What Is True Beauty in a World of Comparison? with Megan O’Neill [Episode #617]
This week’s topic is: What Is True Beauty in a World of Comparison? with Megan O’Neill
I am so excited to have my very special guest, Megan O’Neill, who is the senior beauty editor at goop, where she writes the clean skin care column Megan Tries It. Listen in as Megan shares how new mamas can feel good in their body’s, tips on staying grounded in a world of comparison, letting go and forgiving others, and so much more!
Practices to help new mamas feel good in their body’s and overall well being…
Modifying your practice to fit within your lifestyle…
How your relationship changes through having a child…
Megan shares her beauty journey from past to present…
Tips on how to stay anchored in a world of comparison…
Not crossing the line into over-pushing and having more balance…
Letting go and forgiving others, at home and work…
Tips for staying grounded…
About Megan O’Neill
Megan O’Neill has been featured on E!, NY1, and ABC’s Strahan and Sara as a beauty expert and has starred on Netflix’s The goop Lab. She comes to goop from a long career in content at both Lucky and ELLE magazines. Currently goop’s senior beauty editor and a cohost of goop’s beauty podcast The Beauty Closet, she writes the column Megan Tries It. She loves food, beautiful clean skin care, and cold (and hot) showers.
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Kimberly: 00:01 Welcome back beauty to our Monday interview podcast. I’m very excited for our very special guest today. Her name is Megan O’Neill and she is a senior editor at Goop. She also started Netflix, the goop lab, and she is a dear friend of mine. I love talking to Megan. She is a beautiful spirit, a beautiful soul. And today we get into topics about true beauty, what real beauty is and how to connect to that confidence and the beauty inside of each of us. So I’m so excited to share our interview today.
Fan of the Week
Kimberly: 01:00 I love Megan very much, but before we get into it, let me give a shout out to our amazing fan of the week. And her name is AlexandraLauren79. She writes simply lovely. I have found so much peace and balance in my life after implementing Kimberly’s lifestyle, food, body, emotional wellbeing and spiritual growth are the cornerstones. And they truly do transform your life. I feel so much more connected to myself and to spirit. I feel balanced, which is something we don’t often feel today to not attend, would recommend from the supplements and all.
Please leave a review on iTunes
Kimberly: Wow, well, AlexandraLauren79, I give you a huge virtual hug. My sister, my love. It means so much to me. Thank you so much for taking the time to Revit, to write this review. And more importantly, thank you so much for being connected for being part of our community. It makes me so excited and wow. It means the world. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And my loves for your chance to also be shouted out as our fan of the week. Please take a moment to please leave us a review on iTunes, truly from my heart. I have to say it means so much. And as someone who’s on this, you know, the other side talking all the time, just to get that feedback, just to feel that energy back from you really does fuel me.
Kimberly: 02:03 It means a lot to me. So thank you in advance. And also if you screenshot your review and you send it over to email@example.com, we will send you our free seven love of seven self-love affirmation series, where I give these little talks and also process for really helping to work with affirmations in a very empowering way to help shift beliefs, negative blocks you may have in your, in yourself. You may or may not be aware of them. But when I started doing this is when I really started to write books and get things published and get things moving in my life. So as always, I love to share with you the things that have really helped me. So again, just screenshot your review, send it over their firstname.lastname@example.org and we’ll get that to you for free. Also be sure to subscribe to our podcast and that way you don’t miss out on any of these wonderful interviews or Q and a community shows, which are on Thursdays. All right, all that getting said, let’s move right into our interview today with the lovely Megan O’Neill.
Interview with Megan O’Neill
Kimberly: 00:02 Oh, my gosh, I haven’t seen you in
Megan: 00:07 Oh, long. You were pregnant. Last time I saw you in the office and you look so great. You would like cascade pair and you were wearing a really tight dress with your bump. It looked so good.
Kimberly: 00:18 You know, I really loved, um, some people like to wear, you know, the comfy floppy dresses. I like that too, but I’m one of those funny people. I loved being pregnant. I love showing the fob.
Megan: 00:28 I love seeing a bomb that makes me so happy.
Kimberly: 00:31 And since then, my love I’ve been seen your amazing pictures with your little one. Tell us how, how old is your child now?
Megan: 00:41 So he, his name’s Lagos’ and five months old. And I, like, I was, I was sort of worried or I was, I was apprehensive. I was like, I don’t see how you can give birth to something. And like, love it immediately, you know, like it takes time to, for any relationship to develop. And I was worried about that, but I’m so into him. And what pretty, pretty early.
Kimberly: 01:06 Well, I think I remember the first time we met, because we’ve met a couple of times. I remember you were sharing that you were thinking about being a mom at some point. So even before you got pregnant, so then when I heard you were pregnant and now you’re a mama, I was so excited to just see the arc of that journey. It’s so amazing.
Megan: 01:23 It’s been hard.
Kimberly: 01:24 Five months is like a nice, I don’t know if you hit that sleep progression yet. You’ll
Megan: 01:29 Never like, like, I guess worse, you’re saying,
Kimberly: 01:32 Well, at first it’s hard as you know, and then my experience with my babies, they got to sleeping through the night. It was getting better. And then at some point there was a real question. And then I think six months for me was my low point of sleep deprivation seven months. And that’s when we, um, we actually moved mosey out of our bed cause we were co-sleeping till then, and then it started getting better again. Okay.
