Jon Bier [Podcast #497] Blog Graphic for Feel Good Podcast with Kimberly Snyder.

Today’s podcast topic is: Finding Your Soulmate and Making it Work in the Real World, with my Husband Jon

I am very excited to have my husband Jon as our podcast guest this week. We’re going to be talking about relationships and all aspects of practical living. What we do from a food standpoint and connection standpoint when implementing our Four Cornerstones of True Beauty. The Four Cornerstones being, food, body (we’ll talk about sex a little bit), emotional well-being and spiritual growth and how we do it in our life.

I think it’s nice to share more about my life. We talk about some of these concepts in an abstract way, however, when we can talk about it in a real world way I think it’s really great. We get a lot of questions about relationships and how to navigate that. It’s one thing when we’re on our own wellness journeys, but it’s a very different thing when you live with someone and share a home and a kitchen. 

Topics Covered Finding Your Soulmate & Making it Work in the Real World, with my Husband Jon

#1. What brought my hubby Jon and I together surrounding the first cornerstone involving our food choices

#2. How we connect physically, as a couple, to remain close while incorporating the second cornerstone, which is body

#3. We share ways in which we navigate through the third Cornerstone when it comes to our emotional well-being

#4. Staying connected as partners through spiritual connection, which is the fourth cornerstone, and some of the ways we practice this in our life


Kimberly Snyder's husband, Jon Bier, on the Feel Good Podcast.

About Jon Bier

Jon Bier is the Founder of Jack Taylor PR, Co owner of Little Wolf Whiskey, and Cerro Gordo, the ghost town that was once the largest silver mine in California. He is an adjunct professor of Marketing at New York University and a non practicing attorney.


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The intention of the Feel Good Podcast is to well…help you really Feel Good in your body, mind and spirit! Feeling Good means feeling peaceful, energized, whole, uniquely beautiful, confident and joyful, right in the midst of your perfectly imperfect life. This podcast is as informative and full of practical tips and take-aways as it is inspirational. I am here to support you in being your very best! I have so much love and gratitude for you. Thank you for tuning in and being part of the community :).


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Note: The following is the output of transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate. This is due to inaudible passages or transcription errors. It is posted as an aid, but should not be treated as an authoritative record.

Kimberly: Hey Beauties, welcome back to our Monday interview podcast. I am very excited to have my husband Jon as our podcast guest this week, and we’re going to be talking about relationships and all aspects of practical living, what we do from a food standpoint and connection standpoint. Our four cornerstones basically. Food, body, today we’ll talk about sex a little bit, emotional well-being and spiritual growth and how we do it in our life.

Share The Podcast and Leave a Review on Itunes

Kimberly: Before we get in, I just want to remind you if you haven’t yet left us a review on iTunes, please just take a moment or two out of your day. It’s free, it’s easy, it can be one sentence, and it’s a really great way to support the show. Thank you so much in advance, and while you’re at it, please be sure to subscribe to our podcast, that way you don’t miss out on any of these interview Mondays and also our Thursday podcast, which is our Q&A day, where we all the questions from our amazing Solluna community and I love to support you guys and hear what you are wondering about and a lot of us have the same questions. That show’s on Thursday as well.

Interview with hubby Jon

Jon: That’s great.

Kimberly: All right baby, I am glad, we’ve been talking about doing a podcast for a while. I’m happy I roped you into this. We did an Instagram live a couple weeks ago and that was-

Jon: Yeah, I was told it was a fan favorite, but I think maybe you were trying to rope me, butter me up a little bit so I’ll do this.

Kimberly: I think it’s nice to share more about my life and we talk about some of these concepts in an abstract way, but when we can talk about it in a real world way I think it’s really great, and we do get a lot of questions about relationships. And how to navigate that, because it’s one thing when we’re on our journey’s our own wellness journeys, but it’s a very different thing when you live with someone and share a home and a kitchen. So when we were dating we had separate homes, and then we came together and-

Jon: It was all very quick though.

