amazing about this story is when many of us think about food dyes, we think about Froot Loops or, you know, Skittles or things that for many of us and not, you know, not all, but for many of us, it’s, you know, Halloween. Maybe my kids will have some Skittles or whatever. But you’re talking about over the counter medications. And in the film, there’s, you know, the home products, toothpaste. Things that people are using and it’s a tiny amount can really adversely affect your child, which to me is absolutely shocking. Benadryl. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (06:51.598)Yeah. Yes, that was shocking for us too, because if your child has a neurologic reaction in that way, a very small amount can trigger that kind of a reaction. for our son, even one mini marshmallow, which the name brand JetPuff marshmallows have blue one, he one day consumed one mini marshmallow and then we had a reaction for 72 hours and it was his teachers noticed it. His teacher met me outside and was like, I’ve never seen him act like this before. Like was, is everything okay at home? And I was like, it was that one mini marshmallow. And then even fast forward, that was when he was in preschool. But fast forward now, he’s going to second grade and he’s been in a public school. goes to an incredible STEM school. just it, while we’ve been at this school, we haven’t had a single time where he’s had a meltdown or been upset or hit anyone. He’s like literally in the 99th percentile in like reading and math. He’s successful socially, academically. And just to compare that to we had, I mean, initially we had a teacher assigned to him so that he didn’t hurt other kids when he was at his mother’s morning out. Like it was such a stark difference in our child. And what was even crazier as we dug in even deeper, like there were so many families that have reactions like this or worse. Many families have Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:44.846)Well. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (08:10.022)much worse reactions. And what we’ve learned along the way is like everybody is kind of on a spectrum. like not every single kid is on the end of the spectrum as our son where he has these like big reaction to synthetic dyes. It’s, know, some kids might be on the low end of the spectrum where they can consume synthetic dyes and there’s really no noticeable, noticeable difference. And then some kids, you know, it may affect them a little, they may be a little irritable or have a little bit of sleep in it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:15.897)Great. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (08:38.262)And it may be more like a toxic buildup. Like the more they have multiple days in a row, the worse it gets. then, and then you have our kids who are like kids, like our son, who’s on like the far end of the spectrum that just a little bitty amounts, can affect them. and the, and, and the only like thing that, that, that we’ve heard about, about like, what could be causing this with kids? Like our son is there was a big study done in Europe, which is the reason why Europe has a warning label on synthetic dyes. And so we went and interviewed. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:41.037)Yes. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (09:06.754)that researcher, Dr. Jim Stevenson, and he’s also very interested in genetics. And so while he was doing that study, he also took a cheek swab of all the kids that were participating. And so what he found is that a lot of the kids who had those stronger reactions had this one variant in like a histamine gene. So histamines are like a neurotransmitter. So there could be that genetic variance in the kids that are having these extreme reactions to synthetic dyes. And very early on, we assumed that Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:23.566)Wow. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (09:36.012)the number of kids who have that type of reaction was going to be very low. like, and the data points to, know, they probably more armor on the rare side, the kids that have these extreme reactions. But like Whitney said, with a group of 900,000 people, we’re hearing thousands upon thousands of stories that are very similar to ours or like she said, even worse. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:50.339)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:54.489)Well, as a parent, what’s infuriating, there’s a, you or there’s an interview in the documentary about scientists saying no humans should be consuming these additives that are artificial and very detrimental to the body, the gut, so many different aspects. It’s sort of like saying, we’re just giving your child a little bit of rat poison, you know, maybe they won’t react, but little bit’s okay. And so, You know, on so many levels, how are these dyes in our system? How are they allowed in Europe? You many of them are not. And in your case, it was just these medications. But think about how many families are unknowingly consuming them in, I mean, the sources we could talk about, they’re in breakfast cereals, they’re in common foods, they’re in bubble gum, they’re in candy, they’re in Gatorade, right? They’re in toothpaste. There’s just so many products. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (10:46.126)Hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:49.699)when you start to look out there that contain these dyes. It’s like billion dollar industry. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (10:52.269)Right. Yeah, well, and if you look back, the approval process for these synthetic dyes happened in the 50s, 60s and 70s. So, I these are, this is decades ago and the FDA is not required to ever like, once they approve something, there’s no, there’s no like obligation for them to like, like reevaluate a chemical. so there’s, know, dyes luckily are a very regulated chemical. Like they’re, they’re so potentially harmful that every single batch of synthetic dye has to be batch certified. So, Anytime the company makes a batch of synthetic dye, they have to send a sample of that into the FDA. They have to like test it to make sure there’s the allowable, the allowable amount of like heavy metals and carcinogens and things like that. So, making sure they’re not, they’re not passing that threshold. So they are pretty regulated, but the approval process for safety, these tests were done decades ago and the test at the time we’re not capable of detecting like the behavioral and neurological issues that we now know that they. that they now know exist because of microscopic changes in the brain. Like they could not detect that. Yeah, there’s animal studies. It’s either animal studies or test tube studies that showed like certain synthetic dyes can make microscopic changes in the brain. So that’s where it gets a little bit different from like an allergy. Like a lot of people try to associate it kind of like an allergy, but allergies can’t make something that you’re allergic to, can’t make a microscopic change in the brain. this is a different- children are allergic to synthetic You can’t have like a reaction type allergy to synthetic dyes. So that doesn’t exist, especially like, I think red 40 is a big one that people are actually allergic to. But what we’re kind of focusing on in the film goes beyond that. And it’s these neurological impacts and changes. then, know, there’s a lot of associations with cancer for certain dyes, especially red three. So it’s just this weird Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:21.54)Yes. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (12:45.378)bureaucracy of, you know, the FDA has long said, you know, they’re understaffed and they don’t have enough resources to tackle these sorts of things. And their big focus is obviously on the pharmaceutical side of the FDA, the Food and Drug Administration. You know, there’s multiple advisory boards for the pharmaceutical side, but currently there is no food advisory board. there’s like, it’s really crazy and it’s really messed up. then on top of that, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:10.542)Yeah. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (13:15.682)Like you said, industry has been using these products for so long that they’ve become a marketing tool and they have, they spend tons and tons of money lobbying anytime there’s any kind of legislation to like, to make these changes or have these dyes looked at or evaluated or regulated. So it’s a, it’s a Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:20.495)It’s crazy. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:26.904)Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:32.483)Well, that’s the power to the people, right? This film, and you mentioned it came out right around when Red’s Eye was banned, which for many of us were like, my gosh, amazing. We didn’t think that something like this could actually happen. So it gives me hope that more and more people have this information and speak up and are pushing for that change because a lot of people, you know, you guys were talking about the film, it just wasn’t really talked about. But now people are starting to talk about it. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (13:58.834)Yeah. Yeah. People that that’s, that’s, that’s awesome. But even with red three, like it’s awesome that red three was banned, but it took 35 years for it to happen. like red three was banned in cosmetics in 1990 because studies showed that it caused cancer in animals, but it was already permanently approved in food. So for 35 years, the FDA said they were going to take steps to remove it from food. They just drug their feet and never did it. And then of course you had, you know, the petition, that actually it was the cause of the, of red three getting banned was supposed. think they have like a FDA supposed to have like a 40 day window to respond to a petition. Well, that petition happened in 2022. And so it didn’t like, they didn’t address it until they finally announced that they were going to ban it. think the, you know, with a lot of things happening and a lot of, a lot of this knowledge of getting out there, there was a lot of people talking about it and red three was kind of the low hanging fruit. You know, we already, we’ve, it’s already banned and Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:39.043)No. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:51.522)Yes. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (14:55.704)cosmetics, it’s known to be a, it’s known to cause cancer in animals. like, you know, it’s almost like they gave us a little bit like, okay, we’re going to go ahead and ban red three. But just like you said, it’s taking people making this conversation louder to actually make changes happen. And that’s not to take away from how powerful this is. Like that’s incredible. But to your point, it took so much to just make that happen. And legally the FDA is not Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:11.375)Yes. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (15:24.43)legally allowed to because of the Delaney clause, they’re not allowed to have things in our food system that we know cause cancer in animals. Like that’s pretty intuitive. We don’t want anything in our food system that causes cancer in animals. And I don’t, I don’t think anybody could make a good argument for why we would need these high risk cancer studies on humans. If we know it causes cancer in animals, I think we should not have in our food system. But they’re legally not allowed to do that, but they kept it in our food system for 35 years. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:53.23)Wow. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (15:53.432)Like that’s the year before I was born to put that in perspective. Like that’s a very long time. And the reality is now, know, Brandon was talking about how initially when they were approved, you know, we didn’t, we weren’t able to do the studies that needed to be done to see if they were safe is the reality. But now we have 27 clinical trials, just looking at children and the neurologic behavior or the neurologic issues that we see. And so that’s a lot when it comes to food additives, like that’s unheard of to have so many studies. And that’s just looking at children and to your point, like we can look at the carcinogenic risk, the genotoxicity, the issues that it plays in our gut, the allergic reaction, like there are so many and honestly, I don’t think science has caught up to the effects, to all the cumulative effects of having synthetic dyes, know, regularly, even if you just look at the sleep, like so many children, you know, they have insomnia whenever they consume dyes and so, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:25.423)All right. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (16:52.846)A lot of people, their child will be on an antibiotic. They’re like, they’re not sleeping all night. It must be because they’re sick. When in reality, it could be the die because that’s exactly how many children happen. so if they’re on this loop where they’re eating something colorful in the morning and then they go to school and they have a pop tart for snack. then when they go home, they have, you know, a strawberry or a cherry Gatorade at basketball practice and they go to sleep and they can’t sleep and they’re up all night. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:00.312)Right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:09.912)Mmm. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (17:20.824)you know, there’s so much healing that goes on at night in your body. And so many families have reported like ticks or certain other neurologic issues that are made worse when their child consumes dyes. And so I think that there’s a lot more issues. And the reality is that like Brandon said, that synthetic dyes are a marketing tool. They are only used to make our food look bright and beautiful so that consumers will want to buy them. They don’t add to the taste. On the contrary, they actually make food Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:47.247)Right. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (17:49.39)taste chemically if they use too much of a synthetic dye. And so there’s really no point, especially when many of the synthetic dyes are used to market children’s food so that children will want to buy them. There’s something very dirty about the fact that like things like PediaShirt contained red 3 for decades. And we knew that, we knew that red 3 caused cancer in animals. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:02.029)Great. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:06.029)Yes. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (18:15.8)But like our children, they struggled to gain weight and our pediatrician suggested PediaShare. Luckily I, you know, I made something at home, like I made like a protein smoothie, but so many families just opt to an easy option like PediaShare. Because their doctor tells them to. And it’s, and I don’t even know the doctors. I don’t think that there’s anything evil about doctors. They’re just not trained. They don’t know. And we’ve educated our doctors on it. And it’s just… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:29.591)All right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:36.548)No. Brandon & Whitney Cawood (18:40.074)We, our goal with our film, it’s obviously to create awareness. And when awareness happens, when people know, when people are informed, then change can actually take place. Well, and one thing that that’s like not talked about a whole lot is I’m going to butcher it. I’m going to butcher this definition, but like the FDA has a legal definition of safe when it comes to food additives. And it’s something along the lines of like a reasonable certainty of no harm, but like That’s we’re so far from we have so many studies showing that there there is strong evidence of harm. like technically these chemicals are not like even by the FDA is on definition. I don’t think they can be labeled as safe, but they you know, they have been for so long. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:19.759)All right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:23.385)So a couple of things in there. When you were saying that, the first thing that came to mind is how ironic this is in the broad scope. Because when you look at natural foods, blueberries and strawberries and kale and watermelon, natural foods are so colorful. And where are we in society where we’re making all these artificial colors that are just to make junky foods look bright and fresh instead of, I know this is like a larger systemic issue, but just getting our children Brandon & Whitney Cawood (19:51.105)It is. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:52.879)from the get-go used to nature’s candies, you know, like these natural foods, because there’s so much coal in nature. And then the other thing I wanted to ask you guys about all these research studies and you know, there’s red dye, and then I hear you guys talking about food dyes, like as a category, are the studies on specific ones? How many are there behind red, you know, besides red dye? I there’s yellow dye, there’s blue dye, and is it possible to create like a multi-band? Brandon & Whitney Cawood (19:56.812)Right. You’re so right. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (20:22.371)where instead of,

  This Week’s Episode Special Guest: Soren Gordhamer In this enlightening conversation, Kimberly Snyder and Soren Gordhamer explore the themes of mindfulness, presence, and self-discovery in an age filled with distractions. They discuss the importance of embracing emotions, living from a place of fullness rather than lack, and the role of technology and AI in our lives. Soren shares insights from his book, ‘The Essential,’ emphasizing the need for authenticity, connection, and creating conditions for our gifts to flourish. The dialogue encourages listeners to reflect on their own journeys and the impact of their choices on personal and collective well-being. About Soren Gordhamer SOREN GORDHAMER is the founder + host of Wisdom 2.0, the premier conference for exploring living with greater mindfulness, wisdom, and compassion in the modern age. His new book THE ESSENTIAL: Discovering What Really Matters in an Age of Distraction explores the influence of AI and cutting through distractions to uncover what truly matters in our lives, and engaging purposefully and creatively. He is the founder + host of Wisdom 2.0, the premier conference exploring living with greater mindfulness, wisdom, and compassion in the modern age. It brings the leaders of technology together with leaders in wisdom to explore how we can create a truly livable world. He is also founder and host of Wisdom & AI, an annual event that explores the impact AI will have on society and how we can harness it wisely. Soren is also the founder of the Lineage Project a New York City-based nonprofit that offers awareness-based practices to at-risk and incarcerated teens. He also spent a year walking through parts of the United States, India, Pakistan, and Japan as a part of the Global Walk for a Livable World. He is also a Co-Founder and General Partner of Wisdom Ventures, along with Jack Kornfield and Yung Pueblo, which invests in companies creating a more just and compassionate world. He and Jon Kabat-Zinn also co-hosted the Mitigation Retreat, which was a free 3-month course held every weekday offering meditations and teachings during Covid. He has taught techies at Google, incarcerated youth in New York City, and trauma survivors in Rwanda. Soren is currently focused on the impact AI will have on our world, and how our society can prepare. Episode Sponsors: MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription.   GREENS POWDER OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. Guest Resources Book: THE ESSENTIAL: Discovering What Really Matters in an Age of Distraction Website: https://www.wisdom2summit.com/ Social: @wisdomventures   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Mindfulness and Presence02:49 Navigating Chaos and Embracing Emotions06:01 The Journey of Self-Discovery and Healing09:00 Living from Fullness vs. Lack12:00 Understanding Our True Essence15:07 The Role of Inquiry in Personal Growth18:01 Practical Steps to Connect with Self21:02 The Impact of Information on Our Lives24:04 Nurturing the Next Generation27:03 Conclusion: The Gift of Presence and Authenticity27:26 Understanding Misunderstanding: Embracing Our True Selves28:52 Visionaries and the Courage to Follow Inner Guidance30:25 The Role of Technology in Human Connection32:45 Wellness: The Balance Between Self-Care and Self-Obsession34:52 The Intersection of Spirituality and Health37:48 AI and Humanity: Navigating the Future Together41:14 Rethinking Society in the Age of AI44:50 The Essence of Humanity: Connection Over Technology47:52 Creating Conditions for Our Gifts to Flourish   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:00.6)Hi everyone and welcome back to our Monday interview show. I am so excited for our very special guest here with me today, Soren Gordhammer. He has a new book out, which I absolutely love and did read cover to cover. It’s called The Essential, Discovering What Really Matters in an Age of Distraction. Soren is also the founder and host of Wisdom 2.0, the premier conference for exploring lives with greater mindfulness, wisdom and compassion in the modern age. Thorne, thank you so much for being here with us today. Soren Gordhamer (00:34.169)It’s great to be here. Thank you for inviting me. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:36.718)No, you and I were chatting before the podcast and we were just going on and on. said, wait a second. We had to make record. is. Soren Gordhamer (00:41.425)Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I’m super excited to talk to you because it feels like, you know, it’s always nice to meet somebody who kind of comes to the same kind of like insights, but maybe for slightly different channels. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:56.088)There are so many topics in the book and I ear, what’s the word, dog ear or ear march or whatever you like to call it. I fold it down so many different pages, Soren. I’m like, I really love this. This piece of wisdom really speaks to me. it’s, you know, it’s just something that in the way that you’re packaging is so beautiful. You talk about wholeness, you talk about presence. It’s funny because I had a really challenging morning this morning. I’ll share with you. Soren Gordhamer (01:01.222)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:24.654)I was reading your book afterwards, my son’s who I love so much, one’s in preschool and one’s in third grade. You know, boy energy, I know you have a son as well. And there was just this, you know, like fighting over toys, breakfast, and just so many things. And I was sitting there and I was breathing. And one of the things you talk about in the book is the tension builds when we’re not resisting. And it’s funny because, and I was reading that part of your book after this. Soren Gordhamer (01:49.264)Mmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:53.186)And when I became a new mom, and I know we have a lot of moms in the community, it was just, it just felt so challenging to really, you know, have to manage all these different personalities and all these different energies. And it’s not that it’s not challenging now, but a little bit further along the path toward, there is a lot of wisdom in what you said about just sort of being in chaos or messiness. Soren Gordhamer (02:05.2)Yeah. Soren Gordhamer (02:09.915)Yeah. Soren Gordhamer (02:18.555)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:20.042)and not trying to wish it with something else and just sort of relax into it. Soren Gordhamer (02:22.799)Yeah. Yeah. I think that’s really our challenge today. There’s so much coming at us and I think virtually there’s even more coming at us than our phone pings and alerts and the energy just can get pretty intense. And part of the reason, you know, I really kind of questioned or struggled with the subtitle as like, how do we, you know, discovering what really matters in an age of, is it distraction? Is it stress? Is it turmoil? Like, what’s that word? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (02:33.154)Yeah. Soren Gordhamer (02:49.037)And I think it’s more that there’s just so much coming at us that we lose center, we lose balance. And when we come back, just like you did to our breath, to our body, to how we’re feeling, it’s not like the kids all of a sudden start behaving better, but our resistance to them and our frustration with them and our anger towards them takes on a different context because we’re no longer seeing them as the enemy. We’re seeing that there’s this challenge coming through and that we get the opportunity to respond. And how might the response expand me? How might it open my heart? How might it develop my compassion versus like, this should not be happening. They should not be doing this thing. They are the problem. The problem needed to be solved. And I’m not saying they don’t need to have rules and guidelines and sometimes have repercussions for their actions, but the energy behind that can either be one of this should not be happening. You’re doing something wrong. or it can be the energy of just like, wow, this moment is inviting me into something. How do I expand into it? And I think that inquiry is really the inquiry that we need to make. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:48.942)Exactly. it’s really, there’s a part of the book where you talk about feeling a full spectrum of feelings and knowing that as humans, do experience all these things. And that’s part of, I think, what real presence is in aliveness. Because many of us are not taught to feel feelings. know Sorin, for as an adult, I’m unlearning and relearning a lot. And part of that is saying, wow, you know, there was so much of my… Soren Gordhamer (04:10.545)We’re all, yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:16.216)childhood and what I learned to be like, this doesn’t feel good. Let me prove my worth. Try to mitigate this pain of not feeling lovable by, hey, look at my A’s, look at my perfect grade, look at this. Right. And so then there’s a lot of blocks and things that, you know, certainly in your book can spark just a different way of revisiting things that you can do. Soren Gordhamer (04:27.673)Yeah, yeah. Soren Gordhamer (04:38.265)Yeah, think, yeah, and what I tried to do in a very, hopefully, you know, honest way is just to tell my story around it and how I got accustomed to the fact that I’m carrying my past with me in the present moment. And how do I become curious about the stories, the myths, and the attitudes that I kind of grew up with that are carrying me today that maybe don’t serve me. And sometimes I like to think of it as like cages. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:02.744)Yes. Soren Gordhamer (05:06.309)that we put up or armor that we put up. And at one point in our life, we did need to put that armor up because it was really dangerous outside and so we needed bars. And then that danger leaves, but we’re still walking around with bars. You know, the bars are still in the cage and we have to go back and like tend to those parts of ourselves that are still hurt, that are still in pain, that are still wounded. So we can show those parts that it’s safe now to let down some of those bars and open our heart in a way that maybe we couldn’t when we were younger. And so I talk about how my own life has unfolded and how my drive to be successful was in part a way of covering up an early pain I had of being a kid and my parents divorcing, my mom leaving and live with my dad. And the narratives that I started to develop around unworthiness and of course something must be wrong with me. Why else would your mom leave and your parents divorce? And there’s something I did. And if you had asked me, like I would say, oh no, I don’t have that thought, I’m fine. But when I really took a deep look at it, I realized that there was this unconscious motivation driving me and it was never fulfilled. was not like, oh, I made it now. I did the successful this or the successful that. There was just like a constant seeking and a constant running. And I think the only way to be free of that is to question that story and to be like, is that really true? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:26.894)Mm. Soren Gordhamer (06:27.033)and to go back and to see if we can heal whatever parts of ourselves that we exiled or pushed away. So for me, a lot of it was in order to be a success, I have to push away my vulnerability and my not knowing and my fear. Like I have to make sure that nobody sees those, only people see my confidence and my happiness. And yet we’re humans, we’re all of it. Parts of us are fearful, parts of us are angry, parts of us are happy. For me, that wholeness involves embracing all those parts and not just building an identity around a pain that we had that really doesn’t serve us. through my conference, I’ve been able to interview, as you probably have, some of the most successful people in the world. I’ve interviewed the founders of OpenAI and Anthropic and LinkedIn and eBay and PayPal and all the different companies. And it’s not like those people succeeded, but not all of them have been healed where they’re actually satisfied and content. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:01.794)Right. Soren Gordhamer (07:24.965)And I think how do we live in a way that’s content with the present moment and when our heart is open and we don’t necessarily have this like enormous either thriving energy or fear energy. I think it can go either way. Either we’re thriving towards success or we’re afraid of putting ourselves out there. We’re afraid of being seen. So we’re just going to spend our days on TikTok or Instagram or the news because we’re kind of hiding out in our apartment or our house and the life. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:28.59)more Soren Gordhamer (07:51.801)question is just like, do we move forward and how do we more fully show up in the world in an authentic way? And that was my hope with the book was just to kind of share my journey in that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:02.614)Yes, I love all the stories along the way and the honesty. you know, if people are different parts of the journey, soreness, sometimes we think, well, hmm, how do I know if I am stuck in the story or I am in the past? And I could say for me personally, one of the biggest markers of my growth has been just feeling more peace because we’re on that treadmill of achievement. What we would say is the propelled heart stage. Soren Gordhamer (08:17.649)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:32.686)It’s like always on, like you said, social media, always consuming, always producing, always trying to uphold this persona or this mask or this identity. And then there’s that dopamine hit if you get a viral post or whatever it is, but it’s not really sustainable. And if we’re really honest with ourselves, it’s not really peaceful. It’s like walking on this razor’s edge of like, hey, let’s just up and down. And there’s something to be really said of, know, things aren’t always going to work out. It’s not always going to look. Soren Gordhamer (08:41.061)Mm-hmm. Soren Gordhamer (08:44.496)Yeah. Soren Gordhamer (08:56.593)Yeah. Soren Gordhamer (09:00.913)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:02.646)you know, neat and pretty and how we want, but can I find more peace with what is with myself? Soren Gordhamer (09:08.24)Yeah, yeah, 100%. I think that’s the number one thing. if we do that, and we were talking before, the creativity that comes out of you is so much different than just that striving for some future moment that this moment doesn’t have. And if I can just get this moment, if I can just get my life situation in this little perfect way, everything is going to be great, right? If I can get all these things and we’ve seen it again and again and again, it doesn’t necessarily satiate, right? There’s still this sense of lack. And I think that’s really a beautiful question. Are we living from lack? Are we living from fullness? And I’d like to think we can create more things. We can make more money. We can have better friends. We can be a better partner, better parent when we actually know ourselves and we’re coming more from a place of fullness rather than a place of lack. And when you’re with somebody and you can feel that lack and they could have bazillions of dollars and be the most famous person in the world. Like they could have all the external, but internally they still feel lack. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:55.032)Yeah. Soren Gordhamer (10:05.435)They feel like they’re not enough. And I think that is the thing that we have to be so careful of and the algorithms that now run our lives on social media. Give us lack. Yeah. They make a ton of money on us feeling lack and continuing to stay on the scroll of the next hit and the next thing and keeping us glued to that. it’s… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:13.696)Attention. Yeah. Soren Gordhamer (10:27.633)I want to complain about that, but it’s just the truth. There’s a system there that wants you to feel lack because it makes more money the more you feel lack. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:36.48)Mm, you know, it’s funny, so when you and I were talking about the journey a little bit and earlier on, as I mentioned, I was pulled into this celebrity world and I was just pretty fresh off of backpacking and it wasn’t something that I planned or chose. A lot of people like, how did you do that? Like I didn’t try, I don’t know what it’s taken to this day. I’m not a movie person. Suddenly I’m on and, you know, what was really interesting, cause I would ask God I aspire. I’m like, why am I here? Soren Gordhamer (10:58.971)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:06.178)And then I started to get this knowingness, know, everything is growth, everything is learning. And one of the growths for me was sort of getting that inner peak into some of these, you know, the lives of people that are on all the magazine covers and be the most famous, the most beautiful and all the timeless and, know, people’s most, whatever beautiful list and having a lot of anxiety amplified and Soren Gordhamer (11:09.275)Mm-hmm. Yeah. Soren Gordhamer (11:20.421)Yeah. Soren Gordhamer (11:24.835)Mm-hmm. Soren Gordhamer (11:31.845)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:32.674)then there’s a part of the book where you say, this system that you speak about is trying to convince us that what is not really essential, like what all these celebrities are doing or having the most followers or all these things aren’t really essential to our wholeness and our wellbeing. It’s not gonna bring the connection to our hearts, to ourselves, to other people. And so it is this giant fallacy. And I’m not saying, Soren Gordhamer (11:42.513)Thank Soren Gordhamer (11:51.653)Yeah. Yeah. Soren Gordhamer (11:58.267)Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:00.728)Believe, you know, I’m not trying to say, know, the amazing things came out of that period and it certainly helped to find my voice as an author and things. I’m very grateful. But it was, it was a little bit, at the time of being in my early twenties, a little bit disconcerting, like, you know, why is the world as it is? Like, why are we striving for something that just feels like the compass is so off? Soren Gordhamer (12:06.118)Yeah. Yeah. Soren Gordhamer (12:19.238)Yeah. Soren Gordhamer (12:24.985)Yeah, I think it’s because we don’t know who we are. We don’t know who we are. And when we can better understand who we are, which is only an inner journey, like nobody can tell you who you are, but you can get glimpses of who you truly are, like the beauty that you truly are, independent of the shape of your body or the age of your body or your intellect or your bank account or your number of followers. There’s like a beauty to each one of us. And I think when we discover that, we walk Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:29.495)Yeah. Soren Gordhamer (12:53.521)through the world a little differently. Granted, we will forget it probably 10,000 times going forward, but if we can get in touch with that inner dimension, that inner knowing, that inner intelligence, I think that’s the only medicine. And then if life wants us to be a successful actor, actress, amazing, and we can play that role, we can do that dance, or an ex, or a CEO of the largest company, whatever, we can play that dance, but we know that’s just a dance. We know that’s not who we are. So we’re not living in this incredible fear that we’re going to lose that status that we have, or there’s a more beautiful model that’s coming up, who’s going to take over our job and then we’ll be less than again, and this fear of lack, this constant searching back and forth. So I think the beauty is to know who we are and then to be able to play in this world of form. mean, isn’t it amazing to write books or to post things or to build companies? It’s all like amazing. if our identity doesn’t depend on it, if we think that I’m this now, I’ll be more of a better person or my rank will increase when I get this, we’re totally lost the path versus like, know who I am and this just wants to be expressed out of me and I’m just going to enjoy it and celebrate it. And I’ve always liked the Buddha, the Buddha said, I teach the path that’s glorious in the beginning, glorious in the middle and glorious in the end. And it might be hard, but there still needs to be a gloriousness with it, right? Like you’re in the process of creating a business or writing a book or doing something. And we feel like we’re supercharged by a power that we’re aligned with that makes that moment so sweet. And we still want to create something and we still want to make an impact. And I think that’s the balance that when we can find that balance, extraordinary things come from that. And it’s not so much by me, but it’s through us, right? We’re tuned to something and it’s happening through us. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:37.708)Yes. Soren Gordhamer (14:41.145)And we can feel like, and we talked about, it’s just the most beautiful feeling because we realized we’re just a channel for something to move through and we each have different karmic assignments, right? So one person might, karmic assignment might be to go into the food industry or the fashion industry or the healthcare industry or whatever. And it doesn’t matter really. I mean, it’s not like, this form is better than being a hermit or being a spiritual teacher is better than being a business owner. Like, I don’t think so. I just think we have different karmic assignments and then how do we fully embody what those are from a place of deep love and compassion and openness. And I think that’s what the world is hungry for. We’re hungry for that presence and that authenticity. And I think the algorithms tell us on you just keep staying here and we’re going to eventually give you something satisfying, but you just keep have to stay in here long enough. And so like people spend four to five hours a day on the platforms and Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:22.093)Yes. Soren Gordhamer (15:34.457)I just think it’s really, really sad. And I totally understand using the platforms for business and, you know, it’s where people’s attention are and it makes sense to have some engagement. But there’s a moment where it shifts from like, this is useful use of social media to now I’m just bored and lonely and I’m just being fed this algorithm that doesn’t serve me. And I think it’s really important for us to know when that turn happens so that we’re aware and we realize like, wow, what actually matters to me? Maybe it calling a friend or going for a walk. or going to a yoga class or meditating or, you know, there’s certain things that are probably more nurturing than being caught in that loop. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:12.48)Yes, yes, it’s true. It’s, I think a lot of people listening to this can say, know that feeling of sort of disconnection or not feeling really peaceful or really fulfilled. And there is a journey between what you’re saying, knowing who we are, which sounds, you know, it sounds true, but there’s also practical steps. And for me, it’s practice, consistency to get there. Because I think about myself, you know, 15 years ago when I was starting really out on the path and the anxiety and the masks and they’re not really knowing who I was. I used sit and meditate and I was, you and I am and I still follow the teachings of Paramahansa Yogananda, Kriya Yoga, and now our own Heart Aligned Meditation and that consistency soren of sitting in meditation and also in nature, not having my phone, the stillness and the spaciousness. Soren Gordhamer (16:45.937)Yeah. Yeah. Soren Gordhamer (16:54.661)Yeah, yeah. Soren Gordhamer (16:59.334)Mmm. Soren Gordhamer (17:07.557)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:08.384)and inquiry because your books raise a lot of, you know, I love to read and sort of reflection have helped me progress. Those are some of the practical steps I would say. What are some of the practices or steps you would say to someone or what’s really helped you to go from identified with a mask or spaciousness of I know more of who I am. Soren Gordhamer (17:13.509)Mm-hmm. Soren Gordhamer (17:25.659)Yeah. Hehehehe Soren Gordhamer (17:32.891)That’s a beautiful question. I think, you I appreciate what you said about my book because I try to make it more of an inquiry for people. So at the end of the chapter, I’ll be like, you you might want to ask, what are the stories that are running your life? I’m not going to tell people what stories are running their life or assume, but I think that kind of inquiry is actually really, really valuable. It’s like, huh, you know, it’s almost like we’re handed a backpack and it’s all the stories of, you know, our society and our family. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:57.835)You Soren Gordhamer (18:01.041)And at some point it helps to look in that backpack and be like, are these true for me? Like, what are the stories that seem impactful for me? And I think to discover who we really are, it’s not a story, right? It’s not like even we can say I’m a spiritual person. Like to me, that’s so limiting because like we are the essence of the cosmos, you know, really like the big bang happened, whatever 13 billion years ago. We are the expression of that. Like we are the energy of that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:22.358)is. Soren Gordhamer (18:29.859)you know, what els