Megan: 01:55 And now he’s a sleeper
Kimberly: 01:57 Now he’s amazing. He’s through the night and similar to what you were saying, I was a little bit worried that I wouldn’t be able to love anything as much as my first son. Cause I haven’t seen him. Like how could I possibly love anything as much as this child, but it’s amazing how the heart just keeps growing and expanding.
Megan: 02:14 That is the most amazing thing about, about it all. Like the heart expansion. Yeah. Having like, I feel like I have more compassion for like any situation I hear about, you know,
Kimberly: 02:25 Exactly. I think, you know, we, we all have friends that don’t want to have kids. I have a lot of friends, so I don’t think it’s the path for everyone, but I can say for me, it has just taught me to love in such a different level and, and love myself more. And I also feel like there’s been a lot of healing from my childhood. So being a mom and sometimes I say things to my sons and I think, oh, this is how I would have wanted to be loved in a way. So it’s sort of like this funny cyclical, you know, thing that goes on, we
Megan: 02:57 Had totally, you just learned much.
Megan and I discuss how we balance our lives and be in the flow
Kimberly: 03:00 Well, I get a lot of questions about this two 11. I’m going to toss them back to you questions about, well, how do you balance being a mom and your work in the world? And for me sometimes I think, you know, am I really balancing? I like the word flow, right? So for me, I kind of flow along in this non-linear way. Right now we’re able to do this podcast cause Moses napping dropped off Bobby at kindergarten. So there’s this sort of like dance that I feel like I’m doing all the time. How is it for you?
Megan: 03:29 Yeah. Um, I’m still, I’m, I’m excited to reach the flow because it’s still new. And I just had to work like three weeks ago at this point, I’m excited to sort of carve out a new routine with the added whole thing of a baby, you know?
Kimberly: 03:45 Yeah, yeah. It’s a whole thing. It, life starts to feel more full, but in the most beautiful way and that, you know, it’s interesting because I feel like things, things grow, things expand, but at the same time, there’s some things that we let we have to let go of, you know,
Megan: 04:03 But, but you know what people say that I’m really excited about. They’re like you, you have a kid and you become more efficient because you have to, like, you have like a, like, like you’re he’s napping right now. So you have to like do this now and that sort of translates to anything. So I’m hoping I’ll just get really good at being succinct at work and just getting it done, you know, in a way I haven’t been before, like I’m on daydreaming and meandering and maybe more focused,
Kimberly: 04:31 You know, I have to share love. I was able to, I had this like crazy thing happened where I had this book idea come down when I was 34 weeks pregnant with mosey. And I thought, oh, this is the most inconvenient time. But then, you know, you just have to feel that, that inspiration. So I signed the book deal three days before he was born. And then 60 days after he was born, I started writing and um, I get it. It was like in the past I’ve written books and I’m like, oh, here’s my creative process. I’m going to get things out. I’m going to flow along. And now it was like, here’s the times you can write. So you write, write, write, write,
Megan: 05:03 And you could do that. Like you could make yourself be creative on command.
Kimberly: 05:08 Well, with this book, Megan is so different than my other books. This book felt like it wanted to be in the world. So it was just, it was a much more, there was so much flow in this book, um, that, you know, the sufficiency as moms that we, we cultivate and we bring in the focus, the heart grows and the focus grows. Right.
Megan: 05:28 So
Practices that help new mamas feel good in their body’s and overall well being
Kimberly: 05:28 How are you, how are you taking care of Megan as a new mama? Again, just for all the mamas out there listening or all the busy people, you have a baby you’re going back to work. What are some of the practices that help you feel good in your body, in your wellbeing mentally, emotionally? Um, so you don’t feel that that burnout or the stress that sometimes happen when you, you know, we just give all our attention to our babies or to our work.
Megan: 05:53 Yeah. I’m, I’m big on the taking care of myself because then, then I’m better for him and for everyone. And it just feels good to take care of yourself, you know, and I’ll be back in for the day. So I, I love exercise. I just, I just love the way it fits into my wife because, um, you know, I, if I don’t do it first thing in the morning, I tend to not do it. So it’s sort of like part of my morning routine. And it’s such a good hack in a way, because you do your exercise, you get it out of the way. And then it’s just like a big check mark. You’ve been put like super early in the day and it encourages you to, to, I dunno, be more productive, you know, throughout the day, like knowing you’ve like done one thing it’s, it’s encouraging.
Megan: 06:38 So I, I, not every morning do I exercise, but it’s, it’s a big part of my life and making me feel grounded and making me feel good and attractive, I still want to feel attractive. I was wondering about that, you know, cause they’re, they’re all these, they’re all these old world views of like, um, you know, that are voiced it on women and also sometimes perpetuated by women that you have to, you know, you, you take care of your child and like nothing else matters. So I’m, I’m happy that I still want to dress cool and you know, wanna look pretty like, I, I love that. I love wanting those things.
Kimberly: 07:18 Well, I think it’s really tough if we give away our whole identity into being a mom and then we lose that connection to self because then we start to feel so depleted and so drained. And then, you know, I’ve, I’ve hit those points as a mom. And then I don’t feel like I’m showing up in the way that I want to. I feel like I’m a shell of myself and that’s not, that’s not the energy. I want my kids to see that I’m in either that almost that guilt, I feel like getting over like, okay, I’m going to take the time to do this walk. And it’s really important to me and standing for that. Um, so, you know, it’s, we all, we all have to figure it out along the way, but that, that time, that energy we put back into ourselves comes out into the family. It comes out into our work into the world. And so it’s really critical.