What brought my hubby Jon and I together surrounding the first cornerstone involving our food choices

Kimberly: Yes, but I will say I was thinking it’s nice, let’s talk about, we have our cornerstones as you know babe. Let’s start with the food one, because we do get a lot of-

Jon: Okay, that’s a big one in our life.

Kimberly: It’s a big one in our life, because I’ve been plant-based now for over 10 years, and you were plant-based for a few months when we met. I think that was to get me solidify the relationship.

Jon: I had to lock you in. Also, I wanted to try. It’s not just a diet for you, it’s a way of life. So I wanted to you know I like doing that stuff anyway. For me, that was an extreme diet, and I do like doing extreme.

Kimberly: Right you like experimenting with things.

Jon: It wasn’t a way of life for me, it was an extreme kind of test to see if it worked, and it didn’t really.

Kimberly: For you, yeah.

Jon: For me. I didn’t feel any weaker.

Kimberly: Yeah, it’s just that I think everybody has their own timeline. I know for you baby, you genuinely do love the taste of meat.

Jon: That was the big-

Kimberly: The enjoyment and you’re into cooking and all this.

Jon: Yeah, I also am aware that I think you say this often, I believe it to be true that you definitely vibrate on a different level when you are plant-based. The idea that we eat like our brothers and sisters and that sort of thing, I do think in 100 years when people look at the history of humanity they are going to, the world is moving towards this, and people are going to be like, you know that used to be me, right?

Kimberly: Oh yeah, just like smoking.

Jon: I do think that’s true. But for me, I’m not there and the main thing for me is a flavor thing. I don’t enjoy food as much.

Kimberly: And I’ve always said this to you guys, it’s really important that you can’t be somebody be where they aren’t. So one thing in our relationship is respect. You respect my viewpoint, and I respect yours.

Jon: Yeah. I think to be fair, it took a while for you to respect mine.

Kimberly: I was disappointed, because at first I thought you were, I guess for lack of a better term sold on the idea. I had shared with you about my yogic perspective, which was how I initially came into the plant-based world was being in India and learning about meditation and really about the spiritual aspect of being plant-based, which is that we want energy to go up, and we don’t want to have decaying energy, or eat something that has suffered, and then I learned about of course the health reasons and then the environmental reasons. So then I was excited that you were excited about it.

Jon: So, I was. And I’m open to it, that’s just something where I’m at right now.

Kimberly: But there’s a mutual respect.

Jon: I also have come down my meat [crosstalk 00:05:24] by probably 85, 90%.

Kimberly: Right, and I think that’s a really important-

Jon: And I cut out dairy by 100%.

Kimberly: I think that’s a really important thing to bring up is that it’s not all or nothing. I think that if we get into that mindset, where we get excited about a certain diet or how we’re living or a workout or a food routine and our partner doesn’t follow it, it can feel like a lot of pressure.

Jon: So it doesn’t feel like a lot of pressure for most people. I think in the plant-based community, that’s really important, because it is a way of life more than a diet, but in most relationships it’s not a thing. [crosstalk 00:06:06]

Kimberly: Okay, well, there’s a lot of-

Jon: Not normally an issue.

Kimberly: Okay, well there’s a lot of plant-based people in our community, babe. So I’m just saying for me to be married to someone who’s not fully plant-based. The things that work for us is number one, mutual respect. I don’t push you, you don’t push me. Number two, we are lucky enough to have two kitchens. That’s a practical thing, we have our main house, then we have the guest house, which is your office. So when you eat meat with

Jackie our dog, it’s over there. And then number three, when we are in a restaurant you will eat whatever you want, and I will eat whatever I want, and we don’t shame each other.

Jon: No. But even there, when was the last time I ordered a steak in front of you? A long time.

Kimberly: A long time. It’s more fish.

Jon: Yeah, that’s kind of a compromise right there. Am I allowed to show this much leg, or is this going to-

Kimberly: Yes, of course you can. I got my belly out.