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Almost 30’s Krista Williams In this engaging conversation, Krista Williams, co-host of the Almost 30 podcast and author of the book ‘Almost 30’, shares her journey of writing the book, navigating change, and embracing authenticity in relationships. The discussion delves into the importance of trust, vulnerability, and the role of money in our lives, as well as the impact of friendships on personal growth. Krista emphasizes that life is about becoming and that we should allow ourselves to be supported by the universe in our journeys. About Krista Williams Krista Williams is a content creator, author, and co-host of the successful “Almost 30” podcast. Known for her style and vibrancy, followers flock to Krista for dating, travel and self-care inspiration. Krista’s first book Almost30: A Definitive Guide to a Life You Love for the Next Decade and Beyond launched in June. Krista is one of the deepest, most curious minds, yet at the same time heart centered and intuitively led. As a multi passionate creator and life experimenter, Krista’s work includes The Life Edit, Metamorphosis, Modern Tarot, Spotify’s Top New Podcast, Morning Microdose and the #1 ranking Almost 30 Podcast. Krista has learned everything she teaches the hard way: by times of suffering allowing her to share embodied insights over commodified knowledge, and out of necessity, discovering the tools and research that transformed her life and got her to where she is today. Episode Sponsors: MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. DETOXY OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order.   Guest Resources Book: Almost30: A Definitive Guide to a Life You Love for the Next Decade and Beyond. Website: almost30.com Social: Instagram: @itskrista 123K   Episode Chapters Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Krista Williams and Her Journey02:18 The Decision to Write a Book04:41 Understanding the Saturn Return and Life Changes06:58 Embracing Change and Flexibility08:48 Navigating Modern Dating and Authenticity10:11 Solitude vs. Loneliness in Relationships12:03 Reclaiming the Concept of God14:01 The Importance of Trust in Relationships17:29 Finding Beauty in Life’s Uncertainties20:34 The Call of Your Soul and Personal Growth22:54 Conflict Avoidance and Clearing Conversations24:25 The Power of Clearing Conversations27:34 The Importance of Friendships30:30 Understanding Money and Abundance40:41 Navigating Perfectionism and Self-Worth SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:01.187)Hi loves, welcome back to our Monday interview show. I am so excited for my very special guest here with us today. Ms. Krista Williams, who is a content creator, author, co-host of the Almost 30 podcast and her first book is out now called Almost 30, a definitive guide to a life you love for the next decade and beyond. And also Krista is a dear friend of mine personally, we’ve known each other for years. So Krista, thank you so much for being back on the show with me. You’ve been on, but I think it’s been a couple years. So welcome back. Bob (00:41.294)Thank you. feels surreal to be talking to the master author herself, author of some of the best books, eight books, and be a first time author. So I feel really lucky and I feel really grateful because I know your audience is just incredible, so heartfelt and loving and open. And I feel so lucky to connect with them and share more about the book and more about some of the lessons and themes in it that I’m hopeful to be really supportive of for them. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:07.907)You know, I remember we were on the same flight going to Mexico or wanderlust. I think it was last year, a year and a half ago. I flew only with Momo, my little one. And I remember distinctly waiting for our bags. And you started telling me that you were about to write the book or you were thinking about writing the book. And so was just that Genesis back then. I remember that spark was, was just being lit. So. Bob (01:12.982)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (01:38.145)Tell us about the decision. As an author, it’s like very near and dear to my heart, the decision to actually put pen to paper, so to speak, writing. The written word is very different format of communication. Bob (01:52.398)Yeah, I remember meeting at the airport too and spending the best week with Momo in Mexico. And, you know, for anyone listening that has something to say or a story to tell or something they believe that should be heard, just encouraging them to start writing, to start doing, to put themselves out there. I was someone that for so long knew that there was a book inside of me, knew that there was a book inside Lindsay and I, but we just wanted the right time to come up. You know, I wanted to feel like… I was the type of woman that could write the type of book that we wrote with almost 30. When we started the show, we were on our closet floors. We were at rock bottom. I felt so lost in life and I felt like I should have known more answers. I felt like I didn’t have a purpose and I would say I was at my worst. And through the years of doing the show, through the years of doing so much self-development work and deepening my spirituality and really coming back home to myself, I’ve really found out. all of the ways in which you can really create and sculpt a life that you love, that have worked for myself, for my best friend and co-host, for some of the experts on the podcast and for some of our audience. And so I wanted to feel first, like I was ready. I wanted to feel secondly, like it was divinely guided and supported and the process of getting the book teal and writing the book was so divinely guided and supported. It was so stunning. And so, and then third, I wanted to feel like I really had something to say. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:11.629)Yeah. Bob (03:17.782)I wanted to feel like the book was meaningful and I think there’s a lot of self-help books out there. There’s a lot of books that people tell you that you should read, that you have to read, and I’m not gonna tell you that you should read or have to read my book, but I wanted to actually feel like I as a reader would get as much value from it as the person would reading it. And so I really feel like all those things came together. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:35.48)Hmm. Beautiful. So I think for me picking up the book for the first time and maybe people listening to this Krista, it’s called Almost 30. Is this book for people almost 30 and you guys started the show at that, you know, around that point in your life and now, you know, many of us have crossed over 30. it’s relevant for, you know, women and people of any age and then we’ll Bob (03:47.886)It’s me. Mm-hmm. Bob (03:55.18)Yeah. Bob (03:59.711)I myself have crossed that bridge. Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:07.528)into that, the Saturn return and that particular period. Bob (04:11.694)Yeah, so it is for anyone of any age. And the reason why it’s called Almost 30 is because the podcast Almost 30 that Lindsay and I do started when we were almost 30, when we were in this period of time called the Saturn Return. It’s a really important astrological transit that I wish I knew about when I was in my 27 to 30 year period. What happens during the Saturn Return is that astrologically Saturn, the planet revisits the same point in your natal chart as it was in the sky when you were born. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:41.059)Mmm. Bob (04:41.314)And what this means plainly is that Saturn is the task master planet. So where each of the areas of your life that you’re living unaligned come up, they’ll be up for review. So say for an example, you’re in this period between 27 and 30, it’s around 29.5 years for most people. You are in a relationship that isn’t aligned with your soul, or you’re at a job that doesn’t let you up. During this time, you might break up with that person, you might leave your job, you might get fired. There’s a lot of change and transition that happens. And it can be really scary and it can be really jarring or it can be really beautiful for you seeing your life as something that has a lot of opportunity and positivity and magic. And there’s a lot of really important decisions that happen in this period. So where there’s information that applies to this period, it’s not just for people in this period because we always go through change. We always go through a transition. We’re always evolving and we’re always becoming. And the lessons in, know, sections in this are around career. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:31.084)Yes. Bob (05:40.022)around money, around nutrition and nourishment and the body. They’re around purpose and they’re around spirituality and search for meaning. And so the more important broader topics are topics we’ve talked about on the show over the past 10 years, but really the entry point is being in good relationship to change and really finding out who you are through the process. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (05:58.562)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:02.157)Beautiful and like you said, it is that particular moment in time, but there’s always ongoing change. remember that time and I was in New York and there’s a lot of changes going on and it was, you know, around when I started writing books and I well, I guess I started doing Korea yoga a little bit before that, but shortly after I moved to LA, but I have to say Krista since then having children and there’s been so many changes. So it really is. Bob (06:11.469)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:31.191)you know, embracing that adaptability. Bob (06:33.558)Yeah, it’s huge. It’s one of the most important things we can be is flexible in life. It’s being really fierce about what we want and where we want to go and who we want to be, but being very flexible about how that comes. And when we can really apply flexibility to everything, to our spiritual practices, to our relationships, to our friendships, to our body, everything just gets better and easier and lighter. And we can not only love ourselves, but we can also love our life. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:38.071)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:58.657)Yes. And one of the things I love about how much you share and again, bracing change, and you’ve talked about this openly is, you know, with your dating life and your love life and you give talks at Bumble and you’ve done all these amazing, you give really amazing pieces of advice about being really authentic. Can you share a little bit, because I know we get a lot of questions about people feeling lonely, putting on masks when they’re on dating apps or trying to meet someone and actually, Bob (07:24.27)Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (07:27.361)My husband’s friend was here the other day and he’s not from LA, Krista, and he’s so sweet and he’s like very good looking, like very successful guy. And he’s like on Raya and he’s on these dating apps and he’s like, it’s really lonely. You know, he said that he just doesn’t, he doesn’t want to just hook up, but there’s sort of like, I don’t know. He said, it’s just hard out there. Bob (07:40.302)Mmm. Bob (07:47.586)See ya. Yeah, it is. It’s a very interesting place and just for background and reference for the audience. So I was married. I was in a relationship for 10 years and then I’ve been divorced for the past two years. I took a year off to heal and kind of recalibrate and then I entered the dating world, you know, in a totally different space and time with online dating and apps and matchmakers and all of these things. And so it’s been so eye opening and interesting. Yeah, there’s matchmakers too. Yeah. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:08.589)Mm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:14.083)Let’s try the matchmaker. Wow. Bob (08:18.914)So they’re in like a lot of big cities, but basically people, mostly men pay to be set up with women. And then these matchmaking sites have women as a part of their database. So they’ll approach women online or in person and have them apply to the database. And then you get set up with these men that are with matchmakers. So people, all of that to say with online dating, with matchmakers, with all of these things, people are really lonely and looking for connection. And it makes a lot of sense that we’re more connected than ever in the digital world. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:35.309)Go. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:44.545)Yeah. Bob (08:48.622)but yet we feel more alone. It can feel really lonely to be inauthentic when we’re online and feel like we have to present as perfect or wear a mask. It can feel really lonely to go to your job and feel like you can’t be yourself and you’re inauthentic. And so the more inauthentic we are and the more invitations for inauthenticity, the lonely we’re going to feel because we’ve lost connection to the true version of us. I know for me when I was in the corporate world for six or eight years, I felt really lonely because I was being inauthentic all day. didn’t feel like I could be myself. I didn’t feel like I could be emotional or deep or curious or inquisitive or all the things that I love about myself. So I think there’s a few different things happening. There’s obviously the change of the landscape of dating where it’s more dopamine based, it’s more validation based, it’s very surface. It’s kind of hitting on people’s fears about love and relationships and people are really feeling like they’re struggling to find depth and. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:34.669)Yeah. Bob (09:42.378)meaningful connection and intention because of the pace. And then I also feel like because there’s so much invitation with the online world to be out of our authenticity and to perform, people really don’t have enough time to connect with the truth of who they are and be themselves fully and completely. And I’ve found that there is such a difference between being lonely and solitude. And Jay Shetty talks about this, but when we have solitude, we’re really choosing to be with ourselves and create intentional relationship with ourselves. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:04.547)Right. Bob (10:11.98)And then when we’re lonely, we’re almost feeling like we’re doing something wrong because we don’t have someone or we’re not with another person. And I’ve felt both experiences of both solitude and loneliness. And I know loneliness can be really hard, but I think what I seek to do the most is firstly with dating, I have the intention to just enjoy myself and have fun. I have the intention to meet people as they are. I’m not gonna meet every man and say, are you my husband? Are you gonna be the one that saves me? Are you gonna provide me with the life that I want? I just want people to show up as themselves. I want to show up as myself. I think secondly, I don’t do online dating or apps. I found it to be interesting and fun, but I didn’t feel like the frequency and the pace really fit me. And I told God that he needs to bring men in another way and God’s been doing that. So I just had a clear conversation with God about what works for me and what doesn’t. And then third, think being really mindful about the ways in which we’re closing our hearts repeatedly, know, and we’re kind of affirming these beliefs that we’re gonna be alone or that no one will find us and really continuing to have the hope that if God is the creator of earth and life and all things, that God can find the right person for you. And there can be that person that’s gonna be your perfect match. And lastly, really focusing on how you can feel really at peace and at home with yourself, even when you’re alone. Because I think no matter what in life, even if we have a partner or not, it’s really important that we cultivate and develop a sense of peacefulness when we are by ourselves. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:38.339)You know, there’s so much in that Krista, and I have to say, I love how clear you are in having that conversation with God. And I love how you use that word. I use it too. Yeah, you have sections in the book where you talk about really connecting to that, you know, that allness, that energy inside and around all things. Some people like to use the word spirit, creative source, universe, whatever it is, but we’re all talking about the same thing. And you Bob (11:44.865)Yep. Bob (12:03.042)Yeah, just to speak on that a little bit, just because I know for some people it can be triggering a little bit to hear the word God. You know, I was someone that grew up in the middle of Ohio and really conservative town and God for me was not a word I loved at all. was like, so like, if you would have heard me saying God, I’d be like, turn it off. Like so boring. Don’t like it kind of gave me just a feeling of constriction. And I almost had to reclaim the word God outside of religion and not allow. the structures and places of religion to take away what I know to be God, which is a benevolent being that loves me and works with me and collaborates me and is in support of my dreams and desires and only wants the best for me. And whether people call it God or universe or Allah or source or a Tom, whatever people want to use is totally fine. And I think they should find what works best for them. But I really found in reclaiming the word God, it almost felt like an act of rebellion a little bit for me against the structures and ways that religion took away this connection to something. that just loves us so deeply. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:02.167)That’s right. You Yogananda uses that word a lot. And in terms of this underneath all the dogma and all the different ways and religions and paths up, there is that one source, that one love. And so, yeah, so I very much connect to that. And I got really clear too, Krista, when I had my breakup and you and I have talked about this a little bit, I didn’t want to go on dating apps. And the monk that from the Self-Realization Fellowship said, you know, just feel, just work on yourself, like connect. So I read scriptures and meditated a lot and took care of Emerson, my older, for about eight or nine months. And then he also said to me, you know, your soulmate is like never far. Like the way, like, it’s like the circles are pretty close. And he just said, you know, just use your intuition and say yes to opportunities. So I remember this very interesting dinner party opportunity came up and I said, sure, why not? I don’t have other plans. And that’s when I met. John, who you’ve met. And it really was our first year of marriage was, you most challenging and like working out, being together and trauma came up, but it really can with this consciousness and this connection that you’re talking about, it does get deeper and deeper and more and more amazing. Now we’re in six years of marriage. you’re on me love. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:29.023)Opsies. Can you hear me? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:37.687)Hmm. We’ll edit this part out, of course, but the sound just went out. you just came back. You came back. don’t know what you just. Yes, it went away and then came back. Okay. Bob (14:43.156)I know that’s so weird. Let me see. Okay, perfect. Is it back? Okay, good. Okay, good. Yeah, there’s two things I just want to say about what you just said, which are so beautiful. And the first is just to provide a little clarity on, you know, my conversation with God and, know, you can even provide yours because I think when people hear that they’re a little curious about what that conversation would be, especially if you’re someone that’s dating online or you want to find the person that you love. The way that I have a conversation with God like that is just getting really, really clear. getting really, really quiet and speaking in a way that’s very directive of like, God, I’m available in service to you and I’m no longer gonna pursue the apps. Like, please bring them in another way. know, please bring in men another way. I’m available for karmic relationships. I’m available for my person. Like saying what I’m available for and not. And whether it’s God or just the universe sort of responding to you and co-creating with you, you can be in clear choice. And in this situation, I think what’s most important is that my energy behind it is Truth and knowing and there’s no fear. I don’t feel scared to go back on the apps I don’t feel like there’s a Timeline where I’m gonna have to go back online and find someone so I think like you had such clarity and intention with your healing you were like I’m gonna heal I’m gonna focus on this and I’m gonna then also follow my intuition and be available for what’s possible There was no pressure. There was no forcing with any of it, which is so beautiful and I think when you put pressure on it and force it can make it hard and then Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:07.969)Yes. Bob (16:16.3)Just briefly, a second thing, which I love that you brought up about how hard the first year of your marriage was, because I think as you get older and you start to date and get into relationships, it’s really beautiful because you know who you are, you know your preferences, you know what’s important to you, you have deep relationships. But what’s also hard is that you also have more fear. You could have more protection. You could have more protector parts and ways of being that could keep you out of really deep love and relationships. And so, Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (16:38.531)Thank Bob (16:44.362)It can be really challenging at first when you commit to that new loving relationship because you’re going to have a lot of fears. Are they going to leave me? Are they going to abandon me? Are they going to cheat on me? Are they always going to do this thing? And you really actually have to work with a different set of things that come up when you’re older compared to when you’re younger. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:04.259)And also just when you really do find that love, for me it was, you’re not playing it safe anymore, there’s a vulnerability because you really are open to this person potentially hurting you. And so for me, it was leaning into real trust, trust in God, trust in me, trust in my partner and trust in life. So you talk about all these subjects in the book, love, you talk about. purpose and how family matters and I know you have really rich friendships and you travel all the time, would you say too, that heals the attachment that you’ve already been married, right? So it heals the attachment of like, have to get married again or like has to look a certain way. Cause I think that’s part of, you know, the expansiveness of life is sometimes it doesn’t always work out how we want it to be, but it can be amazing in many ways. Bob (17:40.343)Mm-hmm. Yes. Bob (17:55.062)Yeah, I’m so grateful for all the things that haven’t worked out for me. I wouldn’t have the life that I have without it. And I think when we can kind of see things is that it can get so much more beautiful. An example is that I was married and I think there is one way to view it where it’s like, could have had kids with someone. I could have had the house. I could have had all the things, but it wouldn’t have been a life that would have felt good for me. And I know from leaving that relationship that When we can choose what’s right for us and what’s intentional for us, our lives can get even better than we could have ever imagined. And when I left that relationship, I had no idea what would happen in my life. I had no idea if I would move, if I would find someone, if I would not find someone, if I would regret it. I just knew that it felt like the right decision for me at the time. And sometimes in life, the most beautiful paths are paths that we don’t know the destination to. We don’t know where we’re going. We don’t know where we’re being led. We just have to follow where we’re being called. And when I’ve done that in my life, my life has gotten even better. And another example is with Lindsay and I, know, when we started the podcast in 2016, she was the perpetually single one. She was always single. She was single for seven years. I was in a really long-term relationship with my ex-husband and now she’s married in Brooklyn with a baby. I’m single in LA with no kids. Like what was thought to be my path is now her path and vice versa. And so, Life just kind of throws things at you and takes you to where you need to go, even if you don’t know where you’re going at the time. And the more we can loosen the grip on this really small, defined idea we have of our lives and really expand into the belief that God has a better plan for us or universe has a better plan for us, the more magic we can allow in and the more miracles we can experience. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:41.635)Yes, I think that really is the heart of connection, right? We’re so connected to the heart, to the true self. And then the attachments to this has to be a certain way and should be married by the time I’m 30. I should have a couple of kids by now, whatever it is. It loosens because the connection is always there. No matter what it looks like on the outside, it’s not gonna look like everybody else’s path and it’s okay. Bob (20:04.844)Yeah, think in your, a lot of the reason why we wrote Almost 32 was because in your 20s, know, up until your 26, from a brain science perspective, your prefrontal cortex hasn’t developed. So your prefrontal cortex is responsible for processing, for thinking into the future, for emotional regulation. So until that point, you’re actually working with an unconscious mind that’s really working on the programming from your parents, fro

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Ghanim Al Sulaiti In this episode Ghanim Al-Sulati shares his transformative journey from a traditional lifestyle to embracing a plant-based diet, inspired by Kimberly Snyder’s book the Beauty Detox Solution. He discusses the impact of food on health, the cultural challenges of veganism in Qatar, and the importance of education in nutrition. Ghanim highlights his entrepreneurial ventures, including the establishment of Evergreen Organics, and emphasizes the emotional and spiritual connections to food. He reflects on personal growth, the role of community, and the ongoing journey of self-discovery through food and lifestyle choices. In this conversation, Ghanim shares his journey of navigating challenges during COVID, the importance of building a sustainable business ecosystem in Qatar, and his commitment to giving back to the community. He discusses his deep connection to Qatar, the lessons learned from the desert, and the shift towards mindful eating and home cooking. Ghanim emphasizes the significance of presence in relationships and the evolution of family dynamics. He also outlines his vision for improving health in Qatar, particularly through increased fiber intake and promoting a vegan-friendly environment. About Ghanim Al Sulaiti Ghanim Al Sulaiti is a young Qatari entrepreneur passionate about creating a positive impact on society by promoting a plant based lifestyle. By trade, Ghanim is a qualified Engineer. In his spare time, he is a serial entrepreneur, founding his first business—Evergreen Organics—in 2016, and now has over 10 projects currently live or under development. All of these projects share the same vision and values as its founder—to be vegan, sustainable, and promote a healthier lifestyle. Equipped with a comprehensive understanding of the creative and operational procedures needed to produce excellent brands, Ghanim has a personal interest in developing dialogue about healthy living, veganism and sustainability. With a mind wired for logic and strategy and a desire motivated by the passion of creativity and business savviness, Ghanim is on a mission to help and transform people’s mindsets to live a lifestyle that helps their planet, their health, and their future. Ghanim has worked extensively with local schools and regional organizations such as Qatar Foundation, Ooredoo Doha Marathon, Qatar National Library, Qatar Financial Center, and the Qatar Investment Authority, producing educational programs to change the status quo. He holds a BSc in Civil Engineering from Drexel University, USA.   Episode Sponsors: LMNT: OFFER: Right now, for my listeners LMNT is offering a free sample pack with any LMNT drink mix purchase at DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD. That’s 8 single serving packets FREE with any LMNT any LMNT drink mix purchase. This deal is only available through my link so. Also try the new LMNT Sparkling — a bold, 16-ounce can of sparkling electrolyte water. USE LINK: DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD   FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY Guest Resources Website: Evergreen Organics Social: @ghanim92 Linked IN: Ghanim Al-Sulaiti Episode Chapters Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Ghanim Al-Sulati and His Journey03:00 The Impact of Food on Health and Lifestyle06:07 Transitioning to a Plant-Based Lifestyle08:55 Cultural Perspectives on Veganism12:01 Education and Awareness in Nutrition15:00 Challenges and Support from Family17:59 Religious and Cultural Considerations20:56 The Evolution of Food Choices24:04 Personal Growth and Self-Discovery27:05 The Role of Food in Emotional Well-Being30:05 Building a Business Around Veganism32:59 Future Aspirations and Community Impact37:09 Navigating Challenges and Opportunities During COVID38:36 Building a Sustainable Business Ecosystem40:00 Giving Back to the Community and Empowering Others41:43 The Importance of Roots and Connection to Qatar43:50 Embracing the Desert and Its Lessons44:49 The Shift to Home Cooking and Mindful Eating46:47 The Energy of Intentional Touch and Connection49:00 Practicing Presence in Relationships51:36 The Evolution of Family Relationships53:35 A Vision for Health Improvement in Qatar SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Kimberly Snyder (00:00.824)Hi everyone and welcome back to our Monday interview show. I am beyond thrilled for our very special guest here with us today from across the world in Qatar. His name is Ghanem Al-Sulati and he’s a Qatari entrepreneur. He’s passionate about creating a positive impact on society by promoting a plant-based lifestyle. He has created Evergreen Organics, which since 2016 has Qatar’s first and only completely plant-based cafe. He’s working on 10 different projects all across the Middle East to support healthy living and sustainability. I started finding Ghanim when someone sent me a YouTube video and he was talking about all these incredible festivals and things he was creating in the Middle East. At the very beginning, he mentioned that he had read the Beauty Detox Solution, now over 10 years old, and it had an impact on his philosophy. And I was just feeling so honored. And it’s so amazing that we’re here today. So Ghanam, thank you so much and welcome to our show. Ghanim (01:03.417)Thank so much, Kimberly. mean, this is such an honor as well from my side. I’m absolutely happy that finally I get to meet you as well virtually, but also to be able to share kind of my journey that have not only impacted me personally, but also impacted everybody in Doha because I’ve realized that I’ve taken something from your book, but then managed to create something out of it that is, you know, Kimberly Snyder (01:12.846)Thank Ghanim (01:30.947)creating a wider impact. And I think I’m just so grateful. So thank you so much for, you know, for hosting me here today. And I’m excited to share my story as well with you. And, and let me take you back actually 10, 10 years ago, actually a little bit more 12 years ago, I lived in the States, actually, I lived in Philly. I went to school there. I’m an engineer by profession. And I was actually sitting one morning, watching Good Morning America. Kimberly Snyder (01:51.063)Okay. Ghanim (01:58.745)in 2013 to be specific. I think it was either January or February of that year. And you came in on the show promoting the beauty detox, the green book. And I remember you were talking about how food changed the way you feel and how it actually inspired you to not only kind of Kimberly Snyder (02:05.304)Wow. Ghanim (02:26.083)to learn more about how food can change the way you feel, but also the way you look. And something about what you said kind of made me so interested that I actually got up my couch, went to Barnes and Noble, which was a few blocks away, picked up your book, opened the first couple of pages. And I remember the first few pages, you were talking a little bit about the concept of veganism, but not necessarily like actually like pinning it down and something about like not consuming dairy. And for me, it was a Kimberly Snyder (02:30.413)Yes. Ghanim (02:56.291)someone who never had any kind of, let’s say idea of what you were talking about, I was completely shocked and overwhelmed. So I literally closed the book, put it back on the shelf and I was like, that’s not for me. I don’t think I, I just, I felt there’s something for me, but at that moment when I read it, I remember like just putting it back. The next couple of weeks after that, I started seeing so many signs when I was opening the TV, I was watching kind of let’s say the doctors or Kimberly Snyder (03:00.757)Right. Kimberly Snyder (03:20.813)Wow. Ghanim (03:25.293)couple of these shows where they were talking about plan-based options. I was walking on the streets and there’s big billboards of like this alternative milks. And suddenly I’ve been seeing all of these things that are giving me signs saying like, my God, you need to go back and get the book. I said, you know what, let me just get the book. There’s nothing gonna happen. There’s no harm to read that book. So I took the book, came back home. I was living with my friend at that time. And I decided to read the book in very, like maybe, I would say loudly in the living room with my friend. And I think I was a bit in a sarcastic mood, kind of like every time I read something, I was pretty much either kind of laughing about it or just saying, that’s never going to happen for me. And I don’t know, something changed when I reached, I think part of the book where you’re talking about experimenting and trying to incorporate more greens and more raw food and I remember telling my friend at that time, said, there’s nothing wrong with trying. Let’s just get this recipe, the glowing green smoothie. Let’s just go to the supermarket and get the ingredients and let’s do it. And I still have the first green smoothie that I drank. It’s actually on my Instagram archive, like as a picture there. And to be very honest, it wasn’t delicious. And it was a shock for me because like, I’m not used to eating like, you know, all these fibers and kind of the Kimberly Snyder (04:41.708)Wow. Kimberly Snyder (04:51.139)Yeah. Ghanim (04:52.057)for me that time, the bitterness. And it started with a smoothie and then that smoothie became another smoothie and then another smoothie. And then suddenly I started kind of saying, hey, how about incorporating less meat? And then I started taking off meat. And then I said, okay, you know what? I’ve been not eating meat for three months. Let’s take off chicken. And then suddenly fish. And I remember you helped me in the book because in the book you were saying you were kind of trying to show us how to do that transition without actually telling me to transition because you didn’t want people to actually go vegan. You wanted them to feel better. And I think that’s the philosophy that sticks with me is I was thinking every day, am I feeling better? And if I was feeling better, I wanted to continue doing that. And that’s what kept me going. And then a year later after reading the book, that’s when I woke up one day and I said, apparently I am vegan. I didn’t have any animal product. I didn’t eat anything. I never said I want to go vegan. Kimberly Snyder (05:32.77)Hmm Ghanim (05:51.459)But I feel great. How about I go for a one year vegan challenge where I actually do it like intentionally and with proper blenders and all of the product that I need. And I never went back since then. And it’s been 11 years since I’ve been vegan. And I always say this to every person that I meet. Yes, veganism was a personal choice, but I still do it today because it feels Kimberly Snyder (06:07.16)Wow. Ghanim (06:20.663)great and amazing. And the moment I don’t feel great, maybe I might explore something else. But of course, nowadays, I’m vegan for the animals, I’m vegan for the planet. So there’s a lot of other reasons as well to keep me on this lifestyle. But yeah, your book, you know, that was the initial kind of stuff. But then you came up with the next book, and I went on and kind of as well, dug deeper into the research aspect of food and how Kimberly Snyder (06:33.997)Yes. Ghanim (06:50.339)combination of food. I think you were talking about, you know, pairing certain foods and you know, got it took me a while to actually believe in it because you know, I love bread, even as a vegan, I love bread, I love gluten. And, and just recently I realized that I actually, whatever you were talking about 10 years ago is really makes a big difference if you follow it and they, and that I, sequence. so this is pretty much what happened. So I just want to kind of give. Kimberly Snyder (06:52.417)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (07:02.006)Yes. Ghanim (07:20.055)you know, a little bit of a, want, I want to, I want to say thank you actually properly to you because you, you, you, you, don’t think you will understand how much impact that had on not only me, but also my family, my friends who actually went to try vegan after my transition, how many people I’ve recommended the book to them and actually change their lives. So yeah, it did, it did change my life completely because I started a Kimberly Snyder (07:44.854)Wow. Ghanim (07:49.667)whole new business. became an entrepreneur and look what I’m doing now. And I think I am very proudly saying that it’s because of you. So thank you so much. Kimberly Snyder (07:51.182)Look at what you’re doing now. Kimberly Snyder (08:00.994)my gosh. I’m just so grateful and in awe, goosebumps all over the place. It’s one of the best stories I’ve ever heard. I really believe we’re all connected in humanity. We’re brothers and sisters and it just seemed like your heart, you were right there, you were ready. And of course there’s a little bit of resistance because it can feel like, this is really different. And it feels a little bit scary when you’re doing, it’s counterintuitive to how you. raised or how you would eat before. But the fact that you kept going back and you kept going back means you were, you know, you’re something in your soul is just so ready to go in that direction. And, know, it really resonates with me when you said it’s just about feeling better, because I think sometimes get people get so caught up in labels, and then separation like, I’m this I’m a vegan, I’m an omnivore, all these different things. But really, what we’re talking about is choosing vitality and choosing nutrient rich foods and choosing fiber. And sometimes for people, it’s not all or nothing, but like you said, you kept going down this path. And the way I started becoming plant-based from the very beginning was when I was traveling actually. And so I love that there’s this through line. We were talking before the podcast, how connection transcends space. Here we are talking across the world, across different cultures, different religions. mean, it’s all this. know, oneness, these truths, it’s how we digest food. There’s a compassion aspect to eating plant-based, there’s an environmental aspect. And when I was in India, it just felt like, wow, I was reading about meditation and just these ideas of how light you can feel in your body. So for me, in my background, which I’ve talked about in my books, I had so much anxiety and insomnia and things you might not directly relate to food. But when I started lightening up, diet and freeing up my digestion, it really did feel much better. And then as I shared, I cleared up my acne, all these things on my skin. And I was like, wow, all this stuff works together. It’s pretty profound. Ghanim (10:00.867)Yeah, you know, to add to that, think after kind of going through the first few months of following, let’s say, all the recipes and following all the knowledge that you were sharing at that time. I remember waking up every day feeling a little bit, am I doing this? Am I a crazy person? People around me were saying, Ghanem, okay, great, you’ve done this step, but it’s not going to take, you know, it’s not going to, it’s not going to be forever, you’re doing it for a while, I’m sure you’re gonna bounce back soon. Everybody was doubting me and also I had a lot of questions, especially when it comes to our cultures, our tradition, everybody was saying, hey, as humans we evolved eating animals, so how can I answer those questions? I was not ready, so I actually started traveling. So I actually traveled to 33 countries in the next kind of two years after reading your book and it opened my mind so much. Kimberly Snyder (10:37.473)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (10:52.493)Wow. Ghanim (10:58.553)to not only food, but also the people that are making the food, to actually understanding how food is being made. I started kind of going to cooking schools, learning how to use herbs and medicinal botanical kind of plants. And I wanted to understand then how is our food being grown and went to the farms. And I’ve been to Nepal, I’ve been to Beijing, I’ve been to Singapore. Kimberly Snyder (11:04.779)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (11:10.914)Mmmmm Wow. Ghanim (11:27.417)Jordan, of course, Egypt, you name it, like all these countries trying to really understand what happened in the last 50 years where we have disconnected completely from nature and especially from our food systems. And I remember every time I used to come back to Qatar, I was thinking, my God, there’s something missing because I’ve I’ve been exposed to all of this information and knowledge and I felt so heavy keeping the knowledge to just myself. Kimberly Snyder (11:40.6)Why? Kimberly Snyder (11:57.452)Right. Ghanim (11:57.485)And I’ve realized that I… needed to share it with as many people as possible because I’ve learned this from you as well because you were traveling and coming back and sharing that knowledge through your books and through your podcasts. And I was like, I need to do the same. And that’s what I started doing. I started coming back and going to schools and getting invited to do normal public speaking events when I actually wasn’t famous at that time. I wasn’t well known. People just loved me sharing my stuff through Instagram and they loved my smoothies that I was creating and simple recipes. And it got people so interested that I started being asked to come to schools and talk to kids. And I was 23 at that time and remember kind of talking to a couple of the kids in school. And one question I remember raising a carrot and I said, do you guys know where this come from? And one of the young kid raised his hand and said, this comes from the fridge. And I said, Kimberly Snyder (12:30.541)Okay. Ghanim (12:58.271)my God, there’s something missing like in our education system where kids think that things comes from a, you know, a fridge and not coming from a, so that’s when I realized that education is very important and I wanted to create a space that can not only raise awareness about this kind of epidemic of nutrition that we have, but also connect people back to our, to the source. And I felt great eating vegetables. And I think a lot of people will feel great eating vegetables and eating more greens and raw food. And that’s what I did for those years. And that’s how I started my businesses afterwards, because I realized I needed to… People were saying, Ghanim, okay, whatever you say is great. How can we do it? How can we do it? I want to do it. I want to be part of it, but I just don’t have access. I don’t have the recipes. And I was like, I need to create a space that can… Kimberly Snyder (13:46.368)Yeah. Ghanim (13:54.349)resemble everything that I’ve learned from my travel and maybe set an example so that people can feel a little bit more comfortable to make the switch. since then, we have been pioneering not only the vegan movement in Qatar, but also changing that mindset and making it more normalized, I would say. Veganism is so normalized nowadays in Qatar and it actually became so… Kimberly Snyder (14:17.07)Mmm. Ghanim (14:23.353)at some point that people felt so cool being vegan, which is completely the opposite anywhere else in the world. Kimberly Snyder (14:30.414)Yeah, you got it. I love you know what I can feel even when you’re telling your story, this heart bursting with authenticity and just so much love and so much passion and so much wanting to help that your journey just kept going and you didn’t plan it. It was just like, I’m going to travel similarly to me and then I’m going to do this. I’m going to do this. And people follow that passion. I mean, you’re just dripping with it. So you don’t really have to try. You don’t have to convince. It’s just this. radiating out of you. Well, in the story, when you started to change over, what did your parents say and people around you? Because at the time, even here, was still, and it did rise up, right? The vegan movement. And now there’s like, there’s pushback from people who feel threatened by it, of course, there’s always opposing ideas and forces. But when you first started, you know, were people saying, you’re not eating, you’re not getting as a protein, like some of the things that we always hear, what were some of the things that you heard? Ghanim (15:17.785)Of course. Yeah. Ghanim (15:29.955)See, I’ve done it very gradually. So when I decided to do it, I actually didn’t do it like cold turkey. So for me, it took me a whole year to actually make the transition. And I wasn’t pressured at all because my goal was not to be vegan. My goal is to feel better. So for me, it didn’t feel like I was transitioning. And then people around me kind of went with me through that transition because I became obsessed at some point on not eating anything Kimberly Snyder (15:37.965)Yeah. Ghanim (15:59.661)but only having goat cheese in my food because that’s kind of for me to transition from eating all the kind of cheeses to just eating one kind of cheese. And I think you did mention it at some point, like that you need to narrow down the choices. I think that’s helped me a lot to simplify kind of the options. And I did that for every category until I reached a place where I not eating anything. So people around me, I think kind of in the beginning, they were a bit, again, as I said, Kimberly Snyder (16:14.294)Yeah, and simplify. Ghanim (16:30.041)thinking that I will just do it for a few months and a few weeks and then suddenly I’m going to go back. So everybody was just on him. It’s okay. It’s just a phase. So don’t, don’t exaggerate. Don’t over, don’t overthink it. And, and, and then I, I, I, I, I saw people around me started kind of wanting to be part of what I was doing. And especially my mom and my dad, they started saying, can you do the smoothie for us? We wanted that. We want to have the green smoothie with you. And then that’s what they started doing. So I started doing the smoothie for them. So they used to have this amazing Kimberly Snyder (16:52.098)Wow. Ghanim (17:01.069)breakfast in the morning that gave them so much energy. They started feeling better. They started having better bowel movements and having more energy. My mom till today, she only have a green smoothie in the morning. And for me, she’s not vegan, but she took some kind of tips to enhance her diet. And I think one of the tips that she as well taught me that I can eat at that time, let’s say, Kimberly Snyder (17:13.591)Wow. Kimberly Snyder (17:23.01)Yes. Ghanim (17:30.359)whatever I want to eat, have the raw green salad at beginning. And that’s a habit that I still do it till today. I just eat lots of greens and then I eat whatever I want. If it’s something that I’m not comfortable eating or of course for me now it’s vegan, but if it’s like a little bit junky vegan or if it’s a bit too over oily, which I don’t usually eat, but I have to kind of have this beginning. That’s in my house. But then of course, publicly, Kimberly Snyder (17:34.114)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (17:48.206)Wait. Ghanim (17:59.513)You know, people were questioning my decisions and they were coming to me saying, you’re going against religion, you’re going against the culture, you’re going against what your ancestors have done for the last hundred years. And for me, it was. People felt intimidated by me every time I was choosing to eat vegan, even though I’m not making it the subject of the event. And I realized that I needed to be stronger in my Kimberly Snyder (18:12.649)It can feel threatening to people. Kimberly Snyder (18:24.234)Sure. Ghanim (18:30.391)defense, because I was a bit hesitant to get into the conversation. so I did a lot of research into my culture, understanding how my people have eaten in the past hundred years. and I’ve found out some amazing facts that, you know, 50 years ago, Qatar was so poor and, and didn’t have enough resources that actually people didn’t have the luxury to eat animal products. They were eating lots of starchy vegetables, lots of rice and beans, lentils to be specific. when they want to eat meat, it was a celebration and it was once or twice a year. So it had a different cultural meanings behind it when they have consumed animal products. And I realized that I needed to kind of go back and talk to people and Kimberly Snyder (18:59.085)Right. Kimberly Snyder (19:04.055)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (19:16.099)What else? Ghanim (19:29.111)that have lived during those times. And I found amazing facts that our region is, lots of people have eaten plant-based in the 40s and 30s because they had their own farms. That was actually the most sustainable way. They didn’t have access to food. The oil industry didn’t boom yet. So actually only after the oil industry had boomed in the 60s and 70s, that’s when people got access to animal products. Kimberly Snyder (19:30.798)Amazing. Kimberly Snyder (19:43.99)Yes. Ghanim (19:58.081)And the funny part is that I do a lot of work as well in Cambodia to help children eat healthy vegan food. And I remember kind of going to Cambodia in 2017, promoting eating fruits and vegetables and no one wants to eat it. And everybody was so angry with me because they say, this is not good food. This is poor people food. And then that same food in Qatar, I go to schools and I show people the vegetables and I said, this is Kimberly Snyder (20:20.941)Yeah. Ghanim (20:26.241)rich people food because no one eats organic except the rich people. And I’m like, wow, look at how cultures are so different. It’s like, have people here who don’t appreciate fruits and vegetables. And we have people here who appreciate fruits and vegetables, they don’t think they can access to it. and then I had to change that mindset. And I think that mindset is about, you know, actually plant-based food is the most affordable option out there. It’s, it’s the simplest food to be, to, to, to be stored, to be, to create, to, cook. Yeah. So. Kimberly Snyder (21:03.904)Yes. Well, this is an amazing story. It’s sort of like the Blue Zones too, Ghanim. You know, when you, they’re not trying to be vegan, but that’s what was available. If you lo

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Kevin Tracey In this episode Dr. Kevin J. Tracy discusses his groundbreaking work on the vagus nerve, its role in inflammation, and it’s connection to autoimmune diseases. He shares personal stories that shaped his career and emphasizes the importance of understanding the vagus nerve for health and wellness. The discussion also covers lifestyle measures, meditation, and the relationship between the vagus nerve and heart health, highlighting the need for further research in these areas. In this conversation, Dr. Kevin Tracey discusses the significance of the vagus nerve in health and wellness, exploring its role in vagal tone, bioelectric medicine, and its implications for autoimmune conditions and depression. He emphasizes the importance of a holistic approach to health, the potential of vagus nerve stimulation as a treatment option, and the reflexive nature of our bodily functions. The discussion also highlights personal experiences and insights that drive the pursuit of medical advancements. About Kevin Tracey Kevin Tracey, MD, is a best-selling author, neurosurgeon, scientist, entrepreneur, and leader in the fields of vagus nerve stimulation and inflammation. His new book THE GREAT NERVE (May 13, 2025 Avery) reveals the vagus nerve is the body’s most powerful—yet underutilized—healing pathway, capable of reversing devastating illnesses without drugs. Dr. Tracey and his colleagues in his lab at the Feinstein Institutes discovered the molecular and neural mechanism for the reflexive control of inflammation, now termed the inflammatory reflex. He is a prolific inventor, with more than 120 United States patents. As measured by and reported in the scientific journal PLOS One, Dr. Tracey is one of the most highly cited living scientists in the world. Dr. Tracey was trained in neurosurgery at the New York Hospital-Cornell University Medical Center and was a guest investigator at Rockefeller University before moving to the Feinstein Institutes. There he directs the Laboratory of Biomedical Science and was appointed President and CEO in 2005.   Episode Sponsors: LMNT: OFFER: Right now, for my listeners LMNT is offering a free sample pack with any LMNT drink mix purchase at DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD. That’s 8 single serving packets FREE with any LMNT any LMNT drink mix purchase. This deal is only available through my link so. Also try the new LMNT Sparkling — a bold, 16-ounce can of sparkling electrolyte water. USE LINK: DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD   FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY Guest Resources Book: THE GREAT NERVE Website: The Great Nerve: The New Science of the Vagus Nerve and How to Harness Its Healing Reflexes   Episode Chapters Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Dr. Kevin J. Tracy and His Work04:05 The Impact of Personal Loss on Purpose07:10 Understanding the Vagus Nerve and Inflammation09:58 Exploring Autoimmune Diseases and Vagus Nerve Connection15:07 Lifestyle Measures for a Healthy Vagus Nerve19:58 Meditation, Heart Health, and Vagus Nerve Dynamics26:11 Understanding Vagal Tone and Health Span28:02 Innovations in Bioelectric Medicine30:04 Vagus Nerve Stimulation for Autoimmune Conditions35:02 Exploring the Connection Between Vagus Nerve and Depression38:57 The Reflex Basis of Health and Well-being44:05 Practical Applications and Personal Insights   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:00.972)Hi everyone. Welcome back to our Monday interview show. I am so excited for our very special guest here with us today. His name is Dr. Kevin J. Tracy, and he’s a neurosurgeon, scientist, entrepreneur, and leader in the fields of vagus nerve stimulation and inflammation. He is one of the most highly cited living scientists in the world, and he has a fascinating new book out, which I read. cover to cover called The Great Nerve, the new science of the vagus nerve and how to harness its healing reflexes. Dr. Kevin, I will call you Kevin from now on, but just to start off, Dr. Kevin, thank you so much for being here with us today. Kevin Tracey (00:42.856)Ha ha ha ha. Kevin Tracey (00:48.042)Well, thank you for having me on. I’m really looking forward to chatting all about the great nerve. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (00:53.774)So it’s really fascinating, the subject matter. I think some of us have heard about the Vegas nerve and increasing popularity, whether in the media, social media. There’s so much I want to get into. But first I want to say, Kevin, that, wow, I wasn’t… Sometimes you get into these scientific books and research books and it can be a little bit dry. But what really surprised me in a positive way about your book was the humanness that you brought to the book. And it was very readable and it was very accessible for a lay person who’s not a scientist to really grasp the information. And right away at the beginning, your book made me cry when you talked about the passing of your mother when you were five. And my youngest is four right now. I was just thinking how, you know, for a child to lose their mother at such a young age, must have been so just, you your world gets turned upside down. So you go into that story, but also because her condition was related to her brain and that you became a scientist, there was a positive outcome. really, sounded like it really influenced your purpose and the direction of your life. Kevin Tracey (02:17.994)It did. You know, the, the idea of, of five year olds, grappling with what reality is and then going through a loss today, modern psychologists and psychiatrists, they look at these events as having long-term trauma to some. And it is a trauma that occurs when you’re five years old and lose your mother. But You can come out of trauma 60 years later, 63 years later and look back and have an understanding to it. she died of a brain tumor very suddenly. And now here I am, a neurosurgeon trying to invent therapies, trying to invent things to help other people not have to lose their mother or their other. And can you connect the dots and say that? led to this? Of course not. You can’t. But you can gain an understanding that children, even very young children, are formulating a view of the world that oftentimes I think is much more profound or Kevin Tracey (03:37.502)deep, if you will, or intuitive than adults understand. it’s not like it’s easy to study this in the groups of five-year-old children. You’re making assumptions about what they’re thinking and feeling because they don’t have the complete capacity of language and vocabulary that develops over many, many years later. But I’m strongly convinced that what happened to me Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (03:44.002)Yes. Kevin Tracey (04:05.798)at five influenced the entire course of my life. And I try to tell that story in this book. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (04:11.02)You know, it’s amazing sometimes, you know, people are searching for their why, or they’re looking for, you know, what is my purpose? And it was so clear from the beginning and it, you tell that story upfront. And then there’s other, another story that has a mother made me cry about the 11 month old Janice who got burned. And you’re talking about some of your theories about inflammation and you know, why this child passed away. And it’s just so clear that your drive, Doctor, is to really understand and to alleviate suffering. And it really comes across in your book and the way you write and your work. And so I just want to really acknowledge that, that, you know, there’s a lot of depth of science, but there’s also so much heart and so much love in the way that you’re writing. And it just really felt and it really touched me when I was reading this book. Kevin Tracey (05:06.9)Well, thank you. Your compliment means a great deal, coming especially from you. So thank you sincerely. In my journey as a neurosurgeon scientist for the past 40 years, give or take, I have come across many others who, like me, were touched, if not by a family member, but by a patient, and found in the inability to help that patient, the drive, the motivation, the meaning, as you say, to pursue a cure. And that story resonates across not only my own experience with friends and colleagues and people I’ve met, but that story resonates across the centuries in the history of medicine. And the idea that one individual suffers and motivates another to find a cure or to pursue a cure or to pursue an answer. That story recurs over and over again in the history of medicine. And if you think about it, what does it say? It says that one person, one person suffering and another trying to alleviate can change the course of the world. And I think the more that message needs to be internalized more and more by your listeners and listeners everywhere to know that what they decide to do and how they decide to react makes a difference not only in their own personal lives and their family’s lives, but everyone can change the world for the better. And that’s very inspiring to me. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (06:44.396)Yes, it’s the concept of oneness. know, Dr. Howe, we’re all connected and what happens to us, we can, you know, change our perspective and be motivated to do good, to shift things. And so it was very, very motivational, very inspiring. And then as you continued your work, you came to focus back to the great nerve on the vagus nerve. Can you tell us a little bit about… just briefly why the Vegas nerve and if people are listening to this and they’re like, I’ve heard of it, but I don’t really exactly know what it is and why it’s important. Of course, there’s a whole book about why it’s important, but just in a nutshell, just to give us a little bit of an intro before we dive deeper. Kevin Tracey (07:26.91)Sure. So by way of intro, you made reference to Janice, the little girl that I cared for in the burn unit at the New York hospital. And she died in my arms of overwhelming inflammation. So what is inflammation and what does that have to do with the vagus nerve? Well, inflammation is what happens when the body reacts to either an injury or an infection. And you’ve seen it if you sprain your ankle or your knee, it turns red, it swells, it hurts. And you’ve seen it if you’ve had an infected pimple or an infected cut on your skin, it turns red and it swells and it’s painful and it gets warm. That’s what inflammation is. And that’s a healthy, good response to injury and infection. It helps heal the wound and clear out the infection. that type of inflammation we need. But the problem is, that inflammation, if it’s not well controlled, if it… doesn’t stop, if it spreads beyond the cut or beyond the local area of injury that occurs, if it spreads into the bloodstream or into the organs like the lungs and the heart and the kidney, inflammation can kill. And so the question that I confronted after Janice died was why did her body fail to control the inflammation that was occurring and why most people walk around Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (08:40.215)Yeah. Kevin Tracey (08:56.648)don’t have too much inflammation. And the very surprising answer that my colleagues and I discovered in the mid 1990s is that the brain controls how much inflammation you have in your body. And it does this by sending signals to your immune system, like the brakes on your car, slow down, slow the inflammation and prevent the inflammation from causing Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:11.96)Hmm. Kevin Tracey (09:26.43)damage to your normal organs. And the brake lines in your car run essentially. to the wheels of your car to stop your car. The brakes on your immune system run from your brain through a nerve called the vagus nerve, which holds the key to stopping inflammation. And that simple sentence, how does the vagus nerve hold the key to stopping inflammation is something that I’ve committed the last 25 or 30 years of my life to studying. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:44.312)Hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (09:58.892)It’s really interesting, doctor, because there’s so much autoimmune and there’s so many conditions and we hear a lot about changing your diet or taking medications and you’re talking about this bioelectric therapies and tell us about how this approach is kind of going a little bit further back than some of these other approaches to inflammation. Kevin Tracey (10:24.564)So you mentioned earlier, as we were warming up that many of your listeners are women and autoimmune disease is a disease that occurs much more in women than in men for reasons that aren’t well understood. But an autoimmune disease are diseases like lupus or rheumatoid arthritis or inflammatory bowel disease, multiple sclerosis. These diseases are conditions where there’s too much inflammation. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (10:37.742)Mm. Kevin Tracey (10:54.558)So the question that we’ve been pursuing for years is if we know that the breaks on inflammation travel in the vagus nerve, if the vagus nerve is carrying signals from the brain to stop too much inflammation, can we use that information to develop therapies for diseases like rheumatoid arthritis? But in order to do that, we had to learn a great deal more. you mentioned… The vagus nerve has the great nerve and we call it the vagus nerve, but you actually have two of them. You have one on each side, like two thumbs or two kidneys. And you actually have inside of each of these vagus nerves, you actually have a hundred thousand fibers. So it’s fair to say that all of us have about 200,000 vagus nerves. they run from about the level of your ear, deep inside your brain down. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:29.165)Mm-hmm. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (11:44.61)Wow. Kevin Tracey (11:51.88)your neck on both sides, across your chest and into your abdomen. And what these vagus nerve fibers do is carry information back and forth from your body’s organs to your brain and back. And this information is absolutely crucial to maintaining a balanced homeostasis is called, a balanced output of your organs that keep you in a healthy range. In other words, The vagus nerve is carrying back and forth from your brain to your body, all of the information necessary to keep you healthy so that you don’t have to think about it. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (12:29.914)Mm-hmm. So what is throwing off the vagus nerve for so many people? Why are these therapies required and is it happening more often in the modern world versus just being able to maintain homeostasis naturally? Kevin Tracey (12:46.512)All, sorry, all the answers to that question are not in yet, but there’ve been some dramatic examples that have taught us quite a bit. So for instance, during the COVID pandemic, several studies discovered that the virus itself could infect the vagus nerve, and this was found at autopsy in some victims of COVID. And when… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (13:07.81)Mmm. Kevin Tracey (13:14.41)when the investigators looked at the vagus nerve, they found evidence that the virus was in the nerve. And in other patients, there was evidence that inflammation caused presumably either directly by the virus or by the body’s reaction to the virus, that the inflammation had settled in the vagus nerve and damaged it. Now, if you have damage in your vagus nerve, that would be like someone cutting the brake lines on your car. and the vagus nerve now is no longer going to be able to slow down the inflammation. And if the inflammation keeps accelerating, now what happens, it accumulates in organs and can cause permanent damage, as I said before, to various organs, whether it’s the kidneys or the heart or the lungs or the brain even. So this was a key insight that the vagus nerve can sometimes be damaged in some patients. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (14:04.919)Right. Kevin Tracey (14:13.128)Very importantly, we and others have begun to ask the question, is it possible that damage to the vagus nerve, like damage to the brake lines in your car, is actually occurring in autoimmune diseases as well? And there is some evidence that that is occurring. In other words, people at risk, relatives at risk for autoimmune disease, often have evidence of impaired vagus nerve signaling to the heart called decreased vagal tone. And this can occur before they have any evidence of the disease itself. So the question is, can damage to the vagus nerve actually be one of the reasons that we’re seeing increasing incidence of some of these autoimmune diseases? We don’t know for sure, but it’s definitely possible. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:07.694)So is it kind of like the chicken or the egg? Is it the diseases are damaging the vagus nerve or potentially damage to the vagus nerve is one of the reasons that there’s a proliferation of the autoimmune condition? Kevin Tracey (15:20.168)Yes or both. Yes or both. Yes, it is an important research question and there’s evidence to support both sides of that equation. Chicken and egg. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (15:30.572)Right. And you know, doctor, in the latter part of your book, I love how you talk about meditation, which is a very big part of our community. You had an experience with the Dalai Lama, and you talk about cold therapy, breath work, we have a mutual friend Wim Hof. You didn’t mention diet as much or you don’t focus on it as much in the book. it based on all the research and what you’ve seen with our lifestyle measures that we can control? does that have quite a, you know, increases our chances of maintaining a healthy vagal nerve, vagus nerve, you know, barring, of course, if we get COVID or there’s some sort of infection in the vagus nerve, but just on a more general everyday basis, these lifestyle measures can help. Kevin Tracey (16:17.438)I think it’s really important to answer this question in the context of some more clear definitions. So back to the basics, we have 200,000 vagus nerve fibers, and each of them has been selected by millions of years of evolution to have a specific job. So a few fibers, maybe a few hundred or maybe one or 2,000 at most, go to the heart and slow your heartbeat. A few hundred or a few thousand go to your lungs and participate in every breath you take. A few hundred, probably not a few thousand, go to your pancreas and control your insulin. Now, the way the nervous system is organized, each individual nerve fiber controls a specific function. each of those functions can operate independently of all the other nerve fibers. So for instance, most people, most of us can walk and chew gum at the same time because the nerves that control our walking are different than the nerves that control our chewing. When you apply that basic obvious fact to the vagus nerve, you have to ask a really important question. When someone says to me, I want to do this, that, or the other thing to my vagus nerve, I say, really, which one? Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (17:42.062)Mmm. Kevin Tracey (17:42.184)Which of the 200,000 fibers do you want to stimulate or inhibit? So for instance, there’s some commonly talked about advice in the billions of web impressions and social media postings about the vagus nerve that chanting or humming stimulates your vagus nerve and that this is good for your overall health. And as I review in detail in the book, there is a grain of truth to that because a few hundred fibers of the 200,000 go to your voice box. technically, you’re larynx. So technically when you hum or chant, you are stimulating those few fibers of the 200,000. Does that mean you’re also stimulating the fibers that can control your immune system? And does that mean you’re stimulating the fibers like Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (18:19.118)Mmm. Kevin Tracey (18:39.85)the brakes of your car on your inflammation? Not necessarily. I mean, you can walk and chew gum at the same time because different fibers have different activities. So I tell that story because each of the chapters at the end of the book, in part three of the book, addressing these recommendations and advice given by so many sources on the web. Each of those has to be considered for scientific validity and reproducibility and truthfulness versus exaggeration of claims beyond what we really understand. So does humming stimulate your vagus nerve? Yes, it stimulates the vagus nerve fibers that go to your larynx. Do we know that humming, because of that is decreasing your inflammation through the vagus nerve? No, we don’t. Do we know that Stimulating those fibers to your voice box also stimulates vagus nerve fibers that have a role in preventing depression or anxiety. No, we don’t. these are important questions and they can be studied and addressed. And if people like to hum and it makes them feel better, then we should encourage that. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (19:58.05)Well, I love the openness as a scientist doctor where you’re not just shutting something down but saying, hey, you maybe we don’t know more research is needed. You use these two words in the beginning of the book that really stood out to me when you’re describing the great nerve, mysterious and beautiful. When you’re talking about the vagus nerve, there’s mystery around it. There’s a lot of things we don’t know yet. And when you get to that section of the book where you’re talking about meditation, and there are thousands of research papers about different benefits of meditation for different systems of the body. And I love that you as a scientist are also a meditator. Kevin Tracey (20:35.218)Meditation is widely studied across imaging studies, very sophisticated brain mapping using fMRI and PET scan and other brain imaging techniques have studied meditators ranging from monks to extreme, to amateur meditators, to highly trained meditators. And what’s interesting is that meditation does influence brain activity. And what’s interesting is that Meditation does activate regions of the brain that are implicated in all kinds of mental states. As a scientist, as a researcher, it sort of stops there, however, because depending on the meditative practice and depending on who the meditator is and depending on what other activity there is going on in the meditator’s brain before meditation begins, you get different answers or explanations as to why meditation could be beneficial to some, but not beneficial to all in terms of reducing anxiety and depression. So for me, I enjoy meditation. I think for me, it’s very interesting to observe myself meditating, if you will, and to watch the state of my mind as I meditate. I find that fascinating. But I don’t think it’s fair when anyone claims cause and effect explanations of how meditation works. It’s an area of active research and much more needs to be done. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (22:18.72)Yeah, well said. Well said. But it really does add a holistic, you know, I just, love that section of the book. And you talked about meeting the Dalai Lama as well was really cool. One thing I was going to say, when you talked about the relationship with the heart, it’s really interesting to me, Dr. My last book was, we did some, we did a meditation study actually in terms of heart coherence and just measuring the patterns of HRV instead of just the numbers, getting those nice smooth sine waves. And so could you talk a little bit about how the heart and the vagus nerve are related? You said that some parts can go to the heart, obviously with 200,000 nerves running through it, not all, but there is a relationship. Kevin Tracey (23:11.25)Yes, so of those 200,000 fibers, some number of them, several hundred or several thousand go to the heart. And the vagus nerve endings from the brain to the heart stop in two different places. The sinoatrial node, which is the pacemaker and sets the resting heart rate, if you will. And the AV node, which is involved in the conduction of the signals from the atriums of the heart to the ventricles of And so when the vagus nerve is sending signals to the heart, it tends to slow the heart down. And what does that mean? It means that the time between the first heartbeat, heartbeat one, and the next heartbeat, heartbeat two, is prolonged. Now, when the vagus nerve is firing frequently, you’re going to see… Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (23:58.861)Mmm. Kevin Tracey (24:09.008)more variability between the time of the individual heartbeats measured in milliseconds. And if you subject those individual heartbeats to statistical analysis, things like Fourier transformations, you come up with what’s called heart rate variability assessments. So the more your vagus nerve is firing, the more variability there will be between the individual times in the individual heartbeats, the instantaneous heart rates. So that is all fairly well, that’s fairly non-controversial. Where it gets complicated is that there are many, many different statistical algorithms used to map out instantaneous heart rates as a function of time, as a function of of frequency and in actually in multiple dimensions after being subjected to Fourier transformation. And so there’s no consensus on the analysis of these data. So there are wearables and I won’t name any, but the wearables use different algorithms to assess the different heart rate variability metrics. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (25:08.854)Great. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (25:27.063)Yes. Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (25:32.088)Yes, I am mad. That’s great. Mad as I’m tired. Kevin Tracey (25:37.768)So now you quickly look online and you see, here’s a graph of heart rate variability by age or by sex or by activity. And you end up with the potential for a great deal of confusion. what I found most interesting perhaps in this is that because the active vagus nerve tends to slow resting heart rate, the slower resting heart rate Solluna By Kimberly Snyder (25:52.481)Hmm. Kevin Tracey (26:07.188)tends to correlate with longer health span and longer lifespan on a population basis. So it’s a good thing to be aerobically fit with a