Megan: 08:03 Yeah. And that’s such a good point about taking the time for yourself because that, that sends a message that you matter and that what you want matters and that you need time. You know?
Modifying your practice to fit within your lifestyle
Kimberly: 08:13 So I think I saw a picture of you and if you were doing Pilates or workout in your home and your baby was there and it reminded me how, you know, with, with mosey, with, with our baby, I take him on walks. He kind of just comes into my life or if I do yoga, which to be honest, like, you’ll go awesome. Those hasn’t been much lately. He would just be next to the mat. And so when you’re, when you say you, you, you, you work out in the morning, are you a, are you doing it sort of with baby? Have you modified your practice or sometimes do you peg it and time to separate as well?
Megan: 08:43 Well, that’s a, that’s a big thing. You you’re forced to modify your practice because if you don’t, it may just not happen the working out. So for instance, that the other day, my husband and I take turns working out in the morning, run one morning and then the next morning I’ll do my Pilates routine, but he really wants to go on a run. And I think he had had a rough time with the baby the night before. So he went on this run and I was like, oh, why like really feel like working out. So I, you know, I put logos on my yoga mat and he was mesmerized. So it actually works because like lifting is what all Cyrell legs and like almost trying to do moves that looks like, and then I have to stop and breastfeed. So, you know, it wasn’t like the, my dream workout, like it was, it was shortened and it wasn’t what it normally is, but I got in a little bit of movement and that just makes my day a bit better.
Kimberly: 09:39 Exactly. I love this approach of it doesn’t have to be all or nothing because I know as a recovering perfectionist, I think, oh, it has to be this big thing or it has to be perfect. And that’s one of the big lessons I’ve learned along the way now being a mom is sometimes it’s messy and it’s not complete it done half way, but it’s better than nothing.
Megan: 09:57 Nothing. Yeah, totally.
How your relationship changes through having a child
Kimberly: 09:59 And you mentioned your husband and sort of finding that balance of, you know, sharing the morning workouts. Have you what’s happened with your relationship through having a child? Because I feel like, you know, to be totally honest, like with John and I, with my husband, you know, in the beginning, there’s all this joy, you have the new baby and then there’s real life and there’s the sleeplessness and there’s stress and there’s, you know, a little bit of butting heads. And then there’s like a lot of communication and like holding space for each other. And we’ve learned so much, you know, over the past now Moses is 14 months, you know, it’s, it’s deepened our relationship, but there’s been that, you know, friction you have to work through for us.
Megan: 10:36 No, for sure. Yeah. It, it changes your relationship. Um, like I, I, in the beginning, when it, when it was like the real sleepless nights are a member of this one day, um, where we were just like, you know, we were zombies and we were like short with each other and we’re, we get along really well and we’re super close, but, um, yeah, it was a tough day. And then we found something to laugh about. And I remember just being like, just, you know, find the humor, like whenever you can. And that, that helps me get through and, and it, and it has worked like we were good. Like, we’re still close, we’re still loving doing this together. Obviously it’s hard. But when you, when you can laugh at, at anything, you know, maybe it’s like hooping a diaper, or maybe it’s, someone’s weird approach to something just the laughing helps and not taking it so seriously.
Kimberly: 11:30 Oh my God. I love that. I remember there was a time where I was trying to change a Mosley’s diaper. He had like, you know, crapped his pants, there’s poop everywhere. And I went down to pick up something and he like peed all over my head and I was, I’d slept like two hours and I felt so overwhelmed. And then I just laughed. Yeah. It just, it helped move this energy because the energy has to move right. The emotions to move, we stuff them down. It doesn’t feel good, but we can, like you said, we can transform it to a more light experience and then it doesn’t have to be so serious. Yeah.
Megan: 12:03 I think you have to sometimes,
Megan shares her beauty journey from past to present
Kimberly: 12:06 So switching gears for a second, my love, I know you live in this, you know, complex multi-leveled world of beauty as well. And you and I have had different conversations about this. Um, four out of five of my previous books had the word beauty in the title because I’m so interested in what is beauty really. And, um, you know, just the different perspectives of it, how we start to really feel beautiful within ourselves. So I know you’re a real expert in, um, all aspects of beauty. And as you and I have talked about, um, routines practices, the, the beauty that builds from the inside out is something that’s really helped me connect in because I didn’t feel beautiful for a really long time. I felt like I was strange looking. And of course, you know, like a lot of young girls I picked on myself, I was always trying to straighten my hair. Um, I was trying to wear makeup to like, you know, make my features look different. Um, can you share a little bit, um, just a little bit about, you know, your, your beauty journey from, you know, past to present.
Megan: 13:08 Yeah. Well, what you just said about, you know, makeup to change your features. My version of that was I straightened my hair chemically, straightened my hair. Um, and because I wanted, you know, I wanted straight hair that I could going back and, you know, toss around, like my friends, my white friends at school. Yeah. I was, you know, the, for awhile, I was the only black person in my like 40 person, private school girls class.
Kimberly: 13:36 W where did you grow up? Megan?
Megan: 13:38 I grew up in Manhattan. Oh, okay. Okay. Yeah. And I went to an all girl private school, which, which I, I love, I had the best time. Those girls are still my very best friends, but it does something to you when no one else looks like you and I’ve even realized that, but it, but it really does, you know, really does sound like why can’t I toss my hair like that? You know, why does my hair stick straight up? Like, that’s not as pretty. That was like the narratives.