Jon: That’s true.

Kimberly: I love having my belly out now.

Jon: I just don’t want to make any of your people uncomfortable.

Kimberly: If you guys tune in to our Instagram TV, this is where we have the video of this podcast if you guys are listening on audio. You can see a little clip of John’s leg. So yeah, I think that there’s a lot of … I experienced it with my dad too. We get excited when we learn about a way of eating, especially plant-based, and there can be disappointment when we think we know more or we know how to help someone feel better, and they’re just not on the same page.

Jon: Right, and let’s be honest, he’s a secret bologna eater.

Kimberly: My dad. Hold on, it took him five years to drink the glowing green smoothie, so that was a triumph. And he will drink the smoothie when he’s here with us.

Jon: But he’s eating bologna on white bread with mayo and [crosstalk 00:08:12]

Kimberly: Well, my dad grew up in New Jersey and he grew up eating canned food and very typical American diet, whereas my mother from the Philippines was always very vegetable forward and fresh food. I saw both sides of that. To me it goes back to we just have to do the best we can for ourselves and live it and embody it, and you can’t push people. That’s a really big thing in our relationship is that we really respect each other from a food perspective.

Jon: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Next.

How we connect physically, as a couple, to remain close while incorporating the second cornerstone, which is body

Kimberly: All right, so let’s talk about body, it’s our second cornerstone here. For us, I thought I don’t talk about it so much babe, but I think it’s part of life, it’s a really great thing to talk a little bit about sex. And I think it’s a really important way for couples to connect and to remain close and to express creativity, so I’m really happy that you’ve been still very attracted to me while I’ve gotten this pregnant.

Jon: Oh I love it.

Kimberly: Because not every man does.

Jon: Yeah, I mean they’re missing out. I mean it’s incredible, I love it. I’m going to miss it.

Kimberly: So I think that we were initially always attracted to each other, but obviously there was so much depth to it, but I think when you’re really connected to someone the sex can also get deeper.

Jon: Mm-hmm (affirmative), I think that’s true. I think it evolves. I think it’s the same thing with a lot of things in life, where you think you get somewhere where you know stuff and then you’re like I feel pretty good and then you look back a little bit a few months or a couple years later you’re like oh shit I didn’t know anything. And it keeps happening in life, and I think it happens similarly in sex. You get to a level where you feel really deep and connected and you are from where you were yesterday, but it continues to get deeper and evolve.

Kimberly: Yes. It gets deeper, it evolves, and it creates an electricity. It creates a different energy when we’re regularly connecting like that, and we do regularly connect.

Jon: I think it’s important.

Kimberly: I do too.

Jon: But also it’s never not fun or a strain or an obligation or something that oh you know we should really connect now. It’s something that-

Kimberly: It’s just natural.

Jon: … a regular part of our lives.

Kimberly: Yeah. And so I think what would you say, I have friends, you probably have friends where maybe they’re not connecting in that way, do you think it’s indicative of something else?

Jon: Yeah. I think sometimes relationships can be difficult and there can be a lot of obligation and maybe even built up resentment, and when those things happen, I think then the sex is impacted by that. You don’t have the same respect for lack of a better word for the other person sometimes.

Kimberly: You don’t want to be intimate with them.

Jon: Yeah. You’re not, you’re just not, you don’t have that … But-

Kimberly: What was that babe? That …

Jon: That fuego, but we communicate really well even if it’s not always like-

Kimberly: We don’t always see eye to eye.

Jon: Yeah, we’re not always connected on every single issue, but we communicate when we’re not connected and I think we maintain that respect. And that desire that way.

Kimberly: Mm-hmm (affirmative), and then also in our body cornerstone beyond sex, I think touch is really important, and we have a very physical relationship. Now since I’ve been pregnant, you have been giving me massages every day, we have a lot of cuddling. We’re both very physical people. I’m very physical with Bubby too. But I think touch is very healing, we talk about the ayurvedic aspect of abhyanga, which is self massage, which is said to be the most rejuvenative anti-aging practice.