This Week’s Episode Special Guest: Danielle Harel and Celeste Hirschman In this episode Kimberly interviews intimacy and sexuality coaches Danielle Harel and Celeste Hirschman. They discuss their partnership, the importance of vulnerability in relationships, and how to dismantle societal masks that hinder authentic connections. The conversation delves into body image, sexual confidence, and the significance of cultivating erotic energy for overall wellness. They also explore the impact of cultural beliefs and shame on sexual expression, offering insights into daily practices for enhancing intimacy and navigating the complexities of pornography in relationships. The discussion also touches on the evolution of sexual desires over time, the impact of trauma on fantasies, and the empowerment that comes from self-connection and healing. The speakers emphasize the significance of open communication in relationships and the journey of understanding one’s own desires and experiences. About Danielle Harel and Celeste Hirschman Danielle Harel, Ph.D., and Celeste Hirschman, M.A., are pioneers in intimacy, sexuality, and relationship coaching. Co-founders of the Somatica® Institute, they’ve transformed how love and connection are taught through their experiential, science-based Somatica Method. Together, they’ve trained over 1,000 coaches and helped countless individuals and couples embrace vulnerability, rediscover desire, and create deeply fulfilling relationships. Authors of three influential books—Making Love Real, Coming Together, and Confidence—Danielle and Celeste blend authenticity, humor, and bold honesty to inspire transformation. Their relatable insights into intimacy and connection make them captivating guests on popular podcasts like Sex With Emily: Coming Together and Shameless Sex: How Core Desires Leads to Hot Sex, and Trauma Empowerment, where they offer audiences practical tools to enhance relationships and live passionately.   Episode Sponsors: MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription.   FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY Guest Resources Book: Sex With Emily: Coming Together and Shameless Sex: How Core Desires Leads to Hot Sex, and Trauma Empowerment Website: https://www.celesteanddanielle.com/   Social Media Instagram: @ somatica_institute   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Intimacy and Sexuality Coaching01:45 The Power of Partnership in Coaching04:08 Dismantling Masks and Embracing Vulnerability07:52 Body Image and Sexual Confidence10:48 Cultivating Erotic Energy and Self-Expression13:32 The Connection Between Sexual Energy and Overall Wellness16:14 Healing from Shame and Cultural Beliefs19:42 Daily Practices for Sexual Energy and Connection22:46 Navigating Pornography and Intimacy in Relationships23:15 Exploring Intimacy Through Pornography24:19 The Connection Between Vulnerability and Sexuality28:09 Overcoming Blocks to Sexual Energy32:31 The Evolution of Sexual Desires Over Time35:55 Understanding Trauma and Fantasy in Sexuality40:24 Empowerment Through Self-Connection and Healing   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Kimberly Snyder (00:01.33)Hi everyone and welcome back for our Monday interview show. I am so excited for my very special guests here today. I have two beautiful ladies to offer an incredible conversation. The first is Danielle Horrell and the second is Celeste Hirschman. They are pioneers in intimacy, sexuality and relationship coaching. They’re authors and co-founders of the Samadica Institute where they have taught and trained over a thousand coaches and helped countless individuals and couples embrace vulnerability, rediscover desire, and create deeply fulfilling relationships. Thank you both so much for being here with us today. Celeste Hirschman, MA (00:44.654)Thank so much for having us. Danielle Harel, PhD (00:46.109)Excited to be here. Kimberly Snyder (00:47.91)Well, so I love having partners on the show, business partners, creators together. So the first thing that comes to mind is number one, how did you find each other and decide to collaborate on so many different endeavors? And number two, what both led you to this particular work with intimacy and sexuality? Because it feels like a real, like everyone, you know, a calling, but this is a very specific type of calling. Celeste Hirschman, MA (01:16.716)Yeah, I mean, I have to say probably one of the best things that’s ever happened to me in my life is finding Danielle. And speaking of things that make me feel good, know, having our business partnership and being able to collaborate with someone for so many years and for us to just have the same mindset on and how we want to change the world has been so powerful and profound, changed my life forever, for sure. Kimberly Snyder (01:22.268)Aww. It’s so beautiful! Danielle Harel, PhD (01:25.477)It’s so cool. Kimberly Snyder (01:45.042)So how did you, was it through like a friends or through conference, business conference? Danielle Harel, PhD (01:52.115)Yeah, so I was doing my PhD in human sexuality and we had like a class that we took through this in the PhD and Celeste took that class. was also people outside of the PhD and Celeste took this class and that’s where we met. know, Celeste and I, as different as people can be, but, you know, we have amazing compatibility around this. We really, we met in the class, in the training, and then we kind of Kimberly Snyder (02:01.97)Danielle Harel, PhD (02:21.964)She asked me out to go to a conference with her. We sat on a bench in San Francisco and we saw that our philosophy is so aligned. It was kind of amazing. We really saw eye to eye. Like, how do we want to help people have a better sex and relationship? And as we were talking, we’re like completing each other’s sentences. Sounds kind of soul-made in some way. Kimberly Snyder (02:27.579)that. Kimberly Snyder (02:51.186)I love this story. You sometimes it’s funny how outwardly it can seem like, we’re different. That’s how me and my husband are. He’s covered in tattoos and he has a gold grill on his teeth and, you know, just completely different lifestyles. But it’s like when you meet, whether it’s a business partnership or soulmate, that you guys, the intimacy, this closeness, this alignment that isn’t necessarily that you see with the physical eyes, but you feel on an energetic level. I love that you have that intensity together. Celeste Hirschman, MA (03:17.366)Yeah, yeah. Yeah, Danielle’s like a solid oak tree and I’m like a butterfly, you know, but we but we definitely have with our different skill sets have been able to do so much more together than we could have done alone in terms of creating this work that helps people have the best, know, helps people feel good. Like you said, this is a feel good. And that’s what it’s all about. And our first workshop was Kimberly Snyder (03:41.724)Yes. Celeste Hirschman, MA (03:46.124)a workshop for men on how to be extraordinary lovers to women. And we thought, you know, what want for the world is for women to feel good, you know, and we can train men and everyone else, you know, obviously women have lots of different lovers across the gender spectrum. But in that instance, we were teaching men how to be better lovers to women. And it was a really wonderful place to start for us. Kimberly Snyder (03:55.409)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (04:08.466)Mm. And you know, I’m glad you brought up this, you know, this term feel good, which to me has so much to do with connection to self. And then you are able to connect with others and authenticity. So it doesn’t mean you have to be like overly giddy or giggly or overly happy, but really authentic and real. And I know a lot of your work touches on that vulnerability because whether it’s in the bedroom or relationships or, you know, business, wherever there’s so many masks that we can wear. that keep us from really connecting. How do you start to, when you’re working with someone and you’ve trained so many different people, start to dismantle the mask? Because I feel like even now in culture with social media and TikTok, it’s even more exacerbated in some ways, where if some people don’t even know what their authentic self is, so they don’t know how to authentically connect physically or sexually. Danielle Harel, PhD (05:02.62)Yeah, it’s a wonderful question. I feel like the way we do it is there are multiple ways, of course, but we start by actually pointing out the cultural belief systems and all the ways that we’re being fed from very early on, different belief systems, different structures that might be working for some people or not. So that definitely, like we start to talk about those social messages. And then we start to give people alternatives about like, Hey, you know, there may be like other options that you can think about. we de-shamify the heck of it because we bring ourselves as examples. We talk about like how not perfect we are. We talk about helping people see that you can have a wonderful, beautiful full life without being perfect, but at least you’re to have your own life and not going to live someone else’s life. Kimberly Snyder (05:56.964)Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Celeste Hirschman, MA (06:00.524)Yeah, I feel like I was very lucky as a child. think my family’s motto was feel good. You know, they sort of like not so much work ethic, much more of a play ethic. And so I learned I learned how to play and I kept playing throughout my life. And and now I get to teach other people how to play with life as well, you know, and and feeling good and having a joyful life. It’s not just like a frivolous thing. It’s like a revolutionary act, especially if you’re who’s supposed to be who you are in the world, you know, to say like, like, I’m a bisexual woman, and I feel good. And I can be myself, you know, like if you’re if you’re not like, if you’re sort of like outside what as our society tries to normalize, normalize, normalize, and everybody’s supposed to be the same. It’s like, no, I’m different. And I feel good is a big deal, right? Kimberly Snyder (06:48.028)Yes, right? And it can be in any way. Sometimes we can fall into a career path because it looks good or our parents wanted us to do this and then we’re never really happy making the money or, you know, all the many ways. So back to this cultural perspective and so much of our society has these ideas of, you know, beauty and body weight and body image. So what would you say to our listeners or anyone that says, well, when I’m in, when I’m naked with my partner, I just can’t enjoy myself because I feel so self-conscious. I’m thinking about, don’t look good, you know, because it just creates, even though in my body, you can feel like you shrivel up instead of expanding, you start to feel very small. And then the thoughts and like overthinking. So how do we open up? How do we start to… embrace our energy more than just the physical, again, in life, but also sexually. Danielle Harel, PhD (07:52.028)Yeah, that’s great. So yeah, it’s beautiful how you said it because like that’s exactly where we start. We say, okay, so when you’re feeling like that about yourself, like notice how it feels like you feel contained and you feel small and you don’t feel your beautiful, glorious, big self. So let’s see what it would feel like if you actually stepped into your body and let your full self actually. breathe and feel pleasure and enjoy the connection and the intimacy because many times because of socialization and because the images that we see, we feel that something’s wrong with our body. But many times our partner might feel that that’s the most delicious body that they’ve ever encountered in life. And if we are like so tight inside that we don’t even allow ourselves to open up and take those compliments and kind of like, you know, I know I worked on my body image a lot through this like in the bedroom. It was one of my most healing places to work on that because that was the place I was like, okay, I’m going to actually listen to my partner and I’m going to take it in. He like, you know, touches my belly and he says like, belly is so beautiful. And I was like, okay, I’m going to take it in. I’m going to ask him again. I really love my belly. Please tell me. He’s like, yeah, my God, I love your belly so much. You know, like it’s a wonderful way to start healing it and allowing a different truth. to come in that’s not just like the very polished truth that we see on social media. Kimberly Snyder (09:21.202)Right, right. I love that. Because we all, you know, it’s interesting how back to this authenticity, to me, know, sexiness isn’t just something you can paint on. It really is the energy that someone’s embodying. And that is something we don’t have to try to be perfect looking. And there really is no perfect looking, but what we can is work on that connection as we express it. You know, in yoga, the sacral chakras, you know, the creative expression is the sexuality, the creating projects, the writing, you know, pregnancy, all these different things come from that place, which is so unique. Are there any in your workshops and your training, are there any practices or specific journal prompts or anything that you do to invoke someone to really connect with that essence of? you know, that sexiness that cannot just be painted on. Celeste Hirschman, MA (10:18.114)Yeah, we actually have like an erotic embodiment class where you go in step by step, get re in touch with your body and actually find that pleasure center and learn how to move that energy through your body and exude it out of your body. And we also have a body image class, you know, to help people overcome some of those challenges. So we really focus on people healing around those things and finding their, you know, their inner glow and letting it shine out in the world. Kimberly Snyder (10:21.478)Man. Danielle Harel, PhD (10:48.404)And we really find that this disconnects from the body and disconnects from our erotic experience in our body. Because women were one of the messages we get is that if we are sexual, we’re sluts. So we don’t let ourselves connect with our sexuality. And I was like, wow, sexuality is your power. That’s the place that you’re to have the creativity and the aliveness. So let’s get deeper into it. And in this classes, we really invite people to kind of like, yeah. how to decompartmentalize this experience of sexuality and make it like a life force as opposed to this like shrunk thing that you just keep in the bedroom for your partner for specific act. No, it’s yours. It’s yours to live with and enjoy and really kind of take it in. Kimberly Snyder (11:38.394)And I think too, there’s this line of what feels really good to us to be in our sexual power, but not to feel like we have to show too much or give things away when we don’t want to to get attention, to know that it’s inside for us. It’s kind of hard to verbalize, but I know you guys know what I’m talking about, where it really is this incredible creative center to share with our partner or who we choose. but also to feel like it’s also really sacred and special. Celeste Hirschman, MA (12:10.006)And I feel like people are so different. Like some people want a little bit more of that internal space and they don’t want to be like looked at all the time or invaded. And so they can decide I’m going to keep that piece a little bit more internal and I’m going to show it just when I want to receive that intention. And other people are like, give me all the attention all the time. And so just allowing for the fact that people are different and people need different amounts of attention, means like you get to, when you really get that glow going, it’s up to you. Kimberly Snyder (12:12.592)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (12:17.425)West. Celeste Hirschman, MA (12:39.246)to decide who you share it with and how you share it with. And you might wanna share it moderately with specific people, or you might wanna share it broadly with everyone. And that’s such a personal choice. And I think that’s the thing that is so important about the way that we teach in Somatica, one size doesn’t fit all. People feel differently about energy and attention, and let’s find out who each person is and what they want in that realm. Kimberly Snyder (12:40.72)Mm-hmm. Kimberly Snyder (12:56.177)Right. Kimberly Snyder (13:02.756)Right. And even to the fact I have a couple of friends who are working on their sexual connection, but they’ve chosen right now to be celibate, which is really interesting. So this sexual energy is coming through and they feel passionate when they’re cooking their dinner, right? Or it’s like they feel it when they’re putting on their makeup and they’re living it, but it doesn’t have to be as literal, like you said, in like sexual acts, but more of this creative energy, this pulse, this Kundalini. Danielle Harel, PhD (13:32.124)Yeah, that’s aliveness. That’s wonderful. That’s it’s really important, as Celeste said, for us to help people understand. It’s yours. Do what you want to do with it. You don’t have to apologize of how you want to live your life. You don’t have to decide. You can change your mind. You can decide how you want to cultivate and grow this erotic energy, but this is your life force and you deserve to experience this level of aliveness. Enjoy and funnel it anywhere that you want to. Kimberly Snyder (14:05.666)Mm-hmm. And you know, here at Saloon on My Brand, we talk a lot about holistic wellness and how one thing affects everything else. So sort of like, you know, you guys are talking about rigidity or clamping it down or trying to suppress sexual energy, which feels quite rigid, can lead to anything, right? Inflammation, stress, constipation, this aliveness, this vitality or yoga, we would say prana. has an overall wellness effect. Have you seen that quite literally in yourselves and or any clients how it just opens up overall physical health? Celeste Hirschman, MA (14:43.262)Yeah, it’s really funny because one day we were accused of only having like hot coaches. And I think people were looking at the photos of our coaches and they were exuding their joy and erotic energy because they don’t all look a particular way. And so it’s, what Somatica does is it helps people find that glow on the inside. And then it just exudes out from you. And it’s so beautiful and healthy and alive and sexy that Kimberly Snyder (14:57.457)Right. Celeste Hirschman, MA (15:09.166)everyone looks gorgeous when they have it, you know? And I think that’s the confusion about like looks have to be a particular way. No, it’s like when you’re connected to your erotic energy, it’s gorgeous, it’s beautiful. And it helps you feel more alive. It helps stress move through your body, right? Orgasms help you get rid of stress. you know, like being in pleasure helps tension and cortisol go away. So all of that increases your health and your joy and your longevity, you know. being in connection with this part of ourselves is hugely, hugely healing. And when we’re robbed of it, it’s so disempowering. Kimberly Snyder (15:45.776)Hmm. And, you know, I mentioned a couple of things that can happen when you feel disempowered, right? On a physical level, we could say like inflammation, like things are sort of kept in. What have you seen in some people when they’re starting in your programs or, you know, just out in the world when you can tell that someone isn’t allowing them to feel this energy, which is part of the human experience. Celeste Hirschman, MA (16:11.598)Go ahead, Danielle, I’m gonna let you take it. Kimberly Snyder (16:12.62)I don’t have to say anything. Danielle Harel, PhD (16:13.332)I feel like many times people are just muted. They feel much more depressed. They feel sad. I feel like they’re not fully owning their body and they are just not fully, you know, alive. And you see it, you see the difference because again, like we have a program when we train coaches and you see people when they come in and you see them when they come out and it’s just like a complete revolution because when you let yourself like be who you are, Kimberly Snyder (16:19.634)I love you. Danielle Harel, PhD (16:42.95)you feel better and it’s not necessarily an easy path, you know what I mean? I don’t want people to think like, it’s all easy. You do confront sadness and you do work with other parts of yourself that are not fully, that were not all celebrated growing up because that’s a healing journey, right? So really kind of… seeing that allows people to really feel their best self on all levels, you know. Kimberly Snyder (17:14.724)Yes, I mean, there’s a part of this too that I think is questioning not just societal beliefs, but also your ancestral, your family beliefs. Because I know having grown up in a very Catholic conservative family, when I was little, I remember starting when I was about seven, my well-meaning grandmother and relatives would tell me not to smile. They were like, you’ll get attention. know, like almost like shaming. like to be like, know, men also to look at you, like you shouldn’t be doing this and that and cover like covering up all the time. So it starts to feel like these patterns are, you know, this bigger level, but then also individual within the family that can they have to be overcome in order to feel that, you know, lack of shame, that freedom burgeoning up. Danielle Harel, PhD (18:08.04)Yeah, definitely. grew up. Sorry. I just, I sorry. You have a delay. Celeste Hirschman, MA (18:08.718)Yeah, and I do feel like Kimberly Snyder (18:13.916)Yeah. Celeste Hirschman, MA (18:16.77)Yeah, no, I think on a foundational level, there’s when you get all of those messages all the time, it’s this kind of lack of safety and reconnecting with safety in your own body and feeling this truth of the self, which is that, you know, I can come back to me always, no matter what happens to me. I can always come back to me gives you this sense of like safety in the world. And then like we said, you get to decide what you want to do with your energy, but don’t put it out, you know. Like learn how to stoke it and connect with it and be with it and find your sense of safety in connection with that part of yourself. Kimberly Snyder (18:46.962)Hmm. Kimberly Snyder (18:55.154)Daniel, do you have something to add to that? Danielle Harel, PhD (19:00.082)Yeah, I totally resonate with what you’re talking about because I grew up with a lot of shame as well and every movement was shamed almost like, you know, and there’s something in the process of healing that is about reclaiming those parts and really like letting myself feel what it feels like to move or start to like shed the shame and start to feel like, wow, like, you know, my body is magical. You know, it has so much. beauty in it that’s not just about what my mom said or what society says and it really can be very powerful, this process of shedding the shame. Kimberly Snyder (19:42.322)So in your work, there’s so many different aspects of wellness. could say with diet, some people kind of go on and off. may try to have a diet. go exercise. With this particular journey with healing sexual energy in your teachings, is it something that you encourage people to think about, consider, work on on a daily basis, on a regular basis? I know it’s a nonlinear path. Some people may touch into it and then, you Danielle Harel, PhD (19:49.544)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (20:11.196)come back, how does it flow in general? Because I know it’s. Celeste Hirschman, MA (20:15.18)Yeah, feel like there’s this sort of sexual anorexia that we have as a culture, this sort of lack of connecting with our eroticism that may make us seek all sorts of, get our needs met elsewhere in a way that doesn’t feel great. Whereas when we actually cultivate our erotic energy, when we allow ourselves to have our orgasms however we want to get them with ourself or with other people. Kimberly Snyder (20:27.867)Uh-huh. Celeste Hirschman, MA (20:44.63)or whatever makes us feel orgasmic, whatever that is, whether it’s dancing or gardening or masturbating, learning how to let ourselves fill up with that energy is so powerful. And I think you wanna take it at a pace that feels comfortable for you, right? Because if you’ve been denying it, denying it, denying it for so long, it can be a lot to just like fully rev up into it. Maybe you need to go very gently with like finding different approaches to pleasure. that are in alignment with, you know, whatever, a walk or a bath or just like, you know, like dancing and conn

This Week’s Episode Special Guest: Keren Eldad Kimberly interviews Keren Eldad (Coach Keren) about her new book, ‘Gilded: Breaking Free from the Cage of Ambition, Perfectionism and the Relentless Pursuit of More.’ They explore themes of emotional well-being, the societal pressures of ambition, and the journey towards personal fulfillment. Keren shares her insights on the emotional needs that drive human behavior, the importance of spirituality, and the influence of Kabbalah on her philosophy. The discussion emphasizes the need to break free from the hustle culture and find a more authentic path to success and happiness. In this conversation, Coach Keren and Kimberly also explore the themes of ego, anger, boundaries, career reconfiguration, authenticity, and personal growth. They discuss how understanding the ego as an opponent can help individuals improve themselves, the importance of breaking up with anger, and the necessity of setting boundaries to honor oneself. They also delve into the evolving nature of purpose and the significance of authenticity in personal and professional life. The discussion emphasizes the idea that true growth often requires breaking free from societal expectations and self-imposed limitations. About Keren Eldad A thought leader in the coaching world, Keren Eldad (“Coach Keren”) specializes in taking high achievers out of the futility of constant pursuit and into the greatest levels of success and fulfillment. Her coaching clients include Olympic athletes, politicians, Hollywood stars, supermodels, Special Forces operatives and serial entrepreneurs, as well as renowned global organizations such as Estée Lauder, J.P. Morgan, and Nike… She is also the founder of THE CLUB, a community of leaders, entrepreneurs and coaches who encourage and support each other to reach their fullest potential and make their greatest contribution. Recognized as a Top Ten Executive Coach by the International Coaching Federation (ICF), Real Leaders Magazine, & Goop, Keren maintains gold-standard coaching credentials on top of her advanced academic degrees from The London School of Economics and the University of Jerusalem. She is also a former C-suite executive, who has lived and worked in 17 countries and on four continents, and now coaches leaders all around the globe in four languages: English, Spanish, Hebrew and French. With half a million views on her TEDx talks, and speaking engagements all over the world, Keren’s message seems to transcend borders. She hopes it resonates with you. Episode Sponsors: LMNT: OFFER: Right now, for my listeners LMNT is offering a free sample pack with any LMNT drink mix purchase at DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD. That’s 8 single serving packets FREE with any LMNT any LMNT drink mix purchase. This deal is only available through my link so. Also try the new LMNT Sparkling — a bold, 16-ounce can of sparkling electrolyte water. USE LINK: DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD   DETOXY OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. Guest Resources Book: Gilded: Breaking Free from the Cage of Ambition, Perfectionism, and the Relentless Pursuit of More Website: https://kereneldad.com/ Social Media Instagram: @coachkeren   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Gilded and Its Themes02:49 The Golden Cage of Ambition and Perfectionism05:58 The Illusion of Success and Fulfillment08:50 Emotional Needs and Their Impact on Well-Being12:04 The 12 Steps to Overcoming the Hustle14:56 The Role of Spirituality in Personal Growth17:52 Kabbalah and Its Influence on Philosophy24:57 Understanding the Ego as an Opponent26:26 Breaking Up with Anger28:48 Navigating Boundaries and Self-Honoring36:15 Reconfiguring Career and Purpose38:34 Authenticity as a Power43:38 The Trojan Horse of Personal Growth   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Kimberly Snyder (00:00.857)Hi everyone and welcome back to our Monday Interview Show. I am so excited for our very special guest here with us today. Her name is Karen Eldag and she has a new book out called Gilded, Breaking Free from the Cage of Ambition, Perfectionism and the Relentless Pursuit of More. Karen, as I said in the subtitle, I started to get goosebumps. Coach Keren Eldad (00:22.552)Mm. Kimberly Snyder (00:27.481)Karen is a top 10 executive coach by the International Coaching Federation, Real Leaders Magazine, and Goop. She has degrees from all around the world, the London School of Economics, the University of Jerusalem. She has lived and worked on 17 countries and on four continents. She coaches leaders all around the world. She speaks four languages, English, Spanish, Hebrew, and French. Wow, Karen, thank you so much for being here with us today and congratulations on your new book. Coach Keren Eldad (01:02.35)Thank you so much. The pleasure and the honor is mine. Kimberly Snyder (01:06.455)You know, one of our cornerstones here, Karen, is emotional well-being. And when your book came across my desk and I started to dive in, I thought how perfect and how much it would resonate with so many of our audience members, because we get a lot of questions about burnout and, you know, as you say here, more and always just feeling like we’re never doing enough in our life. We can never just sort of feel that centeredness. So I feel like your topic is really, you know, one that resonates with a lot of people right now. As a coach or in your personal life, what drew you to this subject matter to focus on for your very first book? Coach Keren Eldad (01:49.944)Well, like most teachers, I teach what I myself had to learn. And in my case, it was. Yeah, I mean, we are teachers. We are teachers. You’re a remarkable teacher. I’ve admired you for so long. And I think that all of us are teaching the same thing. We’re teaching people to take the journey from the head to the heart. That little bio, it’s mad impressive, right? my God, Karen, four languages, 17 countries. You must be remarkable. And you know what? I am. Kimberly Snyder (01:55.755)Yes, wounded healer. Kimberly Snyder (02:08.983)Yes. Coach Keren Eldad (02:20.024)but none of it matters. For my mental health to actually start to take precedent, for my happiness to actually start to move to the forefront, I had to get over that. That’s not actually what I used as an asset. It’s what I had to overcome in order for those patterns to move to the background and for me to not bump into a crash, I mean, into walls anymore. This is the big correction of most of the superstars who are listening right now. Whether you identify as an overachiever or you identify as a regular person, for the record, Kimberly Snyder (02:40.258)you Coach Keren Eldad (02:49.664)I never really thought of myself as an overachiever because I’m quite lazy by nature. I’m very slow paced by nature. Other people have a hugely impressive productivity pace. We were talking right before this session about your eighth book in 11 years. I tell you something, just thinking about that makes me want to go to sleep because this is my first book and it’s been two months and I just, I really just want to go back to my bedroom and go to sleep. But whether we identify as overachievers or not, all of us are susceptible to a society that’s telling us to get more. get more, get more, work harder, do more, be more accomplished. And this is so exhausting and such an awful way to live that ultimately I wrote Gilded as an analogy, as a metaphor for the golden cage that we all find ourselves trapped in by our own success, by our own ambition, a trap of overwhelm. And I hope that it helps people to take the same 12 steps I took and the same 12 steps I teach my clients to take to get out of there. Kimberly Snyder (03:30.585)Mm. Kimberly Snyder (03:36.205)Yes. Coach Keren Eldad (03:48.834)and to get from their brain back to their body, to their heart. Kimberly Snyder (03:50.009)So beautifully said, and I love how you connect this work to Heart-Led Living, which is really about this expansive true self where we can really feel that truth of who we are without having to have a long list of achievements. So I resonate with everything you say, especially the part about society. So two things came to mind when you were speaking, Karen, in my personal journey. So first of all, I was an overachiever. I am a perfectionist. So I really resonated with your book and, you know, correlating doing enough with love, with validation, with worth. I went backpacking for three years around the world. That’s sort of where I started to break my mindset. And when I came back, very, a lot of Israelis, especially in India and Thailand, this is back in the day when Koh Phan Yang was like unpaved. This is over 15 years ago. Coach Keren Eldad (04:35.35)must have met a lot of Israelis. Kimberly Snyder (04:47.479)So the first thing is when I came back here and I started a free blog and it wasn’t my intention, but I got pulled into Hollywood. I started to work with these big celebrities and to this day, I’m not a screen person so I don’t watch movies or TV shows. So sometimes I would ask myself, huh, this is interesting. I wonder why my life turned out this way. But one of the biggest learnings was I could see how much society sort of, you know, Coach Keren Eldad (04:55.48)Mm-hmm. Kimberly Snyder (05:13.089)just idolized this idea of fame and money and, everybody thinks this person’s so beautiful. And being in the inner circles, I could see how much suffering there was, a lot of isolation, insecurities exacerbated, millions of people are looking. So I remember thinking, and again, this is over 15 years ago now, society has it wrong. This is not, when we get there, Coach Keren Eldad (05:39.192)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (05:42.593)This is not it. And there’s this quote in your book upfront, and I don’t want to, I think you actually have all your, I think you actually have to have all your dreams come true to realize they’re the wrong dreams. You quote, Matthew Perry at the beginning of the book. So that was the first thing was like, I remember I was early on and I was still striving, but I was like, wow, this is interesting because these people have all the money and all the fame and they’re, you know, Coach Keren Eldad (05:47.689)Matthew Perry quote. Coach Keren Eldad (05:56.654)May you rest in peace. Kimberly Snyder (06:09.857)I don’t want to generalize, they’re having the same struggles as all the rest of us. Yeah, exacerbated. Everyone’s watching them. Coach Keren Eldad (06:14.68)That’s right. And even worse actually. Magnified, exactly. I went to see Brett Goldstein, who is one of the writers of Ted Lasso and one of the actors in Ted Lasso and the writer of another great huge TV show at the moment. And he did a stand up performance here in Austin last year. My husband and I went to see him. And Innity said, I thought that when I broke through in Hollywood, I would find this amazing nirvana where everybody was having an amazing time and all I found were closed rooms where people were anxious and always smoking. And I had the exact same thing too, except it was different. I broke into something different, which is the high echelons of the intellectual class, essentially the boardrooms and the government societies. Kimberly Snyder (06:47.245)Wait. Kimberly Snyder (07:00.697)Great. Coach Keren Eldad (07:00.992)when I was very, very young and I found exactly what you found in Hollywood, people who technically had it all and were giant balls of nerves. And then I started to ask myself, because I also became one of them, how did we end up here? Why is this such a phony baloney reward? Why is anybody falling for this? And most importantly, how do I get out? This was the beginning of the unraveling of my life, which as you know, I talk about in the book. Kimberly Snyder (07:09.219)What? Isn’t that interesting? Coach Keren Eldad (07:28.504)but also is the story that many of my clients follow through on. And it doesn’t have to be from exaltation to liberation. It doesn’t have to be so dramatic. It can just be, I’m living a life that is not right for me. I’m living a life that looks right for my parents, for my immigrant parents, just like you, for the life society wanted for me, and it’s not my life. How do I get to the other side? That’s pretty much the work. Kimberly Snyder (07:51.897)Back to from the headiness, the mind into the truth in our hearts. So the second thing I wanted to share with you, Karen, so that was at the beginning of my career, but I was still striving and still, you know, kind of obsessed with book sales and just looking at, you know, I think to grow all these things. Fast forward to about a month ago, and I shared this on another podcast where I saw another author. from my publishing house and I’m not on social media a lot, I do go on and answer comments. So I see some things. And so I saw this other author from my publishing house. Well, I’ve admired because she sells a ton of books. She has an enormous podcast, but I saw her from where I am right now, Karen. And I just saw her really like, just so animated, but just so much efforting. felt like doing this. social media posts to get attention and like, you know, it resonates with the masses. Like there’s a lot of people that like that and great for her. Like she’s, you know, doing, you know, she’s in her path and she’s successful. But I had this very clear feeling, Karen, and it was, I don’t want that. You know, whereas in the past I’d be like, amazing what she’s selling. means I should could sell like this and she could have this many downloads and all this stuff. And I said, wow, all this hard work. has an introspection, which I know is a big part of your book as well, has led me to this place where I can honestly say, I’m so content with just having spaciousness and peace and being in nature and having created a really, you know, such deep love in my family life and my day-to-day living. And this feels good. But from decades of that chasing, and as you say in your subtitle, this ambition, this perfectionism, you know. It really is possible. And I love that you’re teaching that and coaching that as well, because so for a long time, you know, I think I would have read this and been like, my gosh, like, I really want that. So I’m here to say, you know, this resonates, this is possible. And we need to talk about this because if anyone out there is feeling that lack of fulfillment, you can get to a place where you can feel so much more aligned with your life. Coach Keren Eldad (09:56.323)Yeah. Yeah. Coach Keren Eldad (10:06.114)Yeah, I’d love to help people get there. That’s the whole job. I think I too have found nirvana. Not just because I’ve come to terms with my lazy energy, my natural desire to be in bed half of the time, but also because the hustle is antithetical to my soul. I dislike it very much. I don’t naturally move fast or break things. I have a lot of energy for… things that I truly love, but I don’t want to do things that are inauthentic to my soul or inorganic. I don’t like the sales game. I don’t particularly like taking score. I don’t think that’s actually natural to me. And I only realized this and started to play my own game by crashing and burning on the first one. Maybe you had a different experience, though I’ve listened to you, I’ve heard you speak several times. I think you also first got basically turned off of the first experience. Kimberly Snyder (10:51.822)Mmm. Kimberly Snyder (11:01.688)Yes. Coach Keren Eldad (11:01.898)Saw on your flesh and saw not only in others but on your own on your own self how this ends up and then made the conscious decision to graduate past that and Like