Kimberly: 14:03 So I’m getting, I’m getting goosebumps because I grew up in a completely Caucasian town in Connecticut and I’m happy. And, you know, it was kind of like where you don’t want to stick out every time there was a culture we studied in school, let’s say it was like, you know, the Pearl Harbor, the teacher would say, oh, Kimberly, aren’t you Japanese and I’ve saved. And then we’d study native Americans. And the teacher would be like, aren’t you native American? And it was like all this attention. And then this, you know, my sense of self became very warped. And I say, I tried to change my features, you know, for prom, I was trying to make my eyes look more round. Um, I started, there was so much emphasis on how I looked that I started to get really disconnected to who I was, and then that, you know, later translated into, you know, contributed to eating disorders and perfectionism and rigidity.
Kimberly: 14:51 And I think that’s part of the reason that we go into heal ourselves. The first, you know, the reason I became a nutritionist was to heal, you know, my own food issues. And the reason I started thinking about beauty so much was because I felt so not beautiful for so long. And now I talk about, you know, spirituality and meditation so much because that anxiety inside of myself didn’t heal. Even when I got the food part I needed to go in. And so that’s what I love to share about now. Um, so it’s amazing these, these real challenges we have, and it sounds cheesy to say, but it’s true. They become our strength later on when we can really like sit with them and go inside and make peace with that and realize, you know, these perceptions we have when we’re young, you know, a lot of it isn’t true. Right. We can start to reprocess that.
Megan: 15:38 Yeah. They really do become our strengths. And then you’re also compelled to share it with people so that they don’t waste time going through, you know, the things you went through.
Anchoring into your soul and healing as an adult
Kimberly: 15:48 So one of the things, my mom is an immigrant from the Philippines. And sometimes there’s this immigrant mentality where you don’t want to, you know, highlight that you don’t want to remember the poverty where you came from. So my mom, um, you know, she, all our parents do our best, but it wasn’t like this, uh, exactly supportive way. I was talking about healing, you know, yourself from childhood where like, oh, it’s beautiful. It’s okay. You’re Filipino. It was just kind of like fit in and like meld in. Um, so again, as an adult, like a few decades later, I’ve done this deep processing for you, Megan, when you were like, oh, I want my hair to look like everyone else. Did you have that support from your family and, um, getting really anchored into your soul into who you were or was that something you had to heal as an adult as well?
Megan: 16:33 Well, it’s, it’s complex because my mom is the one who took me to get my hair straightened because, you know, we’re all sort of in, we’re all living in this together, right? So she wasn’t like straighten your hair so you can be white, but she, she was living in it too. And getting the messages of straight hair is pretty, you know, so, so we did that together and it was sort of, it was like a, it was a nice thing. We get together, we’d go get our hair done. We’d go get our hair straightened and get our head dumped in chemicals that are terrible. But it was, it was a nice thing. And, and back then, I, it didn’t feel like, um, it didn’t feel like it didn’t feel like self-hatred, it felt, it felt like a nice beauty ritual with my mom. And only now looking back, do I see, you know, what it was like, why I wanted to straighten my hair and I don’t straighten my hair anymore. And I love my hair and I love, I love your hair. I love that it’s puffy and. And, but yeah, back then, I, I did not see it that way. And the world was also a bit different back then. I’m 36. But when I was like, you know, 10, 12 doing this, there weren’t as many, um, as many standards of beauty as there are now.
Kimberly: 17:49 Thank God it’s opened
Megan: 17:49 Up. Goodness. Yeah.
Kimberly: 17:52 Um, does your mom still straighten her hair?
Megan: 17:55 No, she doesn’t. She absolutely doesn’t but, um, she, uh, it, it took her, it took her something to stop because she’s, she’s six she’s 70. And you know, that was what was beautiful back then. So old habits die hard, but no, she does not straighten anymore. She has gray, beautiful curly hair.
Kimberly: 18:15 I love it. When, you know, the, the women that let their hair go gray. I think it’s so empowering. It’s shiny and silver and beautiful.
Megan: 18:24 It is beautiful.
Tips on how to stay anchored in a world of comparison
Kimberly: 18:25 I love that. So love, you know, we get, I get a lot of questions and you probably do too about comparison because we live in this world of social media and like, there’s so many images about beauty and, you know, just everything, right? Like how cool we are if we fit in, if we’re successful enough. And it’s very easy to compare when there’s like so much media in our face and these images are in our face. So how have you personally dealt with, I think people in general, but especially women have a lot to deal with comparison wise. Um, what has helped you stay anchored to Megan in this world of, you know, there’s just so much outward energy and, you know, getting pitted against one another for, you know, in different ways. Right.
Megan: 19:13 Well, I think, um, I really genuinely love women. Like, I guess, like if I see a beautiful girl or woman, I get like excited, like I’m, it’s inspiring. I’m happy that, that they look beautiful. I don’t, um, I guess, yeah, there’s, I don’t have a competitive thing towards women like innately. Um, I like them and, you know, we are, we, we have a lot of, uh, power to reclaim and we really can’t do that unless we support each other. Like we really can’t. And, um, I’ve been really lucky to always in my career or mostly my career work for, for women. Um, my bosses have always been women and they’ve and people who, who bolstered me. And I know that is not everyone’s situation. And I’ve always worked in media and magazines. So it’s been a predominantly female environment and it could have gone the other way, I suppose. Uh, but I’ve always worked for people who championed me and don’t have that, oh, you’re another woman jealousy thing.