Jon: Yeah. I mean I’m a fairly stinky musky man-

Kimberly: Very hairy. I love it.

Jon: There’s food in the bed, it’s really-

Kimberly: Some dog hair.

Jon: It’s disgusting, but somehow you’re not disgusted by this, which is wonderful, because you are such an OCD kind of clean person.

Kimberly: Yes. And I just think that shows the level of our connection where things that would have bothered me in the past I think I don’t really notice as much. I’ll clean up your stinky socks.

Jon: Or yeah, or you were wearing one of my shirts this morning.

Kimberly: I was.

Jon: It looked great. I love when you wear my shirts, but then I go have that shirt, and you’re like, “Oh it’s a little stinky.”

Kimberly: I still put it on anyways.

Jon: There’s something about my stink.

Kimberly: I know, it’s I think there’s pheromones.

Jon: That’s an objectively gross smell that I don’t wear deodorant.

Kimberly: I have read some of these David Deida books that talks a lot about polarity and gender, and I think really feminine women want a really masculine man. I love the hair, I love the beard, I love the smell even. I love the masculinity, it feels different in a way so I’m really attracted to it.

Jon: There’s something about stink also that if you don’t love the way someone stinks you’re probably-

Kimberly: Do you like my stink?

Jon: Oh yeah, I love your stink.

Kimberly: Do I stink sometimes?

Jon: I mean you know-

Kimberly: Sometimes, everybody stinks. Body odor.

Jon: You have you know body odor, which is wonderful. I mean you’re pretty stink free though. If you did have a stink I would like it.

Kimberly: Oh that’s good. I think that’s very primal on that level.

Jon: Yeah.

We share ways in which we navigate through the third Cornerstone when it comes to our emotional well-being

Kimberly: Okay, so let’s talk about our next cornerstone, which is emotional well-being. So we’re going through this pregnancy baby, and now we’re very close, I think about having this newborn, and one thing I’ll share with you guys is I’ve had a lot of hormonal cries. I know it’s probably hard for you to understand what’s going on in your logical analytical guy mind, but for me and for women in general, I think we tend to be more emotional and more affected sometimes with what’s going on. I think being pregnant is always a really potent time for hormones and emotions. So how do you feel about seeing me being emotional wild, you’re very steady, very strong, you just hold me.

Jon: Yeah. That doesn’t bother me. I’m never like, “Ugh, she’s crying again.” I like holding you, and I like talking to you. There’s usually, even if it’s emotional, there’s a reason behind it. You might not always be crying if you weren’t so hormonal, but it makes sense, it’s not insane. The only times I get frustrated with it are when you’re like, “You know when the baby comes you’re really going to have to x, y, z.” I’m like, “Yeah, I know, I’m prepared for this. I’m super excited about it.” I think that I’m doing the things now that are showing you that I’m ready for that commitment, and I’ll get annoyed sometimes if you get upset when you’re saying in the future you need to do this or you need to do that. That’s really the only time. Normally-

Kimberly: That goes back to communication where I’m just in my head trying to plan everything and think through everything and feeling a bit freaked out, and you sometimes take it as I don’t have faith in you doing those things. Then we talk about it some more.

Jon: Because I am excited about doing those things.

Kimberly: Yes, which involve cooking for me.

Jon: I’m excited, that doesn’t [crosstalk 00:17:50]

Kimberly: Yeah, all the … I know you’re a good cook. Babe, this is a big cornerstone I think for women especially to feel like you can relax, that you can be with your partner, and it’s something that I always wanted was that real connection with someone emotionally. And I think that’s really important for a lot of women. Do you think, there’s so many, I know this is a stereotype, but a lot of guys can’t be emotionally connected, do you think that’s something if someone’s in a relationship with someone, do you think that’s something they can learn? Do you think that some guys are just less emotionally intelligent?