I like you I also watched the others and I think God bless them if they have the energy and if that’s where they are karmically That’s awesome. Go get it But I will play a different game and it turns out that this game works very very well, too My business is doing exceptionally. Well, so let’s talk to people about that Kimberly Snyder (11:27.641)Mmm. Coach Keren Eldad (11:30.232)how to identify that they’re in the wrong energy and how to get to energy that’s probably gonna help them a little bit more in their life. Kimberly Snyder (11:36.473)Beautiful. And I love how you phrase that there’s a different way. And it’s not saying right or wrong, you know, this person shouldn’t be doing this. It’s just saying, you know, if it doesn’t feel like I’m, know, someone’s life is fully aligned, there is a different way and we can still rise up to much success. And I’ve experienced that too, Karen. You know, now when I, when I’m not trying, like trying so much effort and you know, things grow and my brand grows and Coach Keren Eldad (11:54.531)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (12:04.537)The books naturally get out there without always kind of like, you know, the horse that’s like looking to the sides and, you know, I should be doing what this person’s doing. I should be doing more. So I like how on page 42 in the book, you talk about the six emotional needs, back to emotional wellbeing, one of our cornerstones, certainty, significance, uncertainty, love and connection, progress and growth, and contributing beyond yourself. Are these six attributes, how did you come up with this list? Is it something you found in research or something that you found in working with clients? Coach Keren Eldad (12:39.404)Yes, in research. Yes. This is not my idea. This is a Jungian idea that has been elaborated upon even by Tony Robbins. But essentially, the system is like this. We all have six human emotional needs. These are not Maslov needs. These are not survival needs. So it’s not your need for a roof over your head and water and air and shelter. This is the needs for you to feel emotionally safe. The bottom two are usually running the show for most people. Kimberly Snyder (12:55.833)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (13:03.437)Mm. Coach Keren Eldad (13:06.818)When people are running from the head or what we’re talking about from the head produces hustle and ambition and struggle, usually they’re over-exacerating the bottom two needs. And these are the needs for certainty. This is the need to know that we are safe, that our marriage is safe, that our work is safe, and that we will not be eaten by a tiger. The second is the need for significance. It’s the need to know that we are seen, that the world is buying our books and that everybody likes us on Instagram. Kimberly Snyder (13:34.617)Right. Coach Keren Eldad (13:34.894)Now both of these are a giant trap because they’re actually fear. They’re not needs, they’re terror. The second one, significance, is a fear of being unloved, of being rejected, of being thrown away. The bottom one is the terror of loss, its loss aversion exacerbated. So if those two are the ones you’re dialing the most, you can’t even feel the next four. Uncertainty, your need for variety, your need for problems. Love and connection. Kimberly Snyder (13:57.656)Right. Coach Keren Eldad (14:02.446)No one who wants certainty wants real love because real love is real scary. Nobody who wants real significance, who wants their likes to go up can actually tolerate growth. In other words, can tolerate risk. And finally, the need for contribution beyond the self. This one, this one always makes me laugh, Kim, because I coach teams, I coach executive teams, and I coach the leaders of those executive teams. And they almost always invariably tell me, Karen, I live for other people. Kimberly Snyder (14:16.203)Right. Coach Keren Eldad (14:29.344)It’s what I am. I just live my life in service. And I’m like, first of all, I’ve assessed you. No, you don’t. And secondly, even when you do do a really nice thing, you want credit for it. You want a big plaque that says, Jim did this. So that’s really not contribution beyond the self. Contribution beyond the self is like our real energy. Our real energy doesn’t shout, it whispers. It’s knowing. It’s calm. Kimberly Snyder (14:54.349)Beautiful, beautiful. Coach Keren Eldad (14:56.566)And so what my book is designed to do is to help you actually make that switch. It’s to help you start identifying how much you’re over protecting low level bogus needs and how much you’re sacrificing growth and love the best things in life so that you can make the switch and start playing for those instead. Thank you for calling that out. That’s my favorite part of the book. Kimberly Snyder (15:15.021)Mm-hmm. Kimberly Snyder (15:18.777)It is one of mine. You can see I folded it down. And it’s interesting how it aligns with what you said earlier, because when you’re talking about certainty and fear, you know, from a yogic, Vedic perspective, those can be, you know, sort of imbalances in your Mooladhara, your root chakra. And so you can muscle your way through, like you said, and still create success and abundance. But if you start to really ground that into a deep center, Coach Keren Eldad (15:21.272)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (15:48.493)then the energy rises and the Kundalini and the Shakti, right? You can create abundance as well, but in a much more easeful way, like you said, playing a different, totally different approach. Coach Keren Eldad (15:51.949)Yes. Coach Keren Eldad (15:57.368)Yes. A totally different game. By the way, what I define as real success, I think that’s when you are repressing. It’s not real success. You’re just manifesting money. But money without fulfillment. Money that needs to be maintained all the time. Money that needs to be worried about all the time. I don’t want it. That’s like telling me that I have a husband and I now need to look over my shoulder and check his phone all the time. Excuse me, I don’t want that relationship. I would really like a love that is infinite and abundance that is infinite. Kimberly Snyder (16:10.361)Mmmmm Kimberly Snyder (16:22.357)gosh. Yeah. Coach Keren Eldad (16:28.802)And the only way to get to that is to fully align that energy. Kimberly Snyder (16:34.937)So how, how do we do that in your system, Karen? I noticed, and I appreciate that there’s these really great chapter summaries. There’s a lot of intro-spection, which I think is really powerful for a step and first of all, being aware. So yeah, tell us a little bit about, know your whole book is about this essentially, but just from moving from point A to someone’s listening, wow, I have that fear. I have a fear I’m to lose my job, my relationship. Coach Keren Eldad (17:03.245)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (17:04.664)I’m always terrified about paying the rent. How do we move to that infinite place of abundance, which feels so alluring. Coach Keren Eldad (17:12.888)Well, I’m going to give you a couple of the steps, but first I want to say I’m like you, I’m a teacher at heart. So I present things in systems. This particular system follows the same structure as Alcoholics Anonymous. There are 12 steps in Alcoholics Anonymous. I wanted to call my book Workaholics Anonymous, also known as people who make too much effort for too little results. If you’re done with that, that is the first step. The first step is to admit that your attempts at a life that feels good to you are not. Kimberly Snyder (17:23.416)Mmm. Coach Keren Eldad (17:42.518)working. This is really hard to do because most of us think we’re very right and we’re doing all the right things and we’re doing quote unquote everything. I hear it all the time, I’m sure you do too. But you’re not. If it’s not yielding the results that you want, you must see that this is not working. And that admission is absolutely important. In Alcoholics Anonymous, it’s exactly the first step. The first step is admit that you do not have this under control because what do all addicts say? Kimberly Snyder (17:43.353)Hmm. Kimberly Snyder (17:52.779)Yes. Coach Keren Eldad (18:11.114)I can control this. I got this. I’m fine. Right? So you have to admit that there is a problem to begin with. And to admit that there is a problem does not necessarily mean that your results are off. By the way, like you said, some people do attain success and fame and they therefore don’t recognize there’s a problem. Watch your feelings. If you’re stressed out all the time, if you’re falling asleep to catastrophizing thoughts about the other shoe dropping, Kimberly Snyder (18:15.362)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (18:26.413)Sure. Coach Keren Eldad (18:38.316)and about losing love and about losing all your money and about the next deal being the last one, about how am gonna pay the rent? You are in an anxious cycle. Pay attention to aimlessness. Aimlessness means that you are doing all the things, but they don’t have any flavor. Pay attention to jealousy. Pay attention to resentment. Whenever we pay attention to these and we can admit that something is off, we can graduate to step two. The second thing. Kimberly Snyder (18:47.161)Mmm. Kimberly Snyder (18:55.405)Hmm? Kimberly Snyder (19:03.725)When you say jealousy and resentment, you mean because we’re not feeling good, so we’re looking out. Coach Keren Eldad (19:09.336)You’re looking out, yeah. You’re scrolling endlessly and all

This Week’s Episode: In this episode Kimberly interviews Alicia Jeffrey Thomas, a doctor of physical therapy, about the importance of pelvic health. They discuss the anatomy and function of the pelvic floor, factors that can weaken it, and how it relates to digestive and urinary health. Alicia shares insights on the interconnectedness of body systems, the impact of stress and trauma, and practical exercises for strengthening the pelvic floor. They also touch on the significance of pelvic health during pregnancy and the challenges faced by women experiencing painful sex due to hormonal changes. The conversation continues with the complexities of pelvic floor health, the role of posture and breathing, and the emotional aspects tied to pelvic therapy. They explore the significance of building trust with practitioners, and the interconnectedness of body mechanics. The discussion emphasizes the need for open conversations about pelvic health and the empowerment that comes from understanding one’s body.   About Alicia-Jeffrey Thomas Dr. Alicia Jeffrey Thomas has been a pelvic floor physical therapist since 2016 and treats people of all genders in the greater Boston area. She isn’t one to shy away from taboo topics. From bladder problems to bowel movements to sex, Alicia is always game to talk through the dirty details to help patients figure out what’s going on “down there.” To this end, she has created and directed multiple social media channels where she spreads evidence-based pelvic health information in humorous and relatable ways. Her page, @thepelvicdancefloor, has over 1.2 million combined followers, between Instagram and TikTok. She and her content have been featured in podcasts, magazines and blogs, and on television. Although born and raised in Florida, she now lives in Boston with her husband and their dog. Episode Sponsors:   MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription.   FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY   Guest Resources Book: Power to the Pelvis: Improve Your Pelvic Floor for Better Digestive, Urinary, Reproductive and Sexual Health Website https://www.thepelvicdancefloor.com   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Pelvic Health02:05 Factors Affecting Pelvic Floor Health04:51 The Interconnectedness of Body Systems05:56 The Role of Trauma and Stress06:21 Pelvic Floor and Digestive Health08:28 Personal Experiences with Pelvic Health09:36 Common Bladder Issues11:22 Time Commitment for Pelvic Floor Exercises13:00 Effective Pelvic Floor Exercises15:26 Preventive Care for Pelvic Health16:14 Pelvic Health During Pregnancy18:20 Painful Sex and Hormonal Changes20:12 Understanding Pelvic Floor Challenges22:23 The Importance of Posture and Breathing24:43 Connecting Breath with Pelvic Health27:13 Addressing Trauma and Sensitivity30:12 Preventative Care During Pregnancy31:40 Navigating Vulnerability in Therapy33:18 The Interconnectedness of Body Mechanics35:00 Empowering Conversations Around Pelvic Health SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Kimberly Snyder (00:00.526)Hi loves and welcome back to our Monday interview show. I am so excited for our very special guest here with us today. Her name is Alicia Jeffrey Thomas. She is a doctor of physical therapy and a certified pelvic rehabilitation practitioner. She has a brand new book out called Power to the Pelvis, improve your pelvic floor for better digestive, urinary, reproductive and sexual health. Alicia, thank you so much for being here with us today. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (00:30.621)Thank you so much for having me. Kimberly Snyder (00:32.622)It’s a really interesting topic. think a lot of us have heard about our pelvic floors. We’re always looking for new ways, especially when you’re talking about digestive health, which is such a big thing in our community, but also all these other aspects. Before we dive in, what is, I know this sounds really basic, but what is the pelvic floor? Because some of us are imagining the bones, but then you talk a lot in your book about muscles. So can we just give sort of a broad definition? Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (01:00.497)Yeah. So, okay. So you think about the bones, right, you have your pelvis, there’s a hammock of muscles that run from the pubic bone in the front, all the way up and underneath to the tailbone in the back. So it basically is responsible for holding up your internal organs. So your bladder, your bowel, your, I mean, sort of kind of your uterus, right? And then, you know, opening and closing for those functions to be able to go to the bathroom, to be able to, you know, have a child, be able to have sex, all of these ins and outs there. And then it also works with your core for core stability. It works as a stabilizing function there. So it’s this small set of muscles, relatively speaking, that we don’t see, so we don’t really think about, but it plays a big role in a lot of really integral parts in the body. Kimberly Snyder (01:48.96)And why might our pelvic floor be thrown off, especially in modern life? I know we’re sitting more, or what are some of the factors why, of course, having a baby, but what other reasons might our pelvic floor weaken and we don’t even realize what’s going on? Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (02:05.863)Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, a big factor for a lot of people can be stress. you know, in, the same way that when you’re stressed, find yourself clenching your jaw or like, you know, squeezing your glutes, your pelvic floor is probably also kind of tensing up as a result. so for some people that can result in, you know, pelvic pain, which could be pain with sitting, it could be, you know, just pain with, you know, any kind of, like sexual activity or, exams or anything like that. Kimberly Snyder (02:10.562)Mm. Kimberly Snyder (02:26.094)Mm. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (02:36.166)It could be that pelvic floor issues could develop from repetitive bathroom habits that maybe aren’t the best. So people who strain to go to the bathroom a lot, they could develop like a prolapse or a weakening of the pelvic floor or different things that would kind of fall under that umbrella. There are tons of different little lifestyle factors that we don’t really even think about that over time doing things. on a consistent basis can have those stacking negative effects. Kimberly Snyder (03:09.27)What about not breathing properly? Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (03:12.201)my gosh, that’s a huge one. Yeah. mean, and that kind of comes into it. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, a lot of it, you know, if we, if we think about how we grew up, right, a lot of us were kind of told like suck it in, you know, try to look smaller, look skinnier. we’re constantly like pulling in a little bit. that over time is kind of changing your breathing patterns because if you’re not kind of having this full expansive breath happening, Kimberly Snyder (03:14.574)You’re not really taking your breaths. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (03:37.969)then your muscles are having to do weird things to compensate. They’re tensing up or weakening in different ways. And that can also have kind of a nervous system-wide effect. So it’s harder to get out of that fight or flight if we’re not able to take like really good deep breaths. Kimberly Snyder (03:56.366)Yeah. And what about, I’ve heard, you know, with fascia, Alicia, or fascia, that there’s a piece of fascia that’s connected to your jaw that runs all the way down. So let’s say you’re clenching in your mouth, which is something I used to do a lot. I used to be a mouth or a teeth grinder. And can that, I know it can affect your back. It’s also affect your pelvic floor. It’s all interconnected. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (04:05.49)Mm-hmm. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (04:12.079)Yeah. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (04:15.837)Mm-hmm. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (04:19.315)Right. There’s that whole frontal fascial plane that’s going to run all the way down like to like the front of the pelvis. And so, you know, we, we see that a lot, like people who have, you know, tension through here or, or, you know, gripping through their masseter muscle. we do release work here, we notice a change in their pelvic floor or vice versa. I’m working on somebody’s pelvic floor and they tell me, you know, I didn’t mention this before, but I’ve had jaw pain for a while. My jaw’s actually been feeling a lot better since we started doing this relaxation work for the pelvic floor. So there’s, there’s these kind of cool little. Kimberly Snyder (04:36.174)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (04:43.758)Mmm. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (04:48.847)related effects that we can get. Little side quests. Kimberly Snyder (04:51.234)Well, I love how everything’s so related. And here we talk about really holistic approach with food and your body, your physical body and your emotions and also your spiritual growth. So one of the things you talk about in the book is trauma. You also talk about tension and stress. And from a yogic standpoint, this pelvic floor area is the Mooladhara chakra where we can hold fear. And when it’s balanced, we can feel more safe and secure, which is directly linked to our abundance. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (05:18.397)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (05:18.882)There’s a lot that can happen energetically from feeling literally more rooted and more healthy down in that area. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (05:26.609)No, absolutely. And that totally makes sense with what I see clinically. I mean, if we’re holding a lot of tension, that creates this stress cycle that happens, like stress to tension cycle. so particularly, if we aren’t comfortable with moving that area of the body or talking about that area of the body, then it becomes this thing that we put into a little box. And so part of what I really love about working in pelvic floor therapy is giving people Kimberly Snyder (05:30.862)Mm-hmm. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (05:56.477)that freedom to be curious and explore and bring awareness to these areas. Kimberly Snyder (06:03.438)So I love how you, going back to the digestive health, which you lead in your subtitle, there’s many reasons our digestion can be off. Of course, what we’re eating, we’re not eating fiber, we’re eating a lot of junk food, we’re eating a lot of sugar, so on and so forth. Tell us how realigning your pelvic floor can optimize digestion as well. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (06:21.361)Yeah. So from the most simplistic standpoint, your pelvic floor is the last part of that whole system, right? That starts at your mouth when you take something into your body. so, you know, one of the ways that we can define constipation can be that the muscles there don’t do a good job kind of getting out of the way to allowing things to evacuate completely. So working on that ability to relax so that you’re not having to strain is going to result in Kimberly Snyder (06:42.945)and Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (06:51.335)more complete elimination, which then can kind of cascade into other things, right? So if you’re more backed up, that can actually put pressure on your bladder and contribute to bladder symptoms. So there’s kind of those effects, but then also, thinking up the chain a little bit more, your pelvic floor is very, very related to your abdominal wall and things like that. And so if we work on kind of mobility of the abdominal fascia and things like that, that can also help to promote more gut motility. so that things are moving through the system at a normal pace and not getting stuck somewhere along the path. Kimberly Snyder (07:26.786)Well, I love your pictures in the book and there’s a picture in here of you sitting on a toilet with a little stool. And so there’s all these tips and hacks we can incorporate. And there’s also the exercises, which we’ll talk about in a moment, but also this lifting of your, or lining your knees can actually help you have more thorough bowel movements. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (07:33.0)Yeah. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (07:38.973)Totally. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (07:42.578)Mm-hmm. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (07:46.107)Yeah. So basically when you sit with your feet just flat on the floor, your pelvic floor kind of kinks around your large intestine. So instead of having, you know, a nice easy path, it kind of has to make an extra turn before everything comes out. if you elevate your feet so that your knees are a little bit higher than your hips, then all of a sudden that pelvic floor can relax. And so then your colon straightens out and you have a much more straightforward path to the exit. Kimberly Snyder (08:10.594)Leisha, on a personal note, did you struggle with bathroom problems or pelvic floor problems? I’m always interested how, I know in my line of work, you I write about the things that I’ve worked on myself and struggle with. So it’s really interesting that this is where your career, where your work focus has led you. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (08:27.507)It’s really interesting because before I’d been in the field for a couple of years, I wouldn’t have made that connection. It’s something that I kind of buried, right? But I realized, yeah, I was a really constipated kid. I joke all the time that my mom should have been the person to patent the squatty potty because she was the person that was always saying, just turn the trash can on its side, put your feet on top of that and stuff like that to help me. But there’s little things that I think what drew me to the field was realizing that Kimberly Snyder (08:49.614)Mm. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (08:55.539)I had these little internal conversations with myself that once I started seeing them play out in a clinical setting, I realized just how many people were not having these conversations because they didn’t have the language, because they didn’t feel comfortable, because they were embarrassed, whatever it was. And so that was just an opportunity to really give people their voice and to have them be able to take a little bit of that power and quality of life back. Kimberly Snyder (09:19.084)Yeah. You also talk about the bladder and sometimes again, this isn’t something that’s widely talked about. We think about, maybe when you’re, you know, older, seventies, eighties, nineties, you may have bladder issues. How common is it for women or people of all ages to sort of struggle? Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (09:36.527)It, yeah, mean, you know, the statistics are super variable. mean, it’s kind of like, you know, urinary incontinence can be upwards of like, I think like one in three people. Yeah, can struggle with it. And I think to a certain degree, like everybody can kind of recall a moment that they almost had a problem, right? And it’s whether that then turns into something that Kimberly Snyder (09:49.112)Really? Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (10:04.807)pushes over the edge to where, okay, I leaked a little bit when I coughed that time, but maybe that won’t happen again. And maybe we try to like, you know, hold off and say, okay, no, that was just a, that was a fluke. And then it happens a second time and you’re like, okay. And so whether that then becomes something that you report to your physician to try to get help for is, you know, I think a lot of these statistics could be a lot more common than we give them credit for because people are so afraid to bring this up. Kimberly Snyder (10:30.293)Yeah. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (10:33.691)It’s very common, but it doesn’t have to be your normal. You can have leakage with coughing, laughing, sneezing, running, jumping, that all kind of falls under stress incontinence. And it happens to people regardless of whether they’ve had children. It happens to people at any age. mean, you see elite athletes, gymnasts and people who do a lot of impact work that are starting to talk about their struggles with urinary incontinence. all the way up to your older generation, post-menopausal, where we’re having weakening of the pelvic floor and decreased supporting structures and things like that. So it’s a conversation that I think we need to be comfortable with so that we can get the help that we need. Kimberly Snyder (11:12.674)Well, so, and you break this down by different topics and there’s different exercises. If someone’s listening to this or watching this and they say, hey, I do have a bladder issue that I want to address or digestive issue. How much time on average, and I know this is very individual, but how much time does one have to devote to these pelvic floor exercises on a regular basis? Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (11:22.835)Yeah. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (11:33.959)Yeah, no, that is a really good question. you know, I try to make it when I’m developing a home exercise program for a patient, I don’t want it to be something that feels like it’s so overwhelming to their life. Like if I can give you bite sized things that like maybe you’re doing a couple of times a day that I’m going to try to do that versus saying, here’s an hour’s worth of exercises that you need to do. Right. We’re so busy and that’s just going to increase your stress level. And it’s kind of like, you know, there’s a Kimberly Snyder (11:55.15)We’re all so busy, you know. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (12:02.013)There’s a level at which somebody says, if I can’t do all 10 of these things, then I’m not just going to, I’m just not going to do any of them instead of maybe I’ll do three. And so if I set it as here’s a little module that you can do, right? Of like two or three things. And if we try to incorporate those, you know, when you take a break at work or right before you go to sleep, like little things that are easier to integrate into your life. I tend to see that working better for people. but again, it’s, all going to be individualized to what that person. Kimberly Snyder (12:08.974)Great. Kimberly Snyder (12:26.007)Yes. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (12:30.397)feels like they can commit and maybe that changes the amount of time that they’re working on this for, know, different things like that. Kimberly Snyder (12:37.026)Can you give an example of a general pelvic floor exercise that might be great for, I know it’s individual, but someone who’s just looking to strengthen their pelvic floor in general, like a simple exercise so someone can get an idea of what it feels like. I know there’s a chapter in your book where you talk about going beyond key goals, which is what most of us hear about with exercises in this area. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (13:00.091)Yeah. So, so right. So a Kegel is a contraction of the pelvic floor and it’s just that very isolated activation of the pelvic floor, which is great to know how to do, but it doesn’t translate to function. I want to know more about what the pelvic floor is doing when you’re doing a squat or a deadlift or a bridge or something like that. So if we take a bridge, for example, right, because this is one that most people can do. so you’re lying on your back with your knees bent and you’re trying to like squeeze your glutes to lift your hips up. I want you to be able to kind of get in tune with what your pelvic floor is doing. When you lift up, do you find that you’re holding your breath, right? Which might be putting pressure downward onto your pelvic floor. Then I’m trying to tell somebody, okay, maybe we’re exhaling as we do that. What’s happening with the position of your spine to make sure that you’re not like overly flattening your back, but also that you don’t have some big arch in your back. That’s also kind of throwing off the whole mechanics of the system. And whether we then additionally cue for contracting the pelvic floor as you do that. depends on what’s happening with the person because a lot of times these motor patterns are happening automatically where if I have you do certain movements, your pelvic floor is going to protectively to say, okay, yep, we need to make sure we support the organs when you’re doing this more loaded exercise. So it’s layering in all of those pieces so that you’re not having to kegel, do the thing, relax kegel. That’s not how I want it to have to function in the long term. Kimberly Snyder (14:24.93)got it. So it’s not as simple as, do 10 Kegels while you’re driving your car and you can work it into your day while you’re sitting there with your clothes. It’s more nuanced is what I’m hearing you say. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (14:29.434)No. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (14:36.755)Totally. The Kegel thing, it’s great because it’s an exercise that is really accessible. It doesn’t require any equipment. You can kind of do it anywhere. But it’s like medication, right? We want to make sure that we have the right medication at the right dosage at the right time for the right person. We talk about exercise as medicine, and this is one of those instances where I’m like, okay, well, not everybody needs to be taking the Kegel medicine. Kimberly Snyder (15:05.772)Right. Well, let’s say someone is going to the bathroom pretty well and they don’t have bladder issues. Are these signs that we have a healthy pelvic floor? And in that case, do we still need to do pelvic exercises sort of preventively for the future? Or is this more like you feel that there’s an issue and you want to explore it deeper? Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (15:26.227)So, I I am never going to tell somebody like, just forget about your pelvic floor, right? Like I think it needs to be something that we need to be, you know, aware of and have knowledge of. And so in an ideal world, what I would encourage people to do is to get their pelvic floor muscles assessed by a professional who can say, you know, yes, you’re not feeling XYZ symptoms, but Kimberly Snyder (15:37.923)Right. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (15:49.489)I noticed that when you do this, you are bearing down or that you’re doing something you’re not supposed to. So like, here’s a couple of things that you can individually work on, right? But it’s in, in an asymptomatic person, it’s, it’s going to be like particularly nuanced because I don’t want to have them then like kegel themselves into a pelvic floor issue, you know, where then their muscles get too tense and then they start having issues, you know, relaxing to like go to go to the bathroom or something like that. Kimberly Snyder (16:08.205)Right. Kimberly Snyder (16:14.51)Well, and when there’s a life changing circumstance, let’s say pregnancy. So let’s break it down, Alicia, pre, during, post, because I love you talk about reproductive health. How can healthy pelvic floor even help potentially with fertility? Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (16:18.545)Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yep. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (16:30.547)No, definitely. In the earlier stages, so pre-pregnancy, the vast majority of people are not going to have a pelvic floor issue unless they have that pelvic floor tension. Usually we’re seeing frequent urination or pain with sex or something like that. Once you are pregnant, you can do strengthening and awareness training for your pelvic floor because you’re going to Kimberly Snyder (16:59.16)while you’re pregnant. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (17:00.081)while you’re pregnant in the earlier trimesters, right? So, because as the pregnancy is growing, we’re getting more load placed on top of the pelvic floor. So it’s almost kind of like you’re like strapping more and more dumbbells to the pelvic floor muscles. And so training that and having that awareness can be really good for reducing urinary incontinence in pregnancy to decreasing back pain, you know, especially if we’re incorporating it alongside other, you know, core exercises and body awareness, postural training, things like that. Once we get into the later stages of pregnancy and we’re getting closer to delivery, then we start thinking about the opposite end of the spectrum where we say, okay, the pelvic floor needs to be able to get out of the way for that baby to come out because the pelvic floor doesn’t push the baby out, the uterus does that. But if you’re always clenching the pelvic floor and we’ve only been working on strengthening, then sometimes it doesn’t necessarily have that like… ability to let go on its own, and especially to be able to keep the pelvic floor relaxed through something as painful as labor or a contraction or whatever. And so we do that kind of training. do, know, perineal stretching training, labor positioning training, things like that. Kimberly Snyder (18:07.392)If someone’s clenching though, let’s say sex is painful, is there any way that could, and I’m just asking, really don’t know, but prevent, let’s say the sperm from going all the way, actually prevent pregnancy, is that possible? Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (18:13.787)Mm-hmm. Yeah. Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (18:20.603)No, I wouldn’t say that. As long as penetration is possible, then that’s not going to be the inhibiting factor. There are people who have a condition like vaginismus, for example, where the pelvic floor muscles are so tense that nothing can go in. There are people who can’t even get a Q-tip in or have a speculum exam or something like that. so there are people who work with… Kimberly Snyder (18:25.559)Okay. Kimberly Snyder (18:30.38)Okay. Kimberly Snyder (18:42.669)What? Alicia Jeffrey-Thomas (18:47.313)reproductive endocrinologists who will do artificial insemination because they’re not able to achieve it that way. But from a pelvic floor perspective, it’s not necessarily going to interfere with insemination otherwise. Kimbe