Kimberly: 20:26 Oh, that’s amazing. I feel like I have a similar situation where most of our, a lot of our community is women on the podcast listeners and it’s Selena. And it’s funny because I have two sons, you have a son, so it’s kind of that, that balance, right? Because there’s so much female energy around and in a way it’s similar to you. Like, I feel, um, I realized this now with all the introspection I’ve done as an adult in a way, like, I feel safer with women. Um, I don’t have a lot of male friends I realized, um, which is interesting. And, you know, we just keep work on like, keep working on our own self and, and see of seeing what that is. But, um, my sons have taught me so much about that balance. And it’s interesting, even in the mom community, I remember when my first son, I had a little bit of anxiety, a little bit of that coming up, like perfectionism.
Kimberly: 21:14 I go to mommy and me, I’d be like, do I have the right stuff in my, you know, my diaper bag? Like, is it, are people going to judge me in my, like a good enough mom, like, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But then you realize, you know, we’re all in this together. And if we show up for me, what’s been really healing is just showing up in a more vulnerable way. Like, Hey, I’m trying my best. And you know, not trying to pretend, you know, that I have it all together, that I’m perfect. We don’t, um, and that’s helped me connect a lot more as well. And let go of that. Perfectionism is basically another way of saying I don’t feel good enough. So that’s been really healing for me as well.
Megan: 21:50 The being vulnerable is really like the key to life I’m finding, you know, like why not just, you know, be real and be not perfect. Like there’s nothing else really, you know,
Kimberly: 22:02 Does that come easily to you? No,
Megan: 22:05 It doesn’t come easily. Um, I’m, I’m not, uh, I’m like a low key perfectionist. Like I’m, I’m pretty chill. I’m like mellow, but I, I really do not to secretly, like, we want to just make whatever I’m doing. Great. And that puts pressure on you. And, and of course, it’s great to want to make whatever you’re putting your name on. Great. But, um, it can be really, uh, it can be poisonous to, you know
Not crossing the line into over-pushing and having more balance
Kimberly: 22:31 Yeah. That like pushing, pushing, pushing deadlines, getting more done. How do you find that? Uh, you know, we talked about self care a little bit. How do you find that, that balance of when to say, okay, I’ve done enough today or I’ve done my best and not cross the line into over pushing.
Megan: 22:48 Um, I’m good at that. I’m good at I’m good at stopping. Um, because I think I just, like, I really want to be happy in this life, you know, like we get one and I really, I get a lot of joy out of the day and I don’t want to be miserable. I want to be happy. So I sort of have some kind of innate mechanism that is like, like shuts it off. It’s like, okay, you’ve tried your hardest if this sucks. Oh, well, cause you’ve tried your health.
Kimberly: 23:19 Very healthy.
Megan: 23:21 It’s healthy. It’s good. I don’t, I don’t, um, I don’t get obsessive, you know, when I do, I know when to stop it to like prevent harm and I know when to stop and like go outside.
Kimberly: 23:34 So one thing I found that has, you know, helps, uh, people be happier in general is letting go of like little things, little annoyances, resentments, forgiving people, or little misunderstandings. Do you find it easy for you to let go of stuff because your central goal is happiness.
Megan: 23:52 I’m working on that. No, I hold grudges. I’m sensitive. I, yeah, I I’m big working on letting go and forgiving people. Okay.
Kimberly: 24:02 Oh my God. I feel like I, I, I work on that. I keep working on it and also letting go of forgiving myself. Cause I, you know, I’m one of those people, again, back to the perfectionism where I’m like, oh, I could have done this better. Or I really screwed up. And then I feel this intense pain inside. And I know that affects my energy. So it’s, you know, I feel like the more I forgive myself, the more that translates into letting these little like misunderstandings go, oh, and it’s true. You know, life becomes a lot easier. Um, I’ll also share my husband and I are very different people. And sometimes it’s like one of those things where opposites attract, but because we’re very different, we have very different friends to tell I say, and okay. So when we all kind of hang out, like some of his friends and they’re, everybody’s like, you know, love on the inside. But some of his friends I’m like, you know, they say stuff and it just kinda like, you’ll go Like, think about, you know, like the guy thing too. Some of these guys don’t feel as like, cool, like safe to me or they say things and it like dings me. Um, and so I’ve really worked on like, okay, everybody is coming from a different place, but not to take things so personally, because I think we take things. So personally back to that seriousness, instead of finding the humor, like, you know, that just helps as well. It’s not always easy though. Yeah,
Megan: 25:19 Yeah, yeah. There’s definitely, I’m not taking yourself seriously and not, um, yeah, you just can’t be so delicate. Right? Like most of the time, I think people aren’t trying to ding us, it’s just a different perspective.
Kimberly: 25:34 I feel like so much can get lost in translation over text, over email. I mean, you’ve worked at these like extensive, you know, organizations like lucky and goop where there’s many people, how do you deal with that in the workplace? And I’m sure it comes up like, oh, this was like a little misunderstanding and you have to keep working with this person or going to this meeting or, you know, this person you have to interview, how do you, how do you navigate that?
Megan: 25:57 That
Kimberly: 25:58 Is tricky. Even as I’m saying it.
Megan: 26:00 Oh, it’s so, it’s so tricky. Right? Like communication. And I think like, I think you have to just be as honest as you can, obviously, wherever you work, there’s politics involved and there is, and there is a pecking order and there’s a lot, there’s a lot to navigate. Yeah. But, um, I guess my advice would be just, you know, showing up every day, doing the best you can and not being obsessive, if something went wrong because you know that Michelle Obama quote about she’s learned the most from the like catastrophic mistakes she’s made. Yeah. So you just have to, um, you just have to be able to, to bounce back from a fall and not, and like you said, not take criticism, don’t let criticism destroy you. It’s true.