Jon: I do, and I think some women are also.

Kimberly: Oh sure, to be fair.

Jon: And I think it’s more common with men big time than it is with women, and I think that you can become more emotionally aware, but you can’t become emotionally aware if you’re not emotionally aware. You can get better at it, but be conscious of it, but I think it is something that either you are, or you are not for the most part.

Kimberly: So you think if someone has chosen someone that they’re not getting their emotional needs fulfilled, because therapy-

Jon: I think there are degrees of it, and I think you can get better at it, but if you’re not naturally inclined toward that-

Kimberly: It’s going to be tough.

Jon: … you’re ever going to be a really emotionally aware person.

Kimberly: Right.

Jon: Usually you don’t have to think about it. It’s something that comes naturally. It’s the same thing, and I always say this about something like gratitude. We listen to all the same people that everybody else does, and I read all the same books and there’s a lot of talk about-

Kimberly: Importance of gratitude.

Jon: … remembering to be grateful. And to be honest, I don’t struggle with life that much. I go with the flow, it is what it is, sometimes it’s good, sometimes you’re struggling with things. But I never have to remind myself to be grateful. I’m always aware that the fact that we are alive is so ridiculous. The fact that we know each other, the fact that we’re living this life as humans on this rock is so magical that everything else seems like bonus. And so I don’t have to remind myself to be gratitude, I am grateful, and I think it’s in the same conversation. If you have to remind yourself to have gratitude, you’ll be better at being grateful, but you won’t ever be … You won’t live with gratitude in the same way as someone who is just grateful.

Kimberly: Maybe it is a skill you can learn.

Jon: You can get better at it.

Kimberly: Maybe it can be taught.

Jon: Yeah.

Kimberly: Because some people, if you’re not grateful for what is, then it means you come from the mindset of looking for lack or what isn’t there, you’re never satisfied. There’s some deeper things there. Some people evolve. It’s always nice when it’s your go to, it’s your natural inclination, but people do evolve. I think that’s a great point to bring up is gratitude. I also think the more we are on our journeys just going through a lot of experiences and different relationships, we were so sure when we met, there was no question that we were for each other. And in the past, I’ve kind of is this the right person? There’s been questioning there’s been almost lists pros and cons.

Jon: Have you actually written out the lists?

Kimberly: No, but I think in my mind. Just thinking oh this person’s really a good person, but blah, blah, blah, then we tend to justify things. Do you think that the way we were so sure, I mean always say we’re so lucky, we’re so rare, this is amazing. Do you think we were saying gratitude can be developed, do you think you can get to the point where you’ve been on your spiritual journey, you can tune in right away if that’s your life partner? Or do you think it doesn’t happen for everybody?

Jon: I don’t know. For me, it was I suspected it within 15 minutes, and I was really confident of it I think within a day or two. That’s never happened before. I’ve liked people or I’ve met them before, but I’ve never felt like that. And I wonder, had we met each other a year earlier, or five years earlier, or if we would have been ready for that, because as a human I’m not sure that I was ready for the depth of this relationship and I don’t know if we would have been at different levels of readiness for that if this would have worked. Timing was I think pretty important.

Kimberly: I think timing’s really important in any relationship for sure. Here in our community babe, we talk a lot about true beauty and connecting with yourself and being yourself and being confident as yourself, and yet we live in this world that’s very image driven, that’s very surfacy to an extent in many different ways, sometimes I think all men want externally pretty people, and we’ve had some relationship therapist and sex therapists on here saying men actually do want commitment and closeness as well. Do you think that it’s a face for a lot of men to kind of be attracted to that shiny object, but do you think with all your friends, many of them who I love deep down men are actually looking for that deep partner? For the most part, obviously everybody’s different.

Jon: Yeah, I think it’s tough to generalize. And I think sometimes-

Kimberly: I guess I just want to give hope to all the ladies out there.