Week’s Episode Special Guest: Tiffany Moon In this episode Kimberly interviews Tiffany Moon, a board-certified anesthesiologist and reality TV star. Tiffany speaks about her journey of self-discovery and the lessons learned from her experiences on Bravo’s Real Housewives of Calls. Tiffany discusses the impact of reality TV on her work-life balance, the difference between joy and happiness, and the cultural influences that shaped her perfectionism. She speaks to the importance of authenticity in social media and the role of intention in finding joy in life. Through her personal stories and insights, Tiffany inspires listeners to embrace their true selves and cultivate joy from within. She discusses the importance of self-care, joy, and laughter in maintaining vitality and well-being. The dialogue also touches on the vulnerability of writing a memoir and the insights gained from the process.   About Tiffany Moon TIFFANY MOON, MD, is a board-certified anesthesiologist, entrepreneur, keynote speaker, mother of twins, and author of the upcoming book, Joy Prescriptions: How I Learned to Stop Chasing Perfection and Embrace Connection (May 6, 2025, Legacy Lit). She is also the founder and CEO of Aromasthesia Candles, Three Moons Wine, and LeadHer Summit. Dr. Moon has published over fifty peer-reviewed publications, is one of D Magazine’s “Best Doctors,” serves as an Oral Board Examiner for the American Board of Anesthesiology, and is an Associate Professor of Anesthesiology and Pain Management at the University of Texas’s Southwestern Medical Center Tiffany was the first medical doctor and Chinese American cast member on Bravo’s Real Housewives and her story has been featured in Forbes, Variety, Harper’s Bazaar, USA Today, and more. She lives with her family in Dallas, TX. Episode Sponsors: MOMENTOUS: OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. LMNT: OFFER: Right now, for my listeners LMNT is offering a free sample pack with any LMNT drink mix purchase at DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD. That’s 8 single serving packets FREE with any LMNT any LMNT drink mix purchase. This deal is only available through my link so. Also try the new LMNT Sparkling — a bold, 16-ounce can of sparkling electrolyte water. USE LINK: DrinkLMNT.com/FEELGOOD Guest Resources Book: JOY PRESCRIPTIONS: How I Learned to Stop Chasing Perfection and Embrace Connection Website: Main website: https://www.tiffanymoonmd.com/ Book website: https://joyprescriptions.com/ Social Media TikTok: @tiffanymoonmd Instagram: @tiffanymoonmd   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Tiffany Moon and Her Journey03:06 The Impact of Reality TV on Work-Life Balance06:10 Understanding Joy vs. Happiness08:50 Cultural Influences on Perfectionism12:07 The Evolution of Self-Expression14:52 Navigating Social Media and Authenticity17:57 The Role of Intention in Life and Social Media20:51 Embracing the Duality of Professionalism and Personality24:11 Navigating Social Media and Public Perception26:46 The Creative Process Behind the Book29:41 Balancing Femininity and Professionalism31:05 Self-Care Practices for Well-Being35:05 The Connection Between Joy and Vitality36:48 The Power of Laughter and Gratitude40:41 The Vulnerability of Writing a Memoir   SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Kimberly Snyder (00:00.644)Hi everyone and welcome back for a very special conversation with our guest today, Tiffany Moon, who has a fascinating bio. She is a board certified anesthesiologist, entrepreneur, keynote speaker. She has a new book out, which I love called Joy Prescriptions, How I Learned to Stop Chasing Perfection and Embrace Connection. Tiffany is also, you might recognize her as the first doctorand first generation Asian American to join Bravo’s Real Housewives show. So welcome to the show, Tiffany, and thank you so much for being here with us today. Tiffany Moon (00:40.024)Thank you so much for having me. Kimberly Snyder (00:42.744)You know, I’m getting goosebumps. When your book first came across my desk, I thought, huh, this is really interesting. I think we all have ideas about reality shows and then just the combination was so fascinating that you’re so driven and you’ve created so much in your professional space. And then when I started to get into your book, what really struck me as we chatted about a little bit before the show was just how heartfelt you are. and you’re showing so much, you’re able to take off masks, which isn’t something that we normally associate with, you know, perhaps people that are in the limelight or people that are reality shows. So it’s just the whole, you know, everything that you bring to the table is a combination that is very unique. Tiffany Moon (01:31.33)Thank you. Yeah, sometimes people ask me why I wrote the book. And I think the answer is that I have so much to tell. And it’s very difficult on like a 60 second reel or TikTok to get vulnerable and deep with people. And so the book offers a much more in depth look into my life. And I think people who think they know me might even experience me a little different. Kimberly Snyder (01:58.7)Yes. Well, it was interesting in the book where you talk about how many people ask you, you know, one of the things people might ask right away is, hey, are you happy you did that show because there’s just so many eyeballs sort of scrutinizing and of course the way they edit things. And I thought it was really interesting how you talk about it helped you actually reframe your work life balance. So many of us are. working moms, we’re raising kids, we’re trying to keep up with school, we have career ambitions, we wanna be healthy, there’s so many things. So it sounded like there was one really positive outcome of the show was that in your real life, you started to realize you needed to be more part-time. Tiffany Moon (02:40.428)Yeah, I was really grateful for that. The producers really get deep with you and they figure out sort of what makes you tick and what problems you’re having in your life. And then they really try to have you surface those issues. And for me, it was, you know, the elusive work-life balance. And the show kind of gave me the final push that I needed to ask to go part-time. Kimberly Snyder (03:06.04)Wow. And you also mentioned how you sort of felt like you were in this arena with other women who, you know, knew each other. It could seem a little bit maybe hostile at first. Tiffany Moon (03:17.663)hostile work environment. Kimberly Snyder (03:22.106)I mean, it’s just, mean, were there moments, you know, as we go into the book as well, you’re talking about joy, were there moments you were like, why am I doing this to myself? Like, why did I, you know, sign up for this? I don’t like this. I don’t, you know, what’s going on here? Tiffany Moon (03:38.22)Yeah, I mean, as a person who wrote an entire book about joy and tells others on a daily basis to cultivate joy, let me be the first to admit that Real Housewives of Dallas did not bring me much joy. It brought me many tears. It brought me many insights. It brought a lot of drama, but not much joy. But that’s okay. Not everything in life has to be joyful. That’s the other thing. We’re not heatedness. Not everything has to be joyful. Sometimes you have to experience sorrow to experience joy. Kimberly Snyder (04:01.528)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (04:12.856)Right, there’s the contrast of seeing the, this, you know, to me, Tiffany, I’d love to hear how you think of joy. For me, it’s, part of it is having more peace, right? And just feeling like my mind isn’t racing. I’m not, you know, worrying and like backtracking, ruminating about the past, worried about the future. There’s a lot of joy in being present and just feeling like myself. Can you talk a little bit about how you see joy? Tiffany Moon (04:40.63)Yeah, I recently was talking to my friend Judith and she said something that really hit with me, which is that happiness is an idea and joy is the experience. Because sometimes people would ask me like, Dr. Moon, what’s the difference between happiness and joy? And for me, I think joy transcends happy. I think happy is like a state of being. know, like I’m happy if my team wins, I’m happy if my husband buys me roses. Kimberly Snyder (04:51.93)Mmm. Kimberly Snyder (05:09.08)Right, if. If. Tiffany Moon (05:10.134)Yeah, yeah, but it also kind of happy has this sort of like finish line thing to it. Like I’ll be happy when, right? And the when may or may not come. I feel like joy comes from the inside. Whereas happy often comes from the outside. And if you’re a joyful person, even though you’re having a bad day or you’re not in a joyful, Kimberly Snyder (05:15.928)Yes. Yes. Kimberly Snyder (05:27.17)Yes, yes. Tiffany Moon (05:34.518)scenario, you can still have joy on the inside, but it has to it’s like an inside job for sure. Kimberly Snyder (05:42.894)Well, I love again, as a doctor, you’re framing this book in terms of prescriptions, which have nothing to do with it, you the actual medical practice that you have, but actually talking about, I love this one, good on paper, being open to love in unexpected places. I went right to this chapter as well, being your authentic self, right? Finding your voice. And then you also, there’s also part of the book, the aspect of the book where you talk about being Asian American. I’m also, or my mother’s from the Philippines, so there’s this, culturally this striving, I call myself a recovering perfectionist as well, Tiffany, where so much of my worth in grades and how well I did. When did you start to dismantle some of these really ingrained beliefs and patterns? Because you’re a mother of twin girls, right? And how old are your girls? Wow. So just seeing how you were raised culturally, and of course every parent is doing their best so we’re not blaming or saying anything about our caregivers, but just from that pattern with perfectionism really strong into how you shifted and then into your daughters. Tiffany Moon (06:59.114)Yeah, I would like to think that I’m a more evolved parent. I try to praise my kids for their effort rather than the outcome. I try to catch them being good versus catch them being bad. So if they’re playing nice with one another and I see them sharing or lending a helping hand, I’m always like, my gosh, I saw that you did this. Like, I’m really proud of you for doing that or that was really kind. Versus, you I don’t know about you, but for me, I feel like I only had negative reinforcement as a childhood. It was like, be on a math test, like spanking, you grounded. I was sent to bed with no supper. you know, and there was never this like, oh, good job, or you’re kind, you’re creative, you’re curious. Like all those traits were not. Kimberly Snyder (07:35.578)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (07:43.044)you Tiffany Moon (07:52.288)rewarded and therefore not enforced because as a child you’re gonna do whatever gets you the reward and the positive reinforcement. You know if you’re praised for being quiet and obedient then you’re probably going to continue to be quiet and obedient which is what I did for most of my life until I decided that I didn’t want to be quiet and obedient anymore. Kimberly Snyder (08:05.432)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (08:09.186)Exactly. Kimberly Snyder (08:17.058)And did that take place after you became a mother? Tiffany Moon (08:21.802)It probably took place after I became a real housewife. You had known me 10 years ago. I was not really this person. I was very soft-spoken. I never voiced my concerns. The waiter would send a dish out at a restaurant that was wrong. Like not what I ordered or didn’t have the sauce on the side like I had asked. And I would just eat it even though that’s obviously not what I wanted. And my husband would be like, just send it back. Tell him you asked for the sauce on the side and you don’t like it soggy like that. And I’m like, no, it’s fine. It’s really not that big of a deal. Cause it just didn’t. And I’m like, he’s going to bring it back and spit in my food or something. But, I remember like, you know, going to get a massage for my birthday or something. And the masseuse was like, is the pressure okay? And I’m like, it’s fine. Meanwhile, I’m like, I’m paying $100 for this guy to like apply lotion to me. He’s like not working hard at all. And I just, I was so, so afraid to like, I don’t know, have an opinion or say that I didn’t like something for fear that somebody wouldn’t like me. And it sounds so ridiculous now I realize, you like I’m paying for this massage. Like I should have the pressure how I want it. But I was just, I didn’t know who I was. I wasn’t sure of myself. I based. Kimberly Snyder (09:26.49)Mmm. Tiffany Moon (09:43.703)all my worth on external achievements and how much people liked me. And so therefore I didn’t have the balls to have an opinion that went against the status quo, because that would put in jeopardy somebody liking me. And that’s how I derived my worth. And it’s crazy. It’s crazy to tell you sitting here that going on Real Housewives is what finally let me Kimberly Snyder (09:58.595)Right. Kimberly Snyder (10:11.962)What a blessing. Tiffany Moon (10:12.97)It is a blessing. know, the show was not exactly what I thought it would be. It’s not what I signed up for, but in many ways it ended up being such a blessing for me. Kimberly Snyder (10:25.624)That’s amazing, Tiffany. It’s funny how, you know, depending on your beliefs, say God, spirit, universe brings you ways, brings all of us ways to grow and evolve. And it’s not always gonna be the ways that we think, but just being open to all the lessons and learning because I imagine it was really challenging on set. And as you describe in the book, you know, first coming into that experience and having a lot of drama, but at the end, you can sort of zoom out and say, wow, I really did get a lot of. out of that experience. Tiffany Moon (10:56.972)Yeah, it’s crazy. This one little show like really changed my life in a lot of ways. Kimberly Snyder (11:05.21)So how did it change as you started to come into your voice and expression, which is a chapter in the book as well, how did it change your relationship with your husband? Tiffany Moon (11:14.242)You know, I don’t really think it changed my relationship with my husband. When I was debating to do the show, I called several people because I was not really familiar with the role Housewives. Certainly I knew what it was, but like I had not actually watched any of the franchises on a regular basis. And so I watched, so I called my friends that like knew the show, knew the characters, were Bravo Die Hard fans. And I was like, should I do Housewives? Kimberly Snyder (11:31.737)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (11:43.002)you Tiffany Moon (11:43.028)I interviewed and they offered me a spot, like, should I do it? And one of them was like, don’t do it, girl. They were like, Role Housewives is like the kiss of death for a marriage. And I was like, my God. They’re like, yeah, everybody who goes on that show like gets divorced. And I was like, my God. And I was like, so I really thought my marriage was in jeopardy if I did the show. But spoiler alert, I’m still married, happily married. It’s been, God, 2008. No, 2000, we met in 2008. We got married in 2012, so 13 years. So I guess it’s not always true. But the show didn’t really change our marriage, just that, except for the fact while I was filming, I was not a very good wife, because I was basically working two full-time jobs. Because at the time we were filming, I was still a full-time academic anesthesiologist. So I was either filming or in the hospital. If I wasn’t in the hospital, I was filming or sleeping. So I admittedly was not a very good wife or mother during filming. But again, it was 12 weeks. My husband and I talked about it. He was very supportive. He said, you film, I will take care of the house and the kids primarily while you’re doing this. Kimberly Snyder (12:37.796)Wow. Tiffany Moon (13:02.419)And it all worked out in many ways. Maybe it even brought us closer together Kimberly Snyder (13:07.128)What a beautiful partnership to have that type of communication and one person’s schedule ramps up and someone else is able to step in. So it sounds like you had a really solid relationship prior to the show. And maybe one of the reasons when people get under the spotlight, relationships can crumble is because perhaps the foundation wasn’t there or they start to go in different directions and it doesn’t always have to be that way, obviously. Tiffany Moon (13:34.348)Yeah, I think what you’re saying is right. think, you know, reality TV really puts everything under a microscope. And so if the foundation already had cracks and then you go on reality TV, it’s really going to crumble. But for those people that have strong marriages, I don’t think they have anything to worry about. Kimberly Snyder (13:51.45)You know, again, it’s really interesting that your book is about, part of this is perfectionism because I can’t think of any other way to scrutinize yourself. I used to work with a lot of celebrities and still do to an extent on these big, you know, television movies. You’re like, you could see every pore in your skin. You can evaluate how you look, your angles, your voice, how you come across in interviews. So, How did that experience, which is sort of exacerbating every single aspect of yourself, soften you into a place of deeper self-acceptance, which might seem ironic? Tiffany Moon (14:31.094)Yeah, I think I had the benefit of being naive when I was filming for the show. I didn’t really understand reality TV and the producers and how they try to pit the cast members against each other. Like I was pretty naive, but like in a good way, almost in that like ignorance is bliss kind of way. Kimberly Snyder (14:46.017)We will. Tiffany Moon (14:52.398)So I really wasn’t worried about my angles or how I appeared or what my storyline would be I really was just myself on Housewives like how you see me on my season of Dallas is basically how I am maybe they pushed me a little farther than I would have gone in my regular life to have antics and pranks and things like that because after all we are filming but by and large like the personality that you see on TV is my true personality Kimberly Snyder (15:12.73)yeah. Tiffany Moon (15:20.078)So I didn’t try to like game the system in any kind of way because quite frankly, it’s exhausting to try to be someone else. Now, if you’re a professional actor or actress, obviously you’re playing the role of somebody else. You become and embody that person while on set. I don’t have any acting skills. I’m an anesthesiologist by trade. I put people to sleep for a living. So I was like, I’m just gonna go all in, be myself. If people like it, great. And if they don’t, that’s fine too. Like I went into the show and into life and into social media already with the expectation that like not everyone likes me. Like that’s just not possible. I don’t like everyone I meet. So why would everyone who meets me like me? So I already set the expectation in my mind that I’m not everyone’s cup of tea. That way when, you know, the negative comments or criticisms come in, like it’s okay because I was already expecting that. Kimberly Snyder (16:25.166)That’s a really powerful message and I think where a lot of people really wish they could get to because, know, social media star, reality star or not, so many people are putting themselves out there on social media. example, in their own world, they’re like, you know, really, it’s a lot. And so negative comments can hurt a lot or you mentioned, you know, trying to be something you’re not. What would you say to, you know, women everywhere, people everywhere that are trying to be something on social media and realizing it isn’t giving them joy and how they can find more joy. Tiffany Moon (16:59.47)If it’s not giving you joy, baby, stop. Like life is too short. I do social media consulting and coaching work with a lot of women physicians. take non-women physicians, but those tend to be my clients, I think, just because that’s how the word of mouth is. So I help them build their brand on social media. And some of them really pick up on it. They’re like, that’s so cool. And they’re just learning so much because it’s like a whole education in social media. Kimberly Snyder (17:06.403)Yeah. Tiffany Moon (17:28.034)And then once in a while, I will have a client and she’s like, this is exhausting. I hate being in front of the camera. I hate talking. I hate editing. I hate all of this. And I’m like, great, don’t do it anymore. Like if what you got out of my course and coaching was that you absolutely hate this and it’s not bringing you joy, don’t do it. You don’t have to do social media. Plenty of people have very successful dermatology, plastic surgery practices. Kimberly Snyder (17:41.464)Right. Tiffany Moon (17:57.228)you know, nutrition clinics, weight loss clinics, without being on social media. This is just one way that you can market yourself. But if it makes you miserable and doesn’t bring you joy, like baby girl, let it go. Kimberly Snyder (18:11.16)And in a similar vein, you could be on there and maybe you’re miserable because you’re using it in a way where you feel like you have to be perfect or be something else. And you can shift to be more authentic where you feel like it is bringing you joy for some of your. Tiffany Moon (18:24.482)Yeah, I mean, my social media brings me joy. I know that sounds so crazy. But I will tell you, sometimes my assistant and I will be making a reel. And we are cracking up like I’m gonna pee my pants. Like, we just need it so funny. We’re like spitting wine, you know what I mean? It tends to be after wine, let’s be honest. But like I enjoy social media. I’ve also met like amazing friends like some of my best friends right now. I first heard of them through social media. Kimberly Snyder (18:30.169)You’ll love it. Tiffany Moon (18:53.614)And then I connected with their content. Maybe they DMed me, I DMed them. I don’t know what happened. But like, seriously, some of my closest friends right now that have spoken at my Lead Her Summit, who have given me endorsements for joy prescriptions, if you look on the back and there’s the blurbs, the people who say nice things about my book, many of those people I met through social media, like Vivian too, I met through social media. Kimberly Snyder (19:11.354)Right. Tiffany Moon (19:20.802)Who else? Betsy Grunch. Like a lot of people. And so people are always poo-pooing social media, which I get. It’s a lot of bad too. It all depends on how you’re using it, you know? But I gain lots of joy from social media. Kimberly Snyder (19:31.18)Right. Kimberly Snyder (19:37.69)Well, I think it’s intention, right? And it goes back to, you have a whole chapter on intentions because perfectionism is where we’re just hyper-focused on outcomes. And if we don’t get the hundred on the, I remember, Tiffany, if I got a 98 on the test, would, failure, you know, like I don’t want to show the test to my parents, like all the things, right? Tiffany Moon (19:51.018)I’d be so pissed. Kimberly Snyder (19:57.858)So I love this idea of using intention, inserting it into our day, into our actions, into what we’re creating, because that is one thing that can be really clear. We can’t control the outcomes. So what would you say your intention is for your social media account at this moment? Because it’s bringing you so much joy. Like, what are you wanting to put out as some of the messages in the world right now? Tiffany Moon (20:21.954)Generally speaking, when I’m making or posting a piece of content, I ask myself, is it inspirational? Is it educational? Or is it entertaining? Sometimes it’s just straight up entertaining. Like some of my stuff is, you know, like this Crocs video that has been viewed like 10 or 11 million views. It’s crazy. Like how to style Crocs. And then I throw them in the trash can, you know? And I’m like, well, there goes my Crocs sponsorship. I don’t think they’re ever, which is funny because I own about Kimberly Snyder (20:28.281)Mm. Kimberly Snyder (20:33.719)Yes. Tiffany Moon (20:51.04)eight pairs of Crocs, like no lie, I love Crocs. It just was funny. And it’s like, that’s not educational or inspirational, you know? So social media is for different things, you know? And the other thing that I wanna do on social media is show people that you can be a serious, real life doctor who’s doing very serious things. and outside of work, still have hobbies, still have a personality, still drop the occasional F-bomb. And that doesn’t mean you’re any less of a doctor because I’m tired of society, especially men, weaponizing professionalism when they don’t like something that a woman is doing. They call her unprofessional. And I just think it’s total BS. think… Kim

Week’s Episode: In this heartfelt conversation, Kimberly interviews mother-daughter duo Suzy and Halle Hopkins, co-authors of ‘What to Do When You Get Dumped.’ They discuss the inspiration behind their book, which addresses the emotional turmoil of heartbreak and the journey of healing. Suzy shares her personal experience of being unexpectedly left by her husband after 30 years of marriage, while Halle reflects on her own experiences with heartbreak. The conversation delves into the importance of allowing oneself to grieve, the power of illustrations in storytelling, and the significance of finding faith and understanding in the healing process. In this conversation, Hallie and her mother Suzy discuss the themes of healing, personal growth, and the importance of sharing one’s story. They explore the purpose behind Hallie’s book, which aims to provide encouragement and guidance for those navigating heartbreak. The discussion delves into the universal themes found in personal experiences, the journey of self-love, and the significance of support from unexpected sources. They also touch on generational perspectives on mental health and the importance of authenticity in relationships.   About Robert Biswas-Diener and Christian Van Nieuwerburgh Dr. Robert Biswas-Diener is a researcher, author, and well-known executive coach. His studies have taken him to such far-flung places as Greenland, India, Kenya, and Israel where he has researched culture as it relates to wellbeing. In addition to happiness, he has researched strengths, hospitality, friendship, and leadership. Robert has authored more than 75 peer-reviewed academic articles and chapters and has a citation count of more than 27 thousand. Dr. Biswas-Diener has authored many books, including Positive Provocation (2023), the New York Times Best Seller, The Upside of Your Dark Side (2014), and the 2007 PROSE Award winner, Happiness. As a consultant and trainer, Robert has presented in 30 nations. He has presented keynotes and workshops to Lululemon, Deloitte, Humana, Standard Chartered Bank, Australia Department of Defense, Queensland Police, Ruby Receptionists, AARP, Cellebrite, Financial Planners Association, Australian Council for Educational Leaders, Japanese Psychological Association, Kaiser Permanente, and the World Bank, among others. In 2024, Thinkers50 recognized Robert as one of the 50 most influential executive coaches in the world. Episode Sponsors:   MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription.   FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY   Guest Resources Book: RADICAL LISTENING: The Art of True Connection Website: robertdiener.com   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Radical Listening02:12 The Importance of Listening in Diverse Cultures05:05 The Birth of Radical Listening07:45 Listening vs. Speaking: The Balance of Communication10:23 Intentional Listening: The Key to Connection14:27 Overcoming Barriers to Presence in Listening17:18 Navigating Conversations: Setting Boundaries19:19 The Dangers of Half Listening23:19 Asking Probing Questions for Deeper Connection28:16 Understanding Underlying Issues in Communication30:20 Levels of Acknowledgement32:22 Building Connections Through Radical Listening34:32 The Challenge of Acceptance36:46 Navigating Trauma and Listening38:27 The Importance of Intention in Listening40:41 Self-Care for Effective Listening42:58 Understanding Listening Skills43:44 The Ripple Effect of Radical Listening47:40 Starting Your Journey in Radical Listening51:20 Listening as an Act of Love SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Kimberly Snyder (00:00.76)Hi everyone and welcome back to our Monday interview show. I am so excited for our very special conversation today. We have both co-authors on the show today for the wonderful new book, which I love, called Radical Listening, The Art of True Connection, which provides tools for creating stronger, more resilient relationships and navigating conflicts with empathy and mutual respect. This subject matter is something that the world really needs. So our first co-author is Dr. Robert Biswas-Diener, and he is a researcher, an author, an executive coach. He has presented in over 30 nations. And in 2024, Thinker 50 recognized Robert as one of the 50 most influential executive coaches in the world. Thank you, Robert, for being here. Robert Biswas-Diener (00:51.598)Thank you so much for having me. Kimberly Snyder (00:53.846)And we are so blessed to have our second co-author here, Professor Christian von Neuwerberg, PhD. He’s a leading academic and executive coach as well with an international reputation. He has taught at, we’ll talk about this, universities in Ireland, in Australia. I love the international combination of both of you. He’s presented all around the world as well, from the US to the United Kingdom, Europe, New Zealand. and the Middle East. Interesting. He’s also passionate about motorcycling. You would get along with my husband, Christian, writing and coaching. So welcome both of you. Thank you so much for being here with us today. Christian (01:37.929)Thank you so much. We’re really excited to be here and thanks so much for the work that you do Kim. Kimberly Snyder (01:43.334)thank you. So radical listening. What an amazing concept in a world where it seems like everybody’s focused on speaking and it seems that so much can fall through the cracks. Before we get into some of the concepts in your book, maybe you can share a little bit about why this subject matter is important to both of you. And I don’t think it’s a coincidence that both of you have such international credentials. part of your bio. I imagine that plays a part in listening when you’re going around the world in very different cultures. Yeah, so let’s start there. Christian (02:20.841)Thank you so much, Kimberly. Yeah, it’s so nice of you to make that connection. You know, one of the reasons we wrote the book was exactly what you said. We felt that talking about listening is more important now than it ever has been. But if I think back to where did I become interested in this? Well, you know, I have kind of an international background. My mother was Japanese. My father was Belgian. I was born and brought up in Beirut, Lebanon. And I think one of the things that that really helped me with was I had this perspective that there’s lots of different ways of seeing anything. When my mom was bringing me up, she was really highlighting the importance of being respectful. In fact, being quiet, being invisible was kind of one of her messages. From the Western perspective of my father, Kimberly Snyder (02:53.314)Wow. Kimberly Snyder (03:15.318)Hmm. Christian (03:20.145)It was more like go and get stuff, know, go, need to be put yourself out there. And I was very lucky to have an American education. went to an American community school. went to an American university. So I think I’ve always had that curiosity about, there’s so many different ways to see things. But the other side of it is I’ve always been seen as the other wherever I am because of my mixed background. I’m always not from that place. And if you’re not from that place, you’ve kind of got to be pretty alert. So I think part of my growing up was being highly alert, noticing things, listening. And I guess my question has always been, how can I fit in here? And in order to fit in, I have to listen very carefully to what’s going on around me. So thanks for noticing that, Kimberly. It’s so… I feel seen already. Kimberly Snyder (04:20.366)Well, thank you so much for sharing that Christian. And I really relate to that because my mom comes from the Philippines and I grew up in a very completely actually all white community in Connecticut. So I was always the exotic one, the other one. And there was a lot of characteristics and things that came from that experience. And one of them I would also say is being really highly attuned. to what’s going on, maybe even hypervigilant because I didn’t want to stand out. You don’t want to stand out when you’re five and four years old. So I really relate to that. Thank you so much. And Robert, and also can you guys share how you know each other too? Robert Biswas-Diener (05:04.54)Yeah, that’s actually a little bit what I wanted to talk about, which is, Christian and I have long been in each other’s orbits because we are in the same profession. We both are largely involved with positive psychology research. So our paths would cross at conferences, but our friendship and ability to collaborate really blossomed during sort of the height. or the lowest point, depending how you look at it, of the pandemic. So like many people, March 2020 was a pretty rough time for us. A lot of our work was drying up. There was a lot of uncertainty at that time. And we decided that we would just connect via Zoom and we would just have these sort of one and two hour free flowing conversations. And yeah, just the two of us. Kimberly Snyder (05:36.11)Kimberly Snyder (05:57.154)Just the two of you. Wow, two hours, I love it. Robert Biswas-Diener (06:02.52)Yeah, and so we would just, know, like once a week, twice a week, we would just chat about whatever things we agreed on, things we didn’t agree on. You know, we had lots of, you know, kind of little intellectual arguments, lots of just sharing stories, lots of just, just free ranging conversation. And it was out of that, that the book Radical Listening was born. I think normally an author is sort of pregnant with an idea, you know, this is my my research or this is what I’ve done for the last 20 years so I want to write about it. And I was not naturally a listener, I’m naturally a speaker, but it was the process of interacting with Christian and seeing how respectful he was, even in approaching disagreement and how our different styles that I’m a certain type of listener, I would say kind of a very engaged, jump in quick kind of listener and he’s kind of that, Kimberly Snyder (06:46.189)Hmm. Robert Biswas-Diener (06:59.642)why it give you your full turn to talk listener. And just watching those two dynamics interact, I was like, think we might have something to say about this. think maybe we should be writing about this. And Christian kind of simultaneously had the idea and the book was born. Kimberly Snyder (07:16.812)Wow. So I love it when something comes so naturally and organically just births out of this true need that you both felt. And I see so many books nowadays around creating boundaries and like, have to express this. There’s a lot, you know, especially for women, like being clear, like boundaries. Can you share how listening on the other end of it would radically, I mean to your title and also how you speak about here some of these benefits creating stronger relationships, being able to navigate conflicts, how the listening part is really needed and beneficial. Robert Biswas-Diener (08:03.484)It’s a great question. I do think that assertiveness and boundaries are important. One of my worries is that this just becomes more labor for women if women then have to take on all the responsibility for setting boundaries and making sure they’re protected in terms of time and other things. One of the great things about listening is that it has relatively little cost. It’s pretty easy to do, relatively little energy costs, mental costs, emotional costs. And one of the points that we make that I think makes our approach to listening a little different is that listening is motivated. It’s easy just to think about listening as if you’re just taking in sounds from the air and your job is to understand them. Kimberly Snyder (08:46.849)Mm-hmm. Robert Biswas-Diener (08:54.938)Like you’re just a giant radar dish. Like I’m just taking it in. And then my principal job is, I understand what you’re saying? That’s sort of the traditional active listening model. And that’s not wrong. I mean, there’s some good things to be gotten from that. But we think that listening is motivated and that you’re listening to accomplish something in a conversation. So in one conversation, you might want to listen in order to validate your friend. Kimberly Snyder (08:57.069)Yes. Robert Biswas-Diener (09:22.2)And in that mode, that validation mode of listening, you’re going to pay attention to certain types of things. You’re going to construe your role as listener in a certain way. And that’s very different than if you’re listening to mount a counter argument. You’re going to listen in a very different way for that. Or if you’re listening to solve a problem, you’re actually going to be listening for an entirely different set of information. So just kind of understanding what your mode is, I think can be empowering to people. because it allows you to be more effective conversational. Kimberly Snyder (09:58.102)I like how you talk about, both of you write in the book about the intention to listen because sometimes our friends want to share their, or husband or spouse wants to share their suffering or what they’re going through. And if you’re just kind of like, uh-huh, and you’re doing something while you’re like listening or chiming in, you don’t get that intention across. It can feel very disconnected. Christian (10:23.827)You’re right, Kimberly. And by the way, you’re doing radical listening right now with us because as Robert was speaking, you were interjecting. There were little noises you made and you made tiny words. And that for us is an example of radical listening, right? So the typical active listening is you probably just go completely quiet. And I would say active listening is mostly about looking like you’re listening. Whereas radical listening is being genuinely interested. And that enthusiasm comes up in laughter. I mean, you’ve been laughing, you’ve been really engaged with what we’re saying. So the interesting thing with radical listening is that it does apply in professional contexts, but also very much in personal contexts. And I know this podcast is called Feel Good. And what we’re arguing is that in addition to simply understanding somebody, and we often think, yeah, I listen in order to understand, I listen in order to communicate. But we’re saying that every listening opportunity is an opportunity to build connection with the person you’re listening to. And how does that happen? Well, one of the ways it happens is when we match. As listeners, we match what’s needed by the person we’re listening to. And for example, you were talking about like in a, in when we’re with friends, you know, the intention is I would like to listen to this person in a way that makes them feel seen, valued and heard. And if that’s my intention, then picking up what’s wanted by them. So sometimes a friend of mine might come along and say, You know, I’ve had a really bad day in the office. It’s been a terrible day. And picking up whether do they want to be acknowledged for that? Is that all they want? Or are they actually looking for a solution? So what we argue, Kimberly, is that the matching is important. If I pick up what my, person I’m listening to wants, and I provide that, which is just acknowledgement, then there’s connection and the person feels good. Christian (12:48.361)But if we accidentally mismatch it, and instead of just listening, I’m jumping in with solutions because I think what they want is a solution, or I assume that they don’t want to be feeling down. And I’m like, come on, chin up, you’re gonna be great. In fact, the irony is, although my intention is to be helpful, because I haven’t really paid attention to what it is they want, and I haven’t been intentional. about matching my listening to what they want, can ironically get in the way of that connection. Kimberly Snyder (13:24.982)Right. Well, it sounds like when I was reading the book, radical listening involves a level of being present, right? Because if we’re not really here, which is an issue for many people today, they’re half listening, they may be scrolling on their phone or they’re cooking dinner or doing whatever they’re doing. But this idea of being intentional and intuitive is really, you know, You have to be there. So what would you say to someone listening to this that says, well, you know, I struggled to be present or I would love to share this book with my spouse, not our husband, not just, you know, stereotyping men, but sometimes there is that my husband does this as well, that jumping into, well, you should do this and this. And to your point, Christian, I don’t, didn’t want you to tell me what to do. I just wanted to share this challenge I had today. So what do we do if someone’s already struggling to be present and improve their listening skills? Robert Biswas-Diener (14:27.79)Yeah, so there’s a few things in what you just said. One is if the speaker can make their intention clear, just articulate it, I just want to be heard. just, I don’t need a solution or please give me a solution. Then that can help the conversation align because it suggests a role for the listener. So that’s helpful right up front. Kimberly Snyder (14:42.178)Right. Robert Biswas-Diener (14:54.714)And I think people can be, for the lack of a better word, trained to do that or train themselves to do that. So you’re just walking in saying, look, I just want to vent for five minutes. And I think that’s going to do it for me. not looking for a solution. The other thing is really to recognize, and I think first within ourselves, some of those common obstacles, those distractions to being present. And the easiest one are sort of those external distractions. Your phone is calling your attention, the kids are pulling at you, the dog needs out, whatever the external environment provides. But there’s loads of internal ones as well. And I’ll just give a quick example of it. We call it time poverty. But I think of it as the sort of like the walk with me effect. So you’ve probably at some time in your life been with someone who was like, Christian (15:41.961)Hmm. Robert Biswas-Diener (15:46.076)Okay, I’d love to listen to you, Kimberly. I’ve got five minutes. I got another appointment. Walk with me. And you’re supposed to walk with them to their next appointment and tell you whatever you need to tell them en route. And that’s already a lack of presence because they’re eventually communicating to you. I’m already thinking about what’s coming next. You have divided attention at best. You’re not my priority. I’m trying to multitask. And an alternative to that would be Kimberly Snyder (16:00.949)Right. Robert Biswas-Diener (16:15.63)you can have four minutes of my undivided attention. I’ll stop here, I’ll turn to you, lay it on me. You are my priority. And then I’m gonna go to something else. And if it’s gonna take more than four minutes, we should probably not do it now. And we should probably find a time that gives it the time that it deserves. Kimberly Snyder (16:35.214)Well, let me ask you guys a question. We have these community Zooms. Sometimes there’s hundreds of people, 500 people. And at the end, I’ll say, does anyone, you can raise your hand. Does anyone want to ask a question or speak or share? Please keep it brief. Right? So I say that, but then people come on and they’re telling these heartfelt stories. And sometimes it just goes on and on. So what if this is your friend or this situation? Robert Biswas-Diener (16:38.236)you Kimberly Snyder (17:03.874)And you’ve already set that boundary. can actively, radically listen, but then people don’t follow that. How can you, you know, be compassionate, but actually, you know, hold to the boundaries you want? Yeah. Robert Biswas-Diener (17:18.684)Yeah, think there’s a few things you can do. And I’m sure we’ll talk about this several times, but interrupting is one of them. And interrupting, I know when I say that word, it just sounds rude. But if you want to call it interjecting, or you want to call it jumping in, there are many times conversationally where jumping in is actually very beneficial to both parties. Kimberly Snyder (17:36.127)It does. Robert Biswas-Diener (17:47.694)And many times that it’s not even considered rude. So anytime you’re speaking simultaneously, that’s an interruption. So if I’m speaking and you say, mm-hmm, that’s an interruption. It’s just a very small one. So we don’t think it’s that rude. So sometimes when your friend is going on and on and telling, if you jump in and you just say, my gosh, that’s so awful. that sort of brings them to a halt, but they don’t consider that all that rude because you’re acknowledging them when you do it. Or the same thing, you can interrupt with a question that sort of steers the conversation a little bit. Like, my gosh, Kimberly, you mind if I jump in right there? You just said something so important. I wonder what you take away from that. And those… Kimberly Snyder (18:40.854)Mmm. Robert Biswas-Diener (18:42.588)kinds of interjections are typically not even recognized as an interruption even though they technically are. Christian (18:50.271)Kimberly, can I jump in interject here because you said a little phrase earlier that really kind of highlights something I want to share with your listeners, which is this idea of half listening. You said sometimes you’re kind of half listening. And, you know, for me, the ideal is listening to someone is giving them your full attention for a certain amount of time. Then after that comes not listening at all. Robert Biswas-Diener (18:52.038)Thanks. Kimberly Snyder (19:07.565)Right. Christian (19:19.997)And I would say the worst is half listening. And what I mean by that is half listening is really confusing for the person because it’s almost like there’s been an offer made of listening, but you’re not actually listening. So it’s very confusing. And I want to give a real example. And, you know, there was a time in my life when I was actually running courses on active listening. So I’d be delivering courses about active listening. And there was one day, it was a long day. Kimberly Snyder (19:23.47)Mm. Christian (19:50.655)I come home after a long day, I’m tired. I should have probably gone for a little walk in the park or something, but no, I went straight home because I’m tired. go in, I’ve still got like 200 emails and I need to get back early tomorrow. My son just pops in straight after me, like 10 minutes after me. And I half listened to Kimberly because I said to him, I think he was like 10 years old. And I said, Hey, how was your day at school? And. Kimberly Snyder (20:09.56)No. Christian (20:20.231)You see the half listening, because I’m not really intending to listen, but I just said that my mind is elsewhere. I’m already onto, I need to get onto my emails. Otherwise I’ll never get through all of this. And then he said, well, actually I fell down. I cut my knee and whatever in sports. And I said, good. I’m glad you had a good day on. And this actually happened. And I had to take a minute, Kimberly, because I thought, wait a minute. Kimberly Snyder (20:40.718)Christian (20:48.287)I’m working with professionals around listening. And I thought, here’s the most important person in my life, literally. And I’m not doing it. I’m not doing it. And I did make a promise then. And this is something for everyone, I think, is that our idea of radical listening, it might be radical, but it’s also simple. And the idea is to use listening as a way of showing people that you value and appreciate. Kimberly Snyder (20:57.665)Hmm Kimberly Snyder (21:17.879)Yes. Christian (21:17.981)and just thinking about all the different ways we can do that. And like Robert mentioned, that that’s how we started having these conversations. But I’ll give you an example of how Robert is a great listener. We’d get onto a Zoom call, right? So it’s a Zoom call. And he’d say, right at the beginning, he’d say, let me just get my cat either out of the room or in the room. He’d take time to turn off his mobile phone. But you know what that was saying to me? is I’m getting rid of all these distractions because what you have to say is important. So I think we can all think about what are the messages we’re giving to people. And the moment I say, look, I haven’t really got time for this or, you know, I’m sending this email, talk to me while I’m sending it, my message is actually, I don’t have time for you. You’re not that valuable. So anything we can do. you know, questions is one of our skills, Kimberly. Kimberly Snyder (21:51.277)Mm. Christian (22:14.649)So you know that trip home from school. don’t know if some of your listeners will know what I’m talking about, especially if you have a teenager and you’re like, how was school? It’s like, if you get a grant out of them, you’re loving it, right? But maybe ask a different question. You know, like, what was the best part of school today? What was the thing you most enjoyed? So maybe change the question so that it’s more engaging. and maybe also be okay with silence because sometimes we get frustrated and we keep asking, why don’t you talk to me? Why aren’t you saying anything? So just that being comfortable with them and creating the space which is, look, I’m here to listen to you. And if you want to share something with me, I’m gonna be sitting here quietly. And if you’re not ready yet, that’s okay. So just creating the space for, this is space for you to share something with me. Kimberly Snyder (22:50.478)What? Kimberly S