Kimberly: 26:49 True. It’s true. And one thing I’ve, I, you know, I’ve, I’ve deepened this understanding of not taking things personally is you realize that, you know, people are doing their best and people are projecting their own inner ankles all the time, whether they realize it or not. And when I started to really understand that, I started to find more compassion to be like, oh, this person let’s say they leave a mean comment on your social media. Or they, you know, say something at a meeting or whatever I realized, oh, like, it’s really not about me. There’s something going on inside of them. Otherwise that wouldn’t project out. And I didn’t get that when I was a teenager. And in college, I remember just, oh, so now I feel a lot more, um, like stronger in that way.
Megan: 27:30 Yeah. It is important to realize that the context of what, of, what someone is saying to you, what their context is like, I remember I posted something about black lives matter last summer, and this woman wrote some kind of nasty comment on my, on my thing. She was black. And she was like, she was like, you’re one of those people who, who thinks that, that black people aren’t treated, um, you know, poorly, I don’t know. She, she said, I was like, how on earth did you get that out of my mess? And I am black. Like, it just made no sense, you know? So, so I there’s something not, I took a second and IDM to something, um, not reactive cause I wanted to and where she was coming from. And it was very hard to do that because I was and I want it to be like you, you know, but I totally, I wrote something like where, where are you coming from? And she had just misunderstood what I was saying somehow. And she had obviously come from a place that wasn’t as diverse and, you know, freewheeling as Brooklyn, New York, I think she was from some little town in the south where there was a contingent of black people who, um, like sort of didn’t believe in racism, but that’s what it seems like. And I was just like, that’s why you said that, but, but I, but the reaction was to just fly off the handle at her.
Kimberly: 28:54 Yeah. And then you realize so many people don’t have tools to deal with, you know what I call moving energy. Cause we all, you know, emotions are supposed to be energy in motion. And if we kind of stuffed them down or we don’t feel it and process it, it’s just like, I got to get this out of me. I don’t feel good. So then that’s where all the, you know what I mean, comments on YouTube and stuff come from or the food cravings, it’s just like trying to get out and you know, it’s, I just say some people just don’t have the tools.
Megan: 29:19 Yeah, definitely.
Tips for staying grounded
Kimberly: 29:20 Yeah. And so, um, you know, we continue our journeys that we keep finding more and more, um, compassionate. And he always helped me to, Meghan is four. I go into the day, my morning routine, it’s, you know, hot water with lemon. I take my SBO probiotics. I drink that smoothie. So I have some fiber in my system and I meditate. And even with the babies as we like, that’s my essential time. I’ve started to get up earlier before they’re both awake, which sounds crazy. I wouldn’t have done this six months ago, but now I’m in a place where they’re going to bed earlier, sleeping through the night. And it really helps me just feel so much better the whole rest of the day. I feel a lot more resilient. I’m like in my body, I’m in my breath and I’m present. What, um, you, you mentioned working out in the morning, what are some of your practice? It could be morning or other times they just help you feel connected, um, grounded in, in, in yourself.
Megan: 30:13 Yeah. The working out is great. Um, I try to make myself a raw vegetable juice every morning. So I, I have a juicer that my mom actually got me when I moved out as a house warming present. So I usually do kale, celery, green, apple, lemon, and cucumber. And it means it’s not delicious, but it’s like, it really like, it’s like, so like gets you going
Kimberly: 30:36 And you let the lemon sounds good to brighten it up.
Megan: 30:39 And then the apple brightens it up. Yeah. But, but you just, you feel like you’re doing something nice for yourself when you drink it. So I do that every morning. I try to meditate, although I don’t do it every morning, but when I do it does shift the day. But it’s, it’s so hard for me to just sit, still not grabbing for things, you know,
Kimberly: 30:59 You know what helps me and I had to kind of train myself to do this is I meditate before I get on my phone because I’m on the west coast. So by the time I wake up, there’s already stuff going on. A lot of my team’s on the east coast. So I know if I check meditate, oh no, my mind is like, oh, I got to do this and this all I forgot to do this last night. So I really make it a practice. That’s why I had to get up earlier to just meditate before I reached for my phone. And that’s, wasn’t always easy, but that’s, you know, a practical tip has really helped me
Megan: 31:28 Do it in bed. Like you do it
Kimberly: 31:30 In bed. Yeah. Um, older brother, who’s now five comes in every night in the middle of the night, which you know, we’re okay with, he starts in his bed, but he comes in around midnight or one. So he’s right there, baby. Now knock on wood, wakes up around six, you know, he’s asleep and I’m in the middle. And so I literally set up, sit up in my bed and I just do it, you know, here right next to me, you could see my little pod studio. My, um, I meditate when I can during the day. And also in the evening I meditate down here. Um, but now in the bed, I’m just like, cool spine up, get it done. Like you were saying all your workouts. Otherwise it’s probably going to perhaps get away from me the longer I wait.
Megan: 32:08 And what time are you waking up? A peak comes in at 6:00 AM or wakes up at 6:00 AM. Are you waking up at
Kimberly: 32:12 Like five? I wake up at five on the dot, oh my
Megan: 32:15 God, what time do you go to bed?