Jon: Yeah, you know I have friends that are great people that don’t want a serious relationship right now. Want to bounce around from person to person, and they get, and often times those people are people that are very emotionally needy and they get little bits and pieces from that, and it scratches the itch, but they’re not ready to go in with one person. They may never be. They’re not unhappy. That’s just not how they’re wired and where they’re at right now and maybe ever, but if I look at the people that I hang out with, it’s pretty diverse.

Kimberly: Yes.

Jon: I think a lot of men are looking for a mother figure also. A lot of men-

Kimberly: Do you think that’s because of trauma with their mom? What is that?

Jon: I don’t know. I don’t know what it is, but I think that maybe it comes from, and I’m really just guessing them having mothers that did everything for them, maybe they didn’t fully grow up and they’re kind of looking to replace that a little bit. I don’t know. I see it as a common thing for sure.

Kimberly: Interesting. They’re looking for someone … They want to be taken care of, but not necessarily an equal.

Jon: Yeah, and then there’s also a lot of people that want to … That want someone that they take care of. Who isn’t also an equal.

Kimberly: That’s true.

Jon: If you’re fully taking care of someone and there’s no value prop in some way that makes it equal, and I’m not talking about financially or anything like that, but there’s often-

Kimberly: Like the wounded bird.

Jon: Well, there’s often in relationships there is some form of balance often. One person has this to give and one person has that to give, and it seems to work, but sometimes that scale is tipped very far in one direction and I don’t think those relationships are typically sustainable. I think you do need balance for something to be sustainable.

Kimberly: Like an emotional exchange.

Jon: Something that makes it equal. That’s why I always thought that if you’re going … The old man and the old rich guy and the young beautiful woman, which is like people are always like what are they doing together. [crosstalk 00:27:39] that’s a pretty clear value prop to me. They are trading things for that-

Kimberly: Yes, it’s an energy exchange. It’s money for trophy, sex.

Jon: Right, but at least it’s not something that’s aspirational to me, but I understand how that works in nature.

Kimberly: Yes. So you’re saying you don’t understand when someone’s giving everything. Maybe they have low self esteem or they’re filling something, they want to feel needed.

Jon: You need to find some kind of balance and relationship for it to work, and that relationship, even if it’s not balanced everywhere else, that is something that makes it even for those people in that part of that relationship. I think if the scale is tipped too far in one direction, it doesn’t tend to work out.

Kimberly: Right. You know that reminds me of thinking about what we were talking about here with cornerstones, there’s connection, there’s sex, there’s the emotional part, we haven’t talked about the spiritual part yet, but I know people that say if someone’s not vegan I’m not going to date them. They’re out of my realm, then I think you can really block your soulmate from coming in, because I’ve been with vegans, I wasn’t anywhere as happy as I am with you, that’s not the reason you’re with someone just because, we talked about this in the live a little bit, interests.

Jon: No, but I do understand it, because it’s not just a diet, it is a way of life for a lot of people, there’s a lot that goes along with that often. And we talked about this a little bit when I was on your Instagram.

Kimberly: On the live, yeah.

Jon: I was saying hobbies and things like that, when people talk about we have similar things that we’re into and we both like to go hiking, and we both like to camp, and we-

Kimberly: We’re skiers.

Jon: We’re skiers, and we both eat the same food. That’s cool, but that’s not who you are, and we are super connected spiritually and emotionally and from a character perspective and from a value perspective. We often don’t like doing the same things. Our things that we like to do are on opposite spectrum almost.

Kimberly: Because I like to do yoga and have women circles, and you like to do crossfit and ride your motorcycle.

Jon: Right.

Kimberly: And smoke meat sometimes.

Jon: Yeah, yeah. And martial arts and things like that, that you can’t even … I tried to bring Kim to a fight with me one time.

Kimberly: Yeah, I couldn’t watch it.

Jon: You tried. I was surprised that you came.

Kimberly: I don’t do well with violence, visual violence. And sometimes there’s a documentary you want us to watch like last night where the people are fighting and I just can’t take it in.