Week’s Episode: In this episode Kimberly interviews Monica Yates, an industry-leading trauma healer and embodiment coach. She is the New York Times best-selling author of the new book Becoming Her and Founder/CEO of Monica Yates Health. Through somatic trauma healing and deep embodiment work, Monica has helped women overcome hyper-masculinity and reconnect with their feminine energy in a sustainable way, giving them everlasting expansion in all areas of their lives — business, love, family, health, and fertility. Kimberly and Monica explore the pressures modern women face, the importance of embracing feminine qualities, and the impact of trauma on women’s ability to embody their true selves. Monica shares her personal journey of transformation and healing, emphasizing the need for women to give themselves permission to live authentically. The discussion also delves into the dynamics of polarity in relationships and how trauma can hinder women’s connection to their femininity. They also explore the dynamics of being a female breadwinner, and the importance of connecting with one’s essence through movement and self-acceptance. They discuss the need for women to embrace their feminine energy while navigating modern roles, and practical tools for self-discovery and healing.   About Monica Yates Monica Yates is a renowned trauma healer, embodiment coach, and New York Times best selling author of Becoming You. With nearly a decade of experience, she has guided tens of thousands of women to shed their masculine armor, embrace their feminine energy, and align their lives with authenticity and purpose. At the heart of Monica’s work lies her unique blend of somatic healing and embodiment practices to address trauma at its root. By integrating science-backed techniques with deep emotional exploration, she empowers clients to reconnect with their bodies, heal deeply held wounds, and create lasting change. Her philosophy emphasizes balancing feminine flow with masculine structure, fostering harmony across all areas of life. Monica’s passion for healing is deeply personal. Growing up between Australia and New York City, she initially saw her childhood as idyllic but later recognized patterns of external validation, body image struggles, and unhealthy relationships as signs of unresolved trauma. This realization fueled her commitment to understanding trauma’s effects on the body and mind, equipping her to support others on their journeys. Episode Sponsors:   MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription..   FEEL GOOD DIGESTIVE ENZYMES OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order at mysolluna.com   Guest Resources Book: Becoming HER: Straight Talk for Healing, Embodying, and Radiating as Your Most Powerful Self Podcast: Feminine as F*ck® podcast Website: https://monicayateshealth.com/ Social: @monicayateshealth   Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Transformation and Healing03:03 The Pressure of Modern Womanhood05:47 The Value of Feminine Qualities08:57 Embracing Authentic Womanhood12:01 Understanding Polarity in Relationships14:51 The Impact of Trauma on Femininity17:52 Healing Through Somatic Practices22:51 Understanding Trauma and Its Impact29:00 Navigating Feminine Energy and Breadwinner Dynamics37:04 Connecting to Your Essence Through Movement SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Kimberly Snyder (00:01.176)Hi loves, welcome back to our Monday interview show. I am so excited for our very special interview today with Monica Yates, who is a New York Times Best Selling author. She has a brand new book just out called Becoming Her, Straight Talk for Healing, Embodying and Radiating as Your Most Powerful Self. Monica is a renowned trauma healer committed to helping women achieve profound. personal transformation. She helps women shed their masculine armor and align their lives with authenticity and purpose. These are powerful words, Monica. Thank you so much for being here today. I just got some goosebumps. Monica Yates (00:39.293)Thank you. Thank you for having me. Yay! The energy is thriving already. Kimberly Snyder (00:46.602)Yes. Well, first of all, congratulations on writing this book. And I read it in bed and the book just flows through all these amazing topics. Before we dive in, tell us about your interest in this particular lens of dropping the masculine armor, what’s going on in the world today, why you’re so passionate about focusing on this. Monica Yates (00:51.933)Thank you. Monica Yates (01:03.517)Mmm. Monica Yates (01:14.191)Yeah, well, I think the main reason is and really the reason why I wrote this book is because I realized a lot of women just needed permission. They needed permission to be the version of themselves they want to be at the given season of life that they’re in versus thinking, I just have to fit into kind of this box of being the perfect woman who’s the girl boss and this and keeping an amazing sex life and has a thriving social circle and just this kind of new pressure that’s been put on women where we feel like in order to be a good enough woman, we have to be ticking all these boxes. And you know, I just feel like Instagram has just exacerbated this issue where women are just tearing each other down because one woman doesn’t agree with how another woman is living her life. I mean, me getting into this work in particular was my own journey. used to be such, can I swear on this podcast? I forgot to ask you actually Kimberly. Okay, great. used to be because we have an Australian in the house. I’m like, careful. I used to be such a cold hard bitch when I was younger. I was so masculine. I really thought that being like a cool girl meant being unemotional and being detached and just being masculine. I thought that by being, you know, a masculine woman, I was being a good feminist. And long story short, my journey with all of that and kind of Kimberly Snyder (02:10.126)You’re like. Monica Yates (02:37.063)the downfall of it all. had a really bad ski accident that forced me to then actually give up the control and my like hyper independence. And that really led me into this path of all the trauma healing and everything. And it was actually what really got me started was I lost my period for 18 months. And the only thing that got my period back was being in a relationship with a masculine man. He was like in a healthy way forcing me into my feminine. And that’s when I was like, wait, I think there’s, cause I was trying all the herbs, all the things. And I was like, I think there’s something to being in your feminine that influences your physical health. And I mean, you could even relate to this, right? With like the heart math and everything. And so, you know, that’s just kind of in a different way. And so once I then actually started to drop into my feminine, then my period came back. And that’s what made my business take off eight years ago was I was helping all these women get their periods back, not from. Kimberly Snyder (03:08.322)Yes. Monica Yates (03:33.223)herbs or food or anything like that, but actually from getting into their feminine. Kimberly Snyder (03:38.766)Mm. And there really does feel like a connection between this feminine and the heart, as I talk about a lot, Monica, which is a lot of the ideas, the headiness, it’s very linear, it’s very rational. It can be over masculine, like this idea, like you said, I’m going to be the girl boss, I’m going to be this, I’m going to be that versus it’s not that we can’t achieve in our career, but softening into this really caring, compassionate, loving, Monica Yates (03:44.401)Yeah. Monica Yates (04:02.108)Right. Kimberly Snyder (04:08.064)intuitive part of us as well. Because when we get hardened, like you said, there can be a rigidity in our body, which can manifest in hormonal imbalances and disorders. So I love in the book how you straight away, and I love how you speak your mind, but you talk about girl boss and you said, Hey, I’m not a girl. I’m a woman. I’m a lady. Can you tell, talk a little bit about, cause it’s, it’s kind of complicated, right? We get all these different messages and you and I were chatting before the podcast. Monica Yates (04:10.45)Yeah. Monica Yates (04:17.383)Yeah. Monica Yates (04:21.958)Yeah. Monica Yates (04:26.137)Yes. Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (04:36.748)And I said, I’m really grateful because I am a full-time mom. can honestly say I bring my kids to school, pick them up once they’re home, I’m with them. I bring them to activities, I cook dinner. And at the same time, I get to have a really full career because I have created that. work, you know, I write books at home. I run my business from home, the podcast, but there’s so many women that don’t get to do that, right? And so you see some women. Monica Yates (05:00.497)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (05:02.242)They have to be in the office making great strides in their career and maybe they’re feeling unfulfilled at home. And I know so many friends who are stay-at-home moms and they don’t feel like they get the respect that they want and they can feel isolated. And there was a survey, Monica, about stay-at-home moms having really high levels of chronic insomnia. So it’s complex. Monica Yates (05:12.829)Mmm. Monica Yates (05:20.913)Wow. Yeah, yeah. And I think the bottom line of it is that there is not an answer because we’re all so different, right? And that’s why I like to remind women that it’s about the season of your life. You’re allowed to want to be like one version of you at this age, but then decide, you know what, in this season of life, I really want to just enjoy being a state high mother. And my passion for this has really been, and it’s kind of… Kimberly Snyder (05:38.926)Okay. Monica Yates (05:47.901)gotten even bigger just with how social media has changed from when I first started writing the book. But really, the passion and the kind of oomph behind this is that I think that a lot of women, they tear other women down. And we see it like in the comment section on Instagram. They tear other women down for their individual choices. And what I want for women is I want them to feel like I can give myself permission. to go and live the life that I want right now, whatever that looks like, right? And so for some women, they don’t wanna be a stay-at-home mom. Amazing, go have a career or do both. But for other women, like some of your friends, they want that and why are they getting less respect? And that’s where the devaluing of the feminine is really important to acknowledge. Like we devalue the kind of return on investment that we get from folding the laundry. Kimberly Snyder (06:34.541)Yeah. Monica Yates (06:43.601)whether it’s us folding the laundry, whether it’s our housekeeper, whether it’s our husband, we’ve devalued those more feminine, those kind of more traditional feminine qualities or practices because we see them as less than. it’s more than though, and it’s enough if you’re bringing home money. But if you’re just at home, quote unquote, folding the laundry, that’s not nearly as valuable. And we can both sit here and say that that’s absolutely bullshit. But I think the conversation needs to be branched out to wider communities because too many women still think I’m not doing enough when I’m just at home. Kimberly Snyder (07:21.208)Well, it goes back to that doing versus being or the embodiment part of this, which is our worth is inherently this true self, this heart energy, this energy that’s us. And it manifests in different ways, but our society does pin, you know, title, salary amount. It’s like a linear. know, for me back in the day when I was obsessed with numbers, weight, you know, can get obsessed with calories. Monica Yates (07:24.455)Yeah. Monica Yates (07:30.62)Mm-hmm. Monica Yates (07:41.276)Yeah. Monica Yates (07:48.027)Yeah. Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (07:50.798)reductionist approach versus this embodiment of, as Moses said, I am that I am, right? Confidence that comes from just existing. Monica Yates (07:58.396)right. Yeah. And I love what you just said, Kimberly, about like the enoughness piece, because what I also talk about in the book is that women, so many women these days feel like being a woman isn’t inherently enough. We have to compete with men. And then we’re enough. If we are showing up like men, if we are achieving more than men, if we’re competing against them, it’s to prove this like enoughness. And my argument is, is if you truly are embodied in your confidence and your security, you don’t need to prove anything to anybody. So the woman, for example, that’s like, I can hold open my own door. It’s like, he knows that you can hold open your own door. He’s not saying that you’re incompetent. The only person that’s now thinking that you’re incompetent of holding open the door is yourself. Because that’s where this need to prove your worth as a woman is coming from. It’s coming from insecurity. Kimberly Snyder (08:50.211)Mm. Monica Yates (08:57.755)And obviously the roots of that are not just your own personal trauma, but also like the societal conditioning that’s been put on women to feel like being a woman isn’t necessarily as good as a man. And that’s why I’m so big on why are we trying to be like men? We need to be women. Seriously though, I’m like, why are we trying to be like men? Because we will never be a man. So we are constantly gonna feel like we are failing, right? Versus. let’s be women and then we will feel like we are being successful because we actually are in our own lane. Kimberly Snyder (09:33.27)You know, Monica, when we talk about the societal influence of this, it’s so deep rooted. And I think about places like India, right? And this amazing example of what you’re talking about is Rita Chopra. So she’s Deepak’s wife, who’s not out in the public at all. And when I wrote a book with Deepak a few years ago, I got to know her and she is so unapologetically the mother. Like I… Monica Yates (10:02.397)Hmm. Kimberly Snyder (10:02.636)raise the kids, I take care of the grandkids and there’s not even an ounce of like, I’m trying to be something I’m not. And they were both raised in India and in India there’s the divine feminine literally, right? Great mother, they can speak about aspects of the divine in this very feminine Lakshmi and Saraswati and Durga and it runs through in a very different way. Whereas in our culture, like you said, there’s this Monica Yates (10:32.113)Competitiveness. Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (10:32.16)not enough to us, that’s really, really deep. And it’s just interesting when I was backpacking around the world in certain cultures, it’s really different. And so sometimes when we go outside and then we kind of say, hey, how can we reshape this now for us individuals and future generations? Monica Yates (10:41.213)It is. Monica Yates (10:47.782)Right. Monica Yates (10:51.545)Yeah, you know, even not to go down like the mothering tangent of what we were kind of speaking about before we clicked record, like even I’ve been having these conversations with clients because they’re like, like, do you not feel all this pressure and blah, blah, blah, like, how are going to do it all being a mom and like your thoughts around x, y and z. And I’m like, well, actually, I’ve read a lot of books about French parenting. And it was so expansive for me. I think that sometimes, you know, not just here in the US, but I know Australia can do this well. We really just think like, the whole world is just this country when it’s not. we think that expansion doesn’t also lie in understanding other cultures. And when I read about even just like French parenting and the ways that the French raise kids and how French women are pregnant and how they go through that, I’m like, huh, like that was expansive. And so then to your point, like there is so much energetic expansion. in looking at another culture. And it doesn’t mean that you have to go and then live like that culture fully, but it can give you some of that permission to realize, the way that all my friends around me or what I’m seeing on social media, it’s not the only way. Kimberly Snyder (12:01.514)Mm-mm. And another topic you talk about in the book, which I thought was really interesting, is this polarity. And the first time I heard about this was when I read David Dita’s book, Monica, a few years ago, Discovering Your Sexual Essence. And then you build on that and talk about how it’s like this scale when we’re really feminine. We really attract a masculine man and, you know, kind of, you know, can veer towards the middle as well. Monica Yates (12:12.509)Mmm. Monica Yates (12:25.853)Mm-hmm. Kimberly Snyder (12:30.696)And sometimes we look in the modern world where women are sort of armored up like you talk about, and then aren’t feeling that fulfillment in relationships. And then we get mixed messages and men get mixed messages about toxic masculinity and how they should be this way and they shouldn’t be this way. Can you talk a little bit about this polarity and what you talk about in the book, it’s important to be in our true essence? Monica Yates (12:39.196)Yeah. Monica Yates (12:45.553)Mm-hmm. Monica Yates (12:56.911)Yeah. So as a woman, if you want to be in a relationship where you feel like you can kind of switch your mind off and your man is leading you and directing you and ravishing you and just like this energy of I got you and then the opposite obviously exists. So men, any men listening, if you want to be with a woman that allows you to do that. this still this actually, you know, this polarity still exists even in same sex relationships. There’s going to be feminine and masculine. They’ll often be a little bit more of a dance, like they’ll swap a little bit more between the two, but there’s still that feminine and masculine, right? Like one person is more in that receiving surrender energy, the other person is more in that directing and leading energy, and that’s what creates the chemistry. So, so many women are in this predicament these days where they’re in these relationships and they’re like, I am so unattractive to him. I feel like I have to mother him. I have to tell him what to do. I’m constantly nagging him. Kimberly Snyder (13:23.926)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (13:49.699)Yes. Monica Yates (13:52.133)We, you I do not feel ravished and adored and wanted. Like he loves me, but I like to say like being loved is great, but being wanted is better. Like there is no feeling like your partner being like, I physically need you. Right. And that energy comes from the polarity, but so many women, they come home from work, they’re in their masculine, they’re in their head. Their trauma also causes them to be in their masculine and in their head and not feel safe to let go of control. So then. You know, they cognitively are like, yes, I want a man that leads. Yes, I want to date men that caught me. But then when it actually comes to it, they can’t do it. And it’s not because they don’t want to be able to do it. It’s because in their body viscerally, they don’t feel safe to let go of control to the masculine, which can be for so many different reasons, which we can unpack. But the polarity piece is what allows us to feel that sexual energy and that attraction that a lot of people are finding they’re lacking in their relationships. They feel like they’re constantly butting heads or it’s more of like a roommate friendship vibe. And it’s not that polarized energy that they’re wanting. But you know, if you’re a woman that is heavily in her masculine, in your head, disconnected from your body, know, living this numbed out, living in this kind of numbed out state, it becomes essentially impossible for you to then surrender and relax when you come home. Kimberly Snyder (15:17.358)Mm. Monica Yates (15:17.381)and you’re with your man, so he then can’t lead you. So then he’s more in his feminine because you’re in the masculine. He’s not happy, you’re unhappy. And of course, well, you the women often are like, it’s the man’s fault when they realize, actually, I think I’ve caused this. That’s where that’s actually why I kind of wrote one of the reasons why I wrote the book, because I was really like, okay, I want to help men feel safe to be men in today’s world. But the way that we can do that is not just by telling them like, you know, he has had to be a masculine man because the women won’t them be a masculine man. It’s actually very often the woman needs to step into her feminine these days, at least, you know, in America, so that he feels safe to step into his masculine. Because if you don’t let him, so many men are afraid. As you said before, they’re so afraid of being disrespectful, of saying the wrong thing, of being cold like a creep. Kimberly Snyder (15:51.469)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (16:06.594)Yeah. Monica Yates (16:13.093)And so they just go, okay, I’m just gonna do less. don’t want to make her feel uncomfortable. But meanwhile, we’re all bitching about them on our girls’ night out. Kimberly Snyder (16:24.512)Yeah. So a couple of things, Monica, we can be in touch with our feminine and yet we all know couples and it’s probably the minority where the woman naturally is probably the leader, the more masculine and the man might be more of the feminine, but you know, not the majority. Monica Yates (16:36.231)Mm-hmm. Monica Yates (16:41.116)Yeah. Not the majority, there’s a very small proportion where that actually really works for people. But a lot of the time when you see them and it’s like, she wears the pants, it’s not like, that was a conscious choice. Like she isn’t authentically got a masculine core and he authentically has a feminine core. Very often that has played out over time. And now that’s just the way that is. doesn’t mean they’re actually happy. It’s just how it is. Kimberly Snyder (16:48.376)Yeah. Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (17:04.353)Okay. Kimberly Snyder (17:11.744)Yes. And also, and let’s talk about the trauma piece for a moment that can keep us in a pattern. And also, I just want to say, it’s not like to your point, just putting on the lipstick and wearing a dress. It’s the energy that we’re embodying. It’s what we are exuding out of us moment to moment. And so can you talk a little bit about how trauma can keep us from really embodying who we are? Monica Yates (17:15.932)Yeah. Monica Yates (17:25.127)No. Monica Yates (17:32.262)Yeah. Monica Yates (17:38.748)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (17:38.81)And some of the, I know you work with somatic practices and some of the things that we can do. If we’re listening to this, we hear this, say, you know, I do feel like a little bit disconnected from the softened feminine essence. Monica Yates (17:42.353)Mm-hmm. Monica Yates (17:52.325)Yeah. So firstly, if you notice that you get triggered in different situations, right, you get that like visceral response, whether it’s the heat coming through your body, whether it’s sweaty armpits, you get a little bit shaky, you feel like you can’t like use your voice. There’s so many different ways triggers can come up, but you get that visceral response where you feel like uncomfortable essentially in a situation that tells me that there or you freeze, you completely numb out. That tells me that there is trauma stuck in your body from you know, it could have been last year, it could have been six months ago, or it could have been 10 years ago. For a lot of women, you know, we could go on this forever, I’m sure you know, Kimberly, but for a lot of women, there is a lot of trauma from their own personal experiences, not just in regards to men and boys from when they were little, and their dad, but also the societal trauma that’s kind of like almost like the third party trauma, I like to sometimes call it that’s been put on us. So that’s a really big impact. that we have to recognize, not just the personal situations. But for a lot of women, there is trauma that they have around like daddy issues, not feeling seen by men, not feeling respected by men. Maybe there’s been sexual abuse, maybe there’s been bullying by boys, maybe there’s been like rejection and dating or heartbreak. Maybe they’ve grown up feeling like they’ve been emotionally or physically abandoned by their dad. There also though can be like kind of even taking men out of the equation and their dad out of the equation. There also can be trauma around just being a woman and the feminine, right? It’s not safe to be a woman. It’s not safe to be emotional. It’s not safe to share my feelings. It’s not safe to be open. It’s not safe to surrender. And that feeling of like, it’s not safe can come from. you know, so many different experiences. Maybe you, you know, expressed yourself once when you were 15 years old and you got like shut down by either a girlfriend or a guy friend or your mom or your dad. And that could, that could have made you feel so unsafe that your body decided like, I’m never going to open myself up to anybody again, because then I’m going to feel like this, you know, also taking into account that our nervous system, you know, is attracted to what is Kimberly Snyder (19:56.588)Mmm. Monica Yates (20:03.867)familiar, whatever is familiar feels safe. So if what is familiar to you is, you know, emotionally unavailable men, or men that don’t respect you, then you’re in a million other situations for that, then you

Week’s Episode: In this heartfelt conversation, Kimberly interviews mother-daughter duo Suzy and Halle Hopkins, co-authors of ‘What to Do When You Get Dumped.’ They discuss the inspiration behind their book, which addresses the emotional turmoil of heartbreak and the journey of healing. Suzy shares her personal experience of being unexpectedly left by her husband after 30 years of marriage, while Halle reflects on her own experiences with heartbreak. The conversation delves into the importance of allowing oneself to grieve, the power of illustrations in storytelling, and the significance of finding faith and understanding in the healing process. In this conversation, Hallie and her mother Suzy discuss the themes of healing, personal growth, and the importance of sharing one’s story. They explore the purpose behind Hallie’s book, which aims to provide encouragement and guidance for those navigating heartbreak. The discussion delves into the universal themes found in personal experiences, the journey of self-love, and the significance of support from unexpected sources. They also touch on generational perspectives on mental health and the importance of authenticity in relationships. About Suzy Hopkins & Hallie Bateman Suzy Hopkins is a former newspaper reporter and magazine publisher. She is coauthor of What to Do When I’m Gone with her daughter, writer and illustrator Hallie Bateman. She lives in Cincinnati, Ohio. Hallie Bateman is a writer and illustrator whose work has appeared in the New Yorker, the New York Times Magazine, the Awl, and many others. Her books include Directions, What to Do When I’m Gone, and Brave New Work. Other books she has illustrated include Eggasaurus. She lives in Cincinnati, OH. Episode Sponsors:   MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription.   FATTY15 OFFER: Fatty15 is on a mission to replenish your C15 levels and restore your long-term health. You can get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/KIMBERLY and using code KIMBERLY at checkout. USE LINK: fatty15.com/KIMBERLY   Guest Resources Book: What To Do When You Get Dumped: A Guide To Unbreaking Your Heart Website: http://halliebateman.com   Episode Chapters Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Heartbreak and Healing 03:00 The Genesis of the Book 05:53 Navigating Emotions After Heartbreak 08:57 The Dumpy Bill of Rights 11:57 The Power of Words and Illustrations 15:03 Physical Practices for Healing 18:02 Finding Faith and Understanding 20:59 Reflections on Family Dynamics and Relationships 29:31 The Purpose Behind the Book 31:00 Universal Themes in Personal Stories 33:05 The Journey of Healing and Growth 36:19 Finding Wholeness After Heartbreak 40:31 Self-Love and Personal Values 43:30 Generational Perspectives on Mental Health 46:59 Unexpected Support in Difficult Times 49:32 Navigating Relationships and Emotions 51:19 The Power of Connection and Authenticity SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Kimberly Snyder (00:00.824)Hi everyone and welcome back to our Monday interview show. I am so excited for my very special guests today, a mother daughter team who are the co-authors of the recent book, What to Do When You Get Dumped, A Guide to Unbreaking Your Heart. The author is Suzy Hopkins, who’s a former newspaper reporter and magazine publisher. She lives in Cincinnati and the illustrator is her mama. sorry, other way around. Suzy is the writer and Halle is the illustrator whose work has appeared in The New Yorker, The New York Times Magazine, and The Owl and many other books. She also lives in Cincinnati, Ohio. I have to say, ladies, first of all, thank you so much for being here. Congratulations. And I don’t think I’ve ever interviewed a mother daughter team before. This is awesome. Hallie (she/her) (00:31.129)you Hallie (she/her) (00:52.837)amazing. Thanks for having us. Kimberly Snyder (00:56.448)So tell us a little bit about this inspiration and coming together as mother and daughter to talk about this subject of being dumped, which is something that pretty much all of us at some point feel that heartbreak, that abandonment, that not feeling wanted is really icky part of life. And to come together as family members, it’s really interesting. Hallie (she/her) (00:58.808)But, but… Hallie (she/her) (01:24.026)going to say mom? I’m hearing something in my ears that is the vacuum on. There’s someone doing yard work outside. okay I’m sorry I thought I had something in the house. No no. distracting to me and I’m really sorry to interrupt. ahead. Okay. Okay so I thought it was a vacuum in my house and it’s like in my ear so. Kimberly Snyder (01:41.009)no, that’s okay. We’ll just edit that part out. Hallie (she/her) (01:48.91)That’s your work. That’s just someone leaf blowing. Okay. All right. I’m I will overcome. yeah. So, mom, do you want to start by kind of describing where the idea came from? the, the, the, book is about, it starts from the time, my husband very unexpectedly left. and we were married for 30 years and he one day, couple days, exactly two days before I was to retire, came in and said, I’ve got something to tell you. And what he wanted to tell me was that he had felt he wanted to pursue a relationship with a woman from 30 years earlier prior to the time we got together. And so that night he was for all intents and purposes gone and our marriage was done. And this came as a considerable surprise to me. And I it threw me into a very confused and chaotic and lost state for a long time. And basically I was closing my business of 10 years at the same time. And we had planned to Kimberly Snyder (03:00.906)Ugh. Hallie (she/her) (03:02.51)to go into retirement together. So jump ahead a year. I get counseling, I get medication, I do everything to address this crisis, which is really throws me and then another year goes by and I’m still addressing it, the counseling help, but not quite enough. and I’m still really grappling with trying to set up a new life. And year three comes and I begin to say, why on earth am I not doing better? I thought I got a lot of life experiences. I’ve had a lot of ups and downs. I thought that my recovery might be more cohesive than what I was experiencing. I was still really flailing. So Hallie and I had already written a book together called What to Do When I’m Gone. Kimberly Snyder (03:22.507)Hmm. Hallie (she/her) (03:50.074)about the loss of your mother. And it made me somewhat of an accidental author at in my late 50s. And She got me a tarot reading because she knew I was going through still a lot of grief over this and hadn’t recovered as well as expected. And the tarot reader said, you need to write a memoir as a pathway to healing. But she didn’t know I was a writer or anything about me. So I took that as seriously and began the book, which I’d had an inkling of earlier, but I began to write to record what was working and what kind of as a note of encouragement to myself. And a lot of things also don’t work when you’re trying to recover, including input from other people sometimes that is not constructive. And so that’s the that’s the genesis of the project. And after it took me about a year to write the first draft, and it was an aid to healing for me, because as a former journalist, I Kimberly Snyder (04:31.725)Hmm. Kimberly Snyder (04:51.914)yeah. Hallie (she/her) (04:54.188)was accustomed to finding my way analytically through things, but in this case, this was also forcing myself to notice what was useful in healing from heartbreak and what was not. And by noticing those things and giving myself permission to feel all the feelings that go with that, it was very helpful in moving forward. Kimberly Snyder (05:23.554)Thank you so much, Suzy. And it’s so brave and wonderful to share your story and to pour it into something that can help others heal. You know, when I was reading the book, there was a lot of, you know, X and Y and like if someone, you know, your ex ends up with this other person, which I imagine was informed by this heartbreaking story you shared, which is where your husband didn’t just say, I’m going to go off and travel by myself, but there was this other person in the, in the mix. Hallie (she/her) (05:52.066)Right, right. Kimberly Snyder (05:53.302)And then can you share a little bit about, you know, you said it was three years. Do you think there was a numbing stage where you weren’t able to feel those feelings? Is that part of the advice you might give people is to let yourself feel more early or were there stages, I imagine, of the anger and the sadness? What was some of the arc of the journey? Hallie (she/her) (06:12.026)I had the cocktail of every emotion you could possibly come up with and it was a strong cocktail and it just kept going despite having, I’d had counseling in earlier years for depression due to a lot of childhood trauma. So I had, I thought, well, I took care of that. You know, you don’t take care you learn how to integrate these these grief and trauma issues into your life and I thought I had been somehow more successful but having a third party You know when my husband told me that this woman was going to be His was his new person apparently that Basically Kimberly Snyder (06:37.088)Hmm. Hallie (she/her) (06:58.35)disconnected me from my partner of 30 years who I had shared everything with and we were both journalists and I chose that disconnect because I think he wanted to stay in touch but for me the presence of a third party meant that I could no longer speak to my husband privately. would be a triangulated experience that I wanted nothing to do with. that. Kimberly Snyder (07:03.904)Ugh. Hallie (she/her) (07:24.93)that bringing another party and changed everything for me and sadly, it’s my, you know, I could reconnect with him, but I wanted, you know, I’ve wanted to wait until I didn’t have the hurt that I had. And I just couldn’t, I really haven’t done it still. And I think… that the lesson for me was giving myself permission to take that time and to say disconnected is feel safer to me as I heal in every way that I chose to heal giving myself permission proved to be the challenge. I had to say I’m now going to take care of myself not anybody else and learning to do that when you’re a person that Kimberly Snyder (08:01.44)Hmm. Kimberly Snyder (08:07.138)Beautiful. Hallie (she/her) (08:11.392)isn’t used to necessarily doing that and that was me. So that was the big lesson and it’s in the book there’s a something in the front called a dumpy bill of rights and I wrote that to tell myself it’s okay to take as long as you want. In fact you need to to grieve in only the way that works for you. Basically irregardless of other people’s chiming in which they really want to do people really like to tell you how to get better. I really love the dumpy Bill of Rights and it’s I could read it if that’s okay. Yeah. So this is it is actually after the introduction in the very beginning. So yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You the dumped in order to unbreak your heart hold these inalienable rights. Kimberly Snyder (08:47.734)Yes, please Hallie. Which page is on? Kimberly Snyder (08:57.718)I see, I see. Here’s what it looks like. Hallie (she/her) (09:07.534)You have the right to express yourself fully and honestly. You have the right to say no to whomever or whatever does not help you move forward. You have the right to grieve and heal in a way that works for you and you alone for as long as it takes. Kimberly Snyder (09:22.402)Mm. Mm. Mm. Hallie (she/her) (09:25.434)That is something in your house, Mom. I’m sorry. Now we really do have to pause. Now you have to pause for a second. Sorry. I think it is the vacuum. And I think we should close that door, Sorry. I think it must be Mercury in retrograde or something. Okay. And then can close that. Okay. Sorry. Okay. All right. The Roomba is being put on. Okay. So… Kimberly Snyder (09:30.89)yeah, no, it’s okay, pause. It’s okay, that’s why we have editing. Kimberly Snyder (09:40.782)no, it’s okay. I’ll… Kimberly Snyder (09:46.71)It’ll all work out in the wash. Hallie (she/her) (09:55.032)Yeah, that is the the dumpy Bill of Rights. It’s on downstairs. Kimberly Snyder (10:00.664)Well, I think if there was ever a time to create healthy boundaries, it’s when you’re healing. Because as you said, Suzy, sometimes it’s easy to always give or just to sort of, you know, think of others above ourselves, but it’s such a personal time. I know for myself going through a really hard breakup before my husband, it’s… Hallie (she/her) (10:08.121)Mm-hmm. Kimberly Snyder (10:27.394)So I loved your book because there’s a lot of sharing, but there’s also this, you know, there’s this acknowledgement that it’s also a very individual process as well. And it’s gonna look different for everybody. And along those lines, I love that you guys paired together for illustrations because when it comes to this subject matter, words are powerful, but so is the drawing, right? And I’m just, and it’s humorous. Hallie (she/her) (10:38.426)That’s right. Kimberly Snyder (10:55.598)But some of these pictures literally made me cry. Like there’s pictures of, you know, there’s pictures of people crying and we’ve all felt what it’s like to be in the shower, I’ve cried in the shower. So with my breakup, we had a young child who was just over a year old. And when I moved out on my own, I used to hide in the closet and cry. I didn’t think I would be a single mom. Like I didn’t think this was gonna be my life. Hallie (she/her) (10:57.85)Aww. Hallie (she/her) (11:15.926)Mmm. Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (11:22.348)So there’s so much, there’s depths of feeling that I think also get layered in with the illustrations. And I’ve read like other books about relationships, but I think it’s rare to have that combination. Hallie (she/her) (11:35.992)Yeah, the thing that I love so much about graphic storytelling, being able to combine words and images, which is really my art practice, is that alchemy where like you’re, like when we collaborate, we’re measuring, you know. What do we need to say in words and often it doesn’t need to be much it it really causes you to simplify and sort of get to the heart of something in the language so that you can allow the images to speak and I think especially when it’s a subject like heartbreak or our first book together was about death and loss. Kimberly Snyder (12:19.981)Yeah. Hallie (she/her) (12:23.468)A wall of words can feel really inaccessible, especially when you’re in the throes of grief. And I love that, you know, when we are able to fold the two together, it enables someone, I think, even if you are currently struggling, you can read a paragraph and look at a picture and like allow it to wash over you. doesn’t ask as much of you, but it can still send a very powerful. message and I’m just like in love with this this language of words and images in combination and I think that it allows for such endless possibilities and it’s it’s so incredible to get to work with my mom in this format where you know she comes from decades of experience as a writer and a journalist and is like so practiced there but then I get to to kind of Kimberly Snyder (13:00.109)Yes. Hallie (she/her) (13:19.234)Yeah, talk to her about, but this is gonna be the art. And then we get to like, yeah, just kind of play together and squabble and figure out what the story is gonna look like on the page. And it’s really unique. Kimberly Snyder (13:38.08)Yeah, I agree, especially with the subject matter that you both are writing about, which is, you know, your other book as well. I lost my mom around the time that I went through this breakup. So I relate on both levels. I was a new mom and I became a single mom and I lost my mom and, and getting dumped. And one of the things I think in our, in our culture and our society is it’s very heady. It’s very mental, right? And you can’t think yourself out of heartbreak. Hallie (she/her) (13:50.265)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (14:07.596)Right? There’s a lot of the practices you talk about in here, which is, you know, and the images again, like looking at this roller coaster and it’s, there’s this, the feelings and the sensations and what it evokes allows, you know, now there’s so much research about how trauma and that you imagine this felt like a really traumatic situation you went through, Suzy, because it was shocking. It’s stored in the body. So. It can’t just be this mental way that we heal, but it’s this whole person way, the emotional, the sensations in the body, doing physical practices, allowing the space. It’s nonlinear. Hallie (she/her) (14:46.878)Mm-hmm. And I had no practice allowing space. I was all up in my head for, you know, my entire career. And I basically thought I can forge my way by just thinking through anything. And this really took me into the body practices in order to recover in a way that I could feel the ground again emotionally. So. Kimberly Snyder (15:03.767)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (15:10.272)And what were some of those practices, that you share about in the book and also just that you love to share personally that helped you get to a more grounded place? Hallie (she/her) (15:22.426)I suddenly retired at the same time, but it took me about a year to finish closing my business, I suddenly found myself. you know, without the mental load of running the business, but suddenly this kind of heart load. And I, I moved out of the family home and I got a place in the country that required a lot of manual labor. And I can’t think of anything that would have been better. So I bought a, wood splitter and a lot of downed trees and I split a lot of wood and I, I walked endless miles. I would say, you know, just endlessly in circles around a out in Kimberly Snyder (15:49.996)Wow. Hallie (she/her) (16:03.65)country around a big drive area with my dogs and that physicality I just went until I couldn’t go anymore because I Kimberly Snyder (16:08.451)beautiful Kimberly Snyder (16:12.365)Mmm. Hallie (she/her) (16:13.556)I had to quiet the disruption that was happening to me. and exercise was just the very best way. sort of learned to meditate, in the course of this recovery. And I hadn’t done much of that before. And so I did a lot of breathing work I’d never done. And mostly I just, for a long time, use distraction with physical labor and exercise. My mom essentially became a full-time manual laborer. And as a, from my perspective, I just. Kimberly Snyder (16:44.75)That’s so primal. was like splitting the wood. I can imagine you, Suzy, like on the farm too. Hallie (she/her) (16:53.498)I had a lot of rage and the wood cutting helped a lot. I had a lot of anger for a long time. so, you know, whatever you’re going through, it’s whatever gets you through, right? To the next, I wanted to go on to a life that was a lot healthier. And this really, in a way, forced me in that direction. Kimberly Snyder (16:59.438)Yeah. Hallie (she/her) (17:19.578)I wasn’t a yoga practitioner. I was not a particularly peaceful person. I was just a person who was so busy with work and overwhelmed by it all the time. And that was, was, you know, I wasn’t a workaholic. this was really in the end, I had to learn how to be healthier at this, at this stage in life. And in the book, Kimberly Snyder (17:41.388)Mmm. Hallie (she/her) (17:44.602)that takes different forms. Like you talked about the spread where she’s in the shower and she’s crying and kind of sitting with her feelings. And then I immediately thought of this other spread where it’s just about standing in the sun and letting the warmth embrace you. I think that, yeah, there’s like a through line of being Kimberly Snyder (18:02.222)Mmm. Hallie (she/her) (18:15.034)being with yourself. Yeah. When you say, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Throughout the book, um, relishing in, you know, there’s like this big spread about cooking, relishing in food and nourishment. And I mean, I guess you could summarize it as saying my learning mindfulness, but it’s, it’s so much more than that. It’s really, uh, Kimberly Snyder (18:28.076)Yeah, colors. Hallie (she/her) (18:36.984)just coming to a place where there’s nobody there but you to decide the next step to take, you know, to plan your life. It’s not a contingent on anyone else. And it’s sort of a big responsibility. And, and you can go, it is, that’s exactly right. And I think to what you said earlier, the book is purposely Kimberly Snyder (18:52.138)exciting and scary in a way. Hallie (she/her) (19:02.542)really specifically focused on my mom’s experience and my mom’s story down to, you know, really specific examples. And the idea is not to tell the reader, hey, you should do exactly this because this is what works. The idea is like, hopefully by inviting the reader to see and experience what one person’s journey through heartbreak looks like, that they can Hopefully, A, feel less alone in this really lonely journey and B, like, see that a path doesn’t look, you know, maybe like, yeah, you just go to, you just do an eat, pray, love and you’re good. Like, it’s not, it’s not like that, you know, that seeing that like, yeah, there’s, it’s this really long, weird, unique thing and watching my mom like trust herself and build. Kimberly Snyder (19:50.158)Yeah. Hallie (she/her) (20:02.112)new, you know, coping habits or like the hilarious little like things like she smashes the litter box that she and my dad shared like as a as a gesture of getting out her rage. Like there’s these these things that it’s it’s not saying you need to do this. It’s just saying, look what this can look like and what is your path look like? And ideally, like allowing you to see that you can, you know, trust yourself to find your way. Kimberly Snyder (20:24.897)Yes. Hallie (she/her) (20:31.738)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (20:34.606)Well, I also think it’s very comforting if you’re going through this type of situation to read someone else’s story to not feel alone. Because I remember when I was in those really dark moments, it’s easy to focus on new friends or maybe you go on Instagram and everybody looks so happy and they’re in their little worlds and you’re like, like nobody really is going through this right now or I feel alone. Hallie (she/her) (20:41.934)Mm-hmm. Hallie (she/her) (20:59.788)Mm-hmm. Kimberly Snyder (21:02.05)And so I think it’s incredibly comforting. Again, the words, the story, and also the illustrations. And when I was reading it, I couldn’t help but wonder, Hallie, if you’d been through such a bad breakup or you had been dumped, and also because you were going through this project so closely with your mother, how that might have affected your relationship with your dad. And if, you know, Hallie (she/her) (21:15.705)Hmm. Hallie (she/her) (21:27.469)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (21:29.698)you sort of felt that betrayal as well, because one of the things about someone being dumped is there’s often children and relatives and friends that are in the process. Hallie (she/her) (21:36.488)Mm-hmm. Yeah, well to speak to your first question about heartbreak, I certainly have never experienced heartbreak on this scale. Actually, we ended up kind of talking about this at a book event in New York, but my biggest heartbreak was from a situationship that ended after one month. And it just really, I was really young. It was… for me, a one month relationship was huge. Cause if that’s the longest thing you’ve ever had, then that has a big footprint on your life. And it was really interesting reflecting on that and going through this, you know, this experience of working with my mom on her story after the loss of a 30 year marriage and thinking my biggest heartbreak was after 30 days and. Kimberly Snyder (22:11.936)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (22:31.363)Yeah. Hallie (she/her) (22:31.532)And yet it’s not really comparable, but yet I was devastated by that. And I think that, you know, the way that the book is framed is that it counts you down to your heart being unbroken. And it’s counted down on my mom’s timeline, which was, I think around what, four years? Four plus years. So it starts and the countdown says, you know, Kimberly Snyder (22:58.093)Hmm. Hallie (she/her) (23:01.37)1,582 days and that’s how many days till your heart’s gonna be unbroken. As kind of this reflection of, for my mom, if she’d had this book back then, she could have said, okay, I’ve got to make it through that many days. It won’t go on forever. There will come a time when you shift. And I think that the way that I see it, if I’m thinking about that heartbreak of mine is that, okay, well it would have said, Kimberly Snyder (23:21.729)Yeah. Hallie (she/her) (23:31.652)two years, like, cause it did take me weirdly two years to get over that. But yeah, there would have, you know, there would have been a countdown. Everyone has their own, their own kind of weird ways that that heartbreak manifests. And then, yeah, I think that to speak to the second question about being in relationship with my dad, it was super painful to have. my parents split and to have it happen the way it did was devastating for myself and my brothers. It really reshaped our family and kind of reshuffled the deck of our lives. And at the same time, I’m very thankful that my brothers and I really consciously decided we are not taking sides. Like this is not a thing that we are going to, you know, allow to split the family or anything like that. Kimberly Snyder (24:09.762)Yeah. Hallie (she/her) (24:29.378)Not to say I didn’t feel my own pain and express my own anger or communications with my dad. We certainly had to work through to get to what our relationship would be now that this had happened. I was supporting, my brothers and I were supporting my mom. It just changed everything, but it was never a thought of we’re d

This Week’s Episode: In this episode Kimberly interviews Ayurvedic expert Dr. Nidhi Pandya about her new book, ‘Your Body Already Knows Intuitive Ayurveda.’ They explore the relevance of Ayurveda in modern life, emphasizing the importance of understanding natural rhythms and patterns for overall well-being. Nidhi shares practical steps for integrating Ayurvedic principles into daily life, including meal timing, the significance of intuition, and self-care practices like scalp massage. The discussion also delves into nutritional factors affecting hair health and the healing properties of warm foods, highlighting the holistic approach of Ayurveda to health and wellness. In this enlightening conversation, Nidhi discusses the profound impact of cooking on human evolution, emphasizing the importance of warm and moist foods for our microbiome and overall health. She explores the balance between raw and cooked foods, the significance of fats and spices in cooking, and how Ayurvedic principles can be adapted to various cuisines. Nidhi also shares insights on creating a personal toolkit for maintaining balance in life, the power of breath as a tool for well-being, and the wisdom of aging in relation to biohacking. Ultimately, she empowers listeners to reconnect with their inner wisdom and embrace a holistic approach to health and nutrition. About Nidhi Pandya Nidhi Pandya is an Ayurvedic Doctor based in NYC and creator of the Inner Climate® Framework. This groundbreaking approach, which merges ancient wisdom with modern science, represents the essence of her 15 years of dedicated practice and deep understanding of Ayurvedic principles. Raised in India, Nidhi was immersed in Vedic wisdom from birth, drawing inspiration from her grandfather, a respected Ayurvedic healer. Her journey led her to formal education in holistic health, culminating in her becoming an Ayurvedic Doctor. However, Nidhi soon realized the limitations of a strictly prescriptive approach to health. This insight spurred her to reinterpret Ayurveda through a transformative lens, making ancient knowledge accessible and relevant in today’s world. Nidhi’s passion lies in empowering women to become self-aware and live intuitively, achieving Mind-Body Balance. She excels in distilling complex ancient scriptures into practical wisdom, applicable to modern lifestyles. Her method, taught globally, focuses on realigning the mind and body, fostering radical transformation in the lives of her students. An international teacher, coach, speaker and author, Nidhi contributes to various publications and serves as a faculty member at the Shakti School. Her strength lies in her unique ability to bridge the gap between traditional Ayurvedic teachings and the needs of contemporary women, guiding them towards a balanced, empowered life. Episode Sponsors:   EPSIODE SPONSORS: MOMENTOUS OFFER: Head to livemomentous.com and use code KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription. That’s code KIMBERLY at livemomentous.com for 35% off your first subscription. USE LINK: livemomentous.com Code: KIMBERLY for 35% off your first subscription.   SBO PROBIOTICS OFFER: Go to mysolluna.com and use the CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order. USE LINK: mysolluna.com CODE: PODFAM15 for 15% off your entire order.     Guest Resources Book: Your Body Already Knows Website: https://www.nidhi.me/ Episode Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Ayurveda and Its Relevance Today 03:05 Understanding Rhythms and Patterns in Ayurveda 05:48 Practical Steps to an Ayurvedic Lifestyle 08:53 Intuition vs. Conditioning in Health Choices 11:59 The Importance of Scalp Massage and Hair Care 14:53 Nutritional Factors Affecting Hair Health 17:53 The Role of Warm Foods in Healing 21:00 Balancing Nutritional Intake for Optimal Health 26:10 The Warmth of Cooking and Its Impact on Humanity 28:59 Balancing Raw and Cooked Foods 32:03 The Importance of Fats and Spices in Cooking 34:48 Adapting Ayurvedic Principles to Different Cuisines 37:12 Creating a Personal Toolkit for Balance 40:06 Breath as a Tool for Well-Being 42:55 The Wisdom of Aging and Biohacking 48:57 Empowerment Through Ayurvedic Practices SOLLUNA PRODUCT LINKS Glowing Greens Powder™ Feel Good SBO Probiotics Feel Good Detoxy Feel Good Digestive Enzymes Feel Good Starter Kit Feel Good Skincare KIMBERLY’S BOOKS Chilla Gorilla & Lanky Lemur Journey to the Heart The Beauty Detox Solution Beauty Detox Foods Beauty Detox Power Radical Beauty Recipes For Your Perfectly Imperfect Life You Are More Than You Think You Are OTHER PODCASTS YOU MAY ENJOY! Wellness Insights: How to Listen to Your Body for Nutritional Guidance How the Power Foods Diet helps with Weight Loss with Dr. Neal Barnard EP. 877 How Not to Age with New York Times best-selling author Dr. Michael Greger How to eat to reduce anxiety with Harvard nutritional psychiatrist Dr. Uma Naidoo   Powered and Distributed by: PodcastOne Transcript: Kimberly Snyder (00:01.102)Hi everyone and welcome back to our Monday interview show. I am so excited for our very special guest here today, Nidhi Bansali Pandya and she has the wonderful new book just out called Your Body Already Knows Intuitive Ayurveda. Nidhi is a Ayurvedic doctor and she has this amazing approach which I appreciate very much of making Ayurveda very accessible for the modern day. She has different coaching programs and she has done an Ayurvedic nutrition course at onecommune.com where I also have a course Nidhi and I, the Commune Center is not so far from here. So it is so wonderful to be connected. Thank you so much for coming on and congratulations on your new book. Nidhi (00:48.923)Thank you so much for having me, Kim. It’s such an honor to be here and to be talking to you over your podcast. Kimberly Snyder (00:54.932)know, Nidhi, this book is so beautifully written. I love the cover. And there’s just this way that you subdivide this incredibly deep philosophy of Ayurveda in two very doable steps. Can you share before we dive in just a little bit about why you think Ayurveda is really important for our wellbeing in today’s age? We know it’s thousands of years old. It’s the oldest medical science. Why now in a world where there seems to be so much around biohacking and measurables and wearable devices and blood work? And there’s a place for that too. But where can Ayurveda really come in and create such balance in our lives? Nidhi (01:43.255)Absolutely, such a great question. I can say there’s two main reasons for this. And Kim, the first reason is us understanding that what differentiates an animate object from an inanimate object? It’s a rhythm and pattern, whether it’s the vibration of a cell, whether it’s the breath, whether it’s the pumping of a heart, whether it’s the rotation of our planet, the revolution, anything that’s out there in the universe, which has a life of its own, there is a rhythm and there is a pattern. And now more than ever before mankind. We’ve lost the understanding of these rhythms and patterns. I mean, when you look at anything from weather global warming, when you have a snowfall in spring, or whether you have untimely menopause, or whether we are staying up all night and missing our bowel movements, or we are skipping periods or infertility. Honestly, the underlying basis of all of that is the loss of a certain rhythmic pattern. Kimberly Snyder (02:37.742)Bye. Nidhi (02:38.705)And Ayurveda is a science that deeply understands that everything that’s living can only be in order when it’s following its rhythmic patterns. Not the rhythmic patterns of the universe and how they connect with each other. I think that is one of the main, you know, and we all realize that somewhere or the other, I see every disorder and it’s things have gone out of rhythm, you know? I mean, that’s one way of saying it, whether somebody has missed a period or… Kimberly Snyder (02:48.385)Yes. Nidhi (03:05.521)cannot sleep at night or has this kind of fatigue in the middle of the day, it’s untimeliness of our experience. And I would say there is definitely a second reason which I find so important. And most of Ayurveda, unfortunately, start very academically. So most Ayurveda today has lost connection with this main principle of Ayurveda, which says that disease is caused through the loss of wisdom. Kimberly Snyder (03:12.522)Bye. Kimberly Snyder (03:30.487)Hmm. Nidhi (03:31.589)which means that today there is so much information. mean, can you imagine our grandparents, when they had a question about health, they couldn’t type it in in Google or GPT now and get answers, right? But all of that is information. What they had, what we don’t is wisdom. Wisdom is what’s within you. The knowing that you had as a baby that I need to drink from my mother’s breast. Babies never use its mouth. Like a deer doesn’t wake up saying, my God, I have to wake up again in the morning and go to the same jungle and eat the same grass. They’re just so connected, right? And that’s wisdom. That’s your innate wisdom. And Ayurveda has a way to bring you back to that innate wisdom. And in this era of information overrun, we need that more than we did ever before. Kimberly Snyder (04:15.38)I agree. So beautifully said. And correct me if I’m saying this term, is it pranya parata? Crime against wisdom, my future would say. Because again, it’s easy to say, let me just do this, you know, one biohacking tool or I’ll do this or get the IV done. But it doesn’t correct, as you said, this underlying holistic lifestyle approach. Nidhi (04:21.349)Yes. Yes. Yes. Kimberly Snyder (04:42.2)So today, as you mentioned, people are missing periods. seems like a lot of people are doing IVF or technology. People can’t sleep chronically. There’s so many sleeping pills. There’s so many energy drinks. People are pumped up with caffeine. So what are some of the, and you talk about in the book, meal times, adjusting for seasons. What are some of the, if someone’s listening to this right now and saying, yeah, that’s me. What are some of the very first practices? that we want to look at to come back to a more balanced, RU-Vedic-inspired lifestyle. Nidhi (05:18.647)That’s such a practical question. I love it. But the first thing that I’ll say, it’s just so that anybody who’s listening to this does not take this as just one more prescription. I say the deeper understanding that we are diurnal mammals, which means we are not bats or tigers and or owls. And we have no nighttime vision, which means that before electricity came into urban homes, which is 1930s, we kind of followed the cycle of the sun. You know, when the sun was up, we’re up. You’re not staying with like a million lanterns hosting dinner parties at 10 p.m. We were not. Kimberly Snyder (05:26.7)Yes. Nidhi (05:48.389)So the first thing to understand is that we are diurnal mammals. And if there’s one thing you want to change is you want to start moving your clock and the way you live and eat. I’ll tell you what more what that looks like according to the cycle of the sun. Remembering that even plants do not they cannot photosynthesize unless the sun is out. So we as human beings have a lot of courage to think that we can actually metabolize at all different hours. So basically, what does that look like is the understanding that in the morning when the sun is emerging and the earth is still a little cold, a little damp. That’s how our body is. Exactly. That’s how our body is. And our experience of nasal congestion, eye boogers, sluggish joints, you can’t really show off in a yoga class early in the morning because of the sogginess in the body. It’s the same. So morning time is that perfect time to warm up the body, to exercise and eat a light breakfast, not a heavy breakfast. It’s the light. Kimberly Snyder (06:43.915)Thank Nidhi (06:44.485)warm breakfast because we are warm blooded mammals and you want to support that firing up of your metabolic activity. So you do a light breakfast, warm always. Lunchtime 10 to 2 is when the sun is high, your insulin sensitivity is the highest, your metabolic juices like gastrin and other enzymes are at their peak. Indulge in it. Eat your biggest meal. Whatever it is you want to fantasize about the previous day. Don’t deprive fantasize is what I always say. fantasize and eat that biggest meal between the hours of 10 and two. As the sun starts to set, you wanna know that your body is setting. It does not want to function, has, have its day times functions. So you wanna reserve the lightest work. And then around six o’clock, you wanna eat a small, you wanna eat your soup, you wanna eat a supper, you wanna eat a light meal. And as many days as possible, you wanna call that a day so you can go to bed by 10 p.m. Kimberly Snyder (07:15.939)Yeah. Kimberly Snyder (07:40.226)Mm. Nidhi (07:40.355)And can just rearrange the order of how you live your day, what you do when you do it. You set one rhythm. And when you set one rhythm, all rhythms fall into place. Eventually, of course, and you want to eat warm foods, and that’s a whole different conversation where we can have that as well. If you do these two things, you’ll see that everything starts falling in place. And one of the first things people notice is that they sleep better. They have a bowel movement in the AM. Kimberly Snyder (07:44.962)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (07:51.118)Mmm. Nidhi (08:07.173)you know, sooner or later, within three to five weeks, they’ll have a bowel movement in the AM. They’ll be like, my God, this is regular and this is timely every single day. And then they’ll start noticing if you’re a woman, you’ll start noticing your period cycles and then you’ll start noticing your moods getting better and then your energy levels getting better. But I’ve always seen that there is a certain math to this madness. Kimberly Snyder (08:26.226)Mm-hmm. I love that it feels, for me, it feels very comforting to have a sense of a pattern. And I can see, for example, not to throw him under the bus, but my husband is very, like all over the place. And I try to say, he’s very pit-a, he’s got a lot of fire energy. And he’s like, well, my work is, I have a meeting this hour and then so I don’t need till here and there. But what would you say to someone, Nidhi, if they’re like, well, I like this idea of rhythm and pattern, but I’ve also heard about listening to your body. so sometimes the different parts of my menstrual cycle, I may not want to eat a lot in the morning or like, there’s shifts and changes based on like individuality. What would Arju Veda say to balance that intuitive, the flux, a little bit of intuitive flux? Nidhi (09:22.903)Yeah. So you know, the problem is how far we are from my intuition. I highly value intuition. mean, come on, my book is called Your Body Already Knows. But our intuition is covered with layers of conditioning and denial. Kimberly Snyder (09:30.294)Yeah, exactly. Kimberly Snyder (09:36.982)Mmm. Nidhi (09:38.573)and triggers and just we don’t have access to our intuition the same way simply because you know like for example you know when you know people you may say listen I just want to stay up and watch Netflix and that’s what my intuition says till 2 p.m. but underlying that is actually a procrastination of sorts the the lack of inspiration to get into the bed and get up for your day so usually right somewhere within us we know that that’s not the right But we say, I’m craving sugar. And there’s an intensity in that craving. There’s not an equilibrium in that craving. So in that lack of equilibrium, in that lack of flow, in that lack of being present in the present moment, anything you experience or you think your intuition is speaking, at that time, it’s probably either it’s a trigger or an anxiety or a conditioning of thoughts that’s coming up. But when you’ve lost sense of time and space, when you’re in flow, when there is no intellect, Kimberly Snyder (10:30.52)Right. Nidhi (10:36.079)When you know just from a very deep place and there are no thoughts racing in your head, that is intuition. And what my book actually gives you is a framework to actually tap into that understanding of your body. And what is that state where you can actually know that we’re speaking the same language? Kimberly Snyder (10:49.262)Right. Kimberly Snyder (10:57.26)Yeah, and there’s even, you know, going into some of the, you know, really practical, like how detailed your book is. There was this section and I think a lot, we had a lot of questions even about hair, right? And people are concerned about, you know, there’s stress, there’s hair loss, there’s thinning. And there’s this whole section you have about, you know, hair abianga. And when I read this section, it also reminded me of connecting to your body, even touching. Nidhi (10:58.106)Thank Kimberly Snyder (11:26.092)our body because it’s very easy to be very mental, right? To go through the day and to look in the mirror, to weigh yourself and to have all these numbers. But something like actually massaging your scalp is such a beautiful practice. And can you talk about that practice on all the layers, like energetically what it does and also practically for hair growth? Because it’s again, these simple practices that feel like real self care to me. Nidhi (11:52.419)Absolutely. you know, so this understanding, right, we care so much for our bodies neck down, right? You eat what you’re doing, you’re exercising, et cetera, et cetera. I face yoga is just very new. the other way that we, and the way we care for everything above our neck is always through like cosmetic procedures or even topical applications, even if it’s natural, right? It’s like, what can I put on my skin? What can I do to my face? You know, but Kimberly Snyder (11:54.83)Thank Kimberly Snyder (11:59.374)Mm. Kimberly Snyder (12:16.6)Yeah. Nidhi (12:20.667)We don’t understand that there’s a whole system going on here. There’s like this whole ENT, it’s the sinus irrigation system that’s happening here for your mucus and which goes through your eyes, nose, throat. And there’s a brain and the brain is covered by the skull. There’s a hypothalamus, there’s a lot of happening there. And right, so like a whole earth, like think of it as a round earth and there’s so much happening within it. And right at the edge, right, like is your hair. Think of them as trees coming out of the, you know, out of this whole system that’s within. And that needs to be nourished, right? Like literally every single pore in your hair, in your scalp can have the potential for hair growth that can happen, right? And what happens is that as we start aging, we start losing the oil, you know, the moisture that keeps our hair intact, but we also stop living in a way that creates raw material for new hair or stronger hair. So this practice, which is essentially using warm oil as far as possible warm, if you can’t do warm, that’s fine. Sesame oil is usually the best, but if you have a medicated hair Abhyanga or hair oiling oil, that’s even better. When I say medicated, I don’t mean chemical medication. What I mean is like herbal, know, like. Kimberly Snyder (13:35.694)Yes. Nidhi (13:36.753)or bring Raj oil or neem oil. And you basically would apply it to your scalp. Everywhere you say you part your hair, you apply it to the various partings. And then you lovingly massage it in. And this is not only a very loving practice, what it does, and I’m gonna say at the most superficial level, what it does, it replenishes the sebum in your hair follicles. So think of it like a tree which has kind of lost its moisture. It’s so wibbly wobbly, it can just. lose its roots and fall anytime. And that can happen to us. And that’s what often happens to us as we age. So this kind of goes back. It replenishes that. it also goes and restores the melanin in the cells. You don’t lose color. Your head doesn’t burn out as quickly. But beyond that, it nourishes the brain. It nourishes your, you know, if you all love somebody, most people love somebody running their fingers through their hair. because it’s such a relaxing practice. So it calms your nervous system. It promotes better sleep. It enhances your memory. You feel more grounded and connected. It lowers anxiety. There’s innumerable benefits. But the one you’ll see very, very quickly is the quality of hair loss, as well as prevention of hair grain. Kimberly Snyder (14:53.858)Hmm. And then do we, I’ve heard, you know, sometimes people listen to this and, or hear this and I’ve heard it. I’m like, Whoa, but what if my hair gets really oily and how often do I wash out the oil? it makes me just want to touch my scalp right now as well. It’s so simple. But yeah, but what do we do? Like, do we, are we just oiling our hair and leaving it in? Nidhi (15:08.562)Yeah. Nidhi (15:16.355)Yeah, no, that’s a great question. So you want to do it, you can do it in many other ways. I’ll be honest with you. When I grew up, like my aunt still, my 74 year old aunt who has pretty much all dark hair still, she would oil her hair and keep it on like a little bit all day long. And you would see her, I’ve never seen her without oil. And she just, she loves that look, that whole shiny look. To her, that’s her job. But I wouldn’t do that. So. Kimberly Snyder (15:37.55)Ha Nidhi (15:41.391)somebody like me, is what I would do, right? Or this is a good starting place is oil your hair, keep it on for 20 minutes and wash it out. If you don’t mind that, keep it for two hours. So on the day that you’re washing your hair, keep it, you oil your hair, let’s say in the morning and you want to keep it for 20 minutes, stretch it to two hours. If you don’t mind that, you want to start trying to keep it overnight if you can. So you may not step out that day. I mean, if you’re brave enough like me, I’ll occasionally step out with oil in my hair, but You can oil it at night in that case, and you can get very peaceful, restful sleep. And then you want to wake up the next morning, and then you want to wash your hair. So you can keep it for a couple of nights to one night to 20 minutes to two hours. The idea is to start somewhere and continue to build up your practice. I also tell people that start with just one tablespoon of oil. And even if you want to start with just a few drops, you want to create this relationship with oil, because it is such a almost all Ayurvedic practices, and that’s a whole different conversation, use oil on this. It’s very scientific why they use oil. But it also promotes the microbiome. Most healthy microbiome is lipophilic, which means they love good fats. So you want to start developing that relationship, but you be gentle. You start with a gentle booing and let it go into a full-fledged relationship. I also want to say one more thing. Oil is detoxifying. It’s beautiful. If anybody who’s tried oil pulling knows that when they’re… Kimberly Snyder (16:42.211)Yes. Kimberly Snyder (16:58.627)Mm. Nidhi (17:06.757)consume thick oil, but by the time they’re swishing, suddenly the oil feels like water. It doesn’t feel like thick, dense oil anymore. And why is that? mean, oil, this is oil. So this is what oil does. Oil has this powerful ability to enter your pores and detox, which means all the grime will be pulled out and the moisture component of the oil will actually stay inside the pores and moisturize. It’s such a cleansing mechanism and a hydrating mechanism altogether. Kimberly Snyder (17:31.171)No. Nidhi (17:36.293)which is such a rare combination. And the same thing for your hair follicles, it actually cleanses the hair. It’ll bring the grime to the surface and then you can wash it off. I mean, I’ve done this practice. I’m 43 years old. I don’t have a single gray hair and I can attribute it just to hair oil. Kimberly Snyder (17:45.454)What? Kimberly Snyder (17:53.452)Wow. And I love how you said it’s sort of mix and match, do what you can, because I can say for myself as a busy working mom, I don’t have time to wash my hair that much, but I’ll put the oil in and then if I can leave it in a day or two, it’s more like free flow. And I know there’s rhythms and so I try to do it somewhat regularly, but it’s not so rigid. Nidhi (18:18.319)Basically, no, no, very true. And you know what, Kim, I have two daughters as well. So I usually will apply my oil at night and I’ll wash it off in the morning. Or occasionally I’ll do it first thing in the morning. I’ll keep it all day long if I don’t have a lot of meetings and then I’ll keep it at night and I’ll wash it the next day.