Kimberly: 32:20 Th th that’s the thing about, you know, the relationship thing, because I’m not a screen person, right? Like I just have never been, I love books. I write books, I read, but I just love to read. Whereas hubby really likes to watch stuff at night. I’ll be like, come on and watch like 10 minutes of the office rerun with me or curvier or whatever these shows are. So there’s like this interplay of like, I need meetings I need to read, but then I want to spend time with hubby. So to be honest, you know, I try to get to bed by 10, but usually it’s like 11. Okay. All right. Well it’s like, I get like six hours, seven,
Megan: 32:56 So glowy and rested.
Kimberly: 32:59 Oh, thank you. My love, I, you know, I say this, like, it really comes from the meditations. I think when you, when you connect and I just feel so much energy, it happened. Um, and that’s, I think the main source of my energy, these days
Megan: 33:12 Inventing me to do it more regular way.
Maintaining sanity and balance amongst the many products at Megan’s disposal
Kimberly: 33:14 I love that. Well, and then the other thing we talked about seeing all this stuff around and we get to this, you know, comparison. And the other thing is the world of beauty. You know, we talk about, let’s talk about this practically for a moment. It’s easy to think, oh, I need a million different products. I need to buy more stuff. My skincare routine should be like 15 steps. You get a lot of stuff sent to you. I’m sure my love, you’re trying things. You’re testing things. You’re probably going to lab and all this stuff. How do you, um, maintain sanity with like more is not necessarily more and all these women that feel like I have to spend my whole paycheck on new makeup or new products? Like how do you, what do you, what do you do to balance that? Yeah,
Megan: 33:52 That’s such a good question because we talked about this at work because, you know, we, we write about, we sell all these beautiful, luxurious. Um, a lot of them are expensive beauty products, but also you don’t want to make, you don’t want to blast out the message. You need this to look good, cause that is dangerous and no one needs that and it’s not true, you know? So, so we sort of present beauty as not sort of, we do present beauty as obviously being from the inside out, right? Like we all know that by now, but like skincare is beautiful and can help and can feel luxurious, but it really is about what you’re doing and, and so much more than whatever you’re putting on your skin. Um, obviously that can help, but, but it’s, it’s really about, you just have to keep in mind that if you have these beautiful restful rejuvenating habits, like, you know, working out and eating well and moving your body outside and loving people like that is that is how you are going to look the best. It really is. And skincare is a secondary thing. I love,
Kimberly: 34:57 I love that. That’s the message we need to get out more and more, especially, I feel like, you know, the younger generations that are just on take talk all day with all of the mail. Um, and speaking of which one thing I’ve always noticed about you love is you do have this beautiful glowy skin, but I’ve noticed that you’ve never, I don’t think I’ve ever seen you wear makeup.
Megan: 35:16 Yeah. I’m like, I’m like such a fake beauty editor. Right. I don’t make up.
Kimberly: 35:20 So I love it. It’s like, you know, the times where I get my makeup done for like a shoot or something, a lot of makeup artists also don’t wear Vega. I don’t know if they’re over it,
Megan: 35:28 But yeah, no, I love, makeup’s amazing. It’s an amazing option. Um, especially clean non-toxic beautiful makeup. And I will do a little something when I have like a TV interview or something. And I have, because I am blemish brown, so I will do that. But in my everyday life, I never wear makeup. And um, I, you, you just, you don’t have to, you know, do it if it makes you feel great. And just don’t if you don’t, if you don’t want to, it’s like, I think people, a lot of the time feel like they it’s a societal norm to wear makeup. I mean like Alicia keys, you know, made the headlines for not wearing makeup, which is crazy like that. The headline that’s news that someone’s not wearing makeup a woman. So, so that’s that stuff, but yeah, you do not have to wear makeup to look your best. You really do not.
Kimberly: 36:18 I love that. Have you always had that deep confidence? I think,
Megan: 36:22 I think I don’t even have it’s confidence. I think my mom has never worn makeup ever. And I, I think that’s probably where it starts, you know, like you, you soak in what your mom is doing.
Kimberly: 36:33 A lot of me
Megan: 36:35 That it impacts me. Right. And it’s not a bad thing, makeup, obviously. Makeup’s amazing. But, um, I think when you see someone who you’re really close to get ready every day and not do that, it’s not something you think about as much from an earlier age, she did like, like slather herself in oils and lotion. And I like, I can’t leave the house without feeling moisturized. So that’s my whole body, my whole body. Yeah. That’s like my thing that makes me feel beautiful and ready to start the day.
Kimberly: 37:04 Well, Megan, have you ever done? Avianca like the argued Vedic oil massage and then seek the shower. I’m really into that. I love that.
Megan: 37:11 I love that too.
Kimberly: 37:13 Yeah. I feel like touch too is so important. So I try to be mindful when I’m putting my products on my face of loving touch and, you know, you’re, it’s a way to connect in. And of course skin is still vacillate our nervous system. Everything is connected. So I try not to just slap it on, but I try to make it a little bit of a ritual, even though, you know, I just use the few products we have at Solluna. And it’s just a few things I try to do it with real care.
Megan: 37:38 Yeah. And that is why beauty is so important. And that’s one of the reasons why I love my job so much talking about it because you can, you can really shift the day. If you just give yourself a little time, like a little face massage or a little self body massage, it really shifts things and it makes you feel wonderful.