Jon: They weren’t even fighting.

Kimberly: They were arguing. It was a heightened emotional … I feel that I can feel it in my body and it doesn’t feel good in my body, and I don’t watch a lot of stuff anyways.

Jon: No, we’ve started and stopped a lot of things. Like I’ll watch that with you and then one minute you’re like nope, I can’t do it.

Kimberly: I can’t, I can’t do it. It’s very clear.

Jon: That’s okay, that’s not who we are.

Kimberly: No, I know baby.

Jon: The things that we are connected on, we are super simpatico.

Kimberly: So what would you say, because sometimes there’s these matchmakers, those dating things, I see them in the airline magazines. And a lot of times they do try … I don’t know, I’m not an expert, but they match people based on their hobby and their likes. If we’re saying that’s not it, then what would you say is? Just a feeling in your body.

Jon: I think it’s [crosstalk 00:31:51] I can’t believe it’s 2020 and that’s a matchmaker, this is how your industry has evolved is on the most base level of stuff you like to do. We know that stuff doesn’t work, just like we know if you are with someone because they are physically beautiful in the magazine model sense of that, whatever that works. That’s not enough of a thing.

Kimberly: Yeah, that’s fleeting.

Jon: Because that is fleeting.

Kimberly: And it will get boring.

Jon: All that other shit is also fleeting. You’re going to get bored of doing stuff together, and you’re not going to have anything beyond that, how are you going to go deep with someone. There needs to be something more than that.

Kimberly: Right. Well that’s the problem with even, I mean I’ve never done online dating, but it’s like here are my interests.

Jon: I have done online dating.

Kimberly: Do you think it’s the vibe.

Jon: I’ll tell you what I liked about online dating, and first of all I think the quality of women is probably better than the quality of men on there. I liked the thing that I would meet someone that I knew virtually nothing about and I never would have actually met in real life. That was kind of interesting.

Kimberly: But what I’m saying to get to that phase, you’re listing out your interests, right?

Jon: Not really, you’re more showing your personality and your sense of humor almost I think.

Kimberly: Well, okay, so I think, this is my take on it, I really think if we focus on our energy, and our vibe, and working on ourself, because we met each other at a time when neither of us were looking to meet anyone else. I know that may sound cliché, but I really do think you can, Yogananda talks about this, the yogis talk about this, that’s when you really meet your person, because you’re not pandering, you’re not searching for it, you’re not trying to be something you’re not. You’re not just trying to be the witty person-

Jon: Also, when you are looking for someone, you end up putting the qualities you want in the person that has something that you’re interested in. We were talking about this earlier.

Kimberly: Yes, with a friend.

Jon: And you tend to want something sometimes so badly because you’re lonely or you want that connection or you want to have a baby or whatever that thing is, that you start putting these character traits on a person that doesn’t have them because you want them to have them. That’s why when you’re not actually looking for something, you’re more open I think to finding it because you’re less influenced by your own ego and just wants and desires.

Staying connected as partners through spiritual connection, which is the fourth cornerstone, and some of the ways we practice this in our life

Kimberly: Right, right. So that’s our last cornerstone babe, is spiritual growth and spiritual connection. And that’s not religion, but it’s just connecting with a spirit with the essence, like you were saying there has to be something just beyond the physical magazine beauty or the big muscles otherwise that gets really, really boring, right? You know, I used to work with some people that people thought were really hot and had all these big muscles and I just wasn’t spiritually connected to them so I never got that. But I can see from a purely physical standpoint, I get it. But that’s the part, I think that’s the real glue that holds a relationship together. I know I’ll meditate with you, or you’ll be laying there while I meditate next to you, but more than that-

Jon: I’ll be sleeping after.

Kimberly: Yes, but there’s this is the one that’s hard to put into words I think with a relationship, I feel like we feel so connected to each other on a deeper soul level, when we went to the Holy Land when we went to the Middle East last year, and that whole area it was just the shock tea, the energy of it. Again, that’s what I always wanted in a relationship and for me, I worked towards that within myself, and then I attracted you in.

Jon: But spiritually also, even though we’re coming at things like we’re talking about from very different perspectives, spiritually we are really, really on the same page.

Kimberly: Yes. Yes. It’s true. And the way that we will raise our children, the way we are with Bubby, the way we’ll be with this new baby, it feels again I remember on one of our first dates he said, “Don’t you think we’re a funny couple?” And I said, “What do you mean?” And you’re like, “Oh I have all these tattoos and you have none, and I eat meat and you’re vegan, and I do crossfit, and you’re a yogi.” You named all this external stuff, and I just said, “That’s just the surface.” Now those things may have really mattered to me in the past, but it was just this connection we had so those things didn’t matter. So I guess I would say to anyone that is looking for someone to not get caught up in the surface. It was a feeling in my body, I felt really connected to you. A spirit, it wasn’t in my mind, it was more in my heart.

Jon: Right.

Kimberly: And so it’s like getting past the analytical mind part to connect. Do you think that’s harder for men?

Jon: I don’t know. I don’t know that you can generalize like that. I think that there are-

Kimberly: You can’t talk for all men?

Jon: No. There are a lot of men that are certainly are like man children, that don’t get it, that it goes way over their head, and I think there’s more men than women, I think women are as a genus more naturally emotionally aware, but everyone in my circle is pretty emotionally aware, even if they’re in different phases of things that they want, they’re pretty emotionally attuned.

Kimberly: So if you would say babe, because we talk about this idea of confidence, we get a lot of questions about confidence, if someone is not necessarily the most beautiful externally by conventional standards, but she’s really confident, don’t you think that’s super attractive?

Jon: I do. And I think you and I were talking about this earlier, what was the quote that you said, that beauty-

Kimberly: Oh true beauty increases upon closer examination.

Jon: Yeah. And I think that’s true. You first of all, you need to be attractive to your partner physically.

Kimberly: Yes.

Jon: You do need to be physically attracted to that person, but once you get to know a person, I think that physical attraction gets deeper if that person is your person.

Kimberly: Yes.

Jon: I think that gets deeper and deeper. That person doesn’t have to be the best looking person that you’ve ever seen, or the most beautiful person, or it doesn’t have to be something that the world sees as beautiful if you see that as beautiful, because that’s also I think a big trap that people have and sometimes people date people for other people.

Kimberly: Right, they want to impress them.

Jon: Yeah. Which is a whole other confidence, insecurity thing. But you have to be attracted to your partner physically, they just don’t have to be the best looking person in the world, but that person should get more attractive the more you get to know them.

Kimberly: Yes, yes. That’s true. Well, baby, thank you so much for being on our podcast today. I’m glad that I was able to rope you in.

Jon: You roped me in.

Kimberly: I love sharing you.

Jon: I’m going to now read all the comments.

Kimberly: Yeah, leave some good comments you guys. Some good reviews.

Jon: If you need to disagree with me, that’s fine. I understand.

Kimberly: Well, I feel so, you know friends have commented on this, I feel so proud isn’t the right word, but I feel so happy and joyful in our relationship, I love to share it. I love to share all the things that have worked for me and I would want everyone to have a really connected beautiful relationship as well, like we have. So I love you.

Jon: I love you.

Kimberly: Beauties, thank you so much for tuning in. I hope you enjoyed our conversation. We will have the show notes over at we’ll link to some other podcasts. I think some of the sex therapists that we had, we had Dr. Laura Berman on. She’s Oprah’s sex therapist. You might enjoy some of those other conversations as well, so we will link to some of those other shows. And we’ll be back here Thursday as always for our next Q&A podcast. Until then, I’ll see you over on the site, also on Instagram, @_kimberlysnyder, sending you guys lots of love and see you back here soon.

Jon: Bye Beauties.