Kimberly: 37:57 So is your beauty routine morning and evening? Pretty simple. You don’t have to go into all the specifics, but is it, you know, just, I see you, you know, and just clean, beautiful, no makeup. I can’t imagine your routine is that
Megan: 38:09 No, it’s not complicated. It’s literally just, um, like a face oil or a moisturizer. Um, I, you know, I exfoliate a couple of times a week in the shower. I put, I use sunscreen every day, mineral sunscreen, clean mineral sunscreen. So yeah, it’s not, it’s not by any means a thousand products. I have to try a thousand products, but I don’t, I don’t use this battering Ram of stuff every single day.
Kimberly: 38:37 Exfoliation that’s, that’s key, isn’t it? We all have.
Megan: 38:42 Yes, I, yes. We all have different skin types and some people are more sensitive than others, but it really just brightens and boosts glow. If you exploited a couple times a week to just get that dead skin off and debris and it just, yeah, it makes her skin sing.
Kimberly: 38:58 What are you doing? Like a physical exfoliant or one of those acids that takes off the layers or like, you know, like a scrubber. Yeah. Yeah.
Megan: 39:05 Well, okay. So, and not even just to like, cause I work at goop, but I do, I love the goop glow microderm. It’s like a face Paula. So it’s a physical exploitation and it’s also has, um, acids, but when I’m not using that, I use like a brush only sometimes to wash my face. Um, but I, yeah, I, I like exploiting more than just like a cream cleanser more often than not because it gives you that glow.
Kimberly: 39:33 Mm. I love that. And I love that you can keep that up. Even being a new mama again, back to the balance, not to keep the care going. And then we’re giving all the love to baby and to husband and to job and everything. And it has to come back. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Have you had any moments yet Megan, where you’re like, oh, like I’m kind of like losing it. I mean, we have those almost for a second, but just like a period, like I remember six months, it was, it lasted about like a week or 10 days where I just went into like a really low, you know, it was part of like the lowest part of my postpartum where I was just like, Ugh, like, Ugh. You know,
Megan: 40:09 I have, yeah, of course I have. Yeah. There was, there was a couple of days where it was just, it’s so physical, like lifting a baby and like bending down all the time. And it’s like, he’s tugging on your boobs all the time. I utterly depleted and my mom actually took a month off work cause she like never takes her vacation days. So she took a month off and is here watching him and like, I just, the help is so key. Like if you have your mom available, I just, I hope everyone. I, I, I’m not everyone gets help obviously, but it’s just invaluable having any kind of help.
Kimberly: 40:48 It’s true. It’s true. I was just writing about the, you know, the 40 days postpartum. Are you, um, are you waiting period for our pregnancy course, that’s coming out and aryuveda says that if you don’t really take that time to rest and outsource things like cooking and cleaning the effects, the fatigue and lasts up to two years. Oh my God. Yeah. That’s what ayruveda believes. So it’s nice. To be honest, I didn’t really take the time I needed with my first baby. I remember three days after he was born, I was doing page proofs for radical beauty. The book I wrote with Deepak Chopra. And then when he was, you know, a few months old, we were going on a press tour and you know, I really pushed it. And then with this, with Moses, with a baby, I, you know, months before I blocked it out, I say guys for 40, I’m not going to talk to you.
Megan: 41:35 No, no, that’s great. But did you, I feel like you have a lot of energy. So like the first time when you didn’t take a break, was it because you didn’t want to cause you felt good or like you felt the pressure to,
Kimberly: 41:47 Oh, the pressure. I mean, I was writing a book with Deepak Chopra and I felt like, okay, like I really have to show up. And I was even, you know, nervous to, I mean, he’s amazing. And he was funny. I was nervous to tell him I was pregnant. Honestly. I’m like the whole team, the publishers. And there was like in my head, I was like, Ooh, you know, that, that kind of being a first time mom and like, I want to keep going in my career. And I had to just find that, um, that balance. And then you realize, you know, so much of that pressure is unnecessarily. Put it on ourselves. So with second baby, I just completely put up those boundaries from the start. And that felt really good to,
Megan: 42:23 I, I did that too. Like I literally didn’t check my email. I took four months off work and I didn’t check my email once and I didn’t even care. I mean, I love my job and I take it so seriously, but I like having that time to just not care about it and care about, you know, a new baby was, was crucial for me. I love that.
Kimberly: 42:43 I love that you have so much self connection, my love. And just like you said, this easefulness about you, but you’re the divine feminine can be gentle and loving, but very powerful. And that’s really what I feel in your energy. So thank you. My love for sharing so much of your energy with us. I could chat with you all day long. I love every time we get to see each other, hopefully,
Megan: 43:06 And thank you for having me. It’s so
Kimberly: 43:07 Fun. So fun. Next time I’m in New York, I’ll hit you up, but before we sign off love, where can, where can our listeners, our beauties find out more information about you and your work?
Megan: 43:18 Oh, I’m on goop.com. Check it out for, for lots of beautiful, clean beauty and articles on anything. Sex, love, relationships, food. Yeah.
Kimberly: 43:30 Amazing. My love in the show notes. We’ll also put your Instagram handle cause I love seeing how you’re moving through life with your beautiful baby and life and it’s, uh, it’s very inspiring. So thank you so much.
Megan: 43:42 Thank you, Kimberly. See you soon. See you soon. Okay. See. Yeah.
Kimberly: All right. My loves, I hope you enjoyed today’s interview as much as I enjoyed chatting to Megan, please be sure to check out our show notes for more information on where you can find out more about her and her work, as well as other podcasts. I think you would enjoy other interviews, articles, meditations, recipes, lots more over there on the site. I’ll also see you on social at _KimberlySnyder till then take care and so